Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823375
03/30/20 06:14 PM
03/30/20 06:14 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 7,236 West Michigan
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I see a church held service in the parking lot over there radios. A lot smarter move. Risking the life of other at this point is not a good move. IMO
To Old U.S. Army 60-63 SGT.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823387
03/30/20 06:20 PM
03/30/20 06:20 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
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williamsburg ks
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so much for the first amendment
what happened to the old adage about surrendering your rights in the name of security? i hope they keep holding services. whoever issued the royal proclamation needs kicked out of office
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823392
03/30/20 06:23 PM
03/30/20 06:23 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
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williamsburg ks
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what happens when they decide that speech against whoever is in office is to dangerous to allow or a news story is too controversial? this is very bad people
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823395
03/30/20 06:24 PM
03/30/20 06:24 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,650 Southeast Ohio
amspoker
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Serious question.
If it was something more serious, like bubonic plague, would you feel the same way?
Levi
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823401
03/30/20 06:26 PM
03/30/20 06:26 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
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williamsburg ks
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what kind of a man takes an oath to uphold the constitution then arrests a preacher for holding a church service. i would post the word im thinking of but its not child friendly
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: amspoker]
#6823402
03/30/20 06:26 PM
03/30/20 06:26 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,387 Iowa
PaulB
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Iowa
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How much more serious does this have to get?,,,
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823405
03/30/20 06:30 PM
03/30/20 06:30 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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amspoker nobody is being stopped from isolating theirself at home.
bubonic plague is treatable now. put on your big boy pants and take care of your family the way you think is best. quit expecting other people to do it for you
i am not surrendering my constitutionally recognized rights
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823416
03/30/20 06:36 PM
03/30/20 06:36 PM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
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Many Christians, myself included, believe that regularly gathering in person with other believers is an essential part of their religion, that it's just as much a basic part of practicing their religion as praying or reading from a Bible. If some Christians choose to get their teaching in other ways, that's fine, that's up to them. But to create a "law" (not really a law, just a royal decree) tellling them they can't meet in person with other believers is akin to telling them they can't pray or can't own a Bible. You may have other beliefs, and that's okay, it's not the point. The point is that people are being arrested for what they feel is an essential part of their religion.
Last edited by loosegoose; 03/30/20 06:38 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6823430
03/30/20 06:50 PM
03/30/20 06:50 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,650 Southeast Ohio
amspoker
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amspoker nobody is being stopped from isolating theirself at home.
bubonic plague is treatable now. put on your big boy pants and take care of your family the way you think is best. quit expecting other people to do it for you
i am not surrendering my constitutionally recognized rights Unlike you, I actually believe the precautions are justified. So it isn't about surrendering rights for me. It's about slowing the virus. From your point of view, thinking it's overblown, you are right. As far as church goes, the bible teaches about quarantine, and obeying government authorities... within reason...
Last edited by amspoker; 03/30/20 06:51 PM.
Levi
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823432
03/30/20 06:51 PM
03/30/20 06:51 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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Government knows best for it's sheep herd
Comply or die is not off the table
Report a post club - Non member
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823441
03/30/20 06:59 PM
03/30/20 06:59 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,263 james bay frontierOnt.
Boco
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Its that sense of entitlement popping its ugly head up again. "I can do anything because I'm entitled to do it-to with everybody else or the consequences". They need to lock that idiot up.
Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823460
03/30/20 07:23 PM
03/30/20 07:23 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,987 Oregon
beaverpeeler
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If it was just the pastor's flock that could potentially die I guess I wouldn't care. But what is criminal is that there are innocents that would suffer the consequences as well.
My fear of moving stairs is escalating!
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823466
03/30/20 07:28 PM
03/30/20 07:28 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
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williamsburg ks
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Innocents? Why are the innocents not isolating themselves? If they stay home and practice social distancing how are any "innocents" (whatever that means) going to be affected????????????
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823476
03/30/20 07:34 PM
03/30/20 07:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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By this reasoning , someone with the flu ( with alarming death rates ) walks into a church should be executed
Report a post club - Non member
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823479
03/30/20 07:34 PM
03/30/20 07:34 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,987 Oregon
beaverpeeler
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Eventually most of us have to go out and get groceries. Can't isolate ourselves 100% from the foolishness of others.
My fear of moving stairs is escalating!
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823483
03/30/20 07:35 PM
03/30/20 07:35 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
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Marty
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400 million test kits available soon, get a test and a chip if your kung flu free....the chip will automatically detect kung flu and notify the proper authorities. If your positive.....off to the kung flu camp for a while.....kinda like summer camp, only with armed guards with a shoot to kill line drawn on the ground.
E 'Honey Badger Militia' Sleep, the anti woke adote.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823485
03/30/20 07:37 PM
03/30/20 07:37 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 17,379 Coeur d' Alene, Idaho
James
"Minka"
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"Minka"
Joined: Dec 2006
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Danny: people still have to go out for groceries and medical treatment. Why should they be endangered because of someone else's religion?
Jim
Forum Infidel since 2001
"And that troll bs is something triggered snowflakes say when they dont like what someone posts." - Boco
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: AntiGov]
#6823487
03/30/20 07:38 PM
03/30/20 07:38 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 17,379 Coeur d' Alene, Idaho
James
"Minka"
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"Minka"
Joined: Dec 2006
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Coeur d' Alene, Idaho
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By this reasoning , someone with the flu ( with alarming death rates ) walks into a church should be executed Only in your mind. Jim
Forum Infidel since 2001
"And that troll bs is something triggered snowflakes say when they dont like what someone posts." - Boco
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: Marty]
#6823489
03/30/20 07:38 PM
03/30/20 07:38 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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400 million test kits available soon, get a test and a chip if your kung flu free....the chip will automatically detect kung flu and notify the proper authorities. If your positive.....off to the kung flu camp for a while.....kinda like summer camp, only with armed guards with a shoot to kill line drawn on the ground. Not far fetched at all......
Report a post club - Non member
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823498
03/30/20 07:42 PM
03/30/20 07:42 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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Where you been Jimmy ? Thought the coronavirus got you
Last edited by AntiGov; 03/30/20 07:51 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823519
03/30/20 07:53 PM
03/30/20 07:53 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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They send people home every day with coronavirus . Those people have family members who go to stores and move about town.
Seems More reckless than a church service
Report a post club - Non member
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823521
03/30/20 07:54 PM
03/30/20 07:54 PM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 9,153 Alaska and Washington State
waggler
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If they were just clamping down on religious services I would be worried. The case now though is they are cracking down on everyone. I there was a Joe Biden rally and they turned a blind eye to that, yet stopped a church service, then we would have a constitutional issue.
Regardless of the law this preacher is showing blatant disregard for the health of his church members, possibly for a boost to his proud ego.
Our church last Sunday held our service over Zoom Meeting an internet App. It was great, that was a surprise to me since I'm not a big tech fan
Last edited by waggler; 03/30/20 08:00 PM.
"My life is better than your vacation"
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6823529
03/30/20 07:58 PM
03/30/20 07:58 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 7,236 West Michigan
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so much for the first amendment
what happened to the old adage about surrendering your rights in the name of security? i hope they keep holding services. whoever issued the royal proclamation needs kicked out of office way to late if you want to worry about your constitutional right. Never look at the RED FLAG LAW that will be coming to your State sooner or later.
To Old U.S. Army 60-63 SGT.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823531
03/30/20 07:59 PM
03/30/20 07:59 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 20,914 North East Kansas
Marty
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There is a high possibility of quite a few changes happening in the USA this year.......
E 'Honey Badger Militia' Sleep, the anti woke adote.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: bblwi]
#6823536
03/30/20 08:04 PM
03/30/20 08:04 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,650 Southeast Ohio
amspoker
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To each his own, I am glad he is not my shepherd
Bryce Well said.
Levi
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823543
03/30/20 08:09 PM
03/30/20 08:09 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,263 james bay frontierOnt.
Boco
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james bay frontierOnt.
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He' probably one of those wingnut fake preachers that play with snakes.
Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823544
03/30/20 08:09 PM
03/30/20 08:09 PM
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Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 1,497 Southern NJ
maintenanceguy
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I believe precautions are justified. I believe this church should not have met. But I also believe that when the government, by the proclamation of one government official, can arrest a pastor for holding a church service, we are right around the corner from me being arrested for speaking out against it.
-Ryan
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823548
03/30/20 08:11 PM
03/30/20 08:11 PM
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Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 1,497 Southern NJ
maintenanceguy
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Did you notice in the article that he was charged with "unlawful assembly". I thought the constitution had some mention of that. Next thing you know they'll be arresting people for unlawful possession of a firearm...oh, wait.
-Ryan
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823553
03/30/20 08:14 PM
03/30/20 08:14 PM
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269 Indiana
brianmall
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There is a fine line being towed here with this virus with the loss of rights! But its not the 1st time we have been asked as citizens to give up something for the greater good of the nation!
Here is one example:
"Lights can simply be turned off or light can sometimes be minimized by tarring the windows of large public structures. In World War II, a dark blackout curtain was used to keep the light inside. Tarring the windows can mean a semi-permanent blackout status.
During the 1940s and 1950s, cities such as Detroit would practise blackout air raid drills. During this time, the city's Civil Defense workers would immediately activate the neighborhood air raid siren and families would be required to do the following in order:
Shut off all appliances, such as stoves, ovens, furnaces Shut off valves for water and natural gas or propane, as well as disconnect electricity Close blackout curtains (plain black curtains that would block light from coming in or going out). This step was changed after the atomic age began: where white curtains were used to reflect the thermal flash of the bomb, black curtains were used in World War II to prevent any airborne enemies from seeing light from windows Get to a public shelter, a fallout or bomb shelter, or the household basement, and stay there until the local police or block warden dismissed the blackout.[14][15]"
This topic of church service has hit close to home for me! I'm sure I have lost a couple friends during the last week or so when it comes to being a good citizen and obeying the request of social distancing. Haven't been to church in 3 weeks (haven't missed a service in ten years!).
You have to understand that I this case for once Christians aren't being attacked!!!! We are being asked to help slow the spread of this virus by adhering to the guidelines set forth by govt!!
It is my opinion that these "pastors" that refuse to cancel service are being inconsiderate, uncompassionate, distasteful, rebellious, and are a danger to others health!
