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#6076902 - 12/06/17 08:52 PM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: grisseldog]
Bruce T Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 24438
Loc: Northern Maine
Originally Posted By: grisseldog
BRUCE T
They are a headache here,hunters won't kill enough of them..
They can wipe my garden out in one nite.. I see 6 does on my place all the time.

We are lucky to have 1 deer every 10 miles here.
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#6077180 - 12/07/17 06:55 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
Carolina Foxer Offline
trapper

Registered: 06/21/08
Posts: 889
Loc: NC
Whatcha shooting them with, Swamp Wolf?
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#6077244 - 12/07/17 07:57 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
snowy Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/11
Posts: 3555
Loc: MT
Originally Posted By: Swamp Wolf
Population in the river corridor where my place is located is about 25 to 30 deer/square mile. I probably could take a few more does without any change in next year's hunt quality, but annual recruitment rates are not very good here due to the low quality habitat here.

Sandy soils, minimal agriculture, moderate hunting pressure from neighbors, river bottom deer dependent on acorn crop = go easy on the doe segment.


WOW. You have good population of deer.

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#6077263 - 12/07/17 08:13 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
Dewey NY Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/22/16
Posts: 594
Loc: Central New York
Very Nice...

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#6077273 - 12/07/17 08:19 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
330-Trapper Offline



Registered: 12/31/06
Posts: 17615
Loc: Minnesota
Nice Doe there!
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#6077282 - 12/07/17 08:29 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Carolina Foxer]
Swamp Wolf Offline
trapper

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 3866
Loc: SE Georgia
Originally Posted By: Carolina Foxer
Whatcha shooting them with, Swamp Wolf?


I put the Mathews back in the case and gave in to the ease of my Remington Model Seven 7mm-08...lol
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#6077289 - 12/07/17 08:32 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: snowy]
Swamp Wolf Offline
trapper

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 3866
Loc: SE Georgia
Originally Posted By: snowy
Originally Posted By: Swamp Wolf
Population in the river corridor where my place is located is about 25 to 30 deer/square mile. I probably could take a few more does without any change in next year's hunt quality, but annual recruitment rates are not very good here due to the low quality habitat here.

Sandy soils, minimal agriculture, moderate hunting pressure from neighbors, river bottom deer dependent on acorn crop = go easy on the doe segment.


WOW. You have good population of deer.


25 to 30 dsm is low compared to many areas in the south. 40 to 50 per square mile is common across much of Ga. On Ga's coastal islands the population is 60 to 70 dsm.
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#6077310 - 12/07/17 08:50 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
Claypool313 Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/07/16
Posts: 25
Loc: Pennsylvania
Question from a Pennsylvanian. What do the average dressed does in southern Georgia weigh?


Edited by Claypool313 (12/07/17 08:56 AM)

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#6077334 - 12/07/17 09:07 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
Rye Offline
trapper

Registered: 10/31/07
Posts: 4068
Loc: havelock, NC
Clay,

We have similar habitat to Swamp, our average 1.5-2.5 year old does are 80-90lbs on the hoof. The oldest doe I've taken was 5.5 and weighed 126lbs on the hoof.

something to bare in mind is that SE Deer are a different genetic strain than those further north. They don't get physically as big as the Virginian WhiteTail strain.


Edited by Rye (12/07/17 09:08 AM)
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#6077360 - 12/07/17 09:30 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Rye]
Claypool313 Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/07/16
Posts: 25
Loc: Pennsylvania
It's mostly out of curiosity for me. I've shot a lot of does but only recently started weighing them. Being a meat hunter, I like to also keep track of pounds of meat per dressed weight on the ones I harvest. I weighed my biggest PA a couple days ago and it came in at 109 dressed. Will have the meat weight soon.

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#6077368 - 12/07/17 09:37 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
Cougarw Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/23/13
Posts: 408
Loc: Nebraska
I was wondering how you guys could eat so many deer in a yr, but when you only get a couple burgers out of each one I guess it can be done. If I hunted down there I would be passing them all up thinking they were fawns.
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#6077520 - 12/07/17 11:56 AM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
Rye Offline
trapper

Registered: 10/31/07
Posts: 4068
Loc: havelock, NC
30% take is what you can expect for meat if you process it well.
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--Mark Twain.


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#6077565 - 12/07/17 12:37 PM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Claypool313]
Swamp Wolf Offline
trapper

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 3866
Loc: SE Georgia
Originally Posted By: Claypool313
Question from a Pennsylvanian. What do the average dressed does in southern Georgia weigh?


Rye is correct in his post about average weights and subspecies of whitetail down here.

The doe pictured is 4.5 years old and weighed 85 live wt. She is smaller framed than most does I've seen this old. Usually 4.5 year old will break the 100 to 110 mark live wt.
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#6077567 - 12/07/17 12:40 PM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Cougarw]
Swamp Wolf Offline
trapper

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 3866
Loc: SE Georgia
Originally Posted By: Cougarw
I was wondering how you guys could eat so many deer in a yr, but when you only get a couple burgers out of each one I guess it can be done. If I hunted down there I would be passing them all up thinking they were fawns.


