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Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: Bigfoot] #6512513
04/07/19 07:37 PM
04/07/19 07:37 PM
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ebsurveyor Offline OP
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ebsurveyor  Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Bigfoot
If you guys in Maine ever want to trap Fisher again like you used to you need to get behind this study like it's gospel. That's what the politicians do any study that supports what that what they want becomes the gospel the talking point, the ultimate truth .you MUST Reduce the fisher population IMMEDIATELY to protect the lynx.



Bigfoot makes at least three intelligent guys posting on the thread.

Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512516
04/07/19 07:40 PM
04/07/19 07:40 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 7,249
western mn
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bucksnbears Offline
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I can't imagine a Fisher taking on and beating a lynx.


swampgas chili and schmidt beer makes for a deadly combo

You have to remember that 1 out of 3 Democratic Voters is just as dumb as the other two.
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: trapper les] #6512526
04/07/19 07:54 PM
04/07/19 07:54 PM
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ebsurveyor Offline OP
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Originally Posted by trapper les


Why would Maine be different ?



Here is how: All of Maine is heavily logged. Maine has a large population of Moose, fisher, coyotes & bears throughout their lynx zone. Our fisher in northern Maine are small and mean. I have only killed about 50 of them with close to half caught in foothold traps Never caught one over 11 pounds. I usually don't comment about what I don't know. Many on here don't know what they don't know. I would guess Boco' trapping area is not heavily clear cut and swarming with fishers like Northern Maine is. Maine's lynx are not aggressive. I know of several that were released by just reaching the trap and depressing the springs. Dirt talks about catching them by the neck and them raking with their claws. Off the record I have catch poled more than I'll admit and not one has ever raked at the pole. All they do is pull away. I have walked into the catch circle and put a noose on them with no display of aggression from the lynx. About 50% will not leave the trap location after they are released. Just maybe a northern Maine lynx that grows up in a log yard is different from a wilderness lynx that can be trapped and killed. Maybe an are were lynx are under populated & fisher are over populated is different then an "area" were the reverse is true. BTW: I have "counted coup" on several lynx in footholds and have not been bitten or clawed and I don't care if you choose to not believe it.



[Linked Image]

Last edited by ebsurveyor; 04/07/19 08:15 PM.
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: BillyTraps] #6512540
04/07/19 08:07 PM
04/07/19 08:07 PM
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ebsurveyor Offline OP
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Originally Posted by BillyTraps
" We collected forensic evidence and samples from the carcasses and predation sites, conducted full necropsies when possible, and used molecular methods to determine species of predators responsible for killing fishers. We recovered 101 (59 female, 42 male) fisher carcasses; for 62 (61%) carcasses, we attributed cause of death to interspecific killing. We found that bobcats (Lynx rufus, ;25 fisher mortalities), mountain lions (Puma concolor, ;20), and coyotes (Canis latrans, 4) were predators of fishers in our study areas. Bobcats killed only female fishers, whereas mountain lions more frequently killed male than female fishers, confirming our hypothesis that female fishers would suffer lethal attacks by smaller predators than would male fishers. Coyotes rarely killed fishers."

source: https://wildlife.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/jwmg.698

I thought some might find this interesting.


Billy Traps, no bobcats to speak of where jwood & I tread. I guess the big mean lynx ate them all. Just kidding. 100 years ago when "Wildcat Lunch" hunted & trapped where I do bobcats were common and fisher & lynx were scares.

Last edited by ebsurveyor; 04/07/19 08:08 PM.
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: Boco] #6512544
04/07/19 08:10 PM
04/07/19 08:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 581
Northern Maine
Jeremiah Wood Offline
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Originally Posted by Boco
I think the agenda is clearly self serving for the assistant bio.He wants some job security as in a 25 or 30 year ongoing fisher/lynx study that will bring him to pension age.
Only problem is that his theory is so lame in regards to established scientific as well as traditional knowledge,(which carries the same weight today in many circles),it wont go anywhere.


So you're back to criticizing the biologist conducting the study because the results challenge your 'expertise'. In your extensive research you failed to gain an understanding of the assistant bio position at MDIFW. Scott no longer does research, and will not be the lead on any future lynx work in the state, nor will he rely on any research for job security. This has nothing to do with 'protecting a job' and it bothers me that you guys attack the integrity of professionals because you disagree with the results. The results of this work are unique....that's why the work was published in a scientific journal....to advance our knowledge of the species population interactions. Things are not the same in Ontario, Alaska, or Maine. Thinking you know it all, and those whose findings disagree with yours must have an agenda, says more about you than anything else.

Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: bucksnbears] #6512546
04/07/19 08:12 PM
04/07/19 08:12 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,421
mn north of blakely
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Steven 49er Offline
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Originally Posted by bucksnbears
I can't imagine a Fisher taking on and beating a lynx.


I think a 15 pound toe headed male fisher thinks he's the baddest thing in the woods. Female and kitten lynx could be in trouble.


"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512548
04/07/19 08:12 PM
04/07/19 08:12 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,264
james bay frontierOnt.
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Boco Offline
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Every one I have foot trapped and put a snare on to dispatch has been like a crazy windmill.The lynx in that pic looks like a yoy kitten.
Like I said before I did a little looking into it and that bios agenda seems pretty clear calling for more and extended collaring studies on both fisher and lynx.
I also give a lot of weight to the traditional ecological knowledge of the trappers which is much more subjective and qualitative than strict science,which is objective and quantitative only.
I know that fisher as an opportunistic hunter\scavenger would take lynx kittens if the opportunity arose.
As far as a predator of Adult lynx,I think that guy would be laughed out of a room full of northern trappers with years of bush experience.

Last edited by Boco; 04/07/19 08:25 PM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: Boco] #6512554
04/07/19 08:23 PM
04/07/19 08:23 PM
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ebsurveyor Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Boco
Every one I have foot trapped and put a snare on to dispatch has been like a crazy windmill.


I know a guy that released 10 from footholds and not one of them showed the slightest form of aggression. The pole was just tight enough so the lynx couldn't slip it off. I'm sure the wild wilderness lynx of Alaska & Canada are mean S.O.Bs. I'm also just as sure that the lynx of the log yards of Northern Maine are not.

Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512555
04/07/19 08:23 PM
04/07/19 08:23 PM
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Moved to Fbks, Ak.
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martentrapper Offline
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I'm with Boco. The study is baloney and the people doing it are full of baloney!
mt

Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512556
04/07/19 08:24 PM
04/07/19 08:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
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M.T.V. Alaska
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yukonjeff Offline
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I have had wolverines circle lynx in traps, and left it alone.
Have also saw my pet ferrets take down my full grown house cats. So never underestimate the weasel family.
I doubt they prey on lynx though. Perhaps it's happened before but I would need proof to believe it.

Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512563
04/07/19 08:30 PM
04/07/19 08:30 PM
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ebsurveyor Offline OP
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I know the guy that held the head to the side, depressed the trap springs with his feet and with a free hand pulled the lynx's foot from the trap. No sign of aggression from this large male. It was a little touch and go after the release as the lynx walked toward the trapper and wouldn't go away after the release.

[Linked Image]

Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512566
04/07/19 08:33 PM
04/07/19 08:33 PM
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ebsurveyor Offline OP
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Here's me and one of the meaner ones:

[Linked Image]

Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512582
04/07/19 08:45 PM
04/07/19 08:45 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
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Dirt Offline
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Originally Posted by ebsurveyor
Originally Posted by trapper les


Why would Maine be different ?



Here is how: All of Maine is heavily logged. Maine has a large population of Moose, fisher, coyotes & bears throughout their lynx zone. Our fisher in northern Maine are small and mean. I have only killed about 50 of them with close to half caught in foothold traps Never caught one over 11 pounds. I usually don't comment about what I don't know. Many on here don't know what they don't know. I would guess Boco' trapping area is not heavily clear cut and swarming with fishers like Northern Maine is. Maine's lynx are not aggressive. I know of several that were released by just reaching the trap and depressing the springs. Dirt talks about catching them by the neck and them raking with their claws. Off the record I have catch poled more than I'll admit and not one has ever raked at the pole. All they do is pull away. I have walked into the catch circle and put a noose on them with no display of aggression from the lynx. About 50% will not leave the trap location after they are released. Just maybe a northern Maine lynx that grows up in a log yard is different from a wilderness lynx that can be trapped and killed. Maybe an are were lynx are under populated & fisher are over populated is different then an "area" were the reverse is true. BTW: I have "counted coup" on several lynx in footholds and have not been bitten or clawed and I don't care if you choose to not believe it.



[Linked Image]



Huh? I just volunteered to fight one. I don't live in Lynx country. The few I caught died easy. The one I caught alive was dispatch with the thing that I put nails in with. Apparently he wasn't faster than me. smile In my world all things are possible.

Seriously, I caught one in a 110:dead. Hardly any sign of struggle. What kind of bad arse big animal dies in a 110?

Last edited by Dirt; 04/07/19 09:26 PM.

Who is John Galt?
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: yukonjeff] #6512585
04/07/19 08:46 PM
04/07/19 08:46 PM
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ebsurveyor Offline OP
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Originally Posted by yukonjeff
I have had wolverines circle lynx in traps, and left it alone.
Have also saw my pet ferrets take down my full grown house cats. So never underestimate the weasel family.
I doubt they prey on lynx though. Perhaps it's happened before but I would need proof to believe it.


Funny you should bring that up. A few years back (2015) when I used mostly footholds two coyotes came across a marten in my trap and they ate it. The coyotes traveled down the line and came across this male fisher. They made a lot of tracks around the fisher but stayed out of the catch circle.


[Linked Image]

my marten:

[Linked Image]

Not an uncommon sight from the truck window:

[Linked Image]

Last fall I saw three fisher from the truck and three lynx from the truck.

Last edited by ebsurveyor; 04/07/19 08:48 PM.
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512590
04/07/19 08:53 PM
04/07/19 08:53 PM
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ebsurveyor Offline OP
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To lighten this up a little here is a nice trophy whitetail from the North Maine Woods. I could have shot him as it was in season, but I stopped shooting deer 20 years ago.

[Linked Image]

Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512659
04/07/19 09:56 PM
04/07/19 09:56 PM
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james bay frontierOnt.
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Boco Offline
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Probably caught someones pet.


Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: Dirt] #6512665
04/07/19 09:59 PM
04/07/19 09:59 PM
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james bay frontierOnt.
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Boco Offline
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james bay frontierOnt.
An otter [Linked Image]
An otter is way tougher than a fisher-maybe they kill lynx too.


Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512673
04/07/19 10:07 PM
04/07/19 10:07 PM
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williams,mn
trapper les Offline
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I am not convinced that a fisher can consistently take and prey on adult lynx. But, we have fisher, and few lynx. And more bobcat.


Agenda wise ? Every biologist is suspect to me and wants to prolong or engage in a study at my expense.


"Those who hammer their guns into plowshares will plow for those who do not."
Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: Dirt] #6512688
04/07/19 10:28 PM
04/07/19 10:28 PM
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NH
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Originally Posted by Dirt
Originally Posted by Boco
The bio is full of it.If they always attack in a snowstorm how can he read the tracks-BS big time.
Grab a lynx by the neck and see what he does with his razors.


Oh heck! Hold my Beer and watch this!


No problem, I'm in.

Cool pictures there, EB.

Re: Do fisher kill lynx? [Re: ebsurveyor] #6512755
04/08/19 12:15 AM
04/08/19 12:15 AM
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McGrath, AK
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white17 Online content

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Originally Posted by ebsurveyor
Originally Posted by Boco
Every one I have foot trapped and put a snare on to dispatch has been like a crazy windmill.


I know a guy that released 10 from footholds and not one of them showed the slightest form of aggression. The pole was just tight enough so the lynx couldn't slip it off. I'm sure the wild wilderness lynx of Alaska & Canada are mean S.O.Bs. I'm also just as sure that the lynx of the log yards of Northern Maine are not.



I'll bet most Alaska trappers have pretty much the same experience with lynx as I do. Most of them never move or make a sound. They just sit there and wait for the lights to go out. Very docile. I know of one instance where a cat shredded the coat and pants of a TMAN member.

I think it's entirely possible that fisher are taking the occasional lynx . When you consider that an ermine will attack a critter many times his size, why wouldn't another member of the weasel family do the same ?

But as I said above, when you can show 12 instances in 12 years it isn't a very strong case for saying that this is a regular occurrence


Mean As Nails
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