No Profanity *** No Flaming *** No Advertising *** No Anti Trappers ***NO POLITICS
No Non-Target Catches *** No Links to Anti-trapping Sites *** No Avoiding Profanity Filter


Home~Trap Talk~ADC Forum~Trap Shed~Wilderness Trapping~International Trappers~Fur Handling

Auction Forum~Trapper Tips~Links~Gallery~Basic Sets~Convention Calendar~Chat~ Trap Collecting Forum

Trapper's Humor~Strictly Trapping~Fur Buyers Directory~Mugshots~Fur Sale Directory~Wildcrafting~The Pen and Quill

Trapper's Tales~Words From The Past~Legends~Archives~Kids Forum~Lure Formulators Forum~ Fermenter's Forum


~~~ Dobbins' Products Catalog ~~~


Minnesota Trapline Products
Please support our sponsor for the Trappers Talk Page - Minnesota Trapline Products


Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: AJE] #6874799
05/17/20 10:41 AM
05/17/20 10:41 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,655
ND
M
MJM Offline
trapper
MJM  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,655
ND
I would not say all of the decisions Delta made were based on science. The canvasback work in Canada MB Coonguy spoke of was started because a guy in Canada that donated a lot of money wanted more Canvasbacks. He liked hunting divers and the canvasback falls into that class. They nest on floating cattails on the water. So it is a little different than ground nesting ducks. Do they need help? I would guess as much as most duck types. Delta never really spent much time speaking to the trappers about what they saw and felt was going on. We were told by the more educated office workers what was going on, and what we needed to do. As said above the trapper was told to go after coon and mink on the canvasback work. You would think that makes sense, but fox and coyotes will go out in the water for a meal also. I have seen pictures and video of it.
The 100 skunks per square mile would be a record take, from what I saw. I would think the average number of predators I removed off a 36 square mile block, was closer to 10 per square mile in eight years of work. Some sections you may take three times that number and others you may take next to nothing on. About one third was skunks, a third coon and the last third made up of coyotes,fox, badger and mink. The mink population varied more than the others and it followed the muskrat population. I had to have permission on 80% of the grass to trap the block. What wasn't grass was small grain for the most part. Some of ground you did not have permission to be on, and some the only place to set was the ditch.


"Not Really, Not Really"
Mark J Monti
"MJM you're a jerk."
Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: walleyed] #6874807
05/17/20 10:47 AM
05/17/20 10:47 AM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 10,471
Iowa
T
trapdog1 Offline
trapper
trapdog1  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 10,471
Iowa
Originally Posted by walleyed
Originally Posted by corky
^^^
Which is why I changed who I support.


X 2

Ducks Unlimited is an anti-hunting & anti-trapping

pro-animal rights group just like HSUS & PETA. frown

w


PROOF?

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: MJM] #6874823
05/17/20 10:57 AM
05/17/20 10:57 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,294
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Offline
trapper
bblwi  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,294
East-Central Wisconsin
There are a lot of predators that can adapt to finding and destroying bird nests and that is really a seasonal form of prey for egg eaters.
Whatever species has a high population in the area and nests are common will take a lot of nests. Waterfowl ecologists and biologists have stated that if 25-30% of the nests are successful the population will remain stable so in nature there is a built in loss factor for species to survive.
Coons come to mind for me as the y can and do hunt at night, twilight, on dry land, swim in marshes and can hunt in trees and climb. Most other mammal predators don't have that wide of range of capabilities. Coons do however have many other food sources they can and do use, mostly thanks to human activity. Eggs are a really great source of energy and protein for nursing females feeding young so I am sure that nests are sought out food sources. I am sure that eggs would be a major source of food for opossums in the spring but due to many of their limitations even though eggs might make up a major source of their spring diet how do they compare to more mobile animals with better senses? One of the reasons that waterfowl management units are typically large and as square as possible is that it is just much more likely to have a safe nesting place when the area is large with less edge per acre than long, narrow or the same acres in several smaller units. Not any different for rats or any prey species.

Bryce

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: AJE] #6874855
05/17/20 11:37 AM
05/17/20 11:37 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,655
ND
M
MJM Offline
trapper
MJM  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,655
ND
If ducks have a 20-30% hatch rate they should increase in numbers. I was always told 15% would maintain the population by Delta. The last I worked for Delta they were checking the success of trapping small grass blocks that were scattered out. There was no real rhyme to the shape of the lay of the grass. The grass was often less than a section or even less than a quarter in each given block of grass. You might drive 2-5 miles between grass blocks. I liked a 6x6 mile blocks much better and felt it produced more ducks.


"Not Really, Not Really"
Mark J Monti
"MJM you're a jerk."
Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: MJM] #6874879
05/17/20 12:07 PM
05/17/20 12:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,294
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Offline
trapper
bblwi  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,294
East-Central Wisconsin
A section is huge when compared to some of the landscape we have east of the Mississippi, also the percentage I used was based on information that I read about 15 years ago and maybe why waterfowl numbers are increasing in general. It also shows if we create habitat that species will respond positively and that predator issues are less of an issue when habitat is there. Also we have been in general wetter as of late and that increases habitat for waterfowl and other water dependent species.

Bryce

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: walleye101] #6874892
05/17/20 12:21 PM
05/17/20 12:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 6,635
Wabash, IN USA
Flipper 56 Offline
trapper
Flipper 56  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 6,635
Wabash, IN USA
Originally Posted by walleye101
Originally Posted by Leftlane
If the price of fur doesnt pop back up soon, maybe dicks unlimited and the wild turkey fed will kick in a little bounty


Unfortunately DU has taken a position that predator management does not improve duck production. I think their position is based on political correctness more than science. Delta Waterfowl says otherwise.

100% agree


"Where Can A Man Find Bear Beaver And Other Critters Worth Cash Money When Skinned?"

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: walleye101] #6874895
05/17/20 12:21 PM
05/17/20 12:21 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 41,592
Northern Maine
Bruce T Offline
trapper
Bruce T  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 41,592
Northern Maine
Originally Posted by walleye101
Originally Posted by Leftlane
If the price of fur doesnt pop back up soon, maybe dicks unlimited and the wild turkey fed will kick in a little bounty


Unfortunately DU has taken a position that predator management does not improve duck production. I think their position is based on political correctness more than science. Delta Waterfowl says otherwise.

The only thing I heard was their predator control is not working good enough and they need to improve.


Nevada bound
Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: corky] #6874912
05/17/20 12:46 PM
05/17/20 12:46 PM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,665
PA
W
w side rd 151 Offline
trapper
w side rd 151  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,665
PA
Originally Posted by corky
^^^
Which is why I changed who I support.

Add my name to that list Delta actively supports trapping

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: w side rd 151] #6874940
05/17/20 01:20 PM
05/17/20 01:20 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,294
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Offline
trapper
bblwi  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,294
East-Central Wisconsin
Below is a link that gives a brief overview of the basic programs and areas of main interest etc. for both DU and DW, as that is many times debated on this forum. Both have conservation as the main program but both have different methods or programs to accomplish their goals. For $35 per year a person could support both. Due to their much lower membership and budget DW concentrates on more lower cost methods of enhancing waterfowl popultations.

Bryce

https://www.splitreed.com/all-stories/du-vs-dw

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: Leftlane] #6874948
05/17/20 01:28 PM
05/17/20 01:28 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
W
walleye101 Offline
trapper
walleye101  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
Originally Posted by Leftlane
Originally Posted by walleye101


Unfortunately DU has taken a position that predator management does not improve duck production. I think their position is based on political correctness more than science. Delta Waterfowl says otherwise.


Well consider this me being deplorable but I think wildlife management decisions should be made based upon numbers put together like Mark J Monti and groups like the one he trapped for (boots on the ground and wildlife census takers).

Screw the anit's and their feelings or agendas.



I only got 3 words for simpletons like that
A
Mer
Ica!
grin


I said that was Du's position on predator management. I didn't say I agreed with it.

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: bblwi] #6874956
05/17/20 01:45 PM
05/17/20 01:45 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
W
walleye101 Offline
trapper
walleye101  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,452
MN
Originally Posted by bblwi
A section is huge when compared to some of the landscape we have east of the Mississippi, also the percentage I used was based on information that I read about 15 years ago and maybe why waterfowl numbers are increasing in general. It also shows if we create habitat that species will respond positively and that predator issues are less of an issue when habitat is there. Also we have been in general wetter as of late and that increases habitat for waterfowl and other water dependent species.

Bryce


An article in the DU magazine a couple of years ago explained their position on predator management. They cited the expense of the aggressive predator management (bounties or hired trappers) needed to make any difference as the main reason it was not cost effective. They believe that investing in good habitat has better long term benefits than predator management. Up until then I could accept, if not agree with, their rational. However, near the end of the article they added that trapping predators to increase waterfowl abundance could be viewed unfavorably by some, which may affect DU fundraising efforts.

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: AJE] #6874965
05/17/20 02:08 PM
05/17/20 02:08 PM
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 10,726
SW Georgia
W
Wanna Be Offline
trapper
Wanna Be  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: May 2018
Posts: 10,726
SW Georgia
Can’t speak for ducks, but our WMA’s have adopted a Quail Management Practice which not only involves habitat management but predator management as well. They are opening up more for hog and coyote hunts and are trapping (apparently) year round. Basing that off the cage traps I’m seeing during turkey season. When a property is managed for Quail, all other species benefit and prosper.
All landowners and managers I trap for are wanting more quail and turkeys and get more excited over coons and cats than coyotes any day of the week. I’m after them all. Anything with 4 legs that would eat an egg or anything with feathers gets removed.
But, as already stated, this has to be an extensive endeavor. It really sucks sometimes because the extensive trapping has taken the numbers of predators way down. I always try and get a piece of ground that has never been trapped to get my confidence up, lol. It makes days without a catch somewhat easier on the other properties.

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: AJE] #6874976
05/17/20 02:27 PM
05/17/20 02:27 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,735
Northern Illinois
M
MChewk Offline
trapper
MChewk  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,735
Northern Illinois
Good to hear Wanna Be!

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: AJE] #6875071
05/17/20 05:12 PM
05/17/20 05:12 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,165
Central NC
T
traprjohn Offline
trapper
traprjohn  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,165
Central NC
One predator but you all left out is snakes.
I wonder how many snake traps DU or DW put out.


www.sevenoakstrappingsupplies.com for trap mods and gear
The 10 Commandments are not suggestions.
Buy a soldiers meal EVERY chance you can.

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: traprjohn] #6875072
05/17/20 05:14 PM
05/17/20 05:14 PM
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 10,726
SW Georgia
W
Wanna Be Offline
trapper
Wanna Be  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: May 2018
Posts: 10,726
SW Georgia
Originally Posted by traprjohn
One predator but you all left out is snakes.
I wonder how many snake traps DU or DW put out.

That’s because snakes here, other than venomous, are protected. Just like aerial predators, some things just don’t need mentioning.

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: AJE] #6875315
05/17/20 09:48 PM
05/17/20 09:48 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 7,630
Virginia
5
52Carl Offline
trapper
52Carl  Offline
trapper
5

Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 7,630
Virginia
Raccoons are a problem for ground nesting birds when their numbers are high. They tend to meander around like an elementary kid with ADHD and out of Ridlin. High numbers equals a lot of stumbling into, and raiding ground nests
Red fox are much better skilled at specifically seeking out and raiding nests.
Coyotes are masters at finding nests and outdo red fox due to their ability to cover more ground in a 24 hour period, and a bigger belly.
If tasked with cleaning out a population of 40 raccoons and one coyote to protect ground nesting birds, I would not bother trapping the first racoon until I got rid of the single coyote. They are that much better at cleaning out multiple nests than raccoons.

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: AJE] #6875364
05/17/20 10:48 PM
05/17/20 10:48 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,761
Central, SD
Law Dog Offline
trapper
Law Dog  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 34,761
Central, SD
Don’t buy into that tick thing I think some bunny hugger made that up to give them a reason to be on earth, the ones I get in the summer are covered with ticks.


Was born in a Big City Will die in the Country OK with that!

Jerry Herbst
Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: AJE] #6875655
05/18/20 09:29 AM
05/18/20 09:29 AM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 829
NE NE
W
Wife Offline
trapper
Wife  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 829
NE NE
Its a lot easier for "GROUPS" to conduct some type of fund raising functions and purchase a deep-water marsh than to actually MANAGE a piece of ground for a crop (be that corn, grass, trees, or wildlife). If you are trying to produce (AND I MEAN PRODUCE) " the biggest crop" with the funds you have you better be able evaluate just what maximizes your return on the dollar. In highly managed systems DIVERSITY does not (NOT) mean you will get the max production of your crop. Go tell a corn producer that marestail, velvetleaf, foxtail, corn borer, white mold etc., in/competing with his corn crop is good and "Mother Natures" diverse way. See what he says. Go tell a forest/paper producing company that they should leave all the shrubs and broadleaf trees etc., to grow alongside the valued conifers because it adds "Diversity". See what they say. Go tell a rancher that hoary cress, red cedar, leafy spurge, common ragweed etc., in their pasture shows great promise for a "Diverse Eco-tone". See what he says. If you own/manage a piece of america and you want to maximize production on it you need to look at all the items and conditions that "LIMIT" your production. A few years back I was involved where Nebraska G&P received a wetland complex from DU here and since waterfowl production was the emphasis they immediately removed all the mature stands of cottonwoods (the coon, opossum dens, raptor perches, and sometimes eagle nesting spots) to benefit the waterfowl position on the landscape. So the bottom line is if the science supports the production increases, don't let bureaucrats and GROUPS cloud the issue. Like I said, its a lot easier to buy America and sit back and view slides , buy paintings, raffle a gun and go to meetings than to "Support" the facts.......... off the soap box. Hey MJM,,, did you use the 220's in the wood boxes for the trap as I saw F&W sold about 900 of them 2 years ago?

Re: Biggest nest thief [Re: AJE] #6875670
05/18/20 09:53 AM
05/18/20 09:53 AM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 577
robertson co ky
S
sako22 Offline
trapper
sako22  Offline
trapper
S

Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 577
robertson co ky
Have had 2 of my mel sims X leiper game hens broken up from setting because something dug under pen walls and ate their eggs. Sure it was coon from hair I found after last time it happened. both were within days of hatching. Caught one coon in live trap but second pullet was broke up after I caught it so I know there's more

Page 2 of 2 1 2
Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread