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Re: Climate [Re: James] #6613847
09/10/19 09:15 PM
09/10/19 09:15 PM
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white marlin Offline
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Originally Posted by James
Originally Posted by GROUSEWIT
Your definition of recently is 1986. 34 yrs ago!!


In glacier time, it sure is.

I have some photos of my kids playing on chunks of glacier ice as big as houses that had broken off the glacier and drifted across the lake. Right around 1986, though I don't recall the visitors center being open then. Portage Glacier itself is visible across most of the background in the photos.

Since then the glacier has retreated around the mountain and can't even be seen from the visitor's center.

Jim


NONE of which proves man is responsible.

so what's your point?


"We didn't come all the way out here just to 'feel them on the line.' "
Re: Climate [Re: rex123] #6613861
09/10/19 09:28 PM
09/10/19 09:28 PM
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Anchorage, Alaska
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James Offline
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Why are you still stuck on the notion that man has no responsibility for the warming trend?

Don't tell me: you own stock in oil companies. What happened, did you finally sell your tobacco stocks?

Jim


Forum Infidel since 2001
Re: Climate [Re: James] #6613872
09/10/19 09:36 PM
09/10/19 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by James
Why are you still stuck on the notion that man has no responsibility for the warming trend?

Don't tell me: you own stock in oil companies. What happened, did you finally sell your tobacco stocks?

Jim

An ounce of any proof at all would go a long way. Typically you have none other than staring out a window. Meanwhile, evidence of this being a hoax is not only mounting but for anyone doing any real research on the matter, almost irrefutable.


I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY, MYSELF.
Re: Climate [Re: James] #6613875
09/10/19 09:44 PM
09/10/19 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by James
Do you suppose he could use that Sharpie to redraw the boundaries of the Portage Glacier, which has receded so much that it can no longer be seen from the visitor's center they built recently?

Jim

Jim you are many things, but stupid isn't one of them. Surely you realize that glaciers are ancient relics from the last Ice Age, and that the Earth is in a natural rebound from that ice age in the form of the current Natural Warming Trend which has been going on for the last 10-18 thousand years. Of course they are melting.
We need to leave it alone, lest we inadvertently create the next ice age. You want to see mass destruction? What do you imagine an ice age would cause?
Is human activity adding to the increase of the temperature of the planet? Does one BB added to a boxcar full of BBs make that boxcar heavier? I'd say yes to both, and in the same amount in terms of significance. That would be insignificantly.

Re: Climate [Re: hippie] #6613877
09/10/19 09:44 PM
09/10/19 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by hippie
We wouldn't have the Great Lakes if we hadn't built all the factories that melted the glaciers off.

Ohh wait..........


*BOOM* (heads exploding)

Warming and cooling have always happened, with and without man's presence. Almost as if our contribution is negligible. Doh!


"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
-Edmund Burke
"We are fast approaching... rule by brute force."
-Ayn Rand
Re: Climate [Re: rex123] #6613888
09/10/19 09:52 PM
09/10/19 09:52 PM
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A great majority of people who are far more qualified than anyone here say that human activity is causing most of the earth to warm up.

If we guess wrong, the results will be cataclysmic.

But I won't deny there have been exaggerations and falsehoods told by those favoring drastic measures.

Jim


Forum Infidel since 2001
Re: Climate [Re: James] #6613902
09/10/19 10:07 PM
09/10/19 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by James
Why are you still stuck on the notion that man has no responsibility for the warming trend? Don't tell me: you own stock in oil companies. What happened, did you finally sell your tobacco stocks? Jim


James, Jim, Jimmy....show me where I ever said man had NO responsibility for the warming trend. I don't know how much (if any) measurable effect man has made on the climate. And frankly, neither do YOU!

my points have always been: if you intend to completely disrupt major economies based on this stuff, you'd better have hard core, common sense and rigorous science backing it up. (even then, it may not be worth the disruption). right now, you have some computer projections that say we might/could/likely have a problem. computer PROJECTIONS, Jim...PROJECTIONS.

the other thing is that (if it's true and clearly evident) then EVERYONE ON THE PLANET carries the same burden to resolve it. one group of people should not be "allowed" to continue to pollute when the technology is there to "fix" it.

we have to rely on green energy? so does everyone else!

and when I say "everyone", I mean EVERY ONE! no exemptions for the "elite".

