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Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: waggler] #6614664
09/11/19 07:27 PM
09/11/19 07:27 PM
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Posts: 45,271
james bay frontierOnt.
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Boco Offline
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james bay frontierOnt.
^^^^^^^^^^^
Stereotyping-BS.
Lots of hardworking Whitemen among others-Lazy ones of all colours as well.

Last edited by Boco; 09/11/19 07:29 PM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: danny clifton] #6614665
09/11/19 07:28 PM
09/11/19 07:28 PM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 15,540
Champaign County, Ohio.
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KeithC Offline
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KeithC  Offline
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Champaign County, Ohio.
Originally Posted by danny clifton
Wonder why I.C.E. doesn't show up 2-3 times a week????????????

Could it be nobody really wants to stop illegals?


The problem is that the work that the illegal aliens do, does need done. Lots of jobs go unfilled in the US. We need a better guest worker program. It's easier for the government to maintain the status quo and do nothing.

Keith

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: waggler] #6614670
09/11/19 07:31 PM
09/11/19 07:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 9,154
Alaska and Washington State
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waggler Offline OP
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Alaska and Washington State
Boco,
Don't quite understand what you mean by stereotyping??

Some of you guys assume these are illegals; most of them aren't, they are just guys who know how to work and want to.


"My life is better than your vacation"
Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: waggler] #6614675
09/11/19 07:34 PM
09/11/19 07:34 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,271
james bay frontierOnt.
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Boco Offline
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james bay frontierOnt.
You said white guys are lazy and have no skills-that's stereotyping.
Just like some people say Mexicans are lazy and have no skills.
Although Mexicans did invent the siesta,I'm sure some are good people.

Last edited by Boco; 09/11/19 07:35 PM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: gryhkl] #6614681
09/11/19 07:38 PM
09/11/19 07:38 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 10,404
Northeast Oklahoma
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Mike in A-town Offline
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Northeast Oklahoma
Originally Posted by gryhkl
I was talking to a business owner who does everything from lawnscaping to large construction. He said more than half his workers are Mexicans(legal workers)and they work harder and more hours than almost any of his other guys. He also said they'll work weekends and long hours without complaint.


I'd buckle down and do it for five years if I could get all kinds of taxpayer assistance... And also knowing after my five years are up I could go home and live comfortably for the rest of my life.

Meanwhile I'll be working until I'm in my 70's to pick up the tab for Paco who's working on living the Mexican dream.

Mike


One man with a gun may control 100 others who have none.

Vladimir Lenin
Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: KeithC] #6614696
09/11/19 07:50 PM
09/11/19 07:50 PM
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Posts: 4,528
MN
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Donnersurvivor Offline
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Originally Posted by KeithC
Originally Posted by danny clifton
Wonder why I.C.E. doesn't show up 2-3 times a week????????????

Could it be nobody really wants to stop illegals?


The problem is that the work that the illegal aliens do, does need done. Lots of jobs go unfilled in the US. We need a better guest worker program. It's easier for the government to maintain the status quo and do nothing.

Keith


Jobs go unfilled because the compensation is not high enough to entice a citizen to work. Everyone has differing abilities in jobs they can perform well, by allowing illegals or non citizens to take low skilled labor jobs it drives down wages in those fields making citizens who have low capability's trapped in weather they have to work low wage non "living wage" jobs or depend on welfare.

Think of Dairy farms, the only reason the small dairy farms went under was because of the oversupply of cheap immigrant labor allowing mega farms to out compete small owner operators. Those mega farms "needed" the labor or those jobs would of went unfilled, but do you really think there would of been a dairy shortage? I dont, I think alot more families would still be on the farms.

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: waggler] #6614699
09/11/19 07:56 PM
09/11/19 07:56 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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danny clifton Offline
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KiethC I believe your assessment is spot on. like I said government does not want to stop illegal immigration. I say end welfare. most deadbeats will get fired a few times while learning how to work but hunger is a great motivator


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: Donnersurvivor] #6614731
09/11/19 08:45 PM
09/11/19 08:45 PM
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 1,147
Happy Valley
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Happy Valley
Originally Posted by Donnersurvivor
Think of Dairy farms, the only reason the small dairy farms went under was because of the oversupply of cheap immigrant labor allowing mega farms to out compete small owner operators. Those mega farms "needed" the labor or those jobs would of went unfilled, but do you really think there would of been a dairy shortage? I dont, I think alot more families would still be on the farms.



This has absolutely no basis in fact, in any way, shape or form. You obviously have no understanding of the dairy industry at all.

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: CoonsBane] #6614737
09/11/19 08:55 PM
09/11/19 08:55 PM
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MN
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Donnersurvivor Offline
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Originally Posted by CoonsBane
Originally Posted by Donnersurvivor
Think of Dairy farms, the only reason the small dairy farms went under was because of the oversupply of cheap immigrant labor allowing mega farms to out compete small owner operators. Those mega farms "needed" the labor or those jobs would of went unfilled, but do you really think there would of been a dairy shortage? I dont, I think alot more families would still be on the farms.