Last edited by brianmall; 03/30/20 08:17 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823555
03/30/20 08:15 PM
03/30/20 08:15 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 7,236 West Michigan
Getting There
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Now I see why this virus is going to take so long to get under control, just read some of the above post. Do what you want but stay away from me. Lick all the door handles you want. Get together all you want, just watch the numbers go up in your area. I see they had the first baby die today. Sad.
To Old U.S. Army 60-63 SGT.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: waggler]
#6823567
03/30/20 08:19 PM
03/30/20 08:19 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 9,908 Arkansas
J Staton
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Arkansas
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If they were just clamping down on religious services I would be worried. The case now though is they are cracking down on everyone. I there was a Joe Biden rally and they turned a blind eye to that, yet stopped a church service, then we would have a constitutional issue.
Regardless of the law this preacher is showing blatant disregard for the health of his church members, possibly for a boost to his proud ego.
Our church last Sunday held our service over Zoom Meeting an internet App. It was great, that was a surprise to me since I'm not a big tech fan I can gather with others to work in a cabinet shop but can't gather to worship.This is what's fishy to me. As far as the church, it's members attended services of their own free will. If an arrest was to be made, they should have all been arrested for breaking .govs mandate. When a church makes the call, as my church has done, to not hold services that is perfectly fine and likely the smart thing to do. When .gov decides that you aren't allowed to meet and worship, that's tyranny.
James 1: 19-20
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: bblwi]
#6823577
03/30/20 08:22 PM
03/30/20 08:22 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
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I have never met a dead person that has any 1st amendment rights, maybe some of you have, if so enlighten us.
Bryce They don't talk much, but they still vote.
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: J Staton]
#6823579
03/30/20 08:24 PM
03/30/20 08:24 PM
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,738 carolina, Alabama
The Possum Man
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If they were just clamping down on religious services I would be worried. The case now though is they are cracking down on everyone. I there was a Joe Biden rally and they turned a blind eye to that, yet stopped a church service, then we would have a constitutional issue.
Regardless of the law this preacher is showing blatant disregard for the health of his church members, possibly for a boost to his proud ego.
Our church last Sunday held our service over Zoom Meeting an internet App. It was great, that was a surprise to me since I'm not a big tech fan I can gather with others to work in a cabinet shop but can't gather to worship.This is what's fishy to me. As far as the church, it's members attended services of their own free will. If an arrest was to be made, they should have all been arrested for breaking .govs mandate. When a church makes the call, as my church has done, to not hold services that is perfectly fine and likely the smart thing to do. When .gov decides that you aren't allowed to meet and worship, that's tyranny. The difference is you go to work with a few people, probably less than 10 or 20. Those "mega" churches gather hundreds or thousands of people all within less than arms reach in a room.
"If you're gonna be stupid you better be tough"
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823581
03/30/20 08:26 PM
03/30/20 08:26 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 9,908 Arkansas
J Staton
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If it's that bad why are any of us working? Are we essential or just expendable?
Last edited by J Staton; 03/30/20 08:27 PM.
James 1: 19-20
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: J Staton]
#6823586
03/30/20 08:29 PM
03/30/20 08:29 PM
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269 Indiana
brianmall
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If it's that bad why are any of us working? Are we essential or just expendable? Civilian = essential Military = expendable
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823588
03/30/20 08:29 PM
03/30/20 08:29 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
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OH
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A lot rejoiced when some States stopped abortions because of the virus. Just like Brian said, they are not attacking Christians, they are stopping all non essential activities like sports for instance.
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: brianmall]
#6823598
03/30/20 08:33 PM
03/30/20 08:33 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 9,908 Arkansas
J Staton
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If it's that bad why are any of us working? Are we essential or just expendable? Civilian = essential Military = expendable We're all soldiers now fighting an invisible enemy it seems. We plan on sun rise services on Easter at our church. Spread out across a field. That may change.
Last edited by J Staton; 03/30/20 08:33 PM.
James 1: 19-20
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823609
03/30/20 08:39 PM
03/30/20 08:39 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
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I just got done holding church in my house. 12 of us sat at a table and talked and ate. For now that's not recommended, bout still legal here. 40 miles away in the town I work, it's illegal. If I would have done what I did tonight 40 miles north of me, police could have came and knocked on my door and broke up our church service. In who's world is that acceptable, besides a tyrant? Wouldn't they do the same if MLB started a game?
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823627
03/30/20 08:45 PM
03/30/20 08:45 PM
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Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,491 Southern Illinois
Foxpaw
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I just got done holding church in my house. 12 of us sat at a table and talked and ate. For now that's not recommended, bout still legal here. 40 miles away in the town I work, it's illegal. If I would have done what I did tonight 40 miles north of me, police could have came and knocked on my door and broke up our church service. In who's world is that acceptable, besides a tyrant? Only a wolf would ask his flock to endanger themselves to a known risk. Wonder if he sorts out the true believers by having them stick there tongue to a hot frying pan. They are only saints if it doesn't burn them. If a guy wants to handle snakes and he doesn't endanger others then thats his business. Or drink poison as long as he doesn't endanger others by passing the Kool Aid.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823631
03/30/20 08:49 PM
03/30/20 08:49 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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My son works for kabota. several hundred people gather every day. daughter works for horizon. same thing. lotsa of places around here where hundreds gather every day. fedx ups jett. thats ok.
you people watch to much tv. your being brainwashed
Last edited by danny clifton; 03/30/20 08:49 PM.
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823635
03/30/20 08:51 PM
03/30/20 08:51 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
trapper
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trapper
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There's a difference between production and non production.
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: brianmall]
#6823636
03/30/20 08:52 PM
03/30/20 08:52 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,650 Southeast Ohio
amspoker
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Southeast Ohio
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It's one thing to be arrested for preaching The Word of God!
Whole other ball game if your arrested for putting people's lives in danger by holding a church service! I agree. Strange times we are in. We are trying to do our best.
Levi
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823647
03/30/20 09:02 PM
03/30/20 09:02 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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Central Oregon
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It's one thing to be arrested for preaching The Word of God!
Whole other ball game if your arrested for putting people's lives in danger by holding a church service! Maybe he doesnt buy the crisis bs Something fishy with your reaction ...............different religous denomination than you ?
Report a post club - Non member
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: J Staton]
#6823650
03/30/20 09:05 PM
03/30/20 09:05 PM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 9,153 Alaska and Washington State
waggler
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If they were just clamping down on religious services I would be worried. The case now though is they are cracking down on everyone. I there was a Joe Biden rally and they turned a blind eye to that, yet stopped a church service, then we would have a constitutional issue.
Regardless of the law this preacher is showing blatant disregard for the health of his church members, possibly for a boost to his proud ego.
Our church last Sunday held our service over Zoom Meeting an internet App. It was great, that was a surprise to me since I'm not a big tech fan I can gather with others to work in a cabinet shop but can't gather to worship.This is what's fishy to me. As far as the church, it's members attended services of their own free will. If an arrest was to be made, they should have all been arrested for breaking .govs mandate. When a church makes the call, as my church has done, to not hold services that is perfectly fine and likely the smart thing to do. When .gov decides that you aren't allowed to meet and worship, that's tyranny. This article helps illustrate the difference between a "cabinet shop" and a church gathering. People generally sing at church, so really belt it out. 60 People attended a choir practice in Washington State and 45 end up with CV-19 at least one dead so far. https://www.heraldnet.com/northwest/dozens-from-skagit-valley-chorale-have-covid-19-and-two-died/
"My life is better than your vacation"
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: AntiGov]
#6823651
03/30/20 09:05 PM
03/30/20 09:05 PM
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269 Indiana
brianmall
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269
Indiana
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It's one thing to be arrested for preaching The Word of God!
Whole other ball game if your arrested for putting people's lives in danger by holding a church service! Maybe he doesnt buy the crisis bs Something fishy with your reaction ...............different religous denomination than you ? I'd say he doesn't buy the Bible either! God has set govt over us! And as long as your not being told to do something against God!? Your to obey!
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823654
03/30/20 09:09 PM
03/30/20 09:09 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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i dont believe in god. i do believe in freedom. peaceable assembly does not threaten those who choose to isolate
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823662
03/30/20 09:13 PM
03/30/20 09:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 9,153 Alaska and Washington State
waggler
trapper
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Alaska and Washington State
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I had virtual church last Sunday via "Zoom Meeting", every household was connected via an internet zoom connection, it was great. Many of the these folks come from a place where they have actually suffered true religious persecution, I haven't heard any of them complain that what we are doing now is in any way persecution. We're just wimps and want everything our way a lot of the time. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raDCEhCKa84
"My life is better than your vacation"
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: trapdog1]
#6823664
03/30/20 09:13 PM
03/30/20 09:13 PM
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269 Indiana
brianmall
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269
Indiana
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Did I read that right? You are supposed to obey the government unless God tells you not to? Nope Reread it, think, then start another thread and I'll go there with ya.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: brianmall]
#6823672
03/30/20 09:18 PM
03/30/20 09:18 PM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
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OP
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Being asked not to hold a church service to help save lives is not unbiblical! Being asked is fine, I've got no problem with it. Being told I can't is a whole different ball game. I believe that meeting regularly with other believers in person on a regular basis is an integral part of my faith, no different than reading my Bible or praying. 40 miles away I could get arrested for it.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: brianmall]
#6823673
03/30/20 09:19 PM
03/30/20 09:19 PM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 10,468 Iowa
trapdog1
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Posts: 10,468
Iowa
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I know the thinking part may be a problem. But try
Ive been wanting a solid debate. No need for the insult. Just asking if that is what you meant. You said no. Thanks.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6823683
03/30/20 09:25 PM
03/30/20 09:25 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
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Joined: Nov 2015
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OH
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i dont believe in god. i do believe in freedom. peaceable assembly does not threaten those who choose to isolate Who are these people that isolate? All of us have to go out for stuff some time. Those people go to church, go shopping, get gas and so on. They are helping in the spreading of the virus. I am all about freedom, right now I don't see an infringement, I see sacrifice for our fellowman.
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: AntiGov]
#6823688
03/30/20 09:28 PM
03/30/20 09:28 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 915 Northern Virginia
Jarhead620
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Posts: 915
Northern Virginia
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If you are so stupid or reckless to risk your life on a false premise I guess you deserve your fate. However, that does not give you the right to put the lives of your family and friends in jeopardy.