Last edited by white marlin; 09/10/19 10:10 PM.

"We didn't come all the way out here just to 'feel them on the line.' "
Re: Climate [Re: James] #6613911
09/10/19 10:16 PM
09/10/19 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by James
A great majority of people who are far more qualified than anyone here say that human activity is causing most of the earth to warm up. Jim


then let them make their case to the world. actually, they have been trying for 20 years, but have failed miserably.

I say, let both sides present their cases in the schools. (that doesn't happen today).

and let the voters decide.

but that only works if both sides are taught in the public schools.


"We didn't come all the way out here just to 'feel them on the line.' "
Re: Climate [Re: James] #6613913
09/10/19 10:19 PM
09/10/19 10:19 PM
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Originally Posted by James
A great majority of people who are Paid by the government to push an agenda say that human activity is causing most of the earth to warm up.

If we let them proceed, the results will be cataclysmic.

there have been exaggerations and falsehoods told by those favoring drastic measures.

Jim

Fixed it all


I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY, MYSELF.
Re: Climate [Re: James] #6613916
09/10/19 10:20 PM
09/10/19 10:20 PM
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Originally Posted by James
If we guess wrong, the results will be cataclysmic. Jim


I feel the same way about non-Christians.

as a Christian, if I end up being wrong...oh, well. no harm, no foul.

but if non-Christians are wrong...they end up being eternally separated from God's love.


"We didn't come all the way out here just to 'feel them on the line.' "
Re: Climate [Re: James] #6613919
09/10/19 10:22 PM
09/10/19 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted by James
Why are you still stuck on the notion that man has no responsibility for the warming trend?

Don't tell me: you own stock in oil companies. What happened, did you finally sell your tobacco stocks?

Jim


Respectfully, James I donít believe that as humans we have the power to do it. We canít stop a hurricane, thunderstorm, or even a dirt devil.

If president Trump ordered the federal government to raise the global temp 2 degrees in the next 2 years what would they do? Iíll bet we couldnít do it in ten years. Itís impossible. Yes we can pollute. Make streams, oceans, and soil nasty. But there is a big difference between that and the climate. And all of the climate change deniers like me that I know respect nature. Heck some of us make a living buy it. Iím a grade A conservationist and proud of it. I just donít buy their bs. Last but not least a majority of scientists donít agree. The often sighted 97% of scientists agree. Was just a survey taken many years ago. Less then 100 replies were given, and they have been using it ever since.


Hal is my Hero
Re: Climate [Re: rex123] #6613964
09/10/19 11:18 PM
09/10/19 11:18 PM
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Man probably can't raise the temp 2 degrees in 2 years so that means we do zippo? Just because something is huge, hard and expensive does not mean that resources should not be utilized to learn what we can as quickly as we can and at the lowest cost in dollars and other assets. The main portion of the Earth where most of the 7 billion live are in the temperate climates of the world, which means they vary considerably for the most part annually and also there is a wide range over time, but a general pattern is set.
The extreme portions of the Earth north and South are where most of the temperature changes are impacting the ecosystem. Adding water or moisture to the oceans over time raises water levels. As the oceans warm and the surface and upper layers of water expand as warm water is less dense then cooler water and the heat comes off as moisture which in many areas creates more rain etc. As the deltas and mouths of rivers back up just a few inches due to more rain and higher ocean levels we get more high water way back upstream and also the wind can move the warmer less dense water easier and creates higher waves and more impact on shallow areas around the world. There a multitude of things the World can do to mitigate the impacts of a changing climate, regardless of the causes but if we choose to argue about who is responsible instead of dealing with the issue we are all losers in the end. I feel that raising the human population from a few million to 7 billion in 50 or so generations and we have no impact on any changes on our Earth is a very simplistic and false view of the impact of any and all life on our Earth.

Bryce

Re: Climate [Re: rex123] #6613967
09/10/19 11:22 PM
09/10/19 11:22 PM
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Here's my biggest issue with changing our behaviors to stop alleged climate change. Are the Russians, Chinese, and India going to change? Because if they dont, it really doesn't matter what anyone does. Its global climate change for those that believe in it. Global. The US and Europe probably arent big contributors anymore given all the emission standards we have. Guarantee the other three I mentioned care less as long as their products are cheap and their country keeps ticking.

