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Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? #6924825
07/09/20 10:30 AM
07/09/20 10:30 AM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 3,840
Dunbar, Wisconsin
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Pike River Offline OP
trapper
Pike River  Offline OP
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Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 3,840
Dunbar, Wisconsin
The Supreme Court ruled about half of Oklahoma is part of a Native American reservation, based on a historical claim from the Muscogee (Creek) Nation.

It is the first time much of eastern Oklahoma is legally considered "Indian country."

Gorsuch was the deciding vote.

Last edited by Pike River; 07/09/20 10:31 AM.
Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6924830
07/09/20 10:36 AM
07/09/20 10:36 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 8,167
The Hill Country of Texas
Leftlane Offline
"HOSS"
Leftlane  Offline
"HOSS"

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 8,167
The Hill Country of Texas
Will the landowners who have paid for deeds be bought out or some sort of reparation paid?

This could get interesting.


"Our nation is witnessing a merciless campaign to wipe out our history, defame our heroes, erase our values, and indoctrinate our children."
D. Trump
Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Leftlane] #6924889
07/09/20 11:32 AM
07/09/20 11:32 AM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 3,840
Dunbar, Wisconsin
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Pike River Offline OP
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Pike River  Offline OP
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Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 3,840
Dunbar, Wisconsin
Originally Posted by Leftlane
Will the landowners who have paid for deeds be bought out or some sort of reparation paid?

This could get interesting.

Could be very interesting. Suppose it depends on how the tribe/nation decides to move forward.

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6924898
07/09/20 11:39 AM
07/09/20 11:39 AM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,703
Oklahoma
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Matt28 Offline
trapper
Matt28  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,703
Oklahoma
Creek nation is a worthless joke. They screw the tribe members, any other tribe would be better then the creeks. They are bottom of the barrel for sure. They will likely use the land to make the casinos more money some how. Now if the land would be able to be used by the creek members that may not be bad but that won't be the case. The creeks just got a large grant to give the members a stimulus package, they took all the money and made it where if you made more then a ridiculous low amount of money you didn't get anything.

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6924899
07/09/20 11:42 AM
07/09/20 11:42 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,759
Sandhills Nebraska
G
Gary Benson Offline
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Gary Benson  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,759
Sandhills Nebraska
I'm sure they'd settle for a comfortable cash settlement.
After 1865, when the natives were allocated land for reservations around here, they started selling parts of their reservations to whites for farming and ranching. Someone, either the Govt or the tribe elders put a stop to that. Now the tribes get Fed money to buy land that comes up for sale, on the rez or not. They buy it, regardless of the price.

Last edited by Gary Benson; 07/09/20 11:45 AM.

I know I'm paranoid......but am I paranoid ENOUGH???
Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6924902
07/09/20 11:46 AM
07/09/20 11:46 AM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,086
pa
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hippie Offline
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hippie  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,086
pa
What I read, which was just a summary said the ruling related to who had judicial authority over natives being judged for crimes.

Does this also cover who owns the land?

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: hippie] #6924975
07/09/20 12:43 PM
07/09/20 12:43 PM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 3,840
Dunbar, Wisconsin
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Pike River Offline OP
trapper
Pike River  Offline OP
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Dunbar, Wisconsin
Originally Posted by hippie
What I read, which was just a summary said the ruling related to who had judicial authority over natives being judged for crimes.

Does this also cover who owns the land?

It appears you're right. When I first posted this it was based off of a tweet I saw with little info.

Still.....this could be huge! Pretty much would give every card member the equivalent to diplomatic immunity with in the region and could release a bunch of folks from prisons.

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6924979
07/09/20 12:45 PM
07/09/20 12:45 PM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 3,840
Dunbar, Wisconsin
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Pike River Offline OP
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Pike River  Offline OP
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Dunbar, Wisconsin
"The courtís 5-4 decision, written by Justice Neil Gorsuch, means that Oklahoma prosecutors lack the authority to pursue criminal cases against American Indian defendants in parts of Oklahoma that include most of Tulsa, the second-largest city."

"The case the justices decided Thursday involved 71-year-old Jimcy McGirt, who is serving a 500-year prison sentence for molesting a child. Oklahoma state courts rejected his argument that his case does not belong in Oklahoma courts and that federal prosecutors should instead handle his case.

McGirt could potentially be retried in federal court, as could Patrick Murphy, who was convicted of killing a fellow tribe member in 1999 and sentenced to death. But Murphy would not face the death penalty in federal court for a crime in which prosecutors said he mutilated the victim and left him to bleed to death on the side of a country road about 80 miles southeast of Tulsa."

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6924986
07/09/20 12:53 PM
07/09/20 12:53 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,399
Oklahoma
Blaine County Online content
trapper
Blaine County  Online Content
trapper

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,399
Oklahoma
Wait. Gorsuch was appointed by Trump.....How could this happen????

