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Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6292767
08/02/18 02:36 PM
08/02/18 02:36 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,751
Central, SD
Law Dog Offline
trapper
Law Dog  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,751
Central, SD
Healthcare only cost the people that have worked for something that they are not willing to lose, if you have nothing to your name you will get all of the healthcare you need and never have to pay for it! If you have no property, savings or credit to worry about your in the free healthcare business and can use the ER like a office visit.


Run up all of the bills you want we don't have debtors prisons any more, they will just file a lean on future incomes or transactions they might recoup money from. Piece of cake drink do drugs and smoke all you want your still getting it for free!


Was born in a Big City Will die in the Country OK with that!

Jerry Herbst
Re: Socialism [Re: Donnersurvivor] #6292800
08/02/18 03:41 PM
08/02/18 03:41 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,577
MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
T
Trapper7 Offline
trapper
Trapper7  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,577
MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
Originally Posted By: Donnersurvivor
Originally Posted By: Trapper7


Then why do we have so many people coming to America for our healthcare? It's because it's the best in the world and for some it's free and these are the ones who use it for the tiniest malady.

Keep in mind that when you are catering to people who are getting free healthcare, somebody's got to pay for it. It will drive the cost of healthcare higher which will make insurance rates go up as well.


To be fair many Americans are also going overseas or to Mexico for cheaper healthcare because they cannot afford it here even with insurance. I have stated I am all ears if someone has a solution for healthcare in our country but first we need to accept certain aspects of it (price) are not working. Simply stating the GOVT is the problem with healthcare may be partially true but to think GOVT involvement is the only thing driving cost is a poor assumption.


Most of those going to Mexico are going because they don't have healthcare or are being baited by some new miracle drug that will cure their ailment. Steve McQueen is a good example to Mexico for a drug made from apricot seeds. Research later learned that this was all a hoax.

Part of the reason for the crazy prices are too much free healthcare, pharmaceutical companies charging exorbitant prices stating research costs, etc.

How do you think hospitals, doctors and insurance companies are supposed to make up for the government-mandated free healthcare? Low income people that qualify can get Medical Assistance (MA). It covers everything from a stubbed toe to open heart surgery. I know a single mother who is on it. She has gone into emergency for things like morning sickness, cut finger, headaches, bloody nose, etc. I have health insurance. I've never gone in for any of those things. Know why she does? Answer: Because it's free!

The single payer system or government-run healthcare isn't the answer. Just look at the mess government has made with medicare and social security. Social security is one of the poorest returns on an investment system ever seen and yet it seems every year we keep hearing about how it's about to go broke and how they can't give a cost of living increase because the money isn't there this year.


I don't care how nice the hand soap smells, you should never walk out of the restroom sniffing your fingers.
Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6292834
08/02/18 04:45 PM
08/02/18 04:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,524
MN
D
Donnersurvivor Offline
trapper
Donnersurvivor  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,524
MN
I am all ears if you have solutions to fixing health care provided they are realistic. Denying health care to poor single mothers who cannot pay is not a realistic solution.

Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6292841
08/02/18 04:59 PM
08/02/18 04:59 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,751
Central, SD
Law Dog Offline
trapper
Law Dog  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,751
Central, SD
Covered under Medicaid!


Was born in a Big City Will die in the Country OK with that!

Jerry Herbst
Re: Socialism [Re: Marty] #6292846
08/02/18 05:06 PM
08/02/18 05:06 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 16,170
ny
U
upstateNY Offline
trapper
upstateNY  Offline
trapper
U

Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 16,170
ny
Originally Posted By: Marty
Originally Posted By: upstateNY
I would like a bunch of free stuff.


Let me know if that works out and I will join ya.
LOL I cant afford any more free stuff.


the wheels of the gods turn very slowly
Re: Socialism [Re: Donnersurvivor] #6292848
08/02/18 05:07 PM
08/02/18 05:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,426
Missouri
ol' dad Offline
trapper
ol' dad  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,426
Missouri
Originally Posted By: Donnersurvivor
I am all ears if you have solutions to fixing health care provided they are realistic. Denying health care to poor single mothers who cannot pay is not a realistic solution.


I must have forgotten what amendment it was that grants people the right to free healthcare.

ol'dad


"I season my food with hunger"
Re: Socialism [Re: Marty] #6292877
08/02/18 05:48 PM
08/02/18 05:48 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17,456
Wheaton Ks
L
lee steinmeyer Offline
trapper
lee steinmeyer  Offline
trapper
L

Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 17,456
Wheaton Ks
Originally Posted By: Marty
There are a few around here who still have Bernie bumper stickers on their vehicles. they are pretty much well intentioned morons.



Yeah, and they are all connected to the dang college down there Marty. They are teaching our kids the wrong things.....and have been for many years. Years of indoctrination from lib professors that we have not been able to combat. And every year it starts earlier in our school systems. We need a plan to take our education system away from these jackwads!


