Before

After

Before and after what?

Well handled beaver-only one small critique-it was overstretched a bit too tight.Wont matter though it looks to be a nice HVY beaver.Other than that a great job.
Looks better after brushing/blowing.

Your beaver wasn't over stretched.

Yes it was you can tell by the white marks on the skin.

I know Boco Is gone but over stretching Is total BS.

Beav did you purposely wait (3 weeks) til boco was gone to make your comment? Overstretching is total b.s.? I think you know better than to make that misleading comment. Over stretching beaver may not make to much difference in some circumstances but we all have heard you preach about overstretching muskrat. Which is it beav, is overstretching total b.s. or not, you've got me confused. LOL

I believe his comment was stating that this beaver was not overstretched. That's the way i took it anyway. I am a puddle on the floor when it comes to the experience of either of them but the hide doesn't look to be over-stretched to me.

Oh, it is over stretched, the lighter areas around the armpits and bellow the hind legs are telling marks; as well as the scalped edges between the nail holes (even though those nails were tightly spaced,especially at the bottom near the tail area).That being said, it will not be a big deal, especially with the current beaver market.
I guess my point was more to the way the " beav" flip flops on the idea that overstretching hides is total b.s. I think it just depends on what his mood is when he posts, kind of like poking at a bear to get a reaction! LOL.

You have NEVER heard me say anything about OVER STRETCHING muskrats. It's OVER DRYING muskrats.
Rats are one of the hides that are actually graded by WEIGHT. A over dried rat hide will get you that krinkley sound when It's graded and In most cases that hide will be graded Central and that In most cases Is the kiss of death. The more moisture the hide looses the thinner it gets and It gets paper thin and that is going to cost you money.
Wire Is worse then wood because wire acts like a spring and is always pushing against the hide while it's drying. And can actually thin the hide as It dries. I just grit my teeth when i hear that trappers are leaving their rat hides on the forms for weeks at a time. When the nose is dry I take them off the forms. In most cases that's about 2 days. Then I place the hides in totes or card board boxes. And they are packed as tight as I can get them. Placing them on edge works the best. Know your hides won't continue to dry out and they will stay nice and supple. If you get some mold don't worry about It, It will come right off and It won't effect the hide or the fur. The other thing Is DON'T OVER flesh you want that fat to be sucked into the leather to keep that leather hydrated.

I can hear you guys say well It's JUST A RAT and this is over thinking this rat thing. But for most of us rats are our bread and butter. Well they use to be. LOL You need to get the most out of every thing we trap so learn how to do It right to begin with.
You can't make any critter bigger or better then It is but you can handle It and display it to it's full potential. And that will get you more money even in a down market.


In my opinion you can't over stretch a hide just by pulling It by hand to the next 1/2". Now maybe If you had a hydraulic device and hooked it up you might be able to OVER stretch a hide.
If In fact we were over stretching a hide there would be bald areas where the hair use to be.
I think Boco may be right to a point. The thing that happens when pulling the hide up as tight as you can you may stretch the leather a bit and In doing so that might thin the leather a bit. Is that a bad thing? I have been told that It Is very expensive to dress beaver the reason being that the leather Is so thick It need to be shaved so It takes the tanning better. It's also done to lighten the weight of the skin.
Another thing I was told that the reason Canadian and Alaskan type beaver are more In demand Is the leather on those beaver Is thinner then the leather on the lower 48 beaver. I would also add the In most cases the fur Is of a better quality. The rational Is that In those areas the food sources aren't as good as lets say WI or Mn. I trapped beaver In Ontario and the areas we trapped had marginal beaver habitat. Sure there were beaver but they had to work a lot harder for their dinner. So lets say those northern beaver have thinner skins to begin with they would be easier and cheaper to process. I don't know this for a fact but that's what I was told.

Greg Schroeder one of the top fur handlers In the business told me he used a pair of vise grips to pull that beaver hide to the next size. If he does It It's good enough for me.

But the bottom line for the trapper Is we are paid by grade and size Is a grade and size does matter when the check is written.

Know I'm getting down off my soap box.

LOL
Those of you that trap braver and put up those beaver Is there any way possible that you can over stretch the butt end of a beaver hide???? That's the thickest part of the hide and In most cases it never gets fleshed correctly because it's so thick. You really need to shave that area down to get it right.

So for those that having a so called problem with the term OVER STRETCHING Is It a bad thing if it truly happens?

My final comment.

Newfox1 you did a outstanding job on that beaver and the fleshing job was perfect. The light outer areas of that hide are caused by the degree of primness and the drying and fleshing Technics. Most frost scraped beaver hides turn out that way.
Good job.

Thank you Beav, love your posts, lots of good information when you expand on the subject at hand! The real purpose of my posts on this thread was "kind of like poking a bear to get a reaction", Thanks for sharing your knowledge, and I loved your reaction! Gary

Pot stirring Is what needs to be done. Or poking the bear. LOL
You can see that the thread had died with a lack of interest. Between the 2 of us we got it started again. Good job garart.

IMO it is very hard to over stretch most beaver pelts. If over stretching has occurred it will be evidenced by the hide spitting/pulling away from the nails when dried.

Spot on bctomcat.

So If there is actually over stretching Is It going to effect the density of the fur In that area?

That is certainly true bctomcat. That splitting and pulling away from the nails can also occur from drying to near a heat source of at too high of heat. Good air circulation being more important than heat.

Probably not, it will most likely reduce pelt grade size only due to the splitting along the pelt edge.