Last edited by Jarhead620; 03/30/20 09:35 PM.
"Just as the deer herd lives in mortal fear of its wolves, so does a mountain live in mortal fear of its deer." Aldo Leopold
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823691
03/30/20 09:28 PM
03/30/20 09:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 9,153 Alaska and Washington State
waggler
trapper
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 9,153
Alaska and Washington State
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Catch 22
Exactly, you got it right. It is the Christian thing to do to sacrifice something in order to serve others. Being selfish and saying "I'm going to do X because it is my right" is not being very Christ-like.
Last edited by waggler; 03/30/20 09:30 PM.
"My life is better than your vacation"
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: waggler]
#6823698
03/30/20 09:34 PM
03/30/20 09:34 PM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
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Catch 22
Exactly, you got it right. It is the Christian thing to do to sacrifice something in order to serve others. Being selfish and saying "I'm going to do X because it is my right" is not being very Christ-like. What about dropping off groceries for a coronavirus patient? What about offering to hold narcotics anonymous in our basement (more than 10 people) because the church that holds it is closed and some of these guys (two of which are in our temporary home church) are on the brink of falling off the wagon? Would that be a good Christian sacrifice, or should those people just suffer so that I don't risk getting sick?
Last edited by loosegoose; 03/30/20 09:35 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823701
03/30/20 09:36 PM
03/30/20 09:36 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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so its too dangerous for 3-400 people to gather at fedx?
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6823704
03/30/20 09:39 PM
03/30/20 09:39 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,650 Southeast Ohio
amspoker
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,650
Southeast Ohio
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so its too dangerous for 3-400 people to gather at fedx? Depends. Do they have a pot luck afterwards?
Levi
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823706
03/30/20 09:41 PM
03/30/20 09:41 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 20,914 North East Kansas
Marty
trapper
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Posts: 20,914
North East Kansas
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This is just the beginning of this type of dissension/arguments......wait a month or two and see what it is like....
If a addict/drunk is about to use its probably best for their sponsor to meet/stay with them....but ultimately they have to want to do it for themselves/by themselves. Really no need to have 30 people @ a meeting, limit it to 8 or something reasonable where people can keep their distance.
E 'Honey Badger Militia' Sleep, the anti woke adote.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: WhiteTrash 88]
#6823709
03/30/20 09:43 PM
03/30/20 09:43 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124
McGrath, AK
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Wonder if he needs all those people to come to his mega church so they can put money in the plate when they pass it. Got to keep up with Jim and Tammy Fay. He may need a new caddy or A-C for his hounds dog house. BINGO !!! The entire episode screams SELFISHNESS. Is that what Christianity is all about ?
Mean As Nails
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823715
03/30/20 09:46 PM
03/30/20 09:46 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124
McGrath, AK
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I wonder what some of you would do if the government said you can own guns, just not certain kinds, because they're too dangerous.....or you've gotta give up your guns, it's dangerous and puts other people at risk....you can talk the talk but would you walk the walk? When your rights are put on hold in the name of safety would you stand up and disobey, or shrug your shoulders go along? Whether I own a particular gun or not is no threat to you unless I choose to use it against you. There are already other laws that cover that eventuality..............even if it is a gun approved by the government. The two situations are not comparable at all.
Mean As Nails
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823721
03/30/20 09:49 PM
03/30/20 09:49 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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Wonder why they dont just issue a royal decree that no one leaves their home, for any reason, for 1 month. Make it legal to shoot anybody you can see outside from your window Would get rid of a lot of homeless people. Virus would be gone after a month. If a month isnt long enough then make it two. Emergency services could deliver sterilized food and water while wearing bio hazard suits.
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823725
03/30/20 09:53 PM
03/30/20 09:53 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
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Posts: 16,951
OH
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I wonder what some of you would do if the government said you can own guns, just not certain kinds, because they're too dangerous.....or you've gotta give up your guns, it's dangerous and puts other people at risk....you can talk the talk but would you walk the walk? When your rights are put on hold in the name of safety would you stand up and disobey, or shrug your shoulders go along? Goose, that's apples and oranges and different scenarios. Again, wouldn't they do the same if MLB started up a game? You can worship with your family. You can do outreach, pray over peoples homes, take groceries to someone in need, you can do a lot and it be pleasing to God without congregating in numbers. Your routine is shaken, not your freedom or your faith.
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6823735
03/30/20 09:58 PM
03/30/20 09:58 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 9,908 Arkansas
J Staton
trapper
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trapper
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Arkansas
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so its too dangerous for 3-400 people to gather at fedx? Maybe could have church at the FedX facility?
James 1: 19-20
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6823736
03/30/20 09:58 PM
03/30/20 09:58 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 16,256 Iowa
~ADC~
The Count
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The Count
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 16,256
Iowa
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Wonder why they dont just issue a royal decree that no one leaves their home, for any reason, for 1 month. Make it legal to shoot anybody you can see outside from your window Would get rid of a lot of homeless people. Virus would be gone after a month. If a month isnt long enough then make it two. Emergency services could deliver sterilized food and water while wearing bio hazard suits. Fine by me.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823737
03/30/20 09:59 PM
03/30/20 09:59 PM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144 Ohio
BuckMink
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144
Ohio
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When it is against the LAW to spread the gospel, to witness, to preach... to share the word then its wrong. The fact that we are STILL meeting through video and not in person is not against the gospel. Its for the common good of people. I am not going to unnecessary put my family at risk. Why? Because I LOVE them!
We dont have people shutting down FB because of a sermon. We dont have police coming into houses and stealing bibles. We dont have youtube channels of pastors and sermons being blocked. We dont have churches, seminaries being burned because its the gospel. We dont have christians being arrested for being a christian. (of course this is debatable in this thread) Im thinking of china, india, and korea where you DONT HAVE FREEDOM.)
That is an underground church.
Last edited by BuckMink; 03/30/20 10:03 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823739
03/30/20 09:59 PM
03/30/20 09:59 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,987 Oregon
beaverpeeler
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Posts: 10,987
Oregon
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Just saw on the news tonight where a choir practice was held in Washington on March 10th (before the shelter rule came into effect). Almost all of them ill with the virus now and two deaths. Just breathing and singing next to each other did it.
They don't sing at churches by any chance do they?
My fear of moving stairs is escalating!
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823745
03/30/20 10:03 PM
03/30/20 10:03 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 9,908 Arkansas
J Staton
trapper
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trapper
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Arkansas
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I think there must be a disconnect between what's "right" and a right. You have the God given right to assemble even if it might not be the right thing to do.
James 1: 19-20
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823747
03/30/20 10:04 PM
03/30/20 10:04 PM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144 Ohio
BuckMink
trapper
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144
Ohio
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The church does have choirs
Last edited by BuckMink; 03/30/20 10:06 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: J Staton]
#6823750
03/30/20 10:05 PM
03/30/20 10:05 PM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144 Ohio
BuckMink
trapper
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144
Ohio
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I think there must be a disconnect between what's "right" and a right. You have the God given right to assemble even if it might not be the right thing to do. Agree with this statement.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: J Staton]
#6823757
03/30/20 10:06 PM
03/30/20 10:06 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951
OH
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I think there must be a disconnect between what's "right" and a right. You have the God given right to assemble even if it might not be the right thing to do. Can you yell fire in a crowded theater without repercussions?
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823759
03/30/20 10:06 PM
03/30/20 10:06 PM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
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OP
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739
Beatrice, NE
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I think there must be a disconnect between what's "right" and a right. You have the God given right to assemble even if it might not be the right thing to do. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should Just because it's not a good idea doesn't mean the government should arrest you for it.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: Catch22]
#6823766
03/30/20 10:12 PM
03/30/20 10:12 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 9,908 Arkansas
J Staton
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Aug 2012
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Arkansas
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I think there must be a disconnect between what's "right" and a right. You have the God given right to assemble even if it might not be the right thing to do. Can you yell fire in a crowded theater without repercussions? 22, these people attended of their own free will knowing the possible consequences. It would be like the movie crowd knowing that someone was going to yell fire.
James 1: 19-20
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823770
03/30/20 10:13 PM
03/30/20 10:13 PM
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269 Indiana
brianmall
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trapper
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269
Indiana
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Lol
Go shoot a jukebox and see what happens!
Your rights end where the other man's nose begins!
Govt isn't telling you how or when to worship in the sense of our inalienable rights! Heck, they aren't even limiting the guidelines to churches!!!! They are telling everyone.
Most churches have a very high demographic of elderly folk! I'd suspect that will change real soon in churches like the one in question! The pastor is the head of the church. If anyone is to be arrested for civil disobedience? It should be him!
Last edited by brianmall; 03/30/20 10:16 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: trapdog1]
#6823772
03/30/20 10:14 PM
03/30/20 10:14 PM
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269 Indiana
brianmall
trapper
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trapper
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Indiana
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I know the thinking part may be a problem. But try
Ive been wanting a solid debate. No need for the insult. Just asking if that is what you meant. You said no. Thanks. I was serious.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823779
03/30/20 10:20 PM
03/30/20 10:20 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 11,440 Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
Sharon
"American Honey"
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"American Honey"
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 11,440
Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
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I think there must be a disconnect between what's "right" and a right. You have the God given right to assemble even if it might not be the right thing to do. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should "All things are lawful, but not all things are advantageous. ".... On the other hand, online meetings ARE the same as personal assemblies. To be reasonable . To be otherwise is to stumble others in fanatical unreasonableness.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823780
03/30/20 10:20 PM
03/30/20 10:20 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124
McGrath, AK
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Just because it's not a good idea doesn't mean the government should arrest you for it.
The pastor was arrested for violating the law. No one was arrested for how they worship, what they worship, who they worship, what they read or think. No one is persecuting Christians with these restrictions ( There may be OTHER efforts in the political realm directed at Christians but this isn't it ) Contrary to what you have posted this "pastor" has violated the law. LAW made and passed by Congress, signed by a President and adjudicated by SCOTUS. You are usually a lot more cogent in your arguments Goose. You are letting your religion overrule your logic. That is neither good for your religion nor society. You can still meet with fellow believers........just not in the numbers or places you are used to. If your Christianity doesn't care about the rest of society, then something is missing in your belief system.