YOU CAN IGNORE REALITY, BUT YOU CANNOT IGNORE THE CONSEQUENCES OF IGNORING REALITY.

http://www.lptraplinesupply.com
Re: Socialism [Re: lee steinmeyer] #6292887
08/02/18 05:59 PM
08/02/18 05:59 PM
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269
Indiana
B
brianmall Offline
trapper
brianmall  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269
Indiana
Originally Posted By: lee steinmeyer
Originally Posted By: Marty
There are a few around here who still have Bernie bumper stickers on their vehicles. they are pretty much well intentioned morons.



Yeah, and they are all connected to the dang college down there Marty. They are teaching our kids the wrong things.....and have been for many years. Years of indoctrination from lib professors that we have not been able to combat. And every year it starts earlier in our school systems. We need a plan to take our education system away from these jackwads!


Home school

Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6292889
08/02/18 06:03 PM
08/02/18 06:03 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,751
Central, SD
Law Dog Offline
trapper
Law Dog  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,751
Central, SD
What I hate is you drive by a hospital and all them dead people piled up outside that could not be seen for no insurance! Oh wait come to think of it I have never seen that, Never mind. LOL wink


Was born in a Big City Will die in the Country OK with that!

Jerry Herbst
Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6293309
08/03/18 09:13 AM
08/03/18 09:13 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,895
michigan,USA
S
seniortrap Offline
trapper
seniortrap  Offline
trapper
S

Joined: May 2012
Posts: 5,895
michigan,USA
Quote:
brianmall: Since its passing, it has never been enforced due to the weakness of the party, but still remains a law, never ruled unconstitutional or repealed.


Its still illegal to have here. But as usual, the D.C. politicians won't do much of anything at all times. Maybe too many communists in there (Democrats)??????


Vietnam--1967 46th. Const./Combat Engineers

"Chaotic action is preferable to orderly inaction."
"After the first shot, all plans go out the window!"
Re: Socialism [Re: ol' dad] #6293455
08/03/18 12:37 PM
08/03/18 12:37 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,524
MN
D
Donnersurvivor Offline
trapper
Donnersurvivor  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,524
MN
Originally Posted By: ol' dad
Originally Posted By: Donnersurvivor
I am all ears if you have solutions to fixing health care provided they are realistic. Denying health care to poor single mothers who cannot pay is not a realistic solution.


I must have forgotten what amendment it was that grants people the right to free healthcare.

ol'dad


Again, what is the realistic solution? Remember we need to get enough people to vote in representatives to pass that solution, so what are we to do to fix this?

Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6293457
08/03/18 12:40 PM
08/03/18 12:40 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 19,688
pa
H
hippie Offline
trapper
hippie  Offline
trapper
H

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 19,688
pa
No one is denied healthcare in the U.S. Donner, so get that out of your head.

Hospitals here have this posted on their doors.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Medical_Treatment_and_Active_Labor_Act


Last edited by hippie; 08/03/18 12:46 PM.
Re: Socialism [Re: hippie] #6293474
08/03/18 01:14 PM
08/03/18 01:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,524
MN
D
Donnersurvivor Offline
trapper
Donnersurvivor  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,524
MN
Originally Posted By: hippie
No one is denied healthcare in the U.S. Donner, so get that out of your head.

Hospitals here have this posted on their doors.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Medical_Treatment_and_Active_Labor_Act



I never said anyone was did I? I said healthcare is to expensive the replies to that were "to many people us it for free" I understand and agree with that, my question is then so what are we going to do to get prices under control? Are we going to start denying health care to those who cant afford it? Are we going to let people die outside of hospitals? Obviously that is not going to happen so again what is the solution? How do we make healthcare affordable? I truly do not like government involvement so give me a good answer and I will switch sides in a second but first I need to know how to fix the problem of unaffordable healthcare.

Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6293478
08/03/18 01:18 PM
08/03/18 01:18 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 19,688
pa
H
hippie Offline
trapper
hippie  Offline
trapper
H

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 19,688
pa
Maybe i misunderstood your statement, "Denying healthcare to single poor single mothers who can't pay is not a realistic solution".

Denying healthcare i don't see happening in the U.S. ever.


Last edited by hippie; 08/03/18 01:25 PM.
Re: Socialism [Re: hippie] #6293486
08/03/18 01:31 PM
08/03/18 01:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,524
MN
D
Donnersurvivor Offline
trapper
Donnersurvivor  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,524
MN
Originally Posted By: hippie
Maybe i misunderstood your statement, "Denying healthcare to single poor single mothers who can't pay is not a realistic solution".

Denying healthcare i don't see happening in the U.S. ever.



