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Critique this please. #6049187
11/09/17 12:21 AM
11/09/17 12:21 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
D
DezertTrapper Offline OP
trapper
DezertTrapper  Offline OP
trapper
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
I'm on a job for a very sick yote. Law and local ordinances state I can only cage trap. Residential area. Trap has been backed into a grouping of native shrubs where he has been seen resting underneath in the afternoons.

Used bacon bait beneath (the recipe is on this site someplace) yote urine, floor is perfectly prepped, bait hanging/wired from inside the top of the trap, he'd have to step on the plate to get to it. What else can I do to convince this animal to enter? It's been only 18 hours, but starving as he is, I'd have thought he'd have entered by now. This has worked well for me in the past, but it's not working yet for this guy. Thanks




Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6049214
11/09/17 12:38 AM
11/09/17 12:38 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 14,841
St. Louis Co, Mo
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BigBob Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 14,841
St. Louis Co, Mo
PM sent


Every kid needs a Dog and a Curmudgeon.

Remember Bowe Bergdahl, the traitor.

Beware! Jill Pudlewski, Ron Oates and Keven Begesse are liars and thiefs!
Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6049267
11/09/17 01:22 AM
11/09/17 01:22 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,238
WA
Vinke Offline
trapper
Vinke  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,238
WA
Starving or mange?
My guess is it wil die before you cage it


Living life like a dog with a stick


Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6049284
11/09/17 01:35 AM
11/09/17 01:35 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
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DezertTrapper Offline OP
trapper
DezertTrapper  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
Severe mange Vinke...and now starving as a result. Horrible for any animal to suffer like this. People and their effing rat and squirrel poisons cause this. Rarely see it in remote desert, they're found near residential or agricultural areas around these parts. I've caged plenty, but this guy isn't going for what normally works, and I was hoping someone might have an idea I hadn't thought of.

Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6049343
11/09/17 02:23 AM
11/09/17 02:23 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,238
WA
Vinke Offline
trapper
Vinke  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,238
WA
Mange is ectoparasitic and has nothing to do with secondary ingestion.....


Living life like a dog with a stick


Re: Critique this please. [Re: Vinke] #6049366
11/09/17 02:45 AM
11/09/17 02:45 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
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DezertTrapper Offline OP
trapper
DezertTrapper  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
Originally Posted By: Vinke
Mange is ectoparasitic and has nothing to do with secondary ingestion.....




Rodenticides affect the immune systems of both canids and felines. Once poisoned rodents are ingested, the immune system is affected, and mange rears its ugly head. Some species of mange are carried naturally, and a healthy immune system keeps it in check, no different than the bacteria on our own skin.

We're seeing rodenticide induced mange due to immune system breakdown in kit foxes, bobcats, mountain lions, yotes, etc. all over this part of the country, in addition to the thousands that bleed out. (Including all raptors, carrion species, etc.)


Here's some reference information for you Vinke. You might want to read up.

Anticoagulant exposure and notoedric mange in bobcats and mountain lions in urban Southern California
https://ucdavis.pure.elsevier.com/en/pub...ats-and-mountai

LA Mountain Lion A Poster Cat For California's Rat Poison Problem
https://www.npr.org/2014/06/21/323970068...-poison-problem

Anticoagulant Rodenticides: Secondary Poisoning of Wildlife in California
http://caforestpestcouncil.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/stella-Mcmillin.pdf


I posted asking for possible ideas to get a sick yote trapped. This yote has severe mange because he's been eating poisoned ground squirrels near a residential area.

Do you have anything to offer?


Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6049390
11/09/17 03:15 AM
11/09/17 03:15 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,238
WA
Vinke Offline
trapper
Vinke  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,238
WA
Yes

Found a better article but it is also on cats, I have never read a thesis on canines


Living life like a dog with a stick


Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6051866
11/12/17 12:47 AM
11/12/17 12:47 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 578
Des Allemands, Louisiana
Budfish Offline
trapper
Budfish  Offline
trapper

Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 578
Des Allemands, Louisiana
I think there is a possibility that yote may have passed away already or will soon. My be too sick to want to eat.

Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6052079
11/12/17 03:40 AM
11/12/17 03:40 AM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,616
Flint, Michigan
bhugo Offline
trapper
bhugo  Offline
trapper

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,616
Flint, Michigan
Just put it down.


Member MTPCA and NTA
Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6052746
11/12/17 11:32 PM
11/12/17 11:32 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 65
Virginia
K
Kurt in Va Offline
trapper
Kurt in Va  Offline
trapper
K

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 65
Virginia
Most trappers don't think you can trap coyote in cages in any where close to a timely matter, you say you have so you have more experience then 99 % in doing it so probably no help here for you on this subject. The last study I read it was more then 1000 trapping days for 17 coyotes and most were sick or pups. One guy said he used a mouse squeaker on a auto loop in back of cage, that's all I can give you.
I was thinking you could ask the trappers from CO. or Wash. they are both cage only states.