Mean As Nails
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823783
03/30/20 10:24 PM
03/30/20 10:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
trapper
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trapper
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Central Oregon
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Wonder why they dont just issue a royal decree that no one leaves their home, for any reason, for 1 month. Make it legal to shoot anybody you can see outside from your window Would get rid of a lot of homeless people. Virus would be gone after a month. If a month isnt long enough then make it two. Emergency services could deliver sterilized food and water while wearing bio hazard suits. You apparently weren't around during the Watts riots in 1965. That is exactly what happened. I recall seeing ..on TV....the national guard open up with an M60 on a car load of looters. That ended the riot immediately, after way too many days of tolerance. The old man has some good stories of the watts riots ..........he went through several boxes of 00 buck shot
Last edited by AntiGov; 03/30/20 10:29 PM.
Report a post club - Non member
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823790
03/30/20 10:26 PM
03/30/20 10:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
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J, my point is rights are not absolute. The people attending these services are going out into the public as well, they aren't just risking themselves, they are putting others in danger as well. It's bad enough that we have to go out to get supplies once in a while, why add to the chances of getting infected and infecting others. The right to worship or assemble is not being infringed upon.
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823794
03/30/20 10:27 PM
03/30/20 10:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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Central Oregon
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Just because it's not a good idea doesn't mean the government should arrest you for it.
The pastor was arrested for violating the law. No one was arrested for how they worship, what they worship, who they worship, what they read or think. No one is persecuting Christians with these restrictions ( There may be OTHER efforts in the political realm directed at Christians but this isn't it ) Contrary to what you have posted this "pastor" has violated the law. LAW made and passed by Congress, signed by a President and adjudicated by SCOTUS. You are usually a lot more cogent in your arguments Goose. You are letting your religion overrule your logic. That is neither good for your religion nor society. You can still meet with fellow believers........just not in the numbers or places you are used to. If your Christianity doesn't care about the rest of society, then something is missing in your belief system. Im not concerned so much with the religeous aspect of it as much as i am over a law made over a fake crisis and then an arrest .........snowball fallout
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823798
03/30/20 10:29 PM
03/30/20 10:29 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
trapper
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Just because it's not a good idea doesn't mean the government should arrest you for it.
The pastor was arrested for violating the law. No one was arrested for how they worship, what they worship, who they worship, what they read or think. No one is persecuting Christians with these restrictions ( There may be OTHER efforts in the political realm directed at Christians but this isn't it ) Contrary to what you have posted this "pastor" has violated the law. LAW made and passed by Congress, signed by a President and adjudicated by SCOTUS. You are usually a lot more cogent in your arguments Goose. You are letting your religion overrule your logic. That is neither good for your religion nor society. You can still meet with fellow believers........just not in the numbers or places you are used to. If your Christianity doesn't care about the rest of society, then something is missing in your belief system.Matthew 6-5, may be worth a read for some of these Pastors.
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823800
03/30/20 10:29 PM
03/30/20 10:29 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 11,440 Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
Sharon
"American Honey"
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"American Honey"
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 11,440
Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
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Just because it's not a good idea doesn't mean the government should arrest you for it.
The pastor was arrested for violating the law. No one was arrested for how they worship, what they worship, who they worship, what they read or think. No one is persecuting Christians with these restrictions ( There may be OTHER efforts in the political realm directed at Christians but this isn't it ) Contrary to what you have posted this "pastor" has violated the law. LAW made and passed by Congress, signed by a President and adjudicated by SCOTUS. You are usually a lot more cogent in your arguments Goose. You are letting your religion overrule your logic. That is neither good for your religion nor society. You can still meet with fellow believers........just not in the numbers or places you are used to. If your Christianity doesn't care about the rest of society, then something is missing in your belief system. Exactly. Many are holding online meetings and seeing the logic of showing love-doing to others as they would wish done to themselves....without a single thing missing from their intent or message. All in compliance with unselfishness to those whom they preach in showing example in action.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: AntiGov]
#6823802
03/30/20 10:30 PM
03/30/20 10:30 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124
McGrath, AK
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The pastor was arrested for violating the law. No one was arrested for how they worship, what they worship, who they worship, what they read or think. No one is persecuting Christians with these restrictions ( There may be OTHER efforts in the political realm directed at Christians but this isn't it )
Contrary to what you have posted this "pastor" has violated the law. LAW made and passed by Congress, signed by a President and adjudicated by SCOTUS.
You are usually a lot more cogent in your arguments Goose. You are letting your religion overrule your logic.
That is neither good for your religion nor society.
You can still meet with fellow believers........just not in the numbers or places you are used to.
If your Christianity doesn't care about the rest of society, then something is missing in your belief system.
Im not concerned so much with the religeous aspect of it as much as i am over a law made over a fake crisis and then an arrest .........snowball fallout I don't know what law you are referring to that was ..."made over a fake crisis.."
Mean As Nails
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: Catch22]
#6823804
03/30/20 10:31 PM
03/30/20 10:31 PM
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,269 Indiana
brianmall
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J, my point is rights are not absolute. The people attending these services are going out into the public as well, they aren't just risking themselves, they are putting others in danger as well. It's bad enough that we have to go out to get supplies once in a while, why add to the chances of getting infected and infecting others. The right to worship or assemble is not being infringed upon. Not only that But also,. The "guidelines" will multiply, tighten, and become more severe if we don't get this virus under control. There was mention today of making is all wear mask while we're out in public! I can't stand wearing hard hats and safety glasses! And I don't like confined spaces! Face mask would kill me! Stay home!
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823805
03/30/20 10:31 PM
03/30/20 10:31 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,488 Moved to Fbks, Ak.
martentrapper
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At least half our population is part of the "essential service" work force. So anytime you go to th store, or anywhere else, at least half the people there are out mingling with other workers every work day. Doubtful many of these people are practicing "social distancing" while at work. Medics are leading this country down the road to DEPRESSION! Some doctor here in Alaska just released a "model" that says we may have to hunker for months to slow the spread. Months? Really? Wonder if his model is one of those garbage in, garbage out models. Does anyone else notice that all the folks calling for, and supporting more restrictions have GUARANTEED incomes? How guaranteed will that income be when no one, except govt. employees, has the money to pay taxes? We have had "pandemics" before. Didn't have to destroy lives financially then. Supposedly some other countries aren't forcing hunker down orders and dealing with the medical aspect satisfactorily. Maybe we could too if we didn't have fear mongering. For those who will respond that we are saving lives I ask, are we? Did you count the increase in suicides? Did you count the increase in drug abuse/deaths? Will domestic violence/ deaths increase? Minuchin was on today saying they are preparing for round 2 of stimulus money. Hey, maybe I can retire, move to my wilderness trapline, and get stimulus money for the rest of my freaking life!!! MT
Last edited by martentrapper; 03/30/20 10:34 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823821
03/30/20 10:42 PM
03/30/20 10:42 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,263 james bay frontierOnt.
Boco
trapper
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james bay frontierOnt.
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You cant put money ahead of peoples lives.So what if you wind up poor and destitute,at least millions of lives will be saved. Empires dont last forever-there is always a re-set.
Last edited by Boco; 03/30/20 10:43 PM.
Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823830
03/30/20 10:46 PM
03/30/20 10:46 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
trapper
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Central Oregon
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Whats way worse is sending thousands of peolpe home with cv19 ........because of predetermined guidelines . But hey we can arrest a pastor
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: amspoker]
#6823834
03/30/20 10:49 PM
03/30/20 10:49 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 62,658 Minnesota
330-Trapper
trapper
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To each his own, I am glad he is not my shepherd
Bryce Well said. Me 3
NRA and NTA Life Member www.BackroadsRevised@etsy.com
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823838
03/30/20 10:51 PM
03/30/20 10:51 PM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,445 idaho
wallfur
trapper
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idaho
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I wonder what some of you would do if the government said you can own guns, just not certain kinds, because they're too dangerous.....or you've gotta give up your guns, it's dangerous and puts other people at risk....you can talk the talk but would you walk the walk? When your rights are put on hold in the name of safety would you stand up and disobey, or shrug your shoulders go along? .......usa just hit the 3000 dead mark today, I hope none of those were from your church gathering.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: Boco]
#6823841
03/30/20 10:52 PM
03/30/20 10:52 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,488 Moved to Fbks, Ak.
martentrapper
trapper
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Moved to Fbks, Ak.
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You cant put money ahead of peoples lives.So what if you wind up poor and destitute,at least millions of lives will be saved. Empires dont last forever-there is always a re-set. I will point out that Boco is one of those with a guaranteed retirement income, right, Bo? We put money ahead of lives all the time. mt
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: BuckMink]
#6823850
03/30/20 10:59 PM
03/30/20 10:59 PM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,445 idaho
wallfur
trapper
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When it is against the LAW to spread the gospel, to witness, to preach... to share the word then its wrong. The fact that we are STILL meeting through video and not in person is not against the gospel. Its for the common good of people. I am not going to unnecessary put my family at risk. Why? Because I LOVE them!
We dont have people shutting down FB because of a sermon. We dont have police coming into houses and stealing bibles. We dont have youtube channels of pastors and sermons being blocked. We dont have churches, seminaries being burned because its the gospel. We dont have christians being arrested for being a christian. (of course this is debatable in this thread) Im thinking of china, india, and korea where you DONT HAVE FREEDOM.)
That is an underground church.
....... and we have a president that is bring back prayer and pledge of allegiance back into the schools
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823854
03/30/20 11:02 PM
03/30/20 11:02 PM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
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A bunch of people watching a sermon at the same time sitting here n their homes is NOT the same as meeting in person. If you watch a sermon in your home, that is NOT "going to church". The church is the group of people that go to the building and meet together. If you don't meet with the people, you don't meet with the church. If every member of T-man eats lunch at exactly 12:00 tomorrow, would we say we all ate lunch together? Of course not, because we weren't together. In the same line of thinking, watching a sermon at the same time as other people does not mean you did church together. There's nothing wrong with watching a sermon at home, but it's no different than watching a teaching on YouTube, or listening to a podcast. Its not the same as meeting in person with other believers.
