Well I'm joining the club of bee keeping. I'm looking at ordering my bees here in the next few days. I'm located in soith west PA in Fayette county.

Been reading a ton and attending classes and meetings. Didn't realize there was so many options of bees..... so would I be best if with italian bees or Caucasian??

I doubt you can find caucasion. They haven't been maintained as pure stock. Sue Cobey recently went through the lengthy process of bringing in germplasm (drone semen) from the caucasus region. She's crossing and back crossing on her New World Carniolans (NWC) to try to bring the caucasian back. If you're wanting something similar try the NWC. Frankly though I think beginners should go with some good locally adapted hygienic/VSH Italian stock.
The reason is the books were written with Italian behavior in mind since Italians are far and away the more common. And hygienic/VSH because we need every possible trick in the book for mite management.

The Italian and Carnolian cross are the best.

I worked up these two flyes today for one of the clubs I'm a member of.

the south western PA bee conference is next weekend. cant wait to go and learn some more.

would it be smart to order bees from two different vendors and get two different types? or should I just stick with two of the same. I have a list of a few reputable vendors that have been that have been vetted by other local bee keepers.

Two types might be a good comparison but then again the true differences between them are so slight that only experience over time can detect.

From my reading I figured but never hurts to all

If at all possible I would try for a wild swarm. I bought a package and had fought mites with that hive all fall. The nucs I bought off a guy that only has wild swarm genetics did way better with mite loads and are full of bees now.

yea I'm going to work on catching a swarm. the only swarm I saw a few years ago has a marked queen. they claim not many "wild" bees left in my area

Any Wis to be bee keepers or established bee keepers my be club is selling 3# pkgs for $100 to club members and $150 for nucs. Pm me if club members of Central Wis Bee keepers or non members for ordering . PM me

Well put my order in for nuc of mite maulers and red line italians

I am seriously considering getting a hive also, what kind of hive and equipment did you get?

I PM’d you wvuarmyeng

I am hearing good things about the Canadian bees (Saskatraz)...especially for out northern climates (if you can find them) I won't buy another bee from the typical Calif supply. They don't do well up here.

http://shop.new.valleybeesupply.com/H105-10-Frame-Beginners-Hive-Unassembled-12600-H105.htm

there is an amish guy out in eastern pa that will be at the conference feb 16th (i think, going to call tomorrow) his prices seem to be a bit cheaper then valley bee. http://foresthillbeesupply.com/ just not sure on shipping. valley has free shipping on most

where are you located?

i would look for a local bee club they are a ton of help and knowledge. anyone in your area have bees?

i did see someone selling them. i hope to have a mix of them to keep them in the next few years to have a nice spread of breads

It's going to cost you money that could be spent on trapping supplies, ask me how I know

yea well I also shoot in a trap league.... during the summer.... haha but the wife wants in on the bees so atleast I got her involved with this hobby lol

So what's best to paint or seal with? I was going to get paint but wondered if tung oil or a stain would be better... also on colors I know red looks black tu bees so would blue yellows and orange be good colors to help them differentiate between their hives

Wow rfdx our 4lb packages are 240 each if i remember right! I deleted the email and hung up my smoker! As poor as the last 4/5yrs of packages have been (up here) i’d be better off throwing the $ out the window. I dont know whats changed but we went from decent success with queens to 40% or worse! Not being able to winter as well....$500 can buy a loooot of honey for a single dude! Lol

Edit.... $231.50


Quees $40 ea

Tradbow,If I order bees it will cost me another $30 in shipping and I will have to snowmachine 40 miles round trip to pick them up.

Try Steve Victors, he has awesome queens and prices probably lower than Keith, who is crazy by the way.

Both of my packages did great and filled two deeps each, made two nucs, and a deep super each of honey.

And both still alive as of yesterday.

Steve said he had 70% overwinter survival rate last year.

Any good exterior house paint. Treat exactly as you would wood siding. Stains, oils, sealers work as well but same as house siding paints give the best protection.
Oil or latex your choice. I prefer oil as latex remains "sticky" and the boxes stick to each other and the paint can peel when unstacking. But that's just my preference.
Do not paint the interior, though some do paint the bottom boards, just the exterior.

Any color is fine, white is traditional, the bees don't care. Studies do show that geometric designs in contrasting color does help in orientation and may lesson drifting.

Jeff,

Steves Peterson is where i had been getting mine we've had extremely poor queen success rates the last 4/5 years.

Two years ago i did the 750mile rt trip for two queens in one day from keith, steve was out. By the time i was home one queen had died. The second never was accepted. That year i lost 5 hives in 2 areas so i dont believe it was area specific. Unmated queens, extremely poor acceptance, and 50-50 just poor laying, (some were slow to start....to reiterate for non arctic beeks, once behind you dont catch up )

My buddies are loosing queens as well. Both from Steve Victors and Steve Peterson. Yes Keith is crazy spendy! victors is 200 per anch prices. I dont know if theres a carge to fbks. I have not received Steve Petersons email. That should be anytime now.

Theres not enough time once you are behind. Barring Steve(s) has queens to begin with. Something has changed since i started. My buddies are doing just as poorly or worse, some are getting the from steve victors some from Steve Peterson . I didnt run bees last year because of the high failures.

Wintering is only a small part of the issue. Are you getting your queen to lay early? If not the hive comes out weak, first flights another issue. Look at wintering two fram nucs (guy in manitoba). He has a setup for getting the queens going. Seems intetesting though i prefer to let them go at their own rate. There has to be some beeks in northern russia etc who are wintering

This year has been crazy mild too!!!!

Nucs here in PA are anywhere from 140-200

Nucs makes sense. You have a laying colony.

Thanks ill see if my local stores have any "wrong" mixes discounted. Hopefully the weather dries out this weekend so I can get them painted and aired out. Supposed to rain here all week

I believe Steve P gets the same bee's as Keith and Sara on the Kenai. All the same source.

I installed my packages on April 15 was still winter here, and they were laying within days. I had Carnie queens and going to try and mate them this year and get daughters if they make it.

I started two nucs with mail ordered queens, from the strongest hive, one Russian queen from Iowa, and one Carni from New York state. They both made it alive and healthy and were excepted and laying good except the Russian she shut down during the dearth like they always do, don't get Russians they shut down in our summers and never recover.

And if you dont treat for mites, its all a waste of time. I treated twice last summer with MAQs.

Queen survivalability seems to be an issue everywhere. I'm in Georgia and the nucs and packages I've gotten in recent years are replacing queens the year they're installed sometimes immediately.
In talking with producers we're chalking this up to early and poorly mated queens being rushed out the door to make up the nucs/packages.
The best luck I'm seeing is one local producer that raises his own queens to make up his nukes and as a result is raising queens later under better local conditions rather than shipping in early queens from florida/hawaii/california. I'm also preferring to requeen with queens raised in June or later.

I've pretty much come to accept it that any new non swarm colony I start is going to need a new queen within a few months.

Have you tried getting bees from the north? I know they shop a lot from south to north. You would think that bees in the north moving south might be a tad hardier but would the warmer temps affect them? I'm just starting so I just know whay I've read and learned from my cousins

Make extra nucs/splits in the summer from any stock that survives the winters up here. Even if it costs you some "initial" honey production. Once you get into the habit of it, you soon have far more hives and nucs than you can deal with. Replace any dead outs with the nucs. THEN the honey rolls in.

I quit buying bees. It will bankrupt you.

Jeff. Winterings not as big of an issue as the die offs come spring, queens dont start laying soon enough. Thats barring you successfully winter which on normal winters isnt very high outside . Petersons averages are pretty low at best 10-40% of 30 +\- hives. This year would be a great year to winter one! However the queens not laying when the mature bees starts dying. Its like starting a year with a 1/2lb package if ypur lucky. First flights are brutal as well. Sun sets temps drop bees die in the snow. Lots!!!! So u get hives through. Theyre weak and never catch up for winter. Thats fairbanks area.

I had both rc’s and carnies . They both did fine for me. I was meaning when something happens. Ie queen gets whacked that puts us behind quite a bit, more you than me. Even 1 week without puts us 3-4 weeks without brood by the time you hive, a queen is accepted, lays and brood hatches.

Yes, that's pretty much the story I hear, I just wonder how many of those hives went into winter fed, treated with enough stores and prepped properly for winter.

I read studies that cold don't kill them, and you guys in FBKS have nice warm summers, and early spring compared to here.

I am expecting both of my big hives to make it if I don't screw up. They are not small clusters at this point from the roar I hear. But if they are even NUC size come spring I am money ahead, rather than buying packages.

Fingers crossed.

Sorry: wvuarmyeng didn't mean to steer your thread in the wrong direction.

Haha all good yukonjeff I love reading and learning all I can. Weather here in pennsyvania has been cold and damp. It's actually almost 60 today but been raining since Friday

wvu - we just started classes with the local organization. it runs through the end of march for 2 hours each saturday. you could check and see if your local organizations has somethign similar.

Headed to the western pa conference in Monroeville on saturday

Jeff, cold WILL kill them! Forcing them to over work to stay warm shortening life span, to warm theyre too active and raises the need for flights. We also have a much higher moisture problem come spring.

Its not that they (we) cant get them through winter. Its that the bees are dying faster than the queens replacing them. One day u think lifes good, the next your colony numbers tank! For me its a fast die off. I have left 5 gallons of honey (thats what came off the next spring) on the hives. I wonder what was wasted trying to pull it off. Theres no pollen coming in nor nectar so laying is low to non existent. The fella who wrote up the winter in 2 frame nuc article has another one on single deeps. He is able to control temps to get the queen laying sooner. My concern is the need for flights. First flights you loose a ton of bees due to the fast temps at we think the snow. Its pretty amazing how many hsteve peterson looses. Between this and no brood, hives come out barely surviving.

If youre serious about it you should pick up ‘beekeeping in western canada’. They have a good section on setting up a building allowing you to keep moisture and temperatures at optimum (35-40 degrees) if i remember right).

I think winterings worth doing up here if you can. If nothing else when you loose a package queen u can always do the news paper combination. Peterson has weighed them and stated what he looses in honey isnt worth trying to winter. Its a tough pill to swallow as a beek in the failing situation we are in nation wide.

I have pretty much given up on packages as they seem to lose/kill the Queen, I have mapped my local area and have a pretty good idea where the swarms show up every year and am going to try to rebuild with swarms.