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Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Ridge Runner1960] #6146368
02/03/18 11:50 AM
02/03/18 11:50 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
Y
yukon254 Offline
trapper
yukon254  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
Originally Posted By: Ridge Runner1960
reckon you would bet on the government being truthful!
RR


no I wouldnt, but when the two Weavers stories are different I certainly dont trust them either. No way any real man would have put his family in the situation that POS did.


do unto others as you would have them do unto you

www.grizzlycreeklodge.com
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Tweed] #6146385
02/03/18 12:18 PM
02/03/18 12:18 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 10,404
Northeast Oklahoma
M
Mike in A-town Offline
trapper
Mike in A-town  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 10,404
Northeast Oklahoma
The account I read stated that Weaver was shot in the back as he was unlocking the shed where his son's body was. The sniper stated he was aiming for his spine but Weaver moved at the last second

And Vicki was shot as they were running back to the house after Randy had been hit in the back... So the sniper attempted a Hail Mary shot to finish the job and hit Vicki who was unseen... So in fairness Vicki Weaver was not the intended target...

However, if any one of us took a wild shot and killed a woman holding a baby we would be crucified. But according to the ROE he was good since shooting those folks on sight, armed or not, was kosher.

Again, whoever OK'ed those ROE should've been prosecuted.

This just reinforces the notion that the U.S. government is willing to burn down the barn to get rid of the mice.

Mike


One man with a gun may control 100 others who have none.

Vladimir Lenin
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Tweed] #6146437
02/03/18 12:50 PM
02/03/18 12:50 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
Y
yukon254 Offline
trapper
yukon254  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
Think it was Janet Reno who authorized those ROE ? And I agree it was wrong.


do unto others as you would have them do unto you

www.grizzlycreeklodge.com
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Mike in A-town] #6146503
02/03/18 01:34 PM
02/03/18 01:34 PM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,127
McGrath, AK
W
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
white17  Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
W

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,127
McGrath, AK
Originally Posted By: Mike in A-town
The account I read stated that Weaver was shot in the back as he was unlocking the shed where his son's body was. The sniper stated he was aiming for his spine but Weaver moved at the last second

And Vicki was shot as they were running back to the house after Randy had been hit in the back... So the sniper attempted a Hail Mary shot to finish the job and hit Vicki who was unseen... So in fairness Vicki Weaver was not the intended target...

However, if any one of us took a wild shot and killed a woman holding a baby we would be crucified. But according to the ROE he was good since shooting those folks on sight, armed or not, was kosher.

Again, whoever OK'ed those ROE should've been prosecuted.

This just reinforces the notion that the U.S. government is willing to burn down the barn to get rid of the mice.

Mike



Not quite Mike.

You are confusing the daughter with the mother.

The daughter, Sara, was with Randy when the sniper shot him in the back. She ran towards the house and as she ( Sara) got close the mom...Vicki...opened the door. She was holding Sara's infant sister. Horiuchi at that point, shot Vicki in the head.


Mean As Nails
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Tweed] #6146520
02/03/18 01:49 PM
02/03/18 01:49 PM
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 10,911
MN
FlyinFinn Offline
trapper
FlyinFinn  Offline
trapper

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 10,911
MN
It Matters Little Who authorized the killing. These agents are supposedly college graduates, trained law enforcement officers and at least human with some command of common sense. They were the ones who ultimately decided how it would go down. They were filled with the feeling of supreme power given to them as government agents and allowed that feeling to cloud their judgement. It ended badly and I doubt very much was learned, overall. I am willing to bet if agents believe today you cut your shotgun down by 1/8" under an arbitrary measurement, would have no qualms about killing you, and your family in order that you be ultimately brought to justice at a time of their choosing. The real body responsible is our legislature, who write laws pertaining to arcane and mundane things and charge these agents-in multiple agencies through our land- with the enforcement of them. All while shielding them from any threat of prosecution when situations like RR occur.

Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Tweed] #6146661
02/03/18 04:33 PM
02/03/18 04:33 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
Y
yukon254 Offline
trapper
yukon254  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
No doubt the Govt. overreacted but Mr.Weaver could have surrendered or sent his family away. He was hit in the arm Ken, not the back.

On August 22, Lon Horiuchi, an FBI sniper hiding about 200 yards (183 metres) from the cabin at Ruby Ridge, opened fire when he believed Weaver and Harris were preparing to shoot at an FBI helicopter. The first shot hit Randy Weaver in the arm. Horiuchi fired a second shot, meant for Harris, as the men ran back into the cabin. The bullet struck Vicki Weaver in the face while she held her infant daughter behind the front door of the cabin and also injured Harris. Vicki Weaver died soon after, but her body remained in the cabin for 11 days.


do unto others as you would have them do unto you

www.grizzlycreeklodge.com
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Tweed] #6146668
02/03/18 04:43 PM
02/03/18 04:43 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 19,689
pa
H
hippie Offline
trapper
hippie  Offline
trapper
H

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 19,689
pa
One thing is for sure, and it's well known........................
You get into a shooting match with police, Feds or local yokals they ain't going away and your best chioce is to drop your weapons and fight them in court.

Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Tweed] #6146704
02/03/18 05:17 PM
02/03/18 05:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,384
kentucky
L
logger coffey Offline
trapper
logger coffey  Offline
trapper
L

Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,384
kentucky
Yep, i agree hippie, i think that was what the guy in Mich. was gona do ,but they got the straight jacket on him first lol.

Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: yukon254] #6146730
02/03/18 05:53 PM
02/03/18 05:53 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 3,660
Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Tweed Offline OP
trapper
Tweed  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 3,660
Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Originally Posted By: yukon254
Think it was Janet Reno who authorized those ROE ? And I agree it was wrong.


Was Reno appointed during Bush?

Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Tweed] #6146738
02/03/18 05:58 PM
02/03/18 05:58 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 19,689
pa
H
hippie Offline
trapper
hippie  Offline
trapper
H

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 19,689
pa
In your dreams maybe.

Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: white17] #6147031
02/03/18 10:03 PM
02/03/18 10:03 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 10,404
Northeast Oklahoma
M
Mike in A-town Offline
trapper
Mike in A-town  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 10,404
Northeast Oklahoma
Originally Posted By: white17
Originally Posted By: Mike in A-town
The account I read stated that Weaver was shot in the back as he was unlocking the shed where his son's body was. The sniper stated he was aiming for his spine but Weaver moved at the last second

And Vicki was shot as they were running back to the house after Randy had been hit in the back... So the sniper attempted a Hail Mary shot to finish the job and hit Vicki who was unseen... So in fairness Vicki Weaver was not the intended target...

However, if any one of us took a wild shot and killed a woman holding a baby we would be crucified. But according to the ROE he was good since shooting those folks on sight, armed or not, was kosher.

Again, whoever OK'ed those ROE should've been prosecuted.

This just reinforces the notion that the U.S. government is willing to burn down the barn to get rid of the mice.

Mike



Not quite Mike.

You are confusing the daughter with the mother.

The daughter, Sara, was with Randy when the sniper shot him in the back. She ran towards the house and as she ( Sara) got close the mom...Vicki...opened the door. She was holding Sara's infant sister. Horiuchi at that point, shot Vicki in the head.


No, I meant exactly what you said... I just didn't type it clearly enough to get it across. Lol

Mike


One man with a gun may control 100 others who have none.

Vladimir Lenin
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: yukon254] #6147268
02/04/18 02:51 AM
02/04/18 02:51 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,240
Minnesota
Woodsloafer72 Offline
trapper
Woodsloafer72  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,240
Minnesota
Originally Posted By: yukon254
No doubt the Govt. overreacted but Mr.Weaver could have surrendered or sent his family away. He was hit in the arm Ken, not the back.

On August 22, Lon Horiuchi, an FBI sniper hiding about 200 yards (183 metres) from the cabin at Ruby Ridge, opened fire when he believed Weaver and Harris were preparing to shoot at an FBI helicopter. The first shot hit Randy Weaver in the arm. Horiuchi fired a second shot, meant for Harris, as the men ran back into the cabin. The bullet struck Vicki Weaver in the face while she held her infant daughter behind the front door of the cabin and also injured Harris. Vicki Weaver died soon after, but her body remained in the cabin for 11 days.


If you believe Horiuchi's statement I have some ocean front property here in Minnesota to sell. White sand beach and palm trees.

Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Woodsloafer72] #6147443
02/04/18 11:02 AM
02/04/18 11:02 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
Y
yukon254 Offline
trapper
yukon254  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
Originally Posted By: Woodsloafer72
Originally Posted By: yukon254
No doubt the Govt. overreacted but Mr.Weaver could have surrendered or sent his family away. He was hit in the arm Ken, not the back.

On August 22, Lon Horiuchi, an FBI sniper hiding about 200 yards (183 metres) from the cabin at Ruby Ridge, opened fire when he believed Weaver and Harris were preparing to shoot at an FBI helicopter. The first shot hit Randy Weaver in the arm. Horiuchi fired a second shot, meant for Harris, as the men ran back into the cabin. The bullet struck Vicki Weaver in the face while she held her infant daughter behind the front door of the cabin and also injured Harris. Vicki Weaver died soon after, but her body remained in the cabin for 11 days.


If you believe Horiuchi's statement I have some ocean front property here in Minnesota to sell. White sand beach and palm trees.