This has absolutely no basis in fact, in any way, shape or form. You obviously have no understanding of the dairy industry at all.


BS. 50% of workers on farms are illegals, the large farms would not have grown at the pace they did without illegal and immigrant labor, this in turn would not have crashed the price of milk and allowed the smaller family farms to continue to operate.

The large farms that hired illegals cost their neighbors their farms by devaluing the price of milk. Any farm or business that knowingly hires illegals should be seized and auctioned off.

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: Donnersurvivor] #6614748
09/11/19 09:13 PM
09/11/19 09:13 PM
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 2,459
Oregon
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Oregon
I have to disagree with both Donner and Coon -- the price regulation of the government caused the smaller dairies to go out. The illegal and legal labor has and always will be an issue -- have you tried to hire anyone for a farm job recently? Noone wants to work the hours required for a dairy to operate (and i don't blame them). Acouple of the dairies that I work for (smaller 5-700 cow) can't get someone to show up with regularity ( they are paying milkers 18$ per hour) but not much for benefits other than housing and beef (cull cow) . However i work for some other farmers that are involved with the guest worker program -- they pay about the same but the workers go home every winter -- they run those guys 14-16 hour a day 7 days a week. why do you suppose they can't get anyone to work for them? . I do agree that any company or farm that hires illegals should be put oput of business -- but i think you need to look at the construction and landscaping trade long before the farms.

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: waggler] #6614755
09/11/19 09:27 PM
09/11/19 09:27 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 62,661
Minnesota
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Not all ...not generalizing, but in our Family which included about 8 farm families...when the Kids grew up and took over the family farms they wanted to Buy and Build Everything New.
Pasturing wasn't good enough, a 24/7 indoor cow barn was built, 2 -85' harvestors , also a New monster Case with duly's on front and back . The adult kids Overspent ...Then the 80's hit. All the farms are no more.


NRA and NTA Life Member
www.BackroadsRevised@etsy.com




Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: H2ORat] #6614758
09/11/19 09:35 PM
09/11/19 09:35 PM
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MN
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Originally Posted by H2ORat
I have to disagree with both Donner and Coon -- the price regulation of the government caused the smaller dairies to go out. The illegal and legal labor has and always will be an issue -- have you tried to hire anyone for a farm job recently? Noone wants to work the hours required for a dairy to operate (and i don't blame them). Acouple of the dairies that I work for (smaller 5-700 cow) can't get someone to show up with regularity ( they are paying milkers 18$ per hour) but not much for benefits other than housing and beef (cull cow) . However i work for some other farmers that are involved with the guest worker program -- they pay about the same but the workers go home every winter -- they run those guys 14-16 hour a day 7 days a week. why do you suppose they can't get anyone to work for them? . I do agree that any company or farm that hires illegals should be put oput of business -- but i think you need to look at the construction and landscaping trade long before the farms.


Carefully reading your post makes me think you are proving my point while saying you disagree with me.

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: waggler] #6614764
09/11/19 09:40 PM
09/11/19 09:40 PM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 15,540
Champaign County, Ohio.
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KeithC Offline
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My entire area is farms. I have never seen a single non white drive a planter, a sprayer, a combine or drive a semi load of corn or beans anywhere. The berries in my area are all picked by whites, mostly teenagers. All the nearby dairies, hog farms and beef farms are small family run operations worked by white people. The hay is put up by white people too. The white who farm in my area have mostly been here for generations. I have a very hard time believing 50% of farm work is done by non whites, much less illegal aliens.

I do know of one guy, Tony, about half an hour from here, who employs Hispanics. They are well paid. The head ones make 6 figures. The lowest paid make 30 some thousand a year, with cheap board.

Keith

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: Pike River] #6614780
09/11/19 09:49 PM
09/11/19 09:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,695
Central Oregon
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Central Oregon
Originally Posted by Pike River
Originally Posted by Donnersurvivor
I have an employee who makes $25 an hour all on the books, by the time I pay taxes, work comp etc he cost me right around $41 per hour. I try and do things right, legal, but how could I compete with a company who saves $16 an hour on labor by hiring off the books and paying cash? These guys hiring off the books labor for cash are gaming the system and there doesnt seem to be any real consequences for it.

That seems awfully high. Our employees cost us 11.5% more than their hourly wage. That $25hr employee would cost us $27.88.



That seems impossible. .

Lots of agencies with thier hands out if you have employees . All government mandated

Donners numbers are more realistic .........and thats a break even number


Report a post club - Non member


Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: KeithC] #6614781
09/11/19 09:51 PM
09/11/19 09:51 PM
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MN
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Donnersurvivor Offline
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Originally Posted by KeithC
My entire area is farms. I have never seen a single non white drive a planter, a sprayer, a combine or drive a semi load of corn or beans anywhere. The berries in my area are all picked by whites, mostly teenagers. All the nearby dairies, hog farms and beef farms are small family run operations worked by white people. The hay is put up by white people too. The white who farm in my area have mostly been here for generations. I have a very hard time believing 50% of farm work is done by non whites, much less illegal aliens.