In any case, it's not up to the government to tell me how to meet with other believers. If a government official tells me I can't meet in person but I can meet online, that amounts to a government official telling me how to practice my religion.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: martentrapper]
#6823856
03/30/20 11:04 PM
03/30/20 11:04 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,263 james bay frontierOnt.
Boco
trapper
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james bay frontierOnt.
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You are wrong-my income is not guaranteed-nothing is guaranteed. My income is a return on investment from when I worked and sacrificed part of my income for several decades.If the stock market crashes-no more income. its not free money from the government for doing nothing like you get in Alaska.
Last edited by Boco; 03/30/20 11:07 PM.
Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823862
03/30/20 11:09 PM
03/30/20 11:09 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124
McGrath, AK
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A bunch of people watching a sermon at the same time sitting here n their homes is NOT the same as meeting in person. If you watch a sermon in your home, that is NOT "going to church". The church is the group of people that go to the building and meet together. If you don't meet with the people, you don't meet with the church. If every member of T-man eats lunch at exactly 12:00 tomorrow, would we say we all ate lunch together? Of course not, because we weren't together. In the same line of thinking, watching a sermon at the same time as other people does not mean you did church together. There's nothing wrong with watching a sermon at home, but it's no different than watching a teaching on YouTube, or listening to a podcast. Its not the same as meeting in person with other believers.
In any case, it's not up to the government to tell me how to meet with other believers. If a government official tells me I can't meet in person but I can meet online, that amounts to a government official telling me how to practice my religion. So your 'church' and belief is dependent on a building ?? The IRS will have a problem with that as well as Muddyriverdogs. What if ...because of fire hazard.....the Forest Service restricts your access to the forest. Are you going to ignore that also ? Is that telling you how you can/should recreate ?
Mean As Nails
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823863
03/30/20 11:11 PM
03/30/20 11:11 PM
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Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,771 WI
WIMarshRAT
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I have been enjoying all the different online services by all the local churches here. About time they try to reach the masses again instead of putting their congregation in danger.
Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass...it's about learning to dance in the rain!
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823867
03/30/20 11:15 PM
03/30/20 11:15 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 11,440 Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
Sharon
"American Honey"
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"American Honey"
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 11,440
Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
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A bunch of people watching a sermon at the same time sitting here n their homes is NOT the same as meeting in person. If you watch a sermon in your home, that is NOT "going to church". The church is the group of people that go to the building and meet together. If you don't meet with the people, you don't meet with the church. If every member of T-man eats lunch at exactly 12:00 tomorrow, would we say we all ate lunch together? Of course not, because we weren't together. In the same line of thinking, watching a sermon at the same time as other people does not mean you did church together. There's nothing wrong with watching a sermon at home, but it's no different than watching a teaching on YouTube, or listening to a podcast. Its not the same as meeting in person with other believers.
In any case, it's not up to the government to tell me how to meet with other believers. If a government official tells me I can't meet in person but I can meet online, that amounts to a government official telling me how to practice my religion. Sigh.......it IS meeting together, online. Every religion who is doing this worldwide sees the logic of this,.if yours is so local it doesn't know this, others do who are organized worldwide .....along with everyone else who speaks by phone, face time , zoom or Skype to their loved ones without being with them, or via an online conference- as big business corporations do. That is as true as the grandmother loving to see and hear her grandchildren encouraging her via Skype or other wise. If you cant see the live action in all of that, at least see the apostle Paul's letters- all his writings- that he said meant as much to the building up of the congregations as in person. But if you need to save face - no reasoning will suffice .
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823880
03/30/20 11:21 PM
03/30/20 11:21 PM
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951 OH
Catch22
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 16,951
OH
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A bunch of people watching a sermon at the same time sitting here n their homes is NOT the same as meeting in person. If you watch a sermon in your home, that is NOT "going to church". The church is the group of people that go to the building and meet together. If you don't meet with the people, you don't meet with the church. If every member of T-man eats lunch at exactly 12:00 tomorrow, would we say we all ate lunch together? Of course not, because we weren't together. In the same line of thinking, watching a sermon at the same time as other people does not mean you did church together. There's nothing wrong with watching a sermon at home, but it's no different than watching a teaching on YouTube, or listening to a podcast. Its not the same as meeting in person with other believers.
In any case, it's not up to the government to tell me how to meet with other believers. If a government official tells me I can't meet in person but I can meet online, that amounts to a government official telling me how to practice my religion. You start a thread, you don't answer questions, you keep saying the same thing over and over. I have said what I believe is my best to help you and your family and I wish you well. I'll leave you with this. You can have your own service at home, a sermon and fellowship with your family. You can do many things that please God without possibly hurting others. Read the Bible and talk to God, ask him for guidance. I personally don't believe any God would want you to feel this way. I will pray for you and yours.
I wonder if tap dancers walk into a room, look at the floor, and think, I'd tap that. I wonder about things.....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823881
03/30/20 11:21 PM
03/30/20 11:21 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 20,914 North East Kansas
Marty
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People not following the guidelines will end up causing much more suffering for everyone....
E 'Honey Badger Militia' Sleep, the anti woke adote.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823892
03/30/20 11:26 PM
03/30/20 11:26 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
trapper
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trapper
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Posts: 17,692
Central Oregon
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A bunch of people watching a sermon at the same time sitting here n their homes is NOT the same as meeting in person. If you watch a sermon in your home, that is NOT "going to church". The church is the group of people that go to the building and meet together. If you don't meet with the people, you don't meet with the church. If every member of T-man eats lunch at exactly 12:00 tomorrow, would we say we all ate lunch together? Of course not, because we weren't together. In the same line of thinking, watching a sermon at the same time as other people does not mean you did church together. There's nothing wrong with watching a sermon at home, but it's no different than watching a teaching on YouTube, or listening to a podcast. Its not the same as meeting in person with other believers.
In any case, it's not up to the government to tell me how to meet with other believers. If a government official tells me I can't meet in person but I can meet online, that amounts to a government official telling me how to practice my religion. So your 'church' and belief is dependent on a building ?? The IRS will have a problem with that as well as Muddyriverdogs. What if ...because of fire hazard.....the Forest Service restricts your access to the forest. Are you going to ignore that also ? Is that telling you how you can/should recreate ? It happens quite offten ..... Forest Diservice restricting access because of a so called fire hazard ........always trying to save us from ourselves
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: hippie]
#6823896
03/30/20 11:30 PM
03/30/20 11:30 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
trapper
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Same arguments anti-gunners use.
" it's for the good of society "
" when it happens to one of yours you'll feel different"
I'm torn on this one, what's next, tracking devises?
Cuomo just signed by executive order that landlords can't evict someone for failing to pay rent. Only a dirtbag would throw someone out right now if they couldn't pay rent, but beyond that is the taking of yet another piece of freedom. And some of those " evil landlords " rely on that income to survive ............gov picking the winners and losers
Last edited by AntiGov; 03/30/20 11:31 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: AntiGov]
#6823897
03/30/20 11:32 PM
03/30/20 11:32 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,124
McGrath, AK
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So your 'church' and belief is dependent on a building ??
The IRS will have a problem with that as well as Muddyriverdogs.
What if ...because of fire hazard.....the Forest Service restricts your access to the forest. Are you going to ignore that also ? Is that telling you how you can/should recreate ?
It happens quite offten ..... Forest Diservice restricting access because of a so called fire hazard ........always trying to save us from ourselves Have you ever had an initial attack crew cutting fire line in your back yard ? I have. They weren't trying to restrict my access to the forest, they were trying to save my house. I'm guessing you'd be offended by that and tell them to get off your property ??
Mean As Nails
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823912
03/30/20 11:44 PM
03/30/20 11:44 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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Come on white , you know thats not what im talking about
You said restricting pubilc access to public forest because of a fire hazard ........happens here all the time for a multitude of reasons , alot of it is bs
Obviously if an inferno is in ones backyard its not going to be unrealistic to have restricted access to mushroom picking in that moment
Last edited by AntiGov; 03/30/20 11:45 PM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823925
03/30/20 11:53 PM
03/30/20 11:53 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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It happens here too but it isn't some Big Government plot to keep citizens out of the forest. It's to protect the dang forest and the public resources in it You might think differently if you lived where the national forest is managed soley by liberals Its always in the " name of protecting public resources "
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823936
03/31/20 12:00 AM
03/31/20 12:00 AM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 11,440 Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
Sharon
"American Honey"
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Joined: Mar 2011
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Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
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I lived in CA for 29 years. That is way long enough to understand the motives in undercurrent tactics....and to discern the need in protection, in other dealings.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823938
03/31/20 12:01 AM
03/31/20 12:01 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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I lived in CA for 29 years. Memory loss then ? ....lol That was a long long time ago ....things have changed in the last 30 yrs Where in cali did you live ?
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823951
03/31/20 12:18 AM
03/31/20 12:18 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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I have absolutely no doubt it is worse now than then.
AS a kid I was was about 20 miles east of L.A
After the military I was in N. CA in Humboldt county I was born in west covina , lived in big bear for awhile Part of my high school yrs i lived in Truckee
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823964
03/31/20 12:29 AM
03/31/20 12:29 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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WOW I was born and grew up in Monrovia.
Fished Big Bear many times. College at Humboldt
In n out ...has finally moved north into oregon ( ive been waiting 35 yrs ) . If you hold out long enough they may move into washington and then alaska
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823969
03/31/20 12:32 AM
03/31/20 12:32 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
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AntiGov
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I remember the orange/ red tide ( gold fish ? ) in big bear lake . And the layer of smog that would creep up from the valley ....
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823975
03/31/20 12:39 AM
03/31/20 12:39 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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I remember the one in Monrovia. On HGWY 66 right under the train trestle. I don't know how early they were there but I remember them at least around 1950. Good stuff !!
I had family in West Covina from about '53 to '60 Prolly not a place either one of us wants to return to ......
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823980
03/31/20 12:44 AM
03/31/20 12:44 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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It was 1948 white , first one in baldwin park , a mile from my grandmothers house ..........growing up i never knew what a mcdonalds was .....lol
Last edited by AntiGov; 03/31/20 12:45 AM.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823984
03/31/20 12:53 AM
03/31/20 12:53 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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Me either. Peaks, in Pasadena was the prototype for MCD. I met Sirhan Sirhan at that place. He was working there around 1962-63
1948. They sure have been a success Good thing you didnt wiz him off ............lol ...........crazy
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823987
03/31/20 01:07 AM
03/31/20 01:07 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,692 Central Oregon
AntiGov
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Dont forget Sambo's resturant ....lol
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6823990
03/31/20 01:11 AM
03/31/20 01:11 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
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AntiGov
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Wasnt puddingstone a small man made lake / swim hole with steel slides into the water , and a nasty overcrowded beach ?
