I believe the attitude about folks that work hard and are successful is a product of the trophy for participation mentality that is so prevalent in our society today. It does not encourage a desire to achieve or excel.

I have seen many lure makers come and go since the mid seventies when I first came down with the trapping bug. It seems that the successful ones are usually hardcore trappers like yourself that love what they do and want to make their living doing it. There will always be people that will want to find fault with anyone that is very good at what they do. I admire you for being able to live your dream.

Society does seem to love to watch a successful person fall anymore, why?? Liberal thinking, social media, fake news, too many hippies lol, probably a combination of a lot of factors. The trapping industry in general is very competitive simply due to competition for the business of a limited number of trappers, a very limited number during the last few years of low fur prices, which seems to make things a bit cutthroat at times. I sent you some fence snare samples a while back Mark, how'd you like them??

I see this as an issue which swings both ways. We are in many ways a society that rewards excellence be that athletes, CEOs, writers, actors etc. greatly for their skills and many wish to be in that picture. We then turn around and criticize how the path to greatness was taken or laid out. Those with large catches on the trap line are admired for their numbers but bashed for their fur hog approach to territory. High scorers are admired for their skills but dissed because they hog the ball etc. etc.
This whole passive aggressive societal behavior makes the vast majority of people like myself that make up the middle very confused as to what is the best for them. This in many ways destroys the desire to take the risks for us to do what may be better for us. We live in a culture where 70% of the population is extroverted, which means their internal value or compass is based on the values OTHERS place on us and not on our own compass. This helps create a divisive society that is easier to sway socially, ethically, morally and politically.
Over the last 26 years our WI Trapper Ed program has probably graduated over 30K of trappers. How different are those we have taking the classes today versus 26 years ago?
How different will the students be in 2040?

Bryce

^^^^^^^^^^
Good post bblwi

When those old timers went on and on and on about hiding and eliminating human odor, anybody who disagreed with them was labeled a heretic. Didn't mean their lure didn't work.

I’ve wondered often how a fairly young or new trapper can come up with an entire line of lure, with claims to their effectiveness on each animal, can start selling it to everyone with good conscience. It would take either years of testing each one or have a trusted network of other trappers out there testing them as well. If they Are selling without good conscience then they can’t be relied on to have a good product either. I can see having one or two that work to some degree in a short time but it should be sent out to other trappers to try before marketing.
At the least I’d take their word that it works in their area very well and give it a try and I think it will work for you. I have one lure I make that I know works well for me and it’s taken a few years of some of my friends to try in other areas of my state but it may not be worth a flip in other areas. I would feel very uncomfortable setting up a booth at a National Trapping Meet and selling it to others unless a good bit of testing had been done beforehand.
I have respect for luremakers that have been in a long time and repeat orders keep them in business.

Where does honesty come into play? Alot of crooked liars in the trapping world,some whom claim they are something other than they really are.

I'm with you. There was a guy that hit a lot of people for money on lures recently, ingredients for lure recipes, and lure recipes themselves. He also hit a pretty well known guy on here that makes a pretty popular trap for over 2k. He would fight and lie his way out of anything, and the best part is many people had screenshots of him asking in February after his first season of trapping for help...this lure was rolling out proven and the best in the world that following October... he didn't even have two seasons under his belt...Mud river lures was the name. Part of the reason you're seeing more of these guys get called out is with technology you're one click away from documenting them full of it. Speaking of Mud River Lure I was following a page, and Ohio was the only convention that I'm aware of that was allowing him there. Maybe he was the guy upset he was being prodded.

Now I am confused by your posts Mark. First you mention new guys starting a lure business, and people thumbing their nose at them, and I think I explained why in the first paragraph. Then by the second page you're talking about "successful" lure businesses that have been around for a while that promote themselves. Here's my take on that. My personal opinion is certain "successful" lure makers promote their products to be something they are not. My other issue is there are certain individuals on here that are allowed to use posts to further promote their products, but certain others are shot down for advertising. Right or wrong I have my own opinion, and I just call it like I see it. Popular or not.

He didn't show up this weekend.

smart man,i bet he was being waited on.