If we buy into this global climate change then it's only going to be the western world that gives up its freedoms and buries itself in debt for nothing. Going to cost a lot of us dearly.

Last edited by Nd native; 09/10/19 11:25 PM.
Re: Climate [Re: rex123] #6613971
09/10/19 11:30 PM
09/10/19 11:30 PM
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Those "projections" are like weather forecasts--uncertain, but the best information we have. No scientific certainty, but THE BEST INFORMATION WE HAVE.

If the weatherman says a storm is coming, do you ignore the forecast just because he could be wrong?

Jim


Forum Infidel since 2001
Re: Climate [Re: rex123] #6613973
09/10/19 11:39 PM
09/10/19 11:39 PM
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Bryce, I will not argue that 7 billion people have an impact on the environment. Iíll lower it to .5 degrees in 2 years. I will still bet short of 50 nuclear weapons we couldnít move the temp. I will say it again. NASA satellites show now warming for the last 15-18 years. Search Ted Cruz and Sierra club on YouTube. Senate hearings on climate change. Watch it and listen to the other side. I listen and research both sides and have came to the conclusion that itís an agenda not a real problem. Good debate. Thanks


Hal is my Hero
Re: Climate [Re: rex123] #6613974
09/10/19 11:43 PM
09/10/19 11:43 PM
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So, who here is for the dems "green new deal"? (no oil and meat consumption to be specific.)

Seems a couple are at least.

Re: Climate [Re: James] #6613979
09/11/19 12:00 AM
09/11/19 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by James
Those "projections" are like weather forecasts--uncertain, but the best information we have. No scientific certainty, but THE BEST INFORMATION WE HAVE.

If the weatherman says a storm is coming, do you ignore the forecast just because he could be wrong?

Jim


James, thatís my problem with it. Itís not based on data or facts. Itís based in computer programs built by people with an agenda. NOAA simulations showed 3 days out that the last hurricane would hit Florida, Alabama, etc. if I lived there of course I would have taken precautions, but I wouldnít have sold my house, or screamed in the street that we were all going to die. Those projections have been wrong since 1989, so Iím a weary of them.


Hal is my Hero
Re: Climate [Re: rex123] #6613981
09/11/19 12:02 AM
09/11/19 12:02 AM
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Iíve never posted a YouTube video on here. If someone has time please post Ted Cruz and Sierra club senate hearings for me. Thanks

Last edited by Pawnee; 09/11/19 12:02 AM.

Hal is my Hero
Re: Climate [Re: James] #6614122
09/11/19 08:14 AM
09/11/19 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by James
Those "projections" are like weather forecasts--uncertain, but the best information we have. No scientific certainty, but THE BEST INFORMATION WE HAVE.

If the weatherman says a storm is coming, do you ignore the forecast just because he could be wrong? Jim


no, but a prudent person would not burn down their house just because a storm might be coming. your side is saying we need to burn down our nice, $250,000 house on an acre and BORROW several hundred million dollars to re-build a cement block hovel for us and $100,000 plain-Janes for everyone else. but of course, WE have to pay for it all.

let's put this in terms you may be more familiar with...

you're the defense lawyer for a client on trial for murder. the prosecution's witness list contains very distinguished experts who all say your client "most likely" committed the crime. the first expert witness has all kinds of charts that they drew up on Corel Draw with all kinds of squiggly lines that seem to say your guy did it. upon cross-examination regarding the data making up the chart, he says "well, my computer program said so". the next three experts (Larry, Moe and Curly) were paid huge amounts of money by the "Foundation to Enslave Millions" to point the finger at your client. but they are "pretty sure" your guy did the crime.

Finally, when it comes time for you to present your defense, the judge says "you won't be allowed to present your defense...we've already decided your client is guilty."

Your side hasn't convinced most Americans to take the steps YOUR side screams we need to (ask AOC). and THAT's true, even though you're brainwashing our kids with only Larry, Moe and Curly's take on it.

Last edited by white marlin; 09/11/19 08:35 AM.

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Re: Climate [Re: hippie] #6614132
09/11/19 08:27 AM
09/11/19 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by hippie
So, who here is for the dems "green new deal"? (no oil and meat consumption to be specific.)

Seems a couple are at least.



And their position on the matter is every bit as stupid as those who simply believe we should be doing nothing to lower the impact of our actions.

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