Are you direct selling any coyotes to CG?

sorry that's my business....not going to go there!

Fair enough.

Is Any body selling coyotes to CG? Direct sales or through NAFA?

Anybody?

CG will be buying at some western state auctions and yes there are some that sell direct.

I don’t have a problem with them buying at auctions. That’s a private company looking for a product to trim their jackets. It’s far over reaching though to try to make the entire nation comply to that. The BMP mental conditioning made this certification pill easier to accept. These type things happen incrementally if allowed to and then you wake up one day and wonder how it all happened.

I asked that because a while back the guys on here that favor CG indicated that Cg bought the ruffs already made from other manufacturers. CG being the end user, so to speak.

When they are all certified, they will all be marketing the same product, like before with only more B.S. paper. They still will probably be selling most below production cost, especially since production costs of certification bologna will be added. I often wonder why business paints it self into a corner?

Of course none of this is reactive; it's all proactive. Nobody is reacting to anti- ranch mink forces in Europe.

Dirt makes a very valet point in regards to certification, we never know what will be the next requirement of trappers in order to remain certified. The big question who is doing the certifying ?? What body of authority is in charge of this so called certification, and if it's all done upon the honor system, then how long before someone with half a brain figures out that their certification is not worth the paper it's drawn up on, because the certification has no basis, just someone that has to answer a few questions with little or no proof to back up the statements.


I would think a trapper going through a state sponsored trapper education course, and having completed that course with a passing grade, that seems more like what I would call a real certification process than just answering a few question on a piece of paper. Has anyone ever thought that they might be making just to easy ?? Why would someone be so willing to give out such a credential with only answering a few questions ??

Could this be a means to like Dirt said, "paint someone into a corner", and maybe that someone is a trapper ?? Those that choose to sign such a document should at least get your attorney to give it a look over first, and see if there might be in anyway you could be held liable in some manner you might not be aware of. Fur buyers better also be on their toes with something like this in place, it might be the very thing to could in some way close the doors to every country buyer out there, but then again that would fit right into the play book of the company introducing this line of BS into our world.


RTT

A trapper certification maybe all that is needed.Problem is not all states require Trappers ed.I think this thread has taken some wild twists and turns.Nobody has said they like thought of a "fur beauracacy".The fact is in this day and age almost all goods and commodities that are business transactions have regulation and paper work,so far its been the buyer that's had to deal with it and not the trapper.The fact that we've been able to escape it this far,considering how controversial it is is a miracle in itself.The question is how bad is it going to get,if we let the ARF's run AND WE DON'T GET INVOLVED,they will use it as an opportunity to finally get rid of it once and for all.Whats it going to be?

Here in KS it is illegal for a buyer not to obtain and record name and license # of every body he/she buys fur from. Nafa requires that on every bag of fur. Where is an auction going on at here in the states or in Canada, where that information is not required? I don't understand this traceability thing at all. See no way its a good thing. Very easy now to trace the source of fur.

The rules and regulations painting us into a corner is exactly what I was talking about. I know with govt. regulated BMP’s at first suggested soon have a way of morphing into a law. I also know from where I work rules and regulations paint you into a corner to the point the actual job is forgotten about and left behind while you’re trying to adhere to all the hoops that you’ve been regulated to follow.
I am of the opinion that each STATE should manage their wildlife, all states are different and no national broad reaching rules should apply, and if you are a legal licensed trapper in that STATE that is enough to satisfy all parties involved. That is why 30 years ago I was highly suspect of the BMP process and this latest marketing ploy I see as a back door effort to achieve the goal they’ve had for decades. But, I’m just a dumb ole hillbilly.

Starting with cites then bmp and now this. All were supposed to appease the soccer moms we need to have wearing fur. Yet pretty much all anyone ever hears still to this day is that animals are tortured for their fur. This aint gonna change anything.

It could very well hurt us however. Its still illegal to import seal products,and any sort of ivory. No matter there is no ecological basis for it. Anybody with a cell phone internet connection can find that out but its still illegal. People for the most part think polar bear populations are dwindling. They just got an injunction to stop grizzly bear hunting. How does this traceability thing alleviate ignorance??????????????????

If all states had a Trapper Ed.that maybe all that would be required.Go back and read PSB'S and Don's take on this again:nobody likes this,and ,yes,its a lot of political nonsense.But ignoring what's facing us is not going to make it go away.Kytrapper,we're all dumb ole hillbillies.We'd love it if it could just go back to the way things used to be,more common sense and less nonsense.Before the anti's had political muscle.Before our game dept.'s became politically correct and started with seasons and quotas that made no sense but are paraded under the banner "scientific wildlife management".Unfortunatly,we live in the 21st century trying to protect an age old rural tradition in a 21st century urban society.

CITIES was forced on us thru the Endangered Species Act,nothing voluntary there.

Yep..Knowing what's on the other side..Why would you jump through the hoop in the first place..LOL...Good post Hippie..

I know I'm supposed to be a NAFA hater because I post critically about some of their less than savory business practices and some stuff they do that is plain goofy IMO, but I don't think NAFA is leading the charge on this. They could have done this right when CG wanted it. Vision 2020 looks like a delaying tactic to shine a customer they got caught lying to about the source of their coyotes. Or maybe CG's marketing of Canadian certified coyotes was their own lie?

Certifying the welfare of animals on farms cannot be compared to certifying the various methods of harvest of a wild animal. IMO

P.S. I like how guys on here who painted themselves into the "Mandatory Trapper Ed" corner, are trying to use this as cover. I guess that ain't going to work.

Traceability and certification are two sides of the same coin, with certification being the real concern here. Canada's system is the template for certification. So it's not simply certifying that trappers are following the rules; it's the certification of the types of traps and methods we can and cannot use that'll virtually end our use of footholds as we know it today.

If we adopted anything close to what the Canadian system is requiring in the next several years, you can say goodbye to the footholds we're using now - Victor Soft Catches will be our future. Two posts on that topic:

https://trapperman.com/forum/ubbthreads....ona#Post6284113
https://trapperman.com/forum/ubbthreads....ona#Post6284337

I'd buy new traps if 100 KS coyotes would again buy a new 4wd pickup. I don't see that happening. No matter what some people will always think if they drive around a section of prairie and don't see a coyote its cause there aint one there. That killing them is morally wrong and trappers and hunters are destroying the "balance of nature".

Im not sure how to change their perception. Truth isn't working. They live in a world of concrete and asphalt. TV is reality to them. Look at some of the Tman posts. TV is reality on here too, at least to many.

If we get American and Canadian women wearing fur we have a market again. Simple as that. Many women in the rest of the world will follow their lead. Except maybe places like England. England is a morass of nut cases. I think they may have San Francisco beat.