I do know of one guy, Tony, about half an hour from here, who employs Hispanics. They are well paid. The head ones make 6 figures. The lowest paid make 30 some thousand a year, with cheap board.

Keith


The U.S department of labor states 53% of farm workers are illegals, feel free to Google it. Your area may be an exception. Sounds like a nice area but it does not represent the entire country.

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: waggler] #6614786
09/11/19 09:53 PM
09/11/19 09:53 PM
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Oregon
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Donner -- the disagreement comes with the 50%, and it is not just the large ones that are doing it. Most ( not all ) ;of the farmers that i work for do not (knowingly) hire illegals. however one of the companies that i used to work for did. They were much worse than the farmers about it.

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: KeithC] #6614803
09/11/19 10:10 PM
09/11/19 10:10 PM
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East-Central Wisconsin
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All of you are somewhat correct in my opinion as to why the dairy industry has changed drastically in the last 25 years in the Mid West and East. The West Coast has utilized large centralized dairy farms since the 1970s. Undocumented labor has milked cows in the USA for two generations in most of the west.
What has caused the rapid centralization of the dairy industry in the Mid West and East is a combination of things.
The west expanded rapidly in the 1980s and 90s due to very low feed and forage costs so they could buy feed instead of getting land and expensive high maintenance machinery.
In the Midwest, WI, MI, WI and the east
Farmers owned or rented the land and machinery but milked fewer cows
What has made large farms more profitable?
1. Spreading the cost of all assets and labor over more milk and income
2. Farm families need to feed a family, buy health insurance, save money for colleges etc. Large dairies can pay good wages, but do not need to provide many or any of the other benefits a family needs. This makes operating a smaller dairy and raising a family almost impossible, even with very low debt.
3. Larger farms can utilize large amounts of lower cost by-product feeds that are not practical and affordable in small volume to smaller farms.
4. Many call the illegal workers, lower cost workers but when salary is looked at for hours worked, odd schedule hours and weekends they are not cheap labor. Where they shine is many are younger and they are very productive workers.
5. As stated above several government programs have made increasing size and production an advantage. Almost all commodities are paid out per bushel, ton, acre or whatever measurement and not by person or persons. Some commodities such as milk have upper limits but with subsidies on crops and large dairies buy a lot of feed this is a huge advantage.
6. The new margin protection program which pays out when feed margins are below a certain point is the new dairy subsidy type program. Large dairies buy a much higher percentage of their feed than small dairies and thus the new program significantly gives advantage to larger farms, as most smaller farms raise a much higher percentage of their feed. Some dairy economists even state that if this does not change soon that the new subsidy program will cause the demise of smaller dairies faster than almost anything else.
Sure a readily available labor force has not caused large dairies labor concerns as they could have but then look at all other perishable crops, meat processing, egg production farms, mink farms, construction, roofing firms and hospitality. The dairy industry loses many workers each year to those industries as undocumented workers learn more English, find easier work and more regular hours and schedules.

Bryce

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: waggler] #6614804
09/11/19 10:11 PM
09/11/19 10:11 PM
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Alaska and Washington State
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waggler Offline OP
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Regardless what the percentages are, it doesn't really matter, there are a lot of jobs in many parts of the Country that white folks won't do.
We need immigrant labor if we want to eat food produced in the USA.
We need a less cumbersome guest worker program, but politicians on both sides of the aisle don't really what to fix the problem. Its too easy for politicians to get the knee-jerk reaction they desire from their constituents with the broken system we have.


"My life is better than your vacation"
Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: bblwi] #6614808
09/11/19 10:15 PM
09/11/19 10:15 PM
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MN
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Originally Posted by bblwi
.
6. The new margin protection program which pays out when feed margins are below a certain point is the new dairy subsidy type program. Large dairies buy a much higher percentage of their feed than small dairies and thus the new program significantly gives advantage to larger farms, as most smaller farms raise a much higher percentage of their feed. Some dairy economists even state that if this does not change soon that the new subsidy program will cause the demise of smaller dairies faster than almost anything else.

Bryce


I didnt really know much about this, good post. We have poultry, all my friends have been chased out of Dairy, lonely feeling to be 29 and have all your peers out of business and moved to town.

Re: How much a Home Depot parking lot workers [Re: waggler] #6614934
09/12/19 05:42 AM
09/12/19 05:42 AM
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williamsburg ks
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danny clifton Offline
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Western KS dairy's and feedlots are closer to 100% illegals. They don't get paid 18 bucks an hour either. Except for the white kids inheriting those dairy's and feedlots most move away.


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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