These are smaller deer for sure. First time I went to north Missouri hunting and saw those deer I was astounded. They are huge compared to our deer. The 6 month old fawns are as big as an adult doe here.
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#6077569 - 12/07/17 12:41 PM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Rye]
Swamp Wolf Offline
trapper

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 3866
Loc: SE Georgia
Originally Posted By: Rye
30% take is what you can expect for meat if you process it well.


This is close to accurate...

And I cube every piece that I can. I dont grind any.


Edited by Swamp Wolf (12/07/17 12:41 PM)
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#6077589 - 12/07/17 12:58 PM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
Swamp Wolf Offline
trapper

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 3866
Loc: SE Georgia


I'm in the yellow region in southern Ga near the Florida line. Our deer are a mixture of Virginia, Osceola, and Seminole subs. A lot of relocating deer occurred in the 60s and 70s with many coastal island deer released here....and they were even smaller.

Generally these deer run smaller, but there is an occassional large one. Largest recorded rack in my county is 137 net. Heaviest deer I've have proof of was 190 live weight. A county or two West and north of me there is more agriculture and better soils and a good many B&C bucks have been taken over the years. These same areas received Borealis subs (from Wisconsin) in the 60s and 70s also.


Edited by Swamp Wolf (12/07/17 12:58 PM)
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#6077597 - 12/07/17 01:06 PM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
TreedaBlackdog Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 725
Loc: SW Iowa/NW Missouri
Soil productivity does not always equate to more deer. Look at our MDC harvest map and you will see the counties with highest harvest generally are timbered more and have more cover. Best soil productivity is along the river and NW Missouri. But, due to loss of CRP and loss of other cover there are no longer the numbers of deer like there was 5 years ago.
A few years ago I lived in North Dakota and the soil was higher in organic carbon than I have ever seen in Missouri even along the Malta Bend farms and due to lack of cover - there was no where for a deer to hide....now I will say with healthier soil usually equates a fatter, larger framed deer. There are quite a few Whitetail strains and generally the principle is the farther north you travel the larger the frame. Same thing with furbearers.....a coon trapper from Georgia or Texas should travel up and catch a northern MN or Canada coon - they will be in for a shock. I kept one of my 49" coons I caught from North Dakota - I had never seen such a mammoth.
Good job on the doe - looks like nice eating....I get tired of cleaning deer after a while.

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#6077601 - 12/07/17 01:08 PM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
TreedaBlackdog Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 725
Loc: SW Iowa/NW Missouri
I should add - those 6 month old fawns are what I like to shoot.....they are your sized does with the tenderness of a yearling.....ummm

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#6077617 - 12/07/17 01:21 PM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: TreedaBlackdog]
Swamp Wolf Offline
trapper

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 3866
Loc: SE Georgia
Originally Posted By: TreedaBlackdog
Soil productivity does not always equate to more deer. Look at our MDC harvest map and you will see the counties with highest harvest generally are timbered more and have more cover. Best soil productivity is along the river and NW Missouri. But, due to loss of CRP and loss of other cover there are no longer the numbers of deer like there was 5 years ago.
A few years ago I lived in North Dakota and the soil was higher in organic carbon than I have ever seen in Missouri even along the Malta Bend farms and due to lack of cover - there was no where for a deer to hide....now I will say with healthier soil usually equates a fatter, larger framed deer. There are quite a few Whitetail strains and generally the principle is the farther north you travel the larger the frame. Same thing with furbearers.....a coon trapper from Georgia or Texas should travel up and catch a northern MN or Canada coon - they will be in for a shock. I kept one of my 49" coons I caught from North Dakota - I had never seen such a mammoth.
Good job on the doe - looks like nice eating....I get tired of cleaning deer after a while.


I agree with most of your post but soil fertility is the base for better quality habitat...and ultimately better populations. But, there are for sure other factors at play. Critters need food, water, cover, and space in an optimum arrangement. Other factors include things such as hunting pressure and diseases such as EHD/CWD.

Also, some good deer populations exist in prairie type habitat in states such as Kansas, Nebraska, and the Dakota's. Not much timber there?

Bergman's Rule is farther north - bigger body concept you referenced.
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#6077888 - 12/07/17 05:54 PM Re: Doe management begins... [Re: Swamp Wolf]
Claypool313 Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/07/16
Posts: 25
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: Swamp Wolf
[quote=Rye]30% take is what you can expect for meat if you process it well.


This is close to accurate...

And I cube every piece that I can. I dont grind any. [/quote

I assume you mean 30% of live weight. I work with hunters in Florida. They never gut their deer. I guess it's because you can't hang them for a few days like we can. So when we compare deer weights I always have to qualify mine as dressed. I scrape every bit I can off a carcass. I get better % in October due to less fat. Maybe around 42% on my October doe this year.

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