Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Ringneck1]
#6843051
04/15/20 08:26 AM
04/15/20 08:26 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,716 Sandhills Nebraska
Gary Benson
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Posts: 21,716
Sandhills Nebraska
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Anyone have experience with "community gardens"? Our town did it here, donating a small piece of land, the idea being some folks didn't have the space or skills to garden on their own, so the experienced folks would teach them how and everyone would work together and split the work, expenses and harvest. Socialist utopia! Maybe Joe didn't have money for seed but he could show up on a hoeing day. 5 people did the majority of the work, all the time thinking that they were doing good for the community. Some of the older generation really bought into the idea that they were going to get a lot of help later in the season. Same 5 kept the thing going all summer, until harvest when >25 showed up with their baskets to harvest away. Of course the 5 were stunned by the freeloaders harvesting everything at every opportunity. A couple of the workers didn't get as much as 1 meal of green beans, such was the intensity of freeloader harvest. The last straw was some of the commie freeloaders absconded with the last few tomatoes and pumpkins to experiment with capitalism by selling them at the farmers market for some quick dispensary cash. Year two, none of the 5 workers showed up, the freeloaders then begged the city for money to buy the seeds. The city summarily dismissed that request and added that the users would have to pay a bit of the water bill this year. Died a quick death. Several of the freeloaders could be seen around town lamenting how great having all those veggies were (they really had a bountiful harvest that first year) but not a single one of them would do the work to grow another harvest. The take home message is that even on what seems like a small manageable scale, socialism or communism doesn't work. I think the first community garden was in Jamestown after it was founded. Same results. An "open house" where there is free food to show customer appreciation is always interesting. Some will show up 30 minutes early to be first in line, gorge themselves, and take some to go. Folks will spend $10 on gas to get a free $5 meal. And bring the whole family of course, even if they have never purchased from the business.
Life ain't supposed to be easy.
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Finster]
#6843059
04/15/20 08:37 AM
04/15/20 08:37 AM
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Mark June
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Mark June
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Is it considered a political thread when the subject is so far from reality that it becomes a punchline? Really, I cannot believe that socialism is even being considered. Have people lost their minds? We have been fighting it and forms of it for the last 100 years and all of a sudden people believe it's a good idea? Examples are everywhere, including modern day examples of it happening right this very minute of the failure and suffering that it causes and through all of this, not one example of it succeeding..... EVER! I know for most of us on here I am preaching to the choir but I can't wrap my head around the mental numbness it must take to buy into this farce. It must be a mental disorder? Finster, It is very hard to unweave what has been taught to some by educators, parents, and culture. That 100 years of enlightenment teaching has been sowed long enough now, it has deep roots.
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Finster]
#6843060
04/15/20 08:37 AM
04/15/20 08:37 AM
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Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 1,018 MI
Co�s
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MI
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Plenty of aspects of our nation are "socialist", our road and highway system, public lands, regulatory agencies (for better or worse). Beyond that we have a recent history of massive amounts of federal dollars pouring into things like the banking system, auto manufacturing and airlines. Sure they aren't being run by the federal government, but that doesn't look like stone cold capitalism to me either.
All of these things don't look good on paper. Communism and Marxist style socialism are based on an authoritarian government. No one wants that. Well, I can think of one guy who does but I won't go there. Even Bernie wasn't calling for democratic socialism (socialism with an democratically elected government) across the board. Health Care is the only major program he was looking to shift into being federally run. He really never should have used the S word. People in this country get rabid when they hear any of those terms.
So to clear the air I agree that yes, full on, 100% socialism would be a distaster in this country. It will also never happen. But we can and should pick and choose elements from that strategy that benefit the country. We already got plenty of it going on as I pointed about above.
Last edited by Coös; 04/15/20 08:38 AM.
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Finster]
#6843140
04/15/20 09:59 AM
04/15/20 09:59 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 17,635 Rodney,Ohio
SNIPERBBB
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Rodney,Ohio
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What Bernie and his ill are really arguing for if people still believe in definitions is a massive welfare state. Socialism, no matter what prefix you put before it is and will always be the State control of the means of production and it's distribution. Capitalism is private control of capital, property and the distribution of goods is determined by the free market.
No government will ever be able to stand in the Ayn Rand version of libertarianism or under communism/socialism , maybe on a small island perhaps with 20 people.
You take away property rights en masse and you'll get a revolution. We are kinda living through it now, something will happen if this goes past May.
The problem with the welfare state we have, not counting the fact we can't afford it, is that people are too comfortable in it. Even those in complete dependacy on the state are still in the top 10% of the world. It's dehumanizing and evil.
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Foxpaw]
#6843167
04/15/20 10:32 AM
04/15/20 10:32 AM
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 461 Nebraska
Poorcoon
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Nebraska
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Everybody's Talkin like it's something that could happen. It's here!. It's now!. The United States is a socialist country right now. And they did it without a fight. They slowly took over the farmers. Slowly getting them dependent on one government program after another. Many other entities and now the Coronavirus finished us off. And there's no going back and there's nothing you're going to do about it either. The Russians are Coming, the Russians are Coming, and they came! Now I think they have put smallpox in our blankets, lol ! Sounds crazy Don't it? But that's the attitude that will perpetuate The Progressive Movement. Take a look around! One thing you can count on. The more things stay the same the more socialist it's going to be. Short of some type of revolution. Explain to me how I'm wrong?