Or am i thinking of something else ?
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6823991
03/31/20 01:11 AM
03/31/20 01:11 AM
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Joined: Jan 2014
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AntiGov
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Oh riiiiiiiigght !! I do remember that !!
Well I suppose we've hijacked Goose's thread enough for one night !!
Fun to reminisce without having to be there ! Roger that
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: Sharon]
#6823997
03/31/20 01:38 AM
03/31/20 01:38 AM
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AntiGov
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Many good things that has had us led to the appreciative places we have found .
And the depth we see in goals we will meet . Everything else is unfocused static . To see the gems sparkling in our timeline is all we need. True story
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824005
03/31/20 02:26 AM
03/31/20 02:26 AM
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Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 343 NW Wisconsin
Muskrat Love
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Getting back to LG original post.... I often wondered how Our Lord would view these mega churches when the Second Coming arrives.
I attended one in Minnesota, several times, at a friends request. Both he and his wife were big time "arm wavers" and liked the pastor... Mac Hammond. Now a service at this church was a real New York production. A band that could put Elvis's Hawaii tour musicians to shame. A great choir and awesome speakers. The underlying message I got out of Mac's sermon was the "God wants us to be successful and wealthy".
My friend said that he made a tithe to the church of 20% of his earnings. When the market crashed in '98, he was unable to give but a small pittance to them, but was chastised for going back on his original pledge. He was shunned by those in the inner circle, of which he was originally part of.
Seems to me like some churches have lost sight of what a house of worship should be about. I remember a great movie..... If I remember correctly it was called Leap of Faith, with Steve Martin. He plays an evangelical preacher who pedals his bogus cures to reap big donations. The movie ends with him getting stuck in a small Kansas town where a miracle actually takes place.
Born and raised Catholic.... Yeah, I heard all the Catholic priest abuse jokes, but my church now is watching a trout "tail out" a redd in our stream or watch a grouse drag her one wing on the ground, when you come upon her on a spring hike. Must be babies near... Watch your step!
Getting back to the abuse thing...... After attending Catholic school for 12 years in the late 40's, well if nuns were included in these "abuse" cases, I'd be a millionaire.
"I'm an old dog, and these are all new tricks!"
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: waggler]
#6824006
03/31/20 02:55 AM
03/31/20 02:55 AM
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,575 N. Carolina
Scout1
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If they were just clamping down on religious services I would be worried. The case now though is they are cracking down on everyone. I there was a Joe Biden rally and they turned a blind eye to that, yet stopped a church service, then we would have a constitutional issue.
Regardless of the law this preacher is showing blatant disregard for the health of his church members, possibly for a boost to his proud ego.
Our church last Sunday held our service over Zoom Meeting an internet App. It was great, that was a surprise to me since I'm not a big tech fan ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^this^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
------------------------------------- DJT & MTG in 2024!
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: Marty]
#6824041
03/31/20 06:15 AM
03/31/20 06:15 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,946 South metro, MN
Calvin
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People not following the guidelines will end up causing much more suffering for everyone.... Yep.. Was this the church that now has 41 people testing positive for covid? Or a different church ( that wasn't taking it seriously)? Most every other church has found a way to get the messages out without endangering their entire congregation.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824050
03/31/20 07:00 AM
03/31/20 07:00 AM
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Mark June
Unregistered
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Mark June
Unregistered
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Our seminary cancelled on-site class, and in-house daily chapel service even before the orders came to do so. DTS, and other world-leading non-denominational seminaries came to the same conclusion fairly quickly. We are now all online from this point until ???
Everyone I interact with daily from Dallas Theological Seminary (professors, staff, students) realize that this isn't optimal, but there are times when we as followers of Christ should be an example; salt, and light, to the world. Churches should be the very first to protect brothers and sisters, whatever that may look like.
It's not a earthly political or freedom America theme. It's a biblical calling to serve your brother and sister and guard them.
Helping to protect "other" people's lives isn't selfish, it's biblical. Many know Matthew 22:39, where Jesus answered the religious Jews who asked the greatest of commands, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself," but Christ who came to fulfill the Law knew the Hebrew Scriptures intimately so Jesus knew that He answered the religious Sadducees quoting the words spoken by God to Moses in the Hebrew text; Leviticus 19:18, "You shall not take vengeance, nor bear any grudge against the sons of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself; I am the Lord."
We as followers of Christ should never put "my rights and privileges" above our concerns over others. If we do, please don't quote your Bible, because your hermeneutics and interpretation skills need a Divine reset.
Unselfishness and righteous (opposite of self-righteous) behavior is not common in society, but the redemptive way has been made available as a choice to each of us... by the One who described it as a narrow, not well traveled path. Mercifully some are allowed on it by choice, not by good deeds or cash or any host of false means.
Blessings y'all Mark
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824055
03/31/20 07:10 AM
03/31/20 07:10 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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Millions of people are going to work, getting ready for work, getting out of bed to work and already at work, right now as I write this. They are all going to mingle with millions of other people. More millions of children than the millions of adults going to work are going to mingle with millions of other children and millions of adults who drop off and pick up kids at daycares all over the nation. That is all perfectly fine.
When 30 of those people who all work together, get together outside of work to celebrate one of thems birthday, or peaceably assemble at a church, or take those kids to park to mingle instead of a daycare, why they are just irresponsible jerks doing their best kill old people and kids with asthma. I say put them in prison to mingle with only a few thousand and slow the spread of this virus.
Anybody that decides to use a TV set for target practice is clearly unhinged and should be redflagged.
Who yells fire in a theater that has fire alarms? Does it really cause a panic?
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: ]
#6824062
03/31/20 07:22 AM
03/31/20 07:22 AM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,162 KY
ksp107
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,162
KY
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Our seminary cancelled on-site class, and in-house daily chapel service even before the orders came to do so. DTS, and other world-leading non-denominational seminaries came to the same conclusion fairly quickly. We are now all online from this point until ???
Everyone I interact with daily from Dallas Theological Seminary (professors, staff, students) realize that this isn't optimal, but there are times when we as followers of Christ should be an example; salt, and light, to the world. Churches should be the very first to protect brothers and sisters, whatever that may look like.
It's not a earthly political or freedom America theme. It's a biblical calling to serve your brother and sister and guard them.
Helping to protect "other" people's lives isn't selfish, it's biblical. Many know Matthew 22:39, where Jesus answered the religious Jews who asked the greatest of commands, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself," but Christ who came to fulfill the Law knew the Hebrew Scriptures intimately so Jesus knew that He answered the religious Sadducees quoting the words spoken by God to Moses in the Hebrew text; Leviticus 19:18, "You shall not take vengeance, nor bear any grudge against the sons of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself; I am the Lord."
We as followers of Christ should never put "my rights and privileges" above our concerns over others. If we do, please don't quote your Bible, because your hermeneutics and interpretation skills need a Divine reset.
Unselfishness and righteous (opposite of self-righteous) behavior is not common in society, but the redemptive way has been described to all of us... by the One who designed it as narrow, not well traveled. Mercifully some are allowed on it by choice, not by good deeds or cash or any host of false means.
Blessings y'all Mark
Wonderful post Mark! A quote from the movie "Cool Hand Luke"...... "Some people, you just can't reach"
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: white17]
#6824099
03/31/20 08:00 AM
03/31/20 08:00 AM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739
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A bunch of people watching a sermon at the same time sitting here n their homes is NOT the same as meeting in person. If you watch a sermon in your home, that is NOT "going to church". The church is the group of people that go to the building and meet together. If you don't meet with the people, you don't meet with the church. If every member of T-man eats lunch at exactly 12:00 tomorrow, would we say we all ate lunch together? Of course not, because we weren't together. In the same line of thinking, watching a sermon at the same time as other people does not mean you did church together. There's nothing wrong with watching a sermon at home, but it's no different than watching a teaching on YouTube, or listening to a podcast. Its not the same as meeting in person with other believers.
In any case, it's not up to the government to tell me how to meet with other believers. If a government official tells me I can't meet in person but I can meet online, that amounts to a government official telling me how to practice my religion. So your 'church' and belief is dependent on a building ?? The IRS will have a problem with that as well as Muddyriverdogs. What if ...because of fire hazard.....the Forest Service restricts your access to the forest. Are you going to ignore that also ? Is that telling you how you can/should recreate ? Exactly the opposite. The church is not the building, it's the group of people that meet anywhere. I feel like there's too much relying on a building and one dude to do all the teaching today. The early church met every single day in each other's homes and shared a meal together, which is why we're meeting in our home and having a meal.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: Catch22]
#6824101
03/31/20 08:00 AM
03/31/20 08:00 AM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
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OP
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739
Beatrice, NE
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A bunch of people watching a sermon at the same time sitting here n their homes is NOT the same as meeting in person. If you watch a sermon in your home, that is NOT "going to church". The church is the group of people that go to the building and meet together. If you don't meet with the people, you don't meet with the church. If every member of T-man eats lunch at exactly 12:00 tomorrow, would we say we all ate lunch together? Of course not, because we weren't together. In the same line of thinking, watching a sermon at the same time as other people does not mean you did church together. There's nothing wrong with watching a sermon at home, but it's no different than watching a teaching on YouTube, or listening to a podcast. Its not the same as meeting in person with other believers.
In any case, it's not up to the government to tell me how to meet with other believers. If a government official tells me I can't meet in person but I can meet online, that amounts to a government official telling me how to practice my religion. You start a thread, you don't answer questions, you keep saying the same thing over and over. I have said what I believe is my best to help you and your family and I wish you well. I'll leave you with this. You can have your own service at home, a sermon and fellowship with your family. You can do many things that please God without possibly hurting others. Read the Bible and talk to God, ask him for guidance. I personally don't believe any God would want you to feel this way. I will pray for you and yours. What questions have I not answered?
