Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: bblwi]
#6703084
12/22/19 09:50 PM
12/22/19 09:50 PM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,481 mn north of blakely
Steven 49er
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trapper
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,481
mn north of blakely
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The workers get back what was taken and then some. If not why is everyone saying it will go broke in xxxxx? Not saying it may have been the best choice but it is what we have and it works for millions and millions of people and not just in the USA. We will see how the millions of families that plan to retire on their IRA savings will do compared to those with pensions. Both have SSI but some will do much better than others. Most federal employees have their own retirement system which they pay into and they are not eligible for SSI nor are the wages or income earned while a federal employee usable in establishing a stipend base. Also if we look at SSI the rate we pay is about 5% as the remainder goes to Medicare so for many workers the return on their 5% is very, very good in comparison and collected and distributed as it is it is an economic booster. The high and very high income persons have a very, very small percentage of their income in the form of SSI collections. This link covers some issues that some or many may have. https://www.aarp.org/work/social-security/info-2015/myths-of-social-security.htmlBryce The reason why it will go broke is because the money isn't invested and is a pay go system. It's been destined to fail since day one without tax and age increases. I can guarantee it that if I was able to invest the money me and my employer have paid into SSI the last 30 years plus what I'll pay in the next 15 I'd be a millionaire or darn close to it. And being a single father if I kick the bucket my children would be able to get the balance of my investments. As it is if I die tomorrow they are pretty much screwed except the one who will be a minor for a few more months. The Social Security Retirement contribution is 6.2% for the employee and 6.2% for the employer, a total of 12.4%. Substantially more than about 5%
Last edited by Steven 49er; 12/22/19 09:53 PM.
"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6703097
12/22/19 09:59 PM
12/22/19 09:59 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,502 james bay frontierOnt.
Boco
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trapper
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,502
james bay frontierOnt.
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Life insurance is even stupider-your betting that your going to die soon and they're betting your gonna live longer.
Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Boco]
#6703264
12/22/19 11:59 PM
12/22/19 11:59 PM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,481 mn north of blakely
Steven 49er
trapper
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trapper
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,481
mn north of blakely
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Life insurance is even stupider-your betting that your going to die soon and they're betting your gonna live longer. Life insurance is voluntary.
"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6703276
12/23/19 12:14 AM
12/23/19 12:14 AM
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,831 Asheville, NC
charles
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trapper
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,831
Asheville, NC
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A death benefit is tax free money. Nobody has ever sent their death benefit back to the company and asked for their premiums. I am glad my wife and I have ours, and it is mostly paid up.
Last edited by charles; 12/23/19 12:17 AM.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6703718
12/23/19 04:16 PM
12/23/19 04:16 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,697 MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
Trapper7
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,697
MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
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The original intent of SS was to do two things for the worker. Provide a lifetime disability benefit if the worker was disabled during their working years. If the worker was able to work until retirement, SS would provide a retirement income for life.
Unfortunately, legislators couldn't keep their hands off the money that was rolling in and nabbed some of it for their little pet projects. Some examples are paying SS disability benefits to people who have never paid into it. Paid college tuition for a disabled worker's children. Saw a woman who was on disability because of obesity. The same woman's 10 year old son was drawing SS because she said he suffers from depression.
You would probably be better off financially if you invested your money in a bank, stocks, real estate, etc. Problem is, most people don't have the discipline to do that.
We are told not to judge all Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but are told to judge all gunowners by the actions of a few.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6703840
12/23/19 07:24 PM
12/23/19 07:24 PM
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,831 Asheville, NC
charles
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trapper
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,831
Asheville, NC
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Too anyone who finds fault with Medicare, I ask you, would you be willing to pay my medical bills if I paid you twice the amount I pay Medicare? Enough said. Thank goodness for Tricare and Medicare.
PS: I need hernia surgery and cervical surgery pretty soon. Two cancer surgeries last year, and a long list of surgeries before that. Heart is now OK since being shocked back into rhythm two years ago.
Last edited by charles; 12/23/19 07:29 PM.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6703904
12/23/19 08:49 PM
12/23/19 08:49 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,716 Sandhills Nebraska
Gary Benson
OP
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OP
trapper
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,716
Sandhills Nebraska
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My Dad just died a month ago or so at 93. He lived a good life! But, when he was a young man, men worked for $1 a day. Compare what he earned during his lifetime to the cost of medical care today. The assisted living facility he died in was costing $4500/month.. At the wages he earned through his lifetime, there's no way he could afford anything at the rate of inflation. Without assistance, old folks today would just be put to death, like the Demoncrats would like. For the working class of Republicans, that is.
Life ain't supposed to be easy.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: bblwi]
#6703921
12/23/19 09:11 PM
12/23/19 09:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,239 Co.-Wy. part time AK.
wy.wolfer
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,239
Co.-Wy. part time AK.
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The workers get back what was taken and then some. If not why is everyone saying it will go broke in xxxxx? Not saying it may have been the best choice but it is what we have and it works for millions and millions of people and not just in the USA. We will see how the millions of families that plan to retire on their IRA savings will do compared to those with pensions. Both have SSI but some will do much better than others. Most federal employees have their own retirement system which they pay into and they are not eligible for SSI nor are the wages or income earned while a federal employee usable in establishing a stipend base. Also if we look at SSI the rate we pay is about 5% as the remainder goes to Medicare so for many workers the return on their 5% is very, very good in comparison and collected and distributed as it is it is an economic booster. The high and very high income persons have a very, very small percentage of their income in the form of SSI collections. This link covers some issues that some or many may have. https://www.aarp.org/work/social-security/info-2015/myths-of-social-security.htmlBryce Do you really think that you only pay 5%? As an employer I pay a bit more than 1/2 of the SS/Medicare deduction, like all employers that money comes from what the employee makes for me while that employee works for me. In other words it comes out of what I can pay that employee.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: wy.wolfer]
#6703947
12/23/19 09:36 PM
12/23/19 09:36 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 17,646 Rodney,Ohio
SNIPERBBB
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 17,646
Rodney,Ohio
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Do you really think that you only pay 5%? As an employer I pay a bit more than 1/2 of the SS/Medicare deduction, like all employers that money comes from what the employee makes for me while that employee works for me. In other words it comes out of what I can pay that employee.
If you are self employed, you get to pay the employer and employee side of FICA.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6703950
12/23/19 09:37 PM
12/23/19 09:37 PM
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,071 South Central Wisconsin
Nelly
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trapper
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,071
South Central Wisconsin
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I'm not sure if I have been responsible and disciplined or just lucky. I will start receiving my military retirement in about 4 years, plus I have been contributing 10 percent to my 401K and a modest amount to a Roth IRA. And since I don't intend to stop working until I am no longer capable, social security should be just gravy. I have been blessed with good health which has helped me to get to this point. If you are young, get started on helping yourself.
I'm just a soul whose intentions are good. O Lord please don't let me be misunderstood.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6704160
12/24/19 12:37 AM
12/24/19 12:37 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,354 East-Central Wisconsin
bblwi
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,354
East-Central Wisconsin
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No you pay 7.62 but about 6 for SSI which is not far from 5%. To many that seems like a lot and they don't want to pay that, but in reality most people don't save that much per year in their life time. If you want to find out how well the average USA couple is doing financially for retirement just spend some time talking with some financial planners and they will help you understand the potential train wreck coming down the road as many are not saving enough and if SSI does need to change there will be some real changes in life styles. The option many are choosing is to find work that they can physically and mentally do until they are in their 70s. A service centered economy allows for much more employment like that. The link below gives some idea of the amount saved by people in different age groups. https://www.thebalance.com/average-...155888#average-savings-for-60-somethingsBryce
Last edited by bblwi; 12/24/19 12:42 AM.
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6704561
12/24/19 01:25 PM
12/24/19 01:25 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,197 Armpit, ak
Dirt
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,197
Armpit, ak
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Bryce the worker pays 12.4% The rest is accounting flim flam. In reality the wage worker does not even send the IRS money. The employer does. Us self employed cut checks to the IRS.
To visualize this think about the two commissions that come out of a deal at a Canadian Auction that in reality the trapper pays.
Who is John Galt?
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Dirt]
#6704567
12/24/19 01:34 PM
12/24/19 01:34 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 16,266 ny
upstateNY
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trapper
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 16,266
ny
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In reality the wage worker does not even send the IRS money. The employer does.
employer,matches,the,,amount,,,,taken,,,out,,,of,,,my,,,,check,,,,for,irs
the wheels of the gods turn very slowly
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6704592
12/24/19 02:16 PM
12/24/19 02:16 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,601 Ohio
newtoga
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trapper
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,601
Ohio
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I got a $28 raise on my SS for 2020 lol!!
Last edited by newtoga; 12/24/19 02:17 PM.
lifetime member NTA, OSTA, GTA
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Re: Average lifetime Social Security donation???
[Re: Gary Benson]
#6704594
12/24/19 02:22 PM
12/24/19 02:22 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 6 NLP Michigan
Wildcatdad
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 6
NLP Michigan
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This is simplifying based on just flat dollars, no interest or other adjustments. If a person makes 30,000 a year for 35 years, they will make $1,050,000 in their lifetime. 6.2 percent is $65,100.00. Employer pays in the same. On the first $10,272 per year they will receive 90 percent, from $10,272 to $61,884.00 per year they will receive 32 percent. So, $10,272 X .90 = $9,244 + (30,000 - 10272) X .32=$6,313. 9,244+6313=$15, 557 Annual Social Security benefit per year at full retirement age. It would take a little over four years to receive as much as they paid in. 8 and a half years if you figure in the employer portion. Considering the fact a very very small percentage of people can save money, and pensions are a thing of the past....maybe social security isn't such a bad thing.
Ohh..the multiplier in excess of $61,884.00 is 15 percent. I think these numbers are 2016 or 2017 numbers and they are adjusted annually, but it gives you a rough idea.
Last edited by Wildcatdad; 12/24/19 02:32 PM.
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