Weavers account in his own book was the same, only thing they differed on was the curtain on the door being open / closed.


do unto others as you would have them do unto you

www.grizzlycreeklodge.com
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: yukon254] #6147463
02/04/18 11:27 AM
02/04/18 11:27 AM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,459
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
W
walleyed Offline
trapper
walleyed  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,459
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
Originally Posted By: yukon254
Originally Posted By: Woodsloafer72


If you believe Horiuchi's statement I have some ocean front property here in Minnesota to sell. White sand beach and palm trees.


Weavers account in his own book was the same, only thing they differed on was the curtain on the door being open / closed.


Lon Horiuchi's Own After-Action Report Of The Head-Shooting Of Vicki Weaver Obtained By Defense Team Lawyer Gerry Spence include Horiuchi's Sketches Of The Door, Curtains, and A Human Head Visable In The Door Window.

Pretty Damning Evidence Pointing To A Foolhardy, Reckless, Action By A Blood-Thirsty, Jack-Booted Federal Thug Out For Payback & Revenge For HRT Agent Bill Deegan's Death.

w


"Provisional/Interim" member of NYS Trappers Association
Jefferson Co. Fur Harvesters

I Support Non-Resident Trapping



Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: walleyed] #6147470
02/04/18 11:36 AM
02/04/18 11:36 AM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,459
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
W
walleyed Offline
trapper
walleyed  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,459
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
Anybody That Wants To Read A Great Re-Telling Of the Ruby Ridge Fiasco as Viewed By The Randy Weaver & Kevin Harris's Defense Team Account Of the Incident Should Read:

"Every Knee Shall Bow" By Jess Walter.

Great Read and Absent The Biased Media & Federal Government Accounts Of This Tragedy.

w

Last edited by walleyed; 02/04/18 11:36 AM.

"Provisional/Interim" member of NYS Trappers Association
Jefferson Co. Fur Harvesters

I Support Non-Resident Trapping



Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: walleyed] #6147531
02/04/18 12:38 PM
02/04/18 12:38 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
Y
yukon254 Offline
trapper
yukon254  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,421
Yukon
Originally Posted By: walleyed
Anybody That Wants To Read A Great Re-Telling Of the Ruby Ridge Fiasco as Viewed By The Randy Weaver & Kevin Harris's Defense Team Account Of the Incident Should Read:

"Every Knee Shall Bow" By Jess Walter.

Great Read and Absent The Biased Media & Federal Government Accounts Of This Tragedy.

w


I don't mind blaming the Feds when they go to far, and they did in this case, no doubt. What bothers me is that some seem to want to make Randy Weaver out to be a hero that rightfully stood up to the Federal Govt. No he didnt. He is/was nothing but a coward. The real tragedy is that he got members of his own family killed. He broke the law. Regardless of how you feel about the law the fact is he broke it. He could have easily sent his family to safety, then fought with everything he had, or just simply turned himself in. He chose to use his family like a shield.....disgusting human being as far as Im concerned....


do unto others as you would have them do unto you

www.grizzlycreeklodge.com
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: yukon254] #6147535
02/04/18 12:45 PM
02/04/18 12:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,001
USA MN
Snowpa Offline
trapper
Snowpa  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,001
USA MN
Originally Posted By: yukon254
Think it was Janet Reno who authorized those ROE ? And I agree it was wrong.




Reno was the real piece of S,,, Weaver was setup IMO and his family was murdered . They knew exactly what they were doing and who they were shooting


Never Confuse Stupid With Crazy
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Tweed] #6147550
02/04/18 12:55 PM
02/04/18 12:55 PM
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 3,660
Milwaukee, Wisconsin
Tweed Offline OP
trapper
Tweed  Offline OP
trapper

Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 3,660
Milwaukee, Wisconsin
I agree that Reno sucked but....she wasn't the AG until a year later....

Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: Tweed] #6147565
02/04/18 01:05 PM
02/04/18 01:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 46
Minnesot
4
4Cody4 Offline
trapper
4Cody4  Offline
trapper
4

Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 46
Minnesot
https://youtu.be/yK2oWlqaSZ8

This song is the basis of my understanding of the Ruby Ridge incident. LOL

Last edited by 4Cody4; 02/04/18 01:06 PM.
Re: Ruby Ridge PBS [Re: 4Cody4] #6147604
02/04/18 01:42 PM
02/04/18 01:42 PM
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,525
northern minnesota
B
beltrami trapper Offline
trapper
beltrami trapper  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,525
northern minnesota
Originally Posted By: 4Cody4
https://youtu.be/yK2oWlqaSZ8

This song is the basis of my understanding of the Ruby Ridge incident. LOL
Cody canada is a heck of a performer- but the Braun brothers are from Idaho, and around the age of weavers oldest daughter- just a few years older. The scenes that unfolded on that ridge hit close to home with them. They are a great group of guys to sit around the fire with after a show, every one of the Brauns are excellent musicians.

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