Last edited by Kurt in Va; 11/13/17 02:35 PM.
Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6054009
11/14/17 11:24 AM
11/14/17 11:24 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
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DezertTrapper Offline OP
trapper
DezertTrapper  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2017
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Desert Southwest-CA
He was trapped this past weekend.

Re: Critique this please. [Re: Kurt in Va] #6054092
11/14/17 01:37 PM
11/14/17 01:37 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,248
Georgia
K
Kirk De Offline
trapper
Kirk De  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,248
Georgia
Quote:
Most trappers don't think you can trap coyote in cages in any where close to a timely matter, you say you have so you have more experience then 99 % in doing it so probably no help here for you on this subject. The last study I read it was more then 1000 trapping days for 17 coyotes and most were sick or pups. One guy said he used a mouse squeaker on a auto loop in back of cage, that's all I can give you.
I was thinking you could ask the trappers from CO. or Wash. they are both cage only states.


All of the studies I have seen have none of the latest trap designs. NONE. The studies are all old and outdated. The designs are changing and improving faster than the years that go by. It is expensive to test. There is so much that goes into it.

Even if the best design for a region were to exist, how it best may be used in the regions tested would take some time. Many years.

Even for one to say that there will be little improvement in the future is in my opinion an uninformed guess. Trap function for coyotes will improve with time.

Re: Critique this please. [Re: Kirk De] #6054447
11/14/17 09:36 PM
11/14/17 09:36 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
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DezertTrapper Offline OP
trapper
DezertTrapper  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
Originally Posted By: Kirk De
Quote:
Most trappers don't think you can trap coyote in cages in any where close to a timely matter, you say you have so you have more experience then 99 % in doing it so probably no help here for you on this subject. The last study I read it was more then 1000 trapping days for 17 coyotes and most were sick or pups. One guy said he used a mouse squeaker on a auto loop in back of cage, that's all I can give you.
I was thinking you could ask the trappers from CO. or Wash. they are both cage only states.


All of the studies I have seen have none of the latest trap designs. NONE. The studies are all old and outdated. The designs are changing and improving faster than the years that go by. It is expensive to test. There is so much that goes into it.

Even if the best design for a region were to exist, how it best may be used in the regions tested would take some time. Many years.

Even for one to say that there will be little improvement in the future is in my opinion an uninformed guess. Trap function for coyotes will improve with time.



"For a region." Bingo!
Many folks think a yote is just a yote and nothing could be further from the truth. There are 19 known subspecies, each with it's own specific "quirks," to to speak, and there are variations in diet, etc. even within the same subspecies. The hardest thing is getting inside of their heads...which is a new game every time I go through this. But I like a good challenge, so that's OK. Trap placement and prep is everything...I'll spent 2-3 hours just getting a trap completely set up. Illness is also a HUGE factor. With scabies, their vision eventually ends up affected, sometimes severely, so setting traps using sight based baits/lures can be a total waste of time. For others, it may work well. I think I spend more time thinking about what's going on in an animal's brain than probably anything else, especially where yotes are concerned. If I were to try to cage trap back east---I might as well be on Mars. :-)

Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6055577
11/16/17 01:36 AM
11/16/17 01:36 AM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7
California
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Baxter Offline
trapper
Baxter  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7
California
Why couldn't you have used collorum?


Aaron

Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6056663
11/17/17 03:16 AM
11/17/17 03:16 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
D
DezertTrapper Offline OP
trapper
DezertTrapper  Offline OP
trapper
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 579
Desert Southwest-CA
Hi Aaron

More feral/stray dogs in that area than I can count. If they end up cage trapped, I can just call animal control to come pick them up-and they do. Too many dogs in these parts killing livestock.

If a yote that sick ends up on a collorum with that many feral dogs around, feral dogs would have torn it apart, and while some folks don't care, I do. It's just not acceptable to me to allow that to happen. If he's cage trapped, he's protected until removed by me.

Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6057217
11/17/17 10:13 PM
11/17/17 10:13 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7
California
B
Baxter Offline
trapper
Baxter  Offline
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Posts: 7
California
Kind of understand. Makes sense .


Aaron

Re: Critique this please. [Re: DezertTrapper] #6057494
11/18/17 02:37 AM
11/18/17 02:37 AM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,174
Virginia
5
52Carl Offline
trapper
52Carl  Offline
trapper
5

Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,174
Virginia
DezertTrapper, you are special (in a good way). I understand fully the circumstances which you must endure in order to accomplish what the rest of us outside of California take for granted. All of us do not want animals to suffer the misery of mange, yet those geniuses in charge of California laws are directly causing coyotes like this one to suffer days/weeks/months needlessly.

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