At the local VFW meeting a young girl approached the meeting to ask us to write a letter in support of her effort to restart the ritual of reciting the Pledge of Allegiance each morning before school starts in the high school. I was surprised that they weren't saying it all along. I do k ow my two elementary aged daughters recite it in their classrooms. They stopped about 2 years ago in the high school for no apparent reason. We agreed to her request.

Personally, I am ambivalent about the issue. I don't care too much if they do or don't. As a taxpayer I do not want to be held financially liable because some pimple farm was forced to do something that deeply offended it. I hope the clause allowing sad sacks to sit down and pout while the pledge is recited is an option left open to students.

No respect in this country anymore starting in the school system!

I agree.

The new Kerry, all over again.

FlyinFinn >>>> what a shame this country has come too. No respect is taught or shown for the country we live in because we might hurt someone feeling and their beliefs.

I hear this all the time, you have to be politically correct, BS, I do not want any politician setting any standard of speech for me. I have lost a lot of respect for our politician but not for our system. I am for the Pledge and Pray in our class rooms. If a person does not like it then do not participate, if it hurts your feeling, to bad you made the choice. JMO

Our Grandson goes to St. Paul Lutheran school. They say the Pledge EVERY morning and at chapel on Wednesdays.

^ outstanding! In grade school we did the pledge and prayed in morning and at noon.

What does it really accomplish? Nothing, the kids stand up half halfheartedly go through it and it is forgotten 10 seconds later. I have never understood why this is a big deal, no one is having a real "patriotic" experience when they do it, no one loves their country because they are forced to do it. I never understood why people get so riled up over it one way or the other.

And donnersurviver, you never will.

Maybe they don't have a real patriotic experience because they've never been taught about what some people endured or the blood that was spilled to give them the right to even say a pledge.
Look at some parents today - most care more about a "career" and making money than raising their children.
An E-7 once told me he felt sorry for the draft dodgers because they have nothing larger to believe in than themselves.

When I was in grade one and two (public school) in British Columbia we said the Lords Prayer every morning and the teacher read a Psalm. Can you imagine that happening now.

I think things like the Pledge, the Lord's Prayer, etc., are good, if for nothing else it should teach kids that there is something bigger, greater, or more important than themselves. We have created a couple of generations of narcissistic, selfish wimps.

...the word you're looking for is "apathetic." "ambivalent" means you have feelings in conflicting directions. carry on.

Thanks pass-thru. I would have to say that I am not apathetic, or I wouldn't have bothered to make the post. I do not have strong feelings either way but I do have conflicted feelings. I feel it is a good thing to practice patriotism, but I do not feel it should be forced. Perhaps this is why the school does the pledge when kids are young and haven't developed cynicism to the degree that high school aged students have. I suppose I made the post to have a discussion and to help think things through.

x3

Donnersurvivor, perhaps children can become apathetic to the pledge, but we as adults should remind them of their error and influence correction. This should be required viewing for all Americans. https://youtu.be/TZBTyTWOZCM

A few years ago, I too was reminded of the value of our Pledge of Allegiance, as I watched a disabled veteran who can not walk without the assistance of two canes, and often uses a wheelchair, come to his feet to recite the pledge. An elderly man, seated in the disabled section of a school auditorium for an assembly, he struggled and fell back in his seat once, and then slowly gained his feet. I was too far away to help, but knowing him I doubt he would of accepted it.

But I watched that man come to his feet and finish strong on the pledge, worn and tired, he sat down again with a flop.

I had tears in my eyes, though truthfully, it is a rare occurrence when my emotions don't stir at reciting the Pledge of Allegiance or hear the National Anthem, or watch the presentation of Old Glory.

If children become apathetic and we as adults don't remind them of the honor it is to represent the finest nation on earth, the fault is ours.

Someday, when my children ask about the tears in my eyes, I will recount memories of many veterans I have known who pledged their lives on exchange for service to country, some made it home. Others did not. I'll remind them of the value of the lives of men and women, who served in many ways, that this country may exist. And I'll remind them of the blessings and provision God has poured out on our nation, that this grand experiment has lasted for over two centuries.