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824109
03/31/20 08:10 AM
03/31/20 08:10 AM
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Mark June
Unregistered
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Mark June
Unregistered
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ksp, The pandemic of a bug is one issue. The pandemic of sin heightened during times of societal stress is bigger than any bug.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824134
03/31/20 08:26 AM
03/31/20 08:26 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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What about all the millions of people going to work today. Taking their kids to a daycare. Some of those people working are in factories, distribution centers and warehouses with hundreds of people all coming into contact with each other. Why are you folks ignoring them??????????? Shouldn't they have to stay home also? How long before they too start dropping like wasps sprayed with carb cleaner? I am thinking it should happen any day now.
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6824141
03/31/20 08:36 AM
03/31/20 08:36 AM
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Mark June
Unregistered
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Mark June
Unregistered
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What about all the millions of people going to work today. Taking their kids to a daycare. Some of those people working are in factories, distribution centers and warehouses with hundreds of people all coming into contact with each other. Why are you folks ignoring them??????????? Shouldn't they have to stay home also? How long before they too start dropping like wasps sprayed with carb cleaner? I am thinking it should happen any day now. Not certain I folla ya. Are you concerned about your fellow man & woman? Or trying to prove a point?
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824143
03/31/20 08:37 AM
03/31/20 08:37 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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you answer first mark june
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6824169
03/31/20 09:11 AM
03/31/20 09:11 AM
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Mark June
Unregistered
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Mark June
Unregistered
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you answer first mark june You may have already done so.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824174
03/31/20 09:15 AM
03/31/20 09:15 AM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
trapper
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OP
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Joined: Jun 2018
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Beatrice, NE
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Two of the people who hat were in our small group were recovering drug addicts. They had been coming for a couple months, had made a decision for Christ, and we're baptised the week before the church building closed. How sincere their commitment was, nobody knows I guess, but if I had to guess, probably not very, but at least they were coming and learning. But as soon as "church" closed, they just gave up. For them as brand new church goers, the building was church as far as they were concerned, and the dude that stands up front was the only one that did the teaching and ministering. After "church" closed, they kept communicating for a while, but never came to our home church. Once we offered to host narcotics anonymous in our basement because the church that had the meetings closed, they quit communicating with everyone in our group, except to tell one guy they "have other stuff going on". So now these two guys are probably lost again because as far as they were concerned "church" just gave up and shut down just like the rest of the world and gave up on them.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824179
03/31/20 09:21 AM
03/31/20 09:21 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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No worries Loosegoose. Its illegal to assemble now so drug addicts are just all going to stay home. They wont be able to buy drugs. Homeless people won't share needles or poop in the gutter either. They are staying in their tents and cardboard boxes. Pooping in dumpsters while maintaining their 6 foot distance from each other. Im not sure how they are keeping other peoples poo off their feet but they must be doing something. Thats why the homeless are not clogging up the emergency rooms.
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6824190
03/31/20 09:30 AM
03/31/20 09:30 AM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,635 Pottawatamie co. IA
LLtrapper
"The Coon Combine"
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"The Coon Combine"
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,635
Pottawatamie co. IA
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No worries Loosegoose. Its illegal to assemble now so drug addicts are just all going to stay home. They wont be able to buy drugs. Homeless people won't share needles or poop in the gutter either. They are staying in their tents and cardboard boxes. Pooping in dumpsters while maintaining their 6 foot distance from each other. Im not sure how they are keeping other peoples poo off their feet but they must be doing something. Thats why the homeless are not clogging up the emergency rooms. I just opened this because I have been staying off the computer. I knew I would find you being cynical on this thread. Can't help yourself can you Danny? Are you working or still hiding and hunkering down like a tick. You and several others on here have really shown your (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) here the last few weeks. The transparency is a good thing. Knowing those who can't play well with others because they are to selfish is actually a good thing really. You have had nothing but argument in this crisis. LLL
Isaiah 51:6 But my salvation will last forever, my righteousness will never fail.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824195
03/31/20 09:33 AM
03/31/20 09:33 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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LLL you are a real piece of work. Where have I said dont hunker down like a tick?????????? Quit putting words in my mouth its getting on my last nerve.
WHAT I"M SAYING IS DON"T TOSS THE BILL OF RIGHTS OUT THE WINDOW
Freedom is a good thing even when its scary
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824200
03/31/20 09:39 AM
03/31/20 09:39 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,439 PA Venango Co.
Ron Marsh
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,439
PA Venango Co.
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The church doors may be closed here. but we have found ways to worship and serve. Services by TV, Facebook and other social media, food by bag instead of sit down. Need to break out this week and go to a doctor, the battery for my tremor control (Deep Brain Simulator) is near dead and needs to be replaced. Prayer for you my friends.
PTA Lifetime #131N. Salvation Army CSM Stakes: Why leave them? ALWAYS John 3:16 814-516-2923
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824203
03/31/20 09:40 AM
03/31/20 09:40 AM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144 Ohio
BuckMink
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144
Ohio
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824204
03/31/20 09:41 AM
03/31/20 09:41 AM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
trapper
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OP
trapper
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739
Beatrice, NE
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Speaking of putting yourself and others in danger...... Another woman that was attending our small group is a brand new christian, and her commitment seems sincere. She's a single mom, just broke up with her boyfriend and moved out, and in a rough place in life. She was a waitress and lost her job at the same time the "church" closed, and was having a really rough time with it. Nobody would go visit her, not her family, not her new church friends, nobody. My wife went over to her house and visited, and this woman said it made a huge difference. She was really struggling with her faith, and feeling like the church just gave up on her because of a germ, but she held on to her faith because someone (my wife) was still willing to visit her. A week and 4 days after my wife went to visit her, this woman was presumed positive for covid19. (We're past the two week time by the way) Obviously my wife, by going to visit her, put our entire family at risk, and the risk was very real as this woman is now sitting at home sick. Was it worth the risk? Absolutely! This woman likely would have just given up had no one made the effort with her. Now my wife is dripping off groceries on her porch, because no one else will. Should we just abondon this woman, because she's sick? Or would the Christian thing to do be to take a chance and minister to her?
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824215
03/31/20 09:51 AM
03/31/20 09:51 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750 williamsburg ks
danny clifton
"Grumpy Old Man"
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"Grumpy Old Man"
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 29,750
williamsburg ks
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So the right to assemble peacefully is unimportant rambling?
Just because you have a right to do something doesnt mean you have to do it.
With all the millions still working, all the millions of kids in daycare, THIS VIRUS IS STILL GOING TO SPREAD. If you are in questionable health you need to stay home. If your healthy and your family is healthy and you CHOOSE to assemble it is your right. Recognized by the first amendment.
With all the talk on here about defending the 2nd amendment I am astounded at how many think tossing out the first is a wonderful idea.
I will never apologize for sticking up for the constitution and its recognition of individual liberties. I will never back down from it either. It is important to me. I am not giving up my liberty to anyone.
No lll I am not working. I have turned down full time work. I dont want to work except part time now. I am not giving my word to work even when I don't want to. I am hoping I have 20 years of life left and I am going to spend those years doing what I want to do. No more putting the needs of a business above my own.
Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: LLtrapper]
#6824262
03/31/20 10:44 AM
03/31/20 10:44 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,488 Moved to Fbks, Ak.
martentrapper
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,488
Moved to Fbks, Ak.
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I just opened this because I have been staying off the computer. I knew I would find you being cynical on this thread. Can't help yourself can you Danny? Are you working or still hiding and hunkering down like a tick. You and several others on here have really shown your (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) here the last few weeks. The transparency is a good thing. Knowing those who can't play well with others because they are to selfish is actually a good thing really. You have had nothing but argument in this crisis. LLL
I believe one could accurately say this country was founded by,"those who don't play well with others". Maybe they were "too selfish" too! MT
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: ]
#6824274
03/31/20 10:55 AM
03/31/20 10:55 AM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
trapper
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OP
trapper
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739
Beatrice, NE
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Just an observation. Have any of you actually watched this Pastor, Rodney Howard Browne? The man makes a mockery of Christianity. Services include laughing uncontrollably while rolling on the floor, barking like dogs, back and forth glossalia with another fake preacher as if they were telling jokes. I wish they would chain his doors shut. Look him up! Really? The government should chain the doors shut on a religious institution because they don't practice true Christianity? Who cares if he's a nut job? It's not the government's job to tell him how to practice his religion. That is the entire point I'm trying to make.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824281
03/31/20 10:59 AM
03/31/20 10:59 AM
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Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,491 Southern Illinois
Foxpaw
trapper
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trapper
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,491
Southern Illinois
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Speaking of putting yourself and others in danger...... Another woman that was attending our small group is a brand new christian, and her commitment seems sincere. She's a single mom, just broke up with her boyfriend and moved out, and in a rough place in life. She was a waitress and lost her job at the same time the "church" closed, and was having a really rough time with it. Nobody would go visit her, not her family, not her new church friends, nobody. My wife went over to her house and visited, and this woman said it made a huge difference. She was really struggling with her faith, and feeling like the church just gave up on her because of a germ, but she held on to her faith because someone (my wife) was still willing to visit her. A week and 4 days after my wife went to visit her, this woman was presumed positive for covid19. (We're past the two week time by the way) Obviously my wife, by going to visit her, put our entire family at risk, and the risk was very real as this woman is now sitting at home sick. Was it worth the risk? Absolutely! This woman likely would have just given up had no one made the effort with her. Now my wife is dripping off groceries on her porch, because no one else will. Should we just abondon this woman, because she's sick? Or would the Christian thing to do be to take a chance and minister to her? Seems you have switched from the subject of having a huge crowd now to a one on one. Even if you are limited to a crowd of 10 you still aren't limited in your work. There is still 24 hrs in a day, unless somehow now you think the sun will stand still for you. Somehow i discern that you kinda believe in pyramid building. I could be mistaking but are you not the one that was advocating having lots of kids to finance social security in the future? And now you are advocating people risk their children and their older parents by assembling together and then go off in their community bearing good gifts. You can't gain Gods' good grace by throwing the children in the fire. And besides that throwing them in the fire is putting your future social security in jeopardy. This thread seems to have came along way from a gathering of a huge crowd down to saving one sick woman, Ok that's your saving face even if it is along way from where you began. Carry on !