This decision will be a legal disaster for Oklahoma and many other places in this country.


MOLON LABE
Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6925098
07/09/20 02:29 PM
07/09/20 02:29 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 379
higginsville, mo
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headache73 Offline
trapper
headache73  Offline
trapper
H

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 379
higginsville, mo
I was in the casino in McAlester a few weeks ago. Hit $400 after 10 minutes and left lol I sure wasn't giving it back

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6925109
07/09/20 02:39 PM
07/09/20 02:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 22,625
Central, SD
Law Dog Offline
trapper
Law Dog  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 22,625
Central, SD
Currently if your a Native on a Reservation the BIA or Tribal Police deal with you a White cannot be jailed on the Reservation but can be held for the jurisdiction they are in. Off of the Reservation a Native or White can be jailed no problem.


Was born in a Big City Will die in the Country OK with that!

Jerry Herbst
Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6925153
07/09/20 03:39 PM
07/09/20 03:39 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,468
Wisconsin
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Moosetrot Offline
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Moosetrot  Offline
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Posts: 4,468
Wisconsin
I have an original 1861 wall map of the U.S. Oklahoma is named "Indian Territory".

Moosetrot

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Moosetrot] #6925162
07/09/20 04:02 PM
07/09/20 04:02 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 756
Texas Hill Country
C
Cedar Hacker Offline
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Cedar Hacker  Offline
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Posts: 756
Texas Hill Country
Originally Posted by Moosetrot
I have an original 1861 wall map of the U.S. Oklahoma is named "Indian Territory".

Moosetrot



Yep, the place of birth on my mother in-law's birth certificate says "Indian Territory".

But my wife's says Seminole, Oklahoma.

Gorsuch probably just started a war amongst the Indian Nations.


Nature is my religion, the earth is my Church
Gun control is using both hands

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Moosetrot] #6925181
07/09/20 04:28 PM
07/09/20 04:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,041
Marion Kansas
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Yes sir Offline
trapper
Yes sir  Offline
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Posts: 4,041
Marion Kansas
Originally Posted by Moosetrot
I have an original 1861 wall map of the U.S. Oklahoma is named "Indian Territory".

Moosetrot

I wonder what a 1461 map would say. L

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6925201
07/09/20 04:44 PM
07/09/20 04:44 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 22,625
Central, SD
Law Dog Offline
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Law Dog  Offline
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Posts: 22,625
Central, SD
Our county map shows some old boundaries on it.


Was born in a Big City Will die in the Country OK with that!

Jerry Herbst
Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Cedar Hacker] #6925211
07/09/20 04:53 PM
07/09/20 04:53 PM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 3,840
Dunbar, Wisconsin
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Pike River Offline OP
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Pike River  Offline OP
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Dunbar, Wisconsin
Originally Posted by Cedar Hacker
Originally Posted by Moosetrot
I have an original 1861 wall map of the U.S. Oklahoma is named "Indian Territory".

Moosetrot



Yep, the place of birth on my mother in-law's birth certificate says "Indian Territory".

But my wife's says Seminole, Oklahoma.

Gorsuch probably just started a war amongst the Indian Nations.


I thought the Seminole were never conquered?

As Law Dog said above regarding whites being arrested on Rez's I wonder if this now does the opposite. That local law enforcement might detain for a tribe but the judiciary will be powerless.

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6925219
07/09/20 04:57 PM
07/09/20 04:57 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,468
Wisconsin
M
Moosetrot Offline
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Moosetrot  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 4,468
Wisconsin
I bought this map in an antique auction in 1974. It's a "Washington Map of the United States". It is about 6ft. by 6ft. and chock full of information including the proposed routes of the Northern, Central, and Southern Pacific railways, zoological distributions, on an on. There are images of the Presidents around the borders and the last one is Lincoln without a beard. I can stand in front of it for hours.


Moosetrot

Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6925241
07/09/20 05:11 PM
07/09/20 05:11 PM
Joined: May 2020
Posts: 186
Alabama
cheechako Offline
trapper
cheechako  Offline
trapper

Joined: May 2020
Posts: 186
Alabama
If you donít have the authority to prosecute crimes you probably donít have the authority to levy taxes either. Should get interesting in the federal courts. I bet federal judge in the eastern district of Oklahoma turned his phone off and started drinking when he got that news!


The trapper formerly known as sanfo008
Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6925244
07/09/20 05:14 PM
07/09/20 05:14 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 18,603
williamsburg ks
D
danny clifton Offline
trapper
danny clifton  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 18,603
williamsburg ks
maybe it will get trapper friendly down there


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: Bye Bye Eastern Oklahoma??? [Re: Pike River] #6925264
07/09/20 05:35 PM
07/09/20 05:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 2,124
MN
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Donnersurvivor Offline
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Donnersurvivor  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 2,124
MN
So does the state of Oklahoma still have the authority to tax on the new rez?

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