And then, I will remind them that this country may only represent the best humanity has to offer it's citizens, only if the citizens are willing to make the sacrifices to serve where and when needed, because we are the capital that backs the concepts this nation stands for and represents.

No entity on earth can have a goal or mission statement that is effective, real, or truthful, without a human to back it up and give it hands and feet.

That is the value of patriotism to our republic. The Pledge of Allegiance is merely one of several opportunities in which we are privileged to have the opportunity to exercise this patriotism.

well stated

ive lived and spent time overseas in many places...usa is still the best! We have our shortcomings but still the BEST....BAR None! Ask my 4 yr old why he doesnt want to go back to Asia

They say the pledge every morning in the public school my sons attended. They also say it before each school board meeting.

How does the school system get blamed for this lack of respect??

The Marxist movement knows the defeat of Free Market , Liberty & Freedom starts in destroying the educational links to love of Nation & God.

Very good reply sir! It is exactly how I feel about it!

our kids and grandkids are being taught they should be ashamed of what their ancestors built, sweated bled and fought to give them. raises my blood pressure a bit.

adults and high school kids ought to not need reminded by others actions to stand for our anthem or to stand when our flag passes.

Perhaps a field trip to a cemetery with row upon row of white tombstones to remind them of what the pledge is for.

Mike

We open our Sportsmen's Club meeting with the pledge. Have for as long as I can remember and I've been a member for over 40 years.

this will make you feel warm and fuzzy

https://www.foxnews.com/us/san-francisco-school-board-president-drops-pledge-of-allegiance

Who made the decision to not do the pledge of allegance?It should be standard to start every school day with a prayer and the pledge.It did not hurt my generation..you know some just want to deny our history..the liberals in charge of the education system are taking us in a downward plunge...God bless the next generation they will need it!

Liberals have owned education for decades and have used that incredibly powerful tool to indoctrinate generations of youth, teaching our naive and impressionable children liberal ideologies.

Just look at how disrespectful some folks(even some here)are to anyone who posts a view that is contrary to their own. And most times those who are most disrespectful are the first to complain about others having a lack of respect,

How does the school system get blamed for this lack of respect?? [/quote]


Just look at how disrespectful some folks(even some here)are to anyone who posts a view that is contrary to their own. And most times those who are most disrespectful are the first to complain about others having a lack of respect, [/quote]

Yep gryhkl
I agree! Lot of the pot calling the kettle black..All over the net.


I think what happened to the pledge is that it got caught up in the whole (Separation of church and state issue) Which didn't happen yesterday..I've heard it argued my whole life. Did get most hot in the 80s I believe.
Hard line liberals wanted the "One Nation Under God" line taken out of the pledge. Feeling their way of life, freedom and country was under attack.
Hard core conservative thinking their freedom, religion and country is under attack wouldn't have it. So the school is forced to the only neutral or middle ground position, drop the the pledge completely. Both parties loose country school take blame.

Which appears to the conservatives as a win for the liberals even if their intent was to only remove one line.

From a neutral observation. As my father would have said. Both groups "Cut off their nose to spite the face."
Then just keep attacking each other..

Lot of people who claim they see the big picture. Seem to me to be looking at it threw soda straw.

Mac

Yep gryhkl
I agree! Lot of the pot calling the kettle black..All over the net.


I think what happened to the pledge is that it got caught up in the whole (Separation of church and state issue) Which didn't happen yesterday..I've heard it argued my whole life. Did get most hot in the 80s I believe.
Hard line liberals wanted the "One Nation Under God" line taken out of the pledge. Feeling their way of life, freedom and country was under attack.
Hard core conservative thinking their freedom, religion and country is under attack wouldn't have it. So the school is forced to the only neutral or middle ground position, drop the the pledge completely. Both parties loose country school take blame.

Which appears to the conservatives as a win for the liberals even if their intent was to only remove one line.

From a neutral observation. As my father would have said. Both groups "Cut off their nose to spite the face."
Then just keep attacking each other..

Lot of people who claim they see the big picture. Seem to me to be looking at it threw soda straw.