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: Foxpaw]
#6824330
03/31/20 11:45 AM
03/31/20 11:45 AM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
trapper
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OP
trapper
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739
Beatrice, NE
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Speaking of putting yourself and others in danger...... Another woman that was attending our small group is a brand new christian, and her commitment seems sincere. She's a single mom, just broke up with her boyfriend and moved out, and in a rough place in life. She was a waitress and lost her job at the same time the "church" closed, and was having a really rough time with it. Nobody would go visit her, not her family, not her new church friends, nobody. My wife went over to her house and visited, and this woman said it made a huge difference. She was really struggling with her faith, and feeling like the church just gave up on her because of a germ, but she held on to her faith because someone (my wife) was still willing to visit her. A week and 4 days after my wife went to visit her, this woman was presumed positive for covid19. (We're past the two week time by the way) Obviously my wife, by going to visit her, put our entire family at risk, and the risk was very real as this woman is now sitting at home sick. Was it worth the risk? Absolutely! This woman likely would have just given up had no one made the effort with her. Now my wife is dripping off groceries on her porch, because no one else will. Should we just abondon this woman, because she's sick? Or would the Christian thing to do be to take a chance and minister to her? Seems you have switched from the subject of having a huge crowd now to a one on one. Even if you are limited to a crowd of 10 you still aren't limited in your work. There is still 24 hrs in a day, unless somehow now you think the sun will stand still for you. Somehow i discern that you kinda believe in pyramid building. I could be mistaking but are you not the one that was advocating having lots of kids to finance social security in the future? And now you are advocating people risk their children and their older parents by assembling together and then go off in their community bearing good gifts. You can't gain Gods' good grace by throwing the children in the fire. And besides that throwing them in the fire is putting your future social security in jeopardy. This thread seems to have came along way from a gathering of a huge crowd down to saving one sick woman, Ok that's your saving face even if it is along way from where you began. Carry on ! Huh? It's two separate but related things I'm speaking about. Thing #1: I believe it's still good to gather with other believers. I've never said anything about gathering in big groups; our home group has been 12 people. Thing #2: it's good to take risks to continue ministering people. My wife took a chance ministering to a woman who ended up being presumed positive with covid19 a few days later, which yes, put our family at risk, it because she took a chance this woman is not just giving up. Sometimes you can't minister to people over the intertwebs, you have to meet them and take a risk. Some of these people are babies in their faith and will just give up if no one makes an effort for them.
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: loosegoose]
#6824335
03/31/20 11:50 AM
03/31/20 11:50 AM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144 Ohio
BuckMink
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,144
Ohio
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Just an observation. Have any of you actually watched this Pastor, Rodney Howard Browne? The man makes a mockery of Christianity. Services include laughing uncontrollably while rolling on the floor, barking like dogs, back and forth glossalia with another fake preacher as if they were telling jokes. I wish they would chain his doors shut. Look him up! Really? The government should chain the doors shut on a religious institution because they don't practice true Christianity? Who cares if he's a nut job? It's not the government's job to tell him how to practice his religion. That is the entire point I'm trying to make. who cares that he is a nut job? its all about the gospel! false teachers leading others to an eternity in (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman). I CARE!!
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: danny clifton]
#6824356
03/31/20 12:13 PM
03/31/20 12:13 PM
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Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 273 CT
Big George W
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 273
CT
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So the right to assemble peacefully is unimportant rambling?
Just because you have a right to do something doesnt mean you have to do it.
With all the millions still working, all the millions of kids in daycare, THIS VIRUS IS STILL GOING TO SPREAD. If you are in questionable health you need to stay home. If your healthy and your family is healthy and you CHOOSE to assemble it is your right. Recognized by the first amendment.
With all the talk on here about defending the 2nd amendment I am astounded at how many think tossing out the first is a wonderful idea.
I will never apologize for sticking up for the constitution and its recognition of individual liberties. I will never back down from it either. It is important to me. I am not giving up my liberty to anyone.
No lll I am not working. I have turned down full time work. I dont want to work except part time now. I am not giving my word to work even when I don't want to. I am hoping I have 20 years of life left and I am going to spend those years doing what I want to do. No more putting the needs of a business above my own. Danny, help me out here: You hate it when the common man is helped out by our government to try and stop this virus dead in it's tracks, you hate it when people are told not to congregate to try and stop this virus dead in it's tracks, you talk about the millions and millions working and in daycare [Christ !!] and, yet - you don't even work full time - or even part time - unless you want too ?? Must be nice !! No wonder you feel the way you do, it must be great being able to avoid contact with other humans for the most part - by choice..... But I'm with you - I just last week walked off the job, after 33 solid years - with no intention of returning - because I myself don't relish the thought of working on a poorly ventilated assembly line where sickness abounds, and oh we have to be there because we are considered essential, God knows why....... So, I up and left - because unlike you, I do not view this virus as B.S. and I also have elderly parents that I am close to and help out. *and right after I walked out - a co-worker turned positive for this new virus, which makes me feel real good inside.............. Now, as luck would have it - a job I put in for - to get me off that disease ridden assembly line - literally today - just came through, so I'll be riding on a forklift shuttling parts back and forth, unloading trucks, etc... which is great because the amount of human contact which I will have will be minimal, which is something I am completely acceptable with during this crisis which is obviously something not effecting your neck of the woods at all. So, right after Easter I return to work, in a new position of my choosing, yes - for much less money, but I'm at a point in my life [just turned 55..] where everything is paid for/off and I can now just coast. *If I had not gotten that job, I would have take an early retirement, get my pensions rolling in and that's it - I'd be completely free to pursue my hobbies, etc.. while I'm still able and healthy enough to do so. Tell me, do you also get angry also when the government bails out the rich, the corporations, the stock market, or is it only when the common man is being helped out that you become enraged ?? I ask because one thing I can't stand is corporate welfare and these never ending bailouts ensuring that the rich stay rich.. You mention something about how it is surprising how many people here in favor of the 2nd ammendment are not in favor of the 1st, actually... you are wrong. Well, I think you are just seeing things differently, as I have no problem giving up some of my civil liberties if it means stopping a - contrary to popular belief - a very deadly virus [*give it time, it's still 2 - 3 months out from hitting the U.S. full force] This is my very last post here. T-Man is just not a good forum for me, and that's fine... I'll just miss the many good people I crossed paths with here, who helped me out when I had questions about trapping and wildlife, and who also those who posted real interesting things trapping and wildlife related.... Adios Amigos.... !!
Respect, Big George + Loki the Dog..... East Derby, CT CTA [life member], NTA, FTA, FBU Connecticut Republican Party
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: BuckMink]
#6824377
03/31/20 12:32 PM
03/31/20 12:32 PM
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Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
OP
trapper
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OP
trapper
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,739
Beatrice, NE
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who cares that he is a nut job? its all about the gospel! false teachers leading others to an eternity in (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman). I CARE!!
I care too if he's spreading a false gospel and leading people to (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman). But does that mean the government should shut him down? Should the government decide what is and isn't true? Perhaps we should just go back to a state-sanctioned religion?
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Re: Pastor arrested for holding church
[Re: Foxpaw]
#6824436
03/31/20 01:34 PM
03/31/20 01:34 PM
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 11,440 Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
Sharon
"American Honey"
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"American Honey"
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 11,440
Montana ,Rocky Mtns.
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Speaking of putting yourself and others in danger...... Another woman that was attending our small group is a brand new christian, and her commitment seems sincere. She's a single mom, just broke up with her boyfriend and moved out, and in a rough place in life. She was a waitress and lost her job at the same time the "church" closed, and was having a really rough time with it. Nobody would go visit her, not her family, not her new church friends, nobody. My wife went over to her house and visited, and this woman said it made a huge difference. She was really struggling with her faith, and feeling like the church just gave up on her because of a germ, but she held on to her faith because someone (my wife) was still willing to visit her. A week and 4 days after my wife went to visit her, this woman was presumed positive for covid19. (We're past the two week time by the way) Obviously my wife, by going to visit her, put our entire family at risk, and the risk was very real as this woman is now sitting at home sick. Was it worth the risk? Absolutely! This woman likely would have just given up had no one made the effort with her. Now my wife is dripping off groceries on her porch, because no one else will. Should we just abondon this woman, because she's sick? Or would the Christian thing to do be to take a chance and minister to her? Seems you have switched from the subject of having a huge crowd now to a one on one. Even if you are limited to a crowd of 10 you still aren't limited in your work. There is still 24 hrs in a day, unless somehow now you think the sun will stand still for you. Somehow i discern that you kinda believe in pyramid building. I could be mistaking but are you not the one that was advocating having lots of kids to finance social security in the future? And now you are advocating people risk their children and their older parents by assembling together and then go off in their community bearing good gifts. You can't gain Gods' good grace by throwing the children in the fire. And besides that throwing them in the fire is putting your future social security in jeopardy. This thread seems to have came along way from a gathering of a huge crowd down to saving one sick woman, Ok that's your saving face even if it is along way from where you began. Carry on ! First of all, this "germ" is causing world wide suffering ...most people have some kind of phone or computer, which she can reach out to others, and they to her. From the way you wrote , it seems like she didn't appreciate, or downplayed (or you did in your phrasing) the seriousness of learning about it and being thoughtful of others. Anyone is capable of understanding that , aside from being "new". There are many ways of being in contact with others without traveling to homes at this time. The whole world is doing that , it works. Now, unfortunately, she HAS to learn to be in contact via other means , phone, computer, etc. Fox, and others have made some good points. Missionary, or mercenary -or wanting to sacrifice risk to others by wanting to be seen a martyr ... Everyone meeting in a group risks illness . To solicit that risk onto others without asking their permission ...in effect, when they go from there to anywhere else. Many others would not agree that it was "worth the risk " , when their loved ones are at stake. From there, everywhere those others go also poses a risk. I'm amazed anyone would WANT to meet anywhere , given all the warnings on a state and national level. There is a real concern on asymptomatic carriers . I'm certain there are not a few in your area who would be very upset with that risk being pushed on them , in all the ways transference happens. I feel for them. I for one am glad there is no one in my area with that attitude. Figuratively speaking, standing proud on the bodies of others who have real risk of becoming sick , due to reckless pride. Many on this forum go about the safe ways of helping others, humble in practicing their religion, without waving a banner of self righteousness , doing just fine in online communications. It simply cannot be overstated how this gets spread by asymptomatic carriers.
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