As long as we let women vote we are going to have health care for all, I can guarantee it. So my question is how do we make it affordable? Right now people are basically forced into jobs that they hate simply because it is the only way to afford health insurance. If you have a family and some savings you cannot quit your job to start a business because your family will lose health insurance, farmers have to work a off the job farm just to afford health insurance, the prices for medical care are outrageous and we need to get them under control otherwise we will become equivalent to coal miners of old paying in scrip at the company store and never being able to afford to leave.

Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6293491
08/03/18 01:39 PM
08/03/18 01:39 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 20,914
North East Kansas
Marty Offline
trapper
Marty  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 20,914
North East Kansas
The 'poor' woman on welfare not only gets more $ by having another kid that she can not afford to raise but the whole hospital bill is paid for by the taxpayer...kid is raised on taxpayer $....food, housing, clothes, medical expenses, and the list goes on.


E
'Honey Badger Militia'
Sleep, the anti woke adote.
Re: Socialism [Re: Donnersurvivor] #6293495
08/03/18 01:48 PM
08/03/18 01:48 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,324
Hancock Co., Indiana
Kart29 Offline
trapper
Kart29  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,324
Hancock Co., Indiana
Originally Posted By: Donnersurvivor
I am all ears if you have solutions to fixing health care provided they are realistic. Denying health care to poor single mothers who cannot pay is not a realistic solution.


The way you phrase it "denying health care to poor single mothers..." makes it sound like somebody desires to prevent somebody else from getting healthcare. It makes it sound like the people in authority have a free will choice to decide who gets health care and who doesn't. I disagree with the very foundational concept that it is within the power of government or society to determine to whom they will grant health care services and to whom they will not. That's just starting off from a wrong foundation - which is where most of our society typically is.

"Ugly truth, freedom rings". Nobody deserves health care. If I or anyone else wants healthcare we should be free to go buy it at our own expense. We should not expect anyone else to buy it for us.

I will guarantee you that part of the reason we have so many single-parent families and children born outside of marriage is because our society has ameliorated most of the negative consequences of making babies outside of marriage. If it weren't for welfare programs, women would be much more reluctant to have babies without a committed husband. And maybe boys would grow start growing up to be real men if they weren't getting all the milk for free.

I'm very much in favor of charity and taking care of the widows, orphans, and other needy. But handling this through the force of government is morally wrong. It's just flat WRONG. There's nothing honorable about it any way. When we as a society do things that are WRONG, there are negative consequences.


What from Christ that soul can sever,
Bound by everlasting bands?
None shall take thee
From the Strength of Israel's hands.

Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6293497
08/03/18 01:51 PM
08/03/18 01:51 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 20,914
North East Kansas
Marty Offline
trapper
Marty  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 20,914
North East Kansas
Man living in the house = not as much government $.

Having unwed babies is a profession in some places.


E
'Honey Badger Militia'
Sleep, the anti woke adote.
Re: Socialism [Re: AntiGov] #6293504
08/03/18 01:54 PM
08/03/18 01:54 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,751
Central, SD
Law Dog Offline
trapper
Law Dog  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,751
Central, SD
I don't think anybody would have a problem with these programs but it's the rampant abuse of the system many people have a problem with! Welfare in many places is a career now and it taught as a way of life. Many won't improve themselves for fear of losing the free stuff what a cycle of thinking that must be.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JG71gZjzz4

Last edited by Law Dog; 08/03/18 01:59 PM.

Was born in a Big City Will die in the Country OK with that!

Jerry Herbst
Re: Socialism [Re: Kart29] #6293508
08/03/18 02:02 PM
08/03/18 02:02 PM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124
McGrath, AK
W
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
white17  Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
W

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124
McGrath, AK
Originally Posted By: Kart29
Originally Posted By: Donnersurvivor
I am all ears if you have solutions to fixing health care provided they are realistic. Denying health care to poor single mothers who cannot pay is not a realistic solution.


The way you phrase it "denying health care to poor single mothers..." makes it sound like somebody desires to prevent somebody else from getting healthcare. It makes it sound like the people in authority have a free will choice to decide who gets health care and who doesn't. I disagree with the very foundational concept that it is within the power of government or society to determine to whom they will grant health care services and to whom they will not. That's just starting off from a wrong foundation - which is where most of our society typically is.

"Ugly truth, freedom rings". Nobody deserves health care. If I or anyone else wants healthcare we should be free to go buy it at our own expense. We should not expect anyone else to buy it for us.

I will guarantee you that part of the reason we have so many single-parent families and children born outside of marriage is because our society has ameliorated most of the negative consequences of making babies outside of marriage. If it weren't for welfare programs, women would be much more reluctant to have babies without a committed husband. And maybe boys would grow start growing up to be real men if they weren't getting all the milk for free.

I'm very much in favor of charity and taking care of the widows, orphans, and other needy. But handling this through the force of government is morally wrong. It's just flat WRONG. There's nothing honorable about it any way. When we as a society do things that are WRONG, there are negative consequences.


X2 Well said !


Mean As Nails
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