The thing Is that even If you pull that hide up tight there Is always some slack In the hide you just can't get It drum tight.

There Is a trend as to where some furriers are wanting beaver put up cased and some that are looking at beaver being split up the back Instead of the belly. Reason being they want to have a full section of belly fur to work with. This way they don't have to sew It back together. I guess the point I'm trying to make Is If you put up a beaver by splitting It up the back are you going to still get those lighter colored areas that some are saying are do to over stretching? If those lighter colored areas still show up that debunks the Idea of that being the reason.
Any one ever put up any beaver that way?

I just talked to a guy that has done beaver that way. He said that he still gets that lighter coloration In the belly area. So It seems to me that this difference in coloration Isn't do to the so called over stretching theory.

Vice grips, made me laugh. My high school buddy would pull the beaver pelts w/vice grips and I would nail the pelt. I gave him the name of pull pliers! I never had a beaver down graded for over stretching.

Size matters Mike.

I know! The fur buyer was the person that told me to use vice grips.

I hope Boco doesn't read this LOL

Loving this post. Has inspired me to put up a case skinned beaver and one split up the back. One question though.... What board to put up the cased one on? Size will dictate somewhat any suggestions?

I would use your grandmother's wooden ironing board

My buddy did the ironing board thing. Used It as a pattern to make more forms. I think he had 26 cased beaver he bought green form some one In Mn.
I wouldn't do to many that way since i don't know if It will meet industry standards if you plan on selling them. He Is getting them tanned and using them for his own personal use.

Sounds good thanks mason and beav I just happen to have one of those old ironing board in the barn. I'll make one board using it as a pattern and give it a try. I'll try tanning it myself. Be a little unique and who knows, may be a head of the curve doin it someday

You might open up a new trend for beaver and jump start the fur price!

Some of the nicest fur on a beaver Is that belly fur. The thing Is It doesn't need plucking or shearing and that makes It more economical to use. And by splitting the beaver down the back you don't have to sew that belly fur back together to make a larger piece. But I guess It just depends on how your going to use that fur.

I half to agree with Beave, I just last week finished up 25 cased beaver and pulled everyone with a Klein lineman pliers. They perfectly fine. To the OP I don't know how to post pics on T-
man but I can text them. If you want me to, send me a pm and phone number I would be happy to send some pics to you. You will definitely see how light the bellys are as opposed to the darker backs. There is no way your going to over stretch these spring beaver, as the leather is to heavy unless you were to use a come along.

I half to agree with Beave, I just last week finished up 25 cased beaver and pulled everyone with a Klein lineman pliers. They perfectly fine. To the OP I don't know how to post pics on T-
man but I can text them. If you want me to, send me a pm and phone number I would be happy to send some pics to you. You will definitely see how light the bellys are as opposed to the darker backs. There is no way your going to over stretch these spring beaver, as the leather is to heavy unless you were to use a come along.

Ironing board is what I made my first cardboard pattern with. After some tweaking I made 2 different size boards out of plywood, sanded down edges and then used those as patterns. For the bigger beaver I ended up with the base of board at 13.5 inches and 4 inch nose. For smaller beaver I have 12 inches at base and 3 inches at nose. Some of the bigger ones come out 46 to 48 inches long.

Mendota did you catch any eyes?

Yep, need a few fillets. Fishing most every morning.

Yea beav,I read it.
I will continue to agree with the beaver graders at FHA.
Do not overstretch your beaver for size unless they are bad damaged.
HVY and SEMI grade in one smaller size will get you a lot better avg than one larger size with a LT grade.
Overstretching thins the fur in the exact place the grader weighs the underfur with his hand-the back of the neck.

Well Boco your saying the change In color on the edges of the hide Is caused by over stretching right. So If a beaver Is split up the back Instead of the belly and stretched that way why would that same color change be apparent when stretched that way. We did we did some that way and the color change was the same. It's even the same when a beaver Is put up cased.
When you frost scrap does the whole beaver hide change to a lighter color?

Hopefully I make it to the beaver skinning demo at this Fall's FTA annual convention. I want to see how they do it.

Boco you haven't addressed the frost scraping question.

Sorry,I missed it.
No frost scraping a hide does not cause it to turn white.
If you frost dry it it will turn white from the ice crystals expanding between the individual skin fibres,then evaporating.This will happen over the entire skin.It is totally different than stress points turning white from overstretching.
It takes very specific climatic conditions which are only found in the far north to properly frost dry skins.
That is why we dont frost dry our frost scraped skins here.

Boco I thought you frost scraped your beaver hides.

Boco I thought you frost scraped your beaver hides.

I do,but I dont frost dry them.

What Boco is saying about how they grade a Beavers fur density by feeling, just tells the buyers you will be getting a variety pack.

Ok I'll explain it. The fur density is hairs per surface area. You can change this by how much you stretch. Loose it will be more. Real tight it will be less. In a perfect world the grader should make allowances for both. If they just feel for fur density in the area most prone to overstretching, not going to be very accurate grading IMHO.

The only place I see discoloration on a beaver hide Is along the edges of the belly. Boco say's that's a sign of over stretching. I feel that since It's the thinnest leather on a beaver It just dries that way. In my opinion without some mechanical devise you can't over stretch by hand.

My favorite part is making fun of how we used to stretch beaver out west and then making allowances for the native's goofy stretch in Ontario. I found that a little offensive. I guess our traditions don't rate?

Very interesting video Dirt. Thanks. I watched the 1st 10 minutes. The full video would probably be a good watch if a person has time