I remember when Mark June and Tom Miranda were new on the scene, trapping video tapes were just coming out, in fact some were in Beta format. These two young men were on the cusp of the new trapping industry. They were early adapters in marketing, Mark wrote a book Trapping in Surburbia, the cover was not normal (it was colorful), just as Toms book covers were not normal compaired to the standard books of that era. Both trapper in my opinion have made it, and still support the industry. They have invested and endured since 1984 or so. Most trappers never heard of Slim Pederson unless you read an O'Gorman catalog and he changed the industry. Trapper/lure makers are a different breed, than most and wisdom is difficult to find in the instant gratification times we live in today. Big dealers like Minnestota, Sterling and Northern (their are others) sell many products, they see what sells and what stays on the shelf. There is a world of difference between marketing and trapping. I enjoy trapping and do not have the time to make lures, I appreciate what the industry provides to me and the men and women that have endured the growing pains. All burgers are not the same, same with lure makers and trappers. Great subject Mark, thank you.

WadeRyan,
I'm afraid the theme of my OP slide past you if your response is your first paragraph and what one person who is not trustworthy has to do with the OP theme? Mud whoever has been culled from the herd I guess (don't know him).

My theme and the discussion at my booth with other trappers in Ohio was relating to a bigger picture of why trappers view other trappers with a bit of skepticism should they want to start a lure & bait business. And then should that particular trapper prove to be successful due to longevity and other factors, some trappers still shoot arrows. Hmmm...
Mud whoever does not fit that OP scenario and that's not what was being chatted about last weekend at my booth.

My view is that I wish we had more folks starting ANY business in trapping. Fur buying, lure making, widget production, whatever! Our industry is not replacing our own at a rate that replenishes... rather we are losing more dealers than we are creating. Blame fur prices if you will but there are societal factors at work also.

Another thing we have lost,which is part of the problem, is that people have lost the ability to step back from the hot emotion of the moment and then evualuate the situation from cold logic. I've always thought that ability nlwas the hallmark of trappers and to a greater extent the country circa 1900

Mark raises a very valid issue here.

All the 'Ole Legend Lure Makers started just like this trapper did "English Mountain Lures", Quote from Walter Arnold, "I Am Going in Business" And he did, he didn't need any track record to start his business, how long he stayed in business would. People tried his stock, if they were happy, they saw him a lot, if they were not happy with his trapping Lure products they never Called Again! That used to be the phrase Please Call Again!

Today people begging for a 5 star feedback, no matter what.

Walter Arnold, Bill Nelson, E.J. Daily, O.L. Butcher S.Stanley Hawbaker, Herbert Lenon, were The Foundation, and 500+ others up through the years that I can not remember right now, at one time during the fur boom years at its peak, there were an estimated 450,000 Lure Makers in the U.S and Canada most were not in bussiness Many were, after the fur crash of 1987, thousands quit the business. Few steadfastly stayed in the business.

I would like to see Fur return back to America as it once was, and at least 300+ new Lure Maker businesses Open There Doors next year, will this happen?
Not likely, Society, as Mark suggests, Has Changed, it started in the state of California and it came East, and crossed the oceans.

There is a post office not far away , None of the workers in that post office like trappers or Lure Makers! How many post offices are out there in America like that?? How many post offices just throw out something with an odor?? A lot of post offices is my guess, HAZ Mat pile growing.

As for snake oil, they were also back in history but wasn't around to long.

Henpecked1 & Lureintheanimal,

Insightful posts, both of them! I appreciate input from those with good memories as you bring a perspective that includes history through the eyes of a faithful trapping heritage.

Good stuff!

BTW Mark, I've gotten your ad taken care of.

Thank you SNIPERBB!

I see that there are those commenting on this thread that have done a bunch of posting & also from some who haven't done too much posting
A good discussion blend.

X2!

Thanks, Mark, "IT IS THE GOD HONEST TRUTH", Sir!

There are many working in the delivery business that despises trappers, hunters or any person or persons involved in anything except golf!

IT IS HORRIBLE TO EVEN HAVE KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THIS Un-Constitutional BEHAVIOR OF THESE OUT OF TOUCH FOLKS.