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Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: tbn] #6595480
08/15/19 08:03 PM
08/15/19 08:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,683
north Idaho
W
wissmiss Online happy
trapper
wissmiss  Online Happy
trapper
W

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,683
north Idaho
Originally Posted by tbn
Does Nafa own anything?


Various buildings in various countries. Canada, US, Poland, Netherlands. Plus computer equipment and pelt processing equipment (tagging guns, stringing machines, fur balers. Basically anything and everything you need to run an international fur auction.


www.usedtraps.com

Please check out my updated inventory of Native American books.

Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: tbn] #6595486
08/15/19 08:08 PM
08/15/19 08:08 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,445
idaho
W
wallfur Offline
trapper
wallfur  Offline
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W

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,445
idaho
Originally Posted by tbn
Does Nafa own anything?
......they do if nafa cash advances are more than what they sell the pelt for.

Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: coonman220] #6595541
08/15/19 08:54 PM
08/15/19 08:54 PM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 6,683
Newark, Ohio 83 years
Actor Offline
trapper
Actor  Offline
trapper

Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 6,683
Newark, Ohio 83 years
If there is a court appointed administrator, they would basically be running the show. Still has to answer to the court in most cases. They could suggest (as a stupid example) that NAFA not buy any more coons because they have been losing money on them. They would then have to show the court evidence to prove it and the court might go along with it and so it would done. In filing a bankruptcy they have list all of their asset and all of their liabilities.


Garry-


“Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.”

Have been trapping 77 years…
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: BullOx] #6595553
08/15/19 09:06 PM
08/15/19 09:06 PM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 6,683
Newark, Ohio 83 years
Actor Offline
trapper
Actor  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 6,683
Newark, Ohio 83 years
For Canada:

Division I Proposal or a CCAA filing

The equivalent of a Chapter 11 bankruptcy in Canada would be either a Division I Proposal or a CCAA filing. A Division I Proposal can be filed by either a company or an individual and a CCAA filing can only be filed by a corporation with a very large amount of debt.
These two options are meant to provide both individuals and businesses with the opportunity to settle a portion of their debt. These options also provide protection from creditors while a company or individual works to regain their financial stability.


Consumer Proposal (aka Division II proposal)

A consumer proposal is the equivalent in Canada to the American Chapter 13 bankruptcy. A consumer proposal is a formal and legal debt settlement arrangement between a creditor and an indebted consumer. The agreement allows the consumer to consolidate their debt and reduce the amount they owe and then repay it over a period of time no longer than 5 years.


Garry-


“Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.”

Have been trapping 77 years…
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: Zim] #6595566
08/15/19 09:21 PM
08/15/19 09:21 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,459
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
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walleyed Offline
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Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
Originally Posted by Zim
Nope, did not hear that. It sure can't be from overpaying trappers for their fur.

Zim


I Heard NAFA over-spent giving away *FREE* Fur handling DVD's !! laugh

w


"Provisional/Interim" member of NYS Trappers Association
Jefferson Co. Fur Harvesters

I Support Non-Resident Trapping



Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: wallfur] #6595569
08/15/19 09:23 PM
08/15/19 09:23 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,511
nunya,ks
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tbn Offline
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tbn  Offline
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nunya,ks
Originally Posted by wallfur
Originally Posted by tbn
Does Nafa own anything?
......they do if nafa cash advances are more than what they sell the pelt for.


So I ship 1000 co on and they are valued at 20$ each. The advance me 50 percent or $10,000. They sell them for $6 each so I owe Nafa $4,000. Is that correct?

Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: BullOx] #6595586
08/15/19 09:53 PM
08/15/19 09:53 PM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,971
WI
N
nimzy Offline
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nimzy  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,971
WI
That plus interest

An advance is simply a loan

Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: BullOx] #6595607
08/15/19 10:13 PM
08/15/19 10:13 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,421
mn north of blakely
S
Steven 49er Offline
trapper
Steven 49er  Offline
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,421
mn north of blakely
It was reported at Coyote Days that NAFA donated a really good chunk of change to the effort to stop the fur ban in California. It's possible that an organization that is going broke would give that much but I'd think the creditors would really frown upon it


"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: nimzy] #6595610
08/15/19 10:16 PM
08/15/19 10:16 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,421
mn north of blakely
S
Steven 49er Offline
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Steven 49er  Offline
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S

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,421
mn north of blakely
Originally Posted by nimzy
That plus interest

An advance is simply a loan


And if I'm not mistaken the interest starts on the day of the advance. I hear the interest is almost usurious as well


"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: BullOx] #6595614
08/15/19 10:19 PM
08/15/19 10:19 PM
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 838
North dakota
N
Nd native Offline
trapper
Nd native  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 838
North dakota
I imagine that the fur market has a lot further to crash and NAFA is going to eventually have to scale back and decline offering/taking certain goods at some point as the labor will be worth more than the commission on the sale. The market is going to have to crash hard enough and for long enough to the point that fur handling and trappers succumb to the dying art until there is so few left that whoever is left is supplying to a limited supply and a niche market that looks upon what is being offered with nostalgia and it becomes valuable again. Like some traditional native american art and old fashioned homemade products. Hopefully I'm wrong.

Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: BullOx] #6595801
08/16/19 09:22 AM
08/16/19 09:22 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,655
ND
M
MJM Online content
trapper
MJM  Online Content
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,655
ND
Dear NAFA Customer,
At NAFA, we are aware of the many rumours in the trade about the present condition of our business. Many stories going around the industry are without merit but we will also not pretend that we are currently operating in a totally “business as usual” environment during these challenging market conditions.
What you should understand, however, is that NAFA is indeed open for business and actively preparing for our August Auction (Sale 23-27, on Show from 19). To date, we have solid attendance for our end of season sale (similar to July 2018) where we will offer over 2.5 million regular, Section III and breeder mink as well as a strong collection of wild fur.
In spite of these difficult business and market circumstances, NAFA’s sole focus, over these past weeks, has been on meeting our consignor production assistance commitments for 2020, fixing the issues that are currently impacting us and ensuring that we can continue to honour our commitments to our valued customers.
I want to assure you, and everyone else in the industry that you might talk to, that NAFA’s August Auction will be conducted under fundamentally the same manner as every other auction that NAFA has hosted in recent times. We will offer our same high levels of customer service. The auction itself will be managed as you would expect and our selling terms will remain highly competitive.
Nevertheless, we do understand that there is some nervousness out in the market about paying for goods bought at the August auction and not receiving them. First, I would say that shipments from our previous auctions have continued throughout the summer on a totally business as usual basis. Many buyers can attest to this. Second, as listed in NAFA’s Conditions of Sale (Articles 4 & 6), and under Canadian Law, any and all purchases made in the auction room or by Private Treaty and fully paid for, become the property of the Purchaser and will be shipped as directed. In other words, once a purchase is fully paid for, title and ownership of those goods completely passes to the Purchaser and NO ONE, including NAFA’s bank, will dispute this. In fact, NAFA’s bank has gone out of its way to stress this principle and would happily offer to reassure anyone who questions this truth. Finally, NAFA has also developed a plan to ensure that broker commissions due from past sales, or going forward, can be dealt with during the course of the August auction.
Still, if none of these Company assurances can satisfy your customer, NAFA is willing to work with our customers to ensure that goods bought in the sale can be paid for and shipped in a fully secure manner.
In short, it remains NAFA’s solemn promise to work with all sectors of the fur trade to get through this difficult time and continue to play an important role in the fur industry in the years to come.
Thank you for your business and understanding. We look forward to seeing you in a few days time.
Douglas Lawson
President & CEO


"Not Really, Not Really"
Mark J Monti
"MJM you're a jerk."
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: walleyed] #6595805
08/16/19 09:28 AM
08/16/19 09:28 AM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,238
Illinois
R
ratbrain Offline
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Illinois
Originally Posted by walleyed
Originally Posted by Zim
Nope, did not hear that. It sure can't be from overpaying trappers for their fur.

Zim


I Heard NAFA over-spent giving away *FREE* Fur handling DVD's !! laugh

w

No No No It was the pins for your hats!

Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: walleyed] #6595821
08/16/19 09:51 AM
08/16/19 09:51 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,791
IA
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teepee2 Offline
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Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,791
IA
Originally Posted by walleyed
Originally Posted by Zim
Nope, did not hear that. It sure can't be from overpaying trappers for their fur.

Zim


I Heard NAFA over-spent giving away *FREE* Fur handling DVD's !! laugh

w
Thats why you didn't get one, so they could just squeak by.

Last edited by teepee2; 08/16/19 09:51 AM.
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: BullOx] #6595866
08/16/19 11:04 AM
08/16/19 11:04 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,271
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
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Boco  Offline
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Posts: 45,271
james bay frontierOnt.
You Americans seem only to support Canadian companys when you are benefitting.


Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: BullOx] #6595880
08/16/19 11:57 AM
08/16/19 11:57 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,951
rogers city mi.
J
jeff karsten Offline
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jeff karsten  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,951
rogers city mi.
True we are no different than anybody else


olden tyred
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: Boco] #6595941
08/16/19 01:40 PM
08/16/19 01:40 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,655
ND
M
MJM Online content
trapper
MJM  Online Content
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M

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,655
ND
Originally Posted by Boco
You Americans seem only to support Canadian companys when you are benefitting.

I fully support NAFA. Our coon have been running up between $20 and $25 average right along. In May of 2013 I averaged $41,67 on my coon. I did pay a comission and $10 for the magazine, but I felt I was ahead and hoped NAFA was too. I am sure everyone else did the same or better elsewhere. The better coyote have been over $100 for 10 years. For two years we have had a trappers auction that runs close to NAFA prices. But, before that, nothing was close. Everyone has to make money in the fur business for it to work. If NAFA makes a bunch of money so have trappers. If NAFA doesn't make money, trappers take it worse.


"Not Really, Not Really"
Mark J Monti
"MJM you're a jerk."
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: BullOx] #6595947
08/16/19 01:46 PM
08/16/19 01:46 PM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,773
el vado, nm
T
Tom Fisher Offline
trapper
Tom Fisher  Offline
trapper
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,773
el vado, nm
Yep

Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: Boco] #6595982
08/16/19 02:43 PM
08/16/19 02:43 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
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Dirt  Offline
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Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
Originally Posted by Boco
You Americans seem only to support Canadian companys when you are benefitting.


Boco NAFA is not really a Canadian company. More international. Most ownership resides in the U.S. The real money that NAFA was making the last few years was coming out of Stoughton and Poland. They pretty much been riding that ranch mink horse the last 3 or 4 years and finally rode that horse till it died. Now what are they going to ride?


Who is John Galt?
Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: BullOx] #6596051
08/16/19 03:54 PM
08/16/19 03:54 PM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,414
Idaho Falls, Idaho
F
Furvor Offline
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Posts: 2,414
Idaho Falls, Idaho
Lots of folks think profits are accumulations of cash. More often profits are just increases in assets such as new equipment or facilities. Profit is not a measure of available cash.

Re: NAFA Bankrupt? [Re: Boco] #6596134
08/16/19 05:22 PM
08/16/19 05:22 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,445
idaho
W
wallfur Offline
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wallfur  Offline
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,445
idaho
Originally Posted by Boco
You Americans seem only to support Canadian companys when you are benefitting.
......boco just get in the life raft, the mother ship is sinking! and taking C+T with her. lol

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