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#6119270 - 01/09/18 09:22 AM Wolves Wiping Out Caribou
Tweed Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/31/16
Posts: 3032
Loc: Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Looks like wolves are planned to wipe out the remaining Lake Superior Caribou

CBC News


With just a few bulls and cows, the population grew to over 700 at one point, but has been cut down after wolves walked across the ice a few winters ago.

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#6119277 - 01/09/18 09:25 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
drasselt Offline
trapper

Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 1045
Loc: Alaska
Impossible! They only kill the weak and sick and keep the herd healthy. whistle

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#6119281 - 01/09/18 09:30 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
Dean Chapel Offline
trapper

Registered: 03/26/09
Posts: 241
Loc: Deer lodge, MT
Funny, I just read a similar article referencing wolves as the reason the Selkirk caribou heard in north Idaho is going extinct. Who gets to pick a winner in one endangered specie against another?

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#6119294 - 01/09/18 09:40 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
Marty Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/13/14
Posts: 9680
Loc: Camp FEMA..Kansas
Wolves suck......smart folk exterminated them a long time ago when folks had common sense.
_________________________
If You Can Take It Then You Can Make It!.....Keep Going!!

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#6119296 - 01/09/18 09:43 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Marty]
Trapper7 Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/27/06
Posts: 5469
Loc: MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
Originally Posted By: Marty
Wolves suck......smart folk exterminated them a long time ago when folks had common sense.


Exactly. The world has lost its way. Too many intelligent people with the common sense equivalence of a field mouse.
_________________________
Will somebody explain to me how criminals will follow new gun laws?

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#6119305 - 01/09/18 09:53 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: drasselt]
Osky Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/09/13
Posts: 5243
Loc: Northern MN
Originally Posted By: drasselt
Impossible! They only kill the weak and sick and keep the herd healthy. whistle



Well by golly, it's obvious the whole darn caribou herd has become sick and weak!
God bless those helpful wolves!


Osky
_________________________
"A womans heart is the hardest rock the Almighty has put on this earth, and I can find no sign on it"

www.SureDockusa.com

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#6119316 - 01/09/18 10:00 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Marty]
red mt Offline
trapper

Registered: 10/15/14
Posts: 3022
Loc: montana
Originally Posted By: Marty
Wolves suck......smart folk exterminated them a long time ago when folks had common sense.

What I like is when we go and buy wolves from Canada, then we pay some other group to monitor them, then pay some other group to kill them.
Sounds like a program to create jobs to me.
_________________________
Kenneth schoening

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#6119322 - 01/09/18 10:05 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
Dirty D Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/12/14
Posts: 273
Loc: east central WI
wolves are just finishing what man started.
wolves and these herds of caribou existed for hundred, probably thousands of years together before man arrived from Europe.
Man has eliminated much of the habitat that these herds occupied. This crashed the populations.
Crashed to the point that predators that they have lived with for centuries now will finish what man started.

Blame man, not the wolves. If your concerned about the caribou lets remove all human habitation from their previous range and restore the area to what it was 250 years ago.

Blaming wolves on the extinction of these caribou is like blaming the guy who shot the last couple of passenger pigeons for causing the birds to go extinct. He may have killed the last of them but if other men had not eliminated the other billions of them then the killing of those few would of made no difference.

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#6119330 - 01/09/18 10:10 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
Tweed Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/31/16
Posts: 3032
Loc: Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Wait....humans were only here for 250 years?

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#6119337 - 01/09/18 10:13 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
Dirty D Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/12/14
Posts: 273
Loc: east central WI
Originally Posted By: Tweed
Wait....humans were only here for 250 years?


you seriously want to compare the impact of Native Americans (Indians) to the arrival of man from Euorope?

If you don't get my point that man altering habitat is the main cause of the decimation of the caribou I don't know what to say.

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#6119346 - 01/09/18 10:16 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Dean Chapel]
waggler Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/11/08
Posts: 2665
Loc: Alaska and Washington State
Originally Posted By: Dean Chapel
Funny, I just read a similar article referencing wolves as the reason the Selkirk caribou heard in north Idaho is going extinct. Who gets to pick a winner in one endangered specie against another?

I think the Selkirk herd in that tiny area of Washington, Idaho and Montana is already extinct. I have a friend who has a cabin in the middle of the herd's range in NE Washington (he traps there also). His cabin is in their winter range, he sees no caribou tracks anymore.

I just don't think the biologists who work for the U.S. Forest Service and the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife can get themselves to admit that the caribou are gone for good. If they did admit that, they couldn't "study" them anymore, they wouldn't have any justification to keep roads in the area closed, and they'd have to admit that their darling wolves and cougars wiped out the caribou.

The U.S. officials had been supplementing the caribou herd by the occasional addition of woodland caribou that the Canadians (British Columbia) had been providing. Eventually the Canadians said they weren't going to donate any more caribou to the wolf and cougar feeding program that the State of Washington was conducting.


_________________________
My life is better than your vacation

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#6119352 - 01/09/18 10:21 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
drasselt Offline
trapper

Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 1045
Loc: Alaska
You first DD.

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#6119353 - 01/09/18 10:21 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
GoneTrappin Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/21/15
Posts: 253
Loc: Northern MN
Dirty D, if you read the post Tweed states that wolves are planned to wipe out the REMAINING Lake Superior caribou population. Never does he say that wolves are the only cause for the loss of caribou in the area.

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#6119383 - 01/09/18 10:45 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Dirty D]
Mike in A-town Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/29/13
Posts: 6209
Loc: Northeast Oklahoma
Originally Posted By: Dirty D
wolves are just finishing what man started.
wolves and these herds of caribou existed for hundred, probably thousands of years together before man arrived from Europe.
Man has eliminated much of the habitat that these herds occupied. This crashed the populations.
Crashed to the point that predators that they have lived with for centuries now will finish what man started.

Blame man, not the wolves. If your concerned about the caribou lets remove all human habitation from their previous range and restore the area to what it was 250 years ago.

Blaming wolves on the extinction of these caribou is like blaming the guy who shot the last couple of passenger pigeons for causing the birds to go extinct. He may have killed the last of them but if other men had not eliminated the other billions of them then the killing of those few would of made no difference.


Then it falls to man to manage both species to their benefit.

Mike
_________________________
One man with a gun may control 100 others who have none.

Vladimir Lenin

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#6119384 - 01/09/18 10:46 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
drasselt Offline
trapper

Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 1045
Loc: Alaska
DD I'll give you a more thoughtful response: Given that this is 2018, what good are those wolves to those caribou?

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#6119420 - 01/09/18 11:43 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
J.Morse Offline
trapper

Registered: 05/31/13
Posts: 2938
Loc: Northern Michigan
Dirty D,in the grand scheme of things, the woodland caribou hasn't lost all that much range in the last couple centuries....they did extend south as far as the U.P. until about 100 years ago, as well as into northern Maine, where they disappeared in the 1930's (?). They were never thick in Michigan unless you go back about a thousand years. Climate changes (Natural changes, not man made) pushed them steadily north, just like the boreal forests they live in. A thousand years ago Ohio had a bunch of spruce forests....2-3 thousand years before that there was even more, pollen samples from the bottom of Ohio bogs prove that. Even if Europeans hadn't arrived here the Woodland Caribou would have been pushed farther north each century, until the next Ice Age reverses that. Crimeny, Muskox used to be here several thousand years ago too. I'm sure shooting thinned things out a bit, and helped whittle down the herd, but even if humans had disappeared 10,000 years ago, the Woodland Caribou in the Lower Great Lakes and northern New England areas would still be on the edge of extirpation from those regions.
FYI, the last Passenger Pigeon....WILD Passenger Pigeon, was shot in the year 1900 in Pike county Ohio.....by a farm kid with a BB gun. A cooped up captive bird, named Martha, lived until September of 1914, also in Ohio (Cincinnati Zoo).
_________________________

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#6119427 - 01/09/18 11:53 AM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Dirty D]
Dean Chapel Offline
trapper

Registered: 03/26/09
Posts: 241
Loc: Deer lodge, MT
Originally Posted By: Dirty D
Originally Posted By: Tweed
Wait....humans were only here for 250 years?


you seriously want to compare the impact of Native Americans (Indians) to the arrival of man from Euorope?

If you don't get my point that man altering habitat is the main cause of the decimation of the caribou I don't know what to say.


If you went to the selkirks, you'd see that there is no change to the habitat from humans where the few caribou are historically found. Nor to the north in BC. Nice try though.

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#6119443 - 01/09/18 12:06 PM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
EdP Offline
trapper

Registered: 03/04/12
Posts: 1015
Loc: meadowview, Virginia
DD doesn't sound like a trapper to me, he sounds like an animal rights activist. Educated but ill informed, highly opinionated but almost completely wrong. DD is correct in that man caused this catastrophe. Man changed the balance between predator and prey species primarily by eliminating predators. This allowed prey species to thrive with controlled hunting by man helping to avoid overpopulation. Man then reintroduced the predators into a target rich environment resulting in a surge in predator populations and a decline in the prey species. When the prey is gone the wolves will starve and the pendulum will swing back. This could all have been avoided by proper managing of the predator species. In the west, it was the animal rights activists working through activist judges that cause the catastrophe by blocking delisting of the wolves until the populations had far exceeded targets.

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#6119453 - 01/09/18 12:14 PM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Marty]
Hal Offline
"old windy fartbag"

Registered: 12/22/06
Posts: 5239
Loc: Blue Creek, Ohio
Originally Posted By: Marty
Wolves suck......smart folk exterminated them a long time ago when folks had common sense.


I'm with ya Marty. Same goes for deer. They certainly suck too and smart folk exterminated them a long time ago when folks had common sense. -- Hal

(And you can include those nasty turkeys too! Smart folk exterminated them a long time ago when folks had common sense.)
_________________________
Waiting for things to be very, very wonderful.

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#6119456 - 01/09/18 12:16 PM Re: Wolves Wiping Out Caribou [Re: Tweed]
Osky Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/09/13
Posts: 5243
Loc: Northern MN
Such procrastination and hand wringing over nothing.
Get Boco to slip on out there and snare those wolves back into reasonable numbers.
Both will then flourish.
Carry on.

Osky
_________________________
"A womans heart is the hardest rock the Almighty has put on this earth, and I can find no sign on it"

www.SureDockusa.com

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