"Nothing I like to do pays well." True Grit
"Revenge is in the hands of God, not mine." Revenant.
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Finster]
#6843172
04/15/20 10:36 AM
04/15/20 10:36 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,697 MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
Trapper7
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MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
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The really weird thing is that, while protesting, they often scream "freedom"??????? Good grief, What they are fighting for is about the furthest thing away from freedom you could ask for. These idiots do not understand that they will be squashed like a bug under socialism. They will be lucky not to starve to death, yet they are begging for it! How can people be so stupid? I think it's mostly these younger people who don't know any better. They like the idea of all the free stuff, but don't realize somebody has to work to subsidize it. Pretty soon the workers funding the lazy ones lifestyle, will get fed up. They'll want the same for themselves and will stop working. Then the funding will have to come from corporations who will leave the country. That will be the collapse of America.
We are told not to judge all Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but are told to judge all gunowners by the actions of a few.
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Dirty D]
#6843182
04/15/20 10:44 AM
04/15/20 10:44 AM
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Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 1,018 MI
Co�s
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MI
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Socialism denies human nature. In that if one doesn't get any reward for his work at best he goes thru the motions and does the minimum to get by or if one wants to he can survive by not working. While capitalism embraces human nature and rewards the thinkers and doers. If you don't work you starve. One motivates the other doesn't.
I worked at a Tool Shop back in the late '70's. We had 2 Machine repair guys that we'd hire on and off for fixing machines when needed. They came from Czechoslovakia when it was under Communist rule. They actually built an airplane in their garage and flew it over the boarder to escape.
One of the guys told me a line about Communism that I'll never forget. He said that it summed up Communism.
"In Communism what's yours is mine and whats mine is none of your business" Remember that Socialism is the first step to Communism. Yup, that sounds bad. Luckily there isn't a chance that would ever happen here. Way too much money being made with the current system. Those with the money and power are not going to change a system that provides the money and power. That's human nature.
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Co�s]
#6843201
04/15/20 10:59 AM
04/15/20 10:59 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,697 MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
Trapper7
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Posts: 15,697
MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
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Socialism denies human nature. In that if one doesn't get any reward for his work at best he goes thru the motions and does the minimum to get by or if one wants to he can survive by not working. While capitalism embraces human nature and rewards the thinkers and doers. If you don't work you starve. One motivates the other doesn't.
I worked at a Tool Shop back in the late '70's. We had 2 Machine repair guys that we'd hire on and off for fixing machines when needed. They came from Czechoslovakia when it was under Communist rule. They actually built an airplane in their garage and flew it over the boarder to escape.
One of the guys told me a line about Communism that I'll never forget. He said that it summed up Communism.
"In Communism what's yours is mine and whats mine is none of your business" Remember that Socialism is the first step to Communism. Yup, that sounds bad. Luckily there isn't a chance that would ever happen here. Way too much money being made with the current system. Those with the money and power are not going to change a system that provides the money and power. That's human nature. That's true, except those with the money and power will want to keep the money and power. So, if you start taking their money they will move to another country where they can continue to keep it just like has happened in the past.
We are told not to judge all Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but are told to judge all gunowners by the actions of a few.
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Finster]
#6843234
04/15/20 11:32 AM
04/15/20 11:32 AM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 16,244 ny
upstateNY
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ny
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Problem is they don't teach history in school any more.
the wheels of the gods turn very slowly
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: upstateNY]
#6843247
04/15/20 11:41 AM
04/15/20 11:41 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,697 MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
Trapper7
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Posts: 15,697
MN, Land of 10,000 Lakes
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Problem is they don't teach history in school any more. Isn't that the truth?
We are told not to judge all Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but are told to judge all gunowners by the actions of a few.
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Re: Socialism ???
[Re: Co�s]
#6843667
04/15/20 06:57 PM
04/15/20 06:57 PM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 6,523 Wi.
Diggerman
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Posts: 6,523
Wi.
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Socialism denies human nature. In that if one doesn't get any reward for his work at best he goes thru the motions and does the minimum to get by or if one wants to he can survive by not working. While capitalism embraces human nature and rewards the thinkers and doers. If you don't work you starve. One motivates the other doesn't.
I worked at a Tool Shop back in the late '70's. We had 2 Machine repair guys that we'd hire on and off for fixing machines when needed. They came from Czechoslovakia when it was under Communist rule. They actually built an airplane in their garage and flew it over the boarder to escape.
One of the guys told me a line about Communism that I'll never forget. He said that it summed up Communism.
"In Communism what's yours is mine and whats mine is none of your business" Remember that Socialism is the first step to Communism. Yup, that sounds bad. Luckily there isn't a chance that would ever happen here. Way too much money being made with the current system. Those with the money and power are not going to change a system that provides the money and power. That's human nature. Can you name one other country or govt that is better for it citizens than ours, If you can you should make it known to about a million wanna be immigrants. Also to all those people fleeing this country you should tell them where to go.
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