No Profanity *** No Flaming *** No Advertising *** No Anti Trappers ***NO POLITICS
No Non-Target Catches *** No Links to Anti-trapping Sites *** No Avoiding Profanity Filter


Home~Trap Talk~ADC Forum~Trap Shed~Wilderness Trapping~International Trappers~Fur Handling

Auction Forum~Trapper Tips~Links~Gallery~Basic Sets~Convention Calendar~Chat~ Trap Collecting Forum

Trapper's Humor~Strictly Trapping~Fur Buyers Directory~Mugshots~Fur Sale Directory~Wildcrafting~The Pen and Quill

Trapper's Tales~Words From The Past~Legends~Archives~Kids Forum~Lure Formulators Forum~ Fermenter's Forum


~~~ Dobbins' Products Catalog ~~~


Minnesota Trapline Products
Please support our sponsor for the Trappers Talk Page - Minnesota Trapline Products


Print Thread
Hop To
Necker 600/ beam curvature? #6428588
01/14/19 09:15 PM
01/14/19 09:15 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,296
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Offline OP
trapper
bblwi  Offline OP
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,296
East-Central Wisconsin
I have been using a Necker 600 for about 200 years. As I get older I am working to keep the sharp edge sharper. I have two 600s. One I have used every year and one I just used on 10 coons this year. The newer one is much sharper. I have not been able to effectively get the sharp edge much sharper on the older knife. What are some ways others get and keep those edges sharp?

Also I have been using a wall mounted beam that is quite flat. What is the best curvature from your experiences that works with a knife like the Necker 600? I do very few yotes, and few otters. It is 98% coon and or grinners. I use other knives for mink and rats. I am keeping the dull edge pretty dull but I am finding that pushing a lot of fat and membrane is getting more difficult.

Thank you

Bryce

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6428620
01/14/19 09:40 PM
01/14/19 09:40 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,663
S.E. Ohio
M
M.Magis Offline
trapper
M.Magis  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,663
S.E. Ohio
A paper wheel kit on a bench grinder usually will get them the sharpest. Depends how sharp you like it. A mill file does decent, but the paper wheel will have you shaving with it.

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6428622
01/14/19 09:45 PM
01/14/19 09:45 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
W
walleye101 Offline
trapper
walleye101  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
The beam curvature should match the knife curvature so you are making complete contact when pushing.

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: walleye101] #6428684
01/14/19 10:39 PM
01/14/19 10:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,296
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Offline OP
trapper
bblwi  Offline OP
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,296
East-Central Wisconsin
The curvature thing is something I have always felt just as you have stated. I am wondering at times if I am trying to take too wide of a swath as pushing that much seems to be difficult, especially the large males. Also I was thinking that if I have a wide swath and the curvature is a bit off then a portion of the swath may have a fine film of fat left on the pelt. I can get that off but then i am rescraping some areas thaat have been scraped already.

I will try the different sharpening tools mentioned.
Do any of you use a dye or some product to put on your knife to lay on your beam to see how much area is covered?

Bryce

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6428722
01/14/19 11:14 PM
01/14/19 11:14 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
W
walleye101 Offline
trapper
walleye101  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
When you want to take a smaller strip like on the back of the neck you should be working the edge of the board. Then when you get to the easy stuff you can push full width.

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6428762
01/15/19 12:10 AM
01/15/19 12:10 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
T
The Beav Offline
trapper
The Beav  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
No need to have the curvature of the beam to match the curvature of the knife. Just taper the edges of the beam so you don't have any square edges.
Your only using about 2 to 3" of your knife blade when fleshing and the knife should be just about flat when making contact. If your using the whole knife blade your doing something wrong. A sideways slicing motion Is all you need and the top of your beam can be just about flat.


The forum Know It All according to Muskrat
Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: The Beav] #6428780
01/15/19 12:33 AM
01/15/19 12:33 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,296
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Offline OP
trapper
bblwi  Offline OP
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,296
East-Central Wisconsin
I need to keep the sharp edge sharper and work more away from the edge. I don't hardly ever put a hole in a coon but if I do it is when I am working the sharp edge to close to the rounded edge of my beam. If it is sharper I can get underneath better straight on. I will work on the dull edge and the swath width. I might sharpen up that edge more as well so the pushing is easier. One of the advantages of a duller knife is more length on a coon pelt. lol

Bryce

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6428812
01/15/19 02:14 AM
01/15/19 02:14 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 9,132
SWMo.
T
tjm Offline
trapper
tjm  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 9,132
SWMo.
I can't imagine how you would match the curve of the knife and beam, any angle of contact variance would change the touching curves.
Top that off one edge is concave and the other is convex so you'd have to have two boards matching an endless array of effective curves. Only by using a straight knife and a flat beam can the 'curves' be matched.
To cut the biggest swath a wide almost flat curve such as Beav suggests, to make it easier to push the curve of the beam needs to be rounder, steeper than the knife, thus reducing the contact area; if using the concave edge. If using the convex edge the contact area will automatically be smaller than it is with the concave edge. Any beam curve at all can be used with any knife. Even a straight bar, as I use use on possums.
Either edge can be "the sharp side' or either could be the"dull side" or both could "dull" on one half and "sharp" on the other half, so that by sliding the knife sideways you control the degree of sharp exposed, this would let you cut wider or narrower by flipping the blade and still have sharp or dull options- four edges.

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6428936
01/15/19 08:58 AM
01/15/19 08:58 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
W
walleye101 Offline
trapper
walleye101  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
Most who use a double edge knife like the necker cut/shoave with the sharp convex side and push with the concave. If you match the curve with the concave edge at a 90 degree you can push a full board. this works well for clean up. When you want to push smaller strips you can tip the angle of the knife to flatten the convex.

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6428985
01/15/19 09:46 AM
01/15/19 09:46 AM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,626
Flint, Michigan
bhugo Offline
trapper
bhugo  Offline
trapper

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,626
Flint, Michigan
Originally Posted by bblwi
I have been using a Necker 600 for about 200 years. As I get older I am working to keep the sharp edge sharper. I have two 600s. One I have used every year and one I just used on 10 coons this year. The newer one is much sharper. I have not been able to effectively get the sharp edge much sharper on the older knife. What are some ways others get and keep those edges sharp?

Also I have been using a wall mounted beam that is quite flat. What is the best curvature from your experiences that works with a knife like the Necker 600? I do very few yotes, and few otters. It is 98% coon and or grinners. I use other knives for mink and rats. I am keeping the dull edge pretty dull but I am finding that pushing a lot of fat and membrane is getting more difficult.

Thank you

Bryce

I use a butcher steel between coon real quick and light. Keeps it going a long time. Diamond sharpening Rodvery occasionally.


Member MTPCA, FTA and NTA
Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6429097
01/15/19 11:05 AM
01/15/19 11:05 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
T
The Beav Offline
trapper
The Beav  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
my beam Is 5" wide I start out with the ears centered take off that neck gristle. Then I turn the hide with one leg up and centered. Cut off the legs before you start that way you can go right over them and not have to screw around working around them. It also helps with sow coon so you don't cut off the teats. Hike the hide up and finish It down to the flank. Don't over reach. Now flip the hide and do the other part leg up. This Is all done with the dull side of the knife. The concave side if your using a necker.
Then just turn the hide ears centered and take off the center strip. Most of this can be done with the dull edge.

Remember start out with the knife up at a slight angle and once your under the fat and gristle flatten it out and make side wise slices. If your trying to push off a whole section buy just pushing In a straight line your working to hard at It.
Think about how a snow plow works. If the blade wasn't turned the snow would build up and stall out the truck. You don't want a lot of build up In front of your knife. So keep your knife turned a bit as you push. Another thing your always going to get some build up on your blade edge so you want to be cleaning your edge as you go. I just swipe It across the hide after I make a few slices.

