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Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169210
02/24/18 11:10 PM
02/24/18 11:10 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,981
Wyoming
S
Starvalleytrappe Offline
trapper
Starvalleytrappe  Offline
trapper
S

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,981
Wyoming
Well, in the lower 48 everyone seems to compare state auctions against nafa auctions. State auctions do not separate damaged or section 3 goods from the average.


Wyoming fur trader

chrismhcc@yahoo.com
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169228
02/24/18 11:28 PM
02/24/18 11:28 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,076
SE Nebraska
T
trapperne Offline
trapper
trapperne  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,076
SE Nebraska
Where do you think the country buyer gets crap, the trapper. Trust me for some trappers section threes are the norm.


Follow me on Facebook @ Lincoln Fur
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169229
02/24/18 11:28 PM
02/24/18 11:28 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 5,073
montana
R
red mt Offline
trapper
red mt  Offline
trapper
R

Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 5,073
montana
Now Boco this was point to your comment on guys that sold country verses nafa ,FHA these pelts get into the offering and sell ,then they should be counted is my point.


Kenneth schoening
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: Boco] #6169236
02/24/18 11:35 PM
02/24/18 11:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,446
Houghton Lake, MI
strike2x Offline
trapper
strike2x  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,446
Houghton Lake, MI
Originally Posted By: Boco
I want to know the avg of sec 3 skins to know if they are worth shipping or not.We pay royalties on skins here and a beaver that is only worth 3 dollars as a sec 3 will put you in the hole after royalty and commission,etc.If they are 5 or 6 avg they may get sent.
I get maybe 3 or 4 sec 3 skins from dmg out of a few hundred.I don't want to see those type of skins in the auction avg,it would not be a true avg of a normal trappers collection.
That stuff must come from country buyers or something because trappers here anyway don't get half their catch damaged.

If you get any they are part of your average. Looks to me like you are just a normal trapper that has a large share of good fur but still normal.... I enjoy your pictures and reading most of your posts but you seem to think you are better than the rest of us. May God bless you with more good fur...


Wish I had more time to trap....
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169243
02/24/18 11:42 PM
02/24/18 11:42 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
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Boco  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
Not so,Are you telling me that a lot of your fur is sec 3 fur?
I could show you reams of auction receipts with hardly any sec 3 fur,and it is the same with all the trappers I know.Not just me.
I see posts all the time on here of trappers tossing fur that is not worth skinning or shipping-sick,damaged etc.That is the right thing to do.I don't know any trappers who ship that kind of fur.I would like to know who ships this kind of fur?maybe nuisance trappers who have already been paid for removing an animal and think they may get an extra buck or two?I trap nuisance beaver,they are not marketable,I would not ship it.This stuff shouldn't be sold to the auction house,and when it is it definitely should not be avged in with in season marketable fur.

Last edited by Boco; 02/24/18 11:54 PM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169259
02/24/18 11:57 PM
02/24/18 11:57 PM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,446
Houghton Lake, MI
strike2x Offline
trapper
strike2x  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,446
Houghton Lake, MI
Southern fur will never be as nice as northern and yet they still allow southern fur to be shipped. That has to equate in the average some way...


Wish I had more time to trap....
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169262
02/24/18 11:58 PM
02/24/18 11:58 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
trapper
Boco  Offline
trapper
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
As far as I know,prime southern fur is not sec 3 fur.


Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169263
02/24/18 11:58 PM
02/24/18 11:58 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,076
SE Nebraska
T
trapperne Offline
trapper
trapperne  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,076
SE Nebraska
Not mine, but as a buyer I can tell you your fur and my fur are not the norm. There are so many guys that start to early, trap to late, don’t know how to handle fur, don’t know or don’t care if their fur is good or not and it all ends up somewhere, somehow some way.


Follow me on Facebook @ Lincoln Fur
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169267
02/25/18 12:01 AM
02/25/18 12:01 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
trapper
Boco  Offline
trapper
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
And I'm glad they avg that stuff separately,and so should the guys that ship it so they know how much it is costing them to do that.And others too who may be thinking about trapping early or late,or skinning mangy or dmgd fur.This is the avg I will get as compared to the avg I will get if I trap in season and don't skin mangy or dmgd fur.
This is why the fur is sectioned and averaged this way.

Last edited by Boco; 02/25/18 12:03 AM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: trapperne] #6169270
02/25/18 12:03 AM
02/25/18 12:03 AM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,134
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
trapper
Dirt  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,134
Armpit, ak
Originally Posted By: trapperne
Not mine, but as a buyer I can tell you your fur and my fur are not the norm. There are so many guys that start to early, trap to late, don’t know how to handle fur, don’t know or don’t care if their fur is good or not and it all ends up somewhere, somehow some way.


Sounds like some kind of hobby?


Who is John Galt?
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169271
02/25/18 12:03 AM
02/25/18 12:03 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,076
SE Nebraska
T
trapperne Offline
trapper
trapperne  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,076
SE Nebraska
And I’ll say this, and even though outside of coyotes the harvest is down I guarantee the percent of low grade fur is up because serious trappers who care about catching quality didn’t go, while hobby guys and newbies and kids killed most of the fur resulting in poorer quality fur. Then add in all the guys chasing dollar signs after coyotes who started way to early and went way to late because they don’t know any better.


Follow me on Facebook @ Lincoln Fur
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: Dirt] #6169272
02/25/18 12:04 AM
02/25/18 12:04 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,076
SE Nebraska
T
trapperne Offline
trapper
trapperne  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,076
SE Nebraska
Originally Posted By: Dirt
Originally Posted By: trapperne
Not mine, but as a buyer I can tell you your fur and my fur are not the norm. There are so many guys that start to early, trap to late, don’t know how to handle fur, don’t know or don’t care if their fur is good or not and it all ends up somewhere, somehow some way.


Sounds like some kind of hobby?


Not sure what that’s supposed to mean


Follow me on Facebook @ Lincoln Fur
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: walleyed] #6169286
02/25/18 12:12 AM
02/25/18 12:12 AM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 14,306
Montana
USMC47 🦫 Offline
trapper
USMC47 🦫  Offline
trapper

Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 14,306
Montana
Originally Posted By: walleyed
Originally Posted By: coonman220
Not sure what happen, sometimes in past I rember good sale or not many coon sell an pick better ones out, next sale, all sell, no idea


What The Heck Did Coonman Just Say ?

Can Anyone Translate For Me ? laugh

w
I think the Jack Links sasquatch is playing with his phone. Lol.


The deadliest weapon in the world is a Marine and his rifle.

www.derricks-nm.com
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: Boco] #6169316
02/25/18 12:56 AM
02/25/18 12:56 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,148
Illinois
ringtailtrapper Offline
trapper
ringtailtrapper  Offline
trapper

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,148
Illinois
Originally Posted By: Boco
I'd be pretty disappointed if my avg wasn't a good bit above the auction avg.I have seen the bins full of very poor fur they have to lot and try to sell.



Boco, please allow me to drive you to the ER, because your shoulder must surly be dislocated from patting yourself on the back. laugh LOL

Boco, down here in the lower 48 we have a certain groups that harvest fur via other methods other than trapping. Coon hunters are the first group that comes to mind. I would also like to add that within hunter, and trapper education many young outdoorsmen/women are taught to utilize as much as possible, thus instilling a certain aspect of respect for the species they harvest. Many focus group studies have been done, and it was found that peoples opinion of trapping was very positive in cases where the species harvested were utilized to their full potential. With that said, sure some low quality fur is coming to a show near you soon. Coon hunters have a real hard time grading fur up a 40" hickory tree at 2Am, and while having to deal with dogs to boot. Buyers see all types of offerings, good, bad, and of course the ugly. There will be times buyers will look at the collection they have purchased overall, and wonder to themselves, what the heck have I done. I know your going to tell me the buyers need to educate their customers, and to some degree I would agree, but some are going to continue no matter how much you tell/show them. To some degree even beating them to death upon price in many case doesn't matter. Buyer have to market this fur some place, and there are many times low grades will move way before upper end goods.

RTT


For Sale, Quality Racing Possums
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169325
02/25/18 01:04 AM
02/25/18 01:04 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
trapper
Boco  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
RTT,you missed the point,Sec 3 fur should always be avged separately from marketable fur.
Of course there will always be some coming in from hobbyists and uneducated.This is not representative of a professional trappers collection sent to auction,and this is why it is always avged separately by both auction houses.
I know the trappers around here want to see an avg that reflects what they target and sell.
They also want to know what sec 3 fur avg is from sale to sale to make sure if they ship it they wont lose money on royalty and other deductions.

Last edited by Boco; 02/25/18 01:05 AM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169342
02/25/18 01:23 AM
02/25/18 01:23 AM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,134
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
trapper
Dirt  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,134
Armpit, ak
IMO the fur industry is reaping the rewards of cheap prices. You want suppliers to supply you product at a loss, then want them to care about what their fur is worth. You have convinced many trappers to trap for fun, good luck making them care about trapping to maximize the value in dollars of their fun. Then you got guys keeping score in their sport by how much they catch, not whether what they catch is profitable. The Auctions got them playing a lottery to keep them trapping at a loss. The ADC guys need a dumping ground. The industry wants cheap fur, you're getting it. smile


Who is John Galt?
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169363
02/25/18 02:21 AM
02/25/18 02:21 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,628
evansville Indiana age72
don Wolf Offline
trapper
don Wolf  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,628
evansville Indiana age72
I personally think that if you catch it, you put it up. It is a waste of a resource if you throw away an animal you harvested. In the lower 48, it is impossible to not catch a certain percent of section III fur. In our world we have lots of things that go wrong with our wild life. from sow coons that have a very late litter to muskrat that have very late litters. We then have bugs and lots of different bugs to contend with. Then we have disease. Then we have roads that have big machines called cars that hit animals that cause damage but don't kill the animal. Then we have animals that live in conditions that either don't let the fur prime right or don't give the animal the nourishment to produce a nice coat. Then in places we have animals that get into fights because of an early breading season or just get into fights because they just plain hate each other> Boco, you must live in animal heaven where conditions are always right to produce no 1 fur or you throw a lot of fur away. Come to the lower 48 and you will get quite an education.

Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169378
02/25/18 03:42 AM
02/25/18 03:42 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
trapper
Boco  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
No thanks,And don't think it is only me,all the trappers I know here,and I know a lot,dont target unprimed fur,and don't ship damaged fur that is worth 2 dollars that they have to pay 3 dollars royalty on.Sure we catch nuisance animals out of season,but the unmarketable ones don't go to the auction.The auction even tells you they don't want unmarketable fur.Why do you think they put out fur handling manuals with all that info repeated over and over again.We need to present a decent product to the international buyers.
Maybe you could come here and get an education also.
Anyway what does that have to do with averaging the poor fur out separate from the fur trade fur?It is to the benefit of the producer to know what each section of fur is worth on avg so he can make the proper marketing decisions.
And if you encourage young trappers to put up mangy and damaged fur that is not wanted by the trade you are not doing our profession any favours,in more ways than one,thats for sure.

Last edited by Boco; 02/25/18 03:51 AM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169393
02/25/18 07:06 AM
02/25/18 07:06 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,589
Timmins Ontario
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gibb Offline
trapper
gibb  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,589
Timmins Ontario
Boco, is right in what he is telling you, for how many years now have both auction houses asked shippers not to send no value fur.
Third section stuff should be used as bait and or discarded. Nobody wants the stuff and it just cost the whole industry money it does not have. If you are buying, I honestly suggest don't buy that sh-t. If a coon hunter wants to start the first of Oct. don't buy the stuff.

Creaming of the best and selling elsewhere then shipping the garbage to auction is not helping anybody.Before you ship clean out the crap first, if you have to buy it to get the better goods, do the industry a favour and burn the crap.

This business is way past being able to absorb summer skins, road kills, mangy, lice infested, rubbed out pelts. The only market thriving right now is the coyote ruff market and for that you need a finished well furred skin. The thousands of pieces of crap that will come in hoping to get a few bucks just kills this market.

Re: NAFA predictions [Re: mr8point] #6169411
02/25/18 07:55 AM
02/25/18 07:55 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 62
north dakota
Y
yotegtr Offline
trapper
yotegtr  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 62
north dakota
Correct in not sending unsaleable fur, but if a guy from the states sends 100 coyotes he has to include every single one of them when he tells me his avg. if he doesn’t it’s not a true avg. I don’t care about the five that sold for $120, I wanna know what his avg is on all 100 put together. Everyone is so jacked up to tell you about their highest coyote but doesn’t say a peep of the $6,$5,$4,$3,$2,$1 and even 50 cent ones! They also usually tell you the avg. before commission which also is not their true avg.

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