Mac [/quote]

Not I.
I avoid these posts because it's a given the schools are liberal minded.
I am guilty of disrespecting people who vote agains't our huntinh/trapping and overall outdoor rights and claim so on a site promoting such, and i won't say i'm sorry to those people!

I'll send you two a quarter to whine to someone who cares.

Thanks for providing a perfect example of what we're talking about, hip.

Glad to help.

Not to late to change your ways voting, and being around people who take their outdoor rights seriously.

No such thing as outdoor rights. Privileges is the correct term.

True.

Either way, most here take it seriously.

What's amazing is people think they will not get called out on posting very liberal views, in some cases, every post being liberal minded, to Trappers, Hunters and all around God and Gun lovers.

Nahh, anti's are welcome. lol.

(expect to see posts with conservitive views when it comes to saying a prayer or saying the pledge of allegiance, and push back when supporting the liberal view of such.)

Anything to add to the thread concerning the pledge of did you just stop by to needle gerkleschmerkle?

Oops, guess you added the thought in an edit. Thank you.

There's nothing I have done that would hurt our outdoor privileges nor heritage. When you say that I have, you are lying, plain and simple.

I have hunted, fished, trapped, been invloved with youth outdoorsmen's clubs and wildlife/forestry organizations, and have raised three fine young men who are passionate about all these things.

Many of the leaders in my once fine republican party show great disrespect for our natural world and will always put profits ahead of ANYTHING else. An "R" in front of a name alone is not enough to get my vote for anyone.

Put it to ya plain and simple.

People here, myself included give money and time to not only promote trapping, but to fight off the liberals wanting it stopped. Maybe you are ignorant as to your posts that 95% of the time support the liberal ideals and politicians we fight, it's the reason you are the most quoted and your posts are admosnished almost every time.

I've said more than enough, too close to an important vote that has most all here riled up.

Awesome, so your posts are to just troll?

WHOOPS, just relaized you threw in the stick-in-the-eye at the end. good troll.

I agree with you. I used to be really stupid. If the person's moniker had a D in front, they got my vote regardless. I was this way for many years. I never really studied their goals until a few things started to surface that I realized weren't in my best interests. I still voted for some Ds, but as time went on, I noticed the Ds had changed and drifted farther left. I still voted for a few of them, but much less that previously. Today, there are some local Ds I support because they have pretty much distanced themselves from the national Ds on issues that are important to me such as gun control, abortion, separation of church and state, etc.

Agreed Trapper7

Dems at a national level will fall in line with the rest, regardless of what they say before being elected. Local yokals not as fast, but i still don;t trust them. Not all "r"s can be trusted either, but as a whole, your better chances are plain to see.

Your welcome Finn, wasn't ignoring ya.

Just had to adress the liberal views that come up on every post that 95% of us agree with.
Our schools still did the pledge when my daughter went, but since then i'm not sure, and wouldn't be suprised if they didn't anymore as people don't think voting for liberals have any effect on things.

At least 90% of the votes I've cast have been for republicans. I have only ever voted for a dem for president once and the same for governor of our state.
As a party, the dems have moved way too far to the left. I also believe much of my republican party has moved too far to the right.

The problems I have with my republican party's positions mainly concern the environment and the deficit. And the talk of republicans concerning the deficit used to be a big plus for them but, as it turns out, it seems it only concerns my party when there is a dem in office.

Both parties seem to be more set on dividing the country into two opposing camps and making enemies of those who have views that differ from themselves.......That, right thar, ain't no good for nobody.

Who said, "can't be civil"... until they(Dems) regain power??? HINT: hillary

Who said, "kick them" HINT: holder Who is he talking to, antifa???

Who said, "no sleep, no peace" HINT: waters

Who's strategy has been misinformation(Fake News), censorship(social media, google, etc.), harassment(ask Sen Cruz) , threats(ask Sarah Huckabee Sanders, the White House press secretary) and violence( ask Sen. Rand Paul or Rep. Steve Scalise). And intimidation(ask Kanye West)
HINT: the left
Who is set on dividing the country???



Drain the Swamp this November!

MAGA!!

TRUMP 2020!!!