Keep your knife blade FLAT your not scraping bark off a tree. And If your knife has a bevel keep It up.

Same as a wood plane you want the fat and gristle to roll off and away from your knife edge just like wood shavings roll away from a wood plane blade.


The forum Know It All according to Muskrat
Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: The Beav] #6429104
01/15/19 11:12 AM
01/15/19 11:12 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
T
The Beav Offline
trapper
The Beav  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
Another thing you should be doing Is take the dull side of your knife and take a file and square It up a bit. The edges over time will get rounded off and make pushing fat harder then It should be. You will also get a better and cleaner job with a squared off dull edge. Your not sharpening It your just creating a square edge so It bites In a bit better.
This squared off edge will also help In pushing off that center strip where most guys use the sharp edge. In my opinion this squared off dull edge Is just as important as the sharp edge.


Last edited by The Beav; 01/15/19 11:15 AM.

The forum Know It All according to Muskrat
Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6429121
01/15/19 11:33 AM
01/15/19 11:33 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,516
La Crosse, WI
Macthediver Offline
trapper
Macthediver  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,516
La Crosse, WI
Ok so now I'm watching this post too. I use a Necker and have two beams one 5 inch wide one 8 inch wide at base. Both are set to the curve of the dull edge of my knife.. The shape from nose end down on the wider big board is I think, about the shape of a medium coon board.. So I do any coon that fit that beam on it. The other narrow beam gets the skunks, possum smaller coon. I really wouldn't mind having just one beam if I could decide on what width it should be.


Mac


"Never Forget Which Way Is Up"

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6429132
01/15/19 11:41 AM
01/15/19 11:41 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,800
Iowa (where the tall corn grow...
D
Dave Plueger Offline
trapper
Dave Plueger  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,800
Iowa (where the tall corn grow...
I too have been using my necker for decades. As bhugo said, I use a butcher steel. I hit the bevel side lightly several swipes, than hit the bottom side lightly just a few swipes. I can still shave with my necker.

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6429145
01/15/19 11:54 AM
01/15/19 11:54 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
T
The Beav Offline
trapper
The Beav  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
Size really doesn't matter when It comes to a BEAM well to a point.

And the base shouldn't even be considered. Since your never going to reach down that far anyway. Well unless your long armed and over reaching. Hike the hide up as you go so you have control and aren't wearing yourself out.
Mine is about 6" wide at the widest point and I can do every thing On It other then mink and rats. With a narrower tapered nose end you will be able to do skunks and grinners with no issues. In fact lots of guys just lay the grinner or skunk on top of the beam to keep from getting to deep Into the roots. Remember your only using about 3" of your knife blade anyway so wider Isn't going to make It any better.


The forum Know It All according to Muskrat
Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: bblwi] #6429515
01/15/19 07:04 PM
01/15/19 07:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,276
Manitoba Canada
M
MB Coonguy Offline
trapper
MB Coonguy  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,276
Manitoba Canada
I use the back side of my skinning knife on the edge and it keeps it razor sharp.If it ever got dull I would use a big wet stone and within a fews swipes it would be razor sharp again.

Re: Necker 600/ beam curvature? [Re: The Beav] #6429516
01/15/19 07:04 PM
01/15/19 07:04 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,296
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Offline OP
trapper
bblwi  Offline OP
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,296
East-Central Wisconsin
Thank you all. I believe my beam curvature item is the lesser issue. One thing I have gained by asking is that I do have a very wide and flat beam and that has me taking a wider swath. I can change that by working on the narrow portion of the beam. Also I traditionally push way down with each stroke with the dull side of the knife. This can cause me to have less force or pressure and thus maybe not cleaning the fat as well right near the pelt. I can start bringing the pelt up toward me more. The reason I always felt longer strokes were better is that it is fewer times one starts and stops and thus hopefully reducing cutting the pelts or holes.
I also can see I have not been diligent on keeping my edges as sharp or as was stated not rounded on the dull side. All good things that I should be able to work on.
Again thanks.


Bryce

Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread