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Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: BillyTraps] #6960481
08/10/20 09:06 PM
08/10/20 09:06 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 13,757
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
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Finster  Offline
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Fredonia, PA.
I also think that the guy who called the police in the first place should be investigated and if it turns out he was reporting false information, he should be charged with involuntary manslaughter.


I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: white17] #6960487
08/10/20 09:08 PM
08/10/20 09:08 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 9,081
SWMo.
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tjm Offline
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SWMo.
Originally Posted by white17
I can't tell if both cops fired. Anyone ??

I am also wondering if the cop who fired from behind him can actually see the guys right hand ??

replaying it over and over it looks like the cop with the light shot first, the dead guy is pushed backward (not kneeling but dying) and the second cop fired repeatedly. Need the autopsy to see if that impression is true.
Originally Posted by Lugnut
Originally Posted by white17
I can't tell if both cops fired. Anyone ??

I am also wondering if the cop who fired from behind him can actually see the guys right hand ??


According to the articles I read only one cop fired. He fired three shots, two of which struck the victim in the back and killed him.

Cancels my opinion


Is it normal for cops to bang a door then hide?

If you heard a commotion outside and looked through the peeper and saw nothing would you assume it was police? Would assume all was well? Nothing seen, nothing wrong?

Last edited by tjm; 08/10/20 09:10 PM.
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: Finster] #6960490
08/10/20 09:09 PM
08/10/20 09:09 PM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 30,550
McGrath, AK
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white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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McGrath, AK
Originally Posted by Finster
I also think that the guy who called the police in the first place should be investigated and if it turns out he was reporting false information, he should be charged with involuntary manslaughter.



No way ! He had no way to anticipate how any of the individuals would respond AND he was not present,


Mean As Nails
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: white17] #6960500
08/10/20 09:16 PM
08/10/20 09:16 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 13,757
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
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Originally Posted by white17
Originally Posted by Finster
I also think that the guy who called the police in the first place should be investigated and if it turns out he was reporting false information, he should be charged with involuntary manslaughter.



No way ! He had no way to anticipate how any of the individuals would respond AND he was not present,

That's what "Involuntary manslaughter" is. By your actions, you set in motion an event, a chain of events that cause the death of another person. So, if they guy was lying about a domestic assault and the police showed up with that in mind expecting violence, well then that would be for a jury to decide whether or not the callers actions contributed to his death. For instance, if I fix the brakes on your car and I screw it up. You drive down a mountain road and because the brakes don't work you go airborne off of a cliff, I just committed involuntary manslaughter. By not fixing your brakes correctly, I caused your death. I didn't mean for you to drive off that cliff but because of my actions you did. Or possibly negligent homicide with my example but we are splitting hairs. You get what I'm saying.

Last edited by Finster; 08/10/20 09:19 PM.

I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: white17] #6960518
08/10/20 09:23 PM
08/10/20 09:23 PM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 8,403
Champaign County, Ohio.
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KeithC Offline
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Champaign County, Ohio.
Originally Posted by white17
Originally Posted by Finster
I also think that the guy who called the police in the first place should be investigated and if it turns out he was reporting false information, he should be charged with involuntary manslaughter.



No way ! He had no way to anticipate how any of the individuals would respond AND he was not present,


I don't think the guy who made the semi fraudulent call can be charged with manslaughter. He can definitely lose a torts case.

Keith

Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: BillyTraps] #6960519
08/10/20 09:23 PM
08/10/20 09:23 PM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 30,550
McGrath, AK
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white17 Offline

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From what I heard it was pretty obvious the neighbor did NOT want to say "domestic violence" was occurring


Mean As Nails
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: KeithC] #6960529
08/10/20 09:33 PM
08/10/20 09:33 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 13,757
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
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Finster  Offline
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Originally Posted by KeithC


I don't think the guy who made the semi fraudulent call can be charged with manslaughter. He can definitely lose a torts case.

Keith

Well he could be civilly sued for sure but if I was the DA, I would be looking into what happened because of his actions. Knowingly making a false report to 911 is akin to filing a false police report, a misdemeanor. The guy himhawed around awhile on 911 but eventually said that they were fighting, doors were slamming and what not. In other words, it seems that he was getting frustrated and made things sound much worse just to get the police there faster. The evidence of the false reporting is when he asked that if they were in a physical fight, would it get the police there faster? If I were the DA, I would be looking into it.

Last edited by Finster; 08/10/20 09:35 PM.

I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: BillyTraps] #6960661
08/10/20 11:14 PM
08/10/20 11:14 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 593
Washington
wildflights Offline
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Washington
You'll know his superior officer thinks it's a bad shoot after the dust settles. Once all the investigations and lawsuits are over, that officer will be looking for another job the next county over. That's how these bad judgement shootings go.


Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. -Gustav Mahler
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: BillyTraps] #6960666
08/10/20 11:37 PM
08/10/20 11:37 PM
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 950
eastern washington
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BillyTraps Offline OP
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eastern washington

Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: BillyTraps] #6960704
08/11/20 05:17 AM
08/11/20 05:17 AM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 3,840
Dunbar, Wisconsin
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Pike River Offline
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Dunbar, Wisconsin

From the article:


Nees, who is several feet away from Whitaker at this point, asks the officer if he could handcuff her so she could be near her boyfriend.

After the officer says no, she asks if Ferragamo could check if Whitaker was OK.

"I'm leaning toward the fact that he's not," Ferragamo responds.


Ferragamo's response seems pretty flippant.

Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: Finster] #6960709
08/11/20 05:33 AM
08/11/20 05:33 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 17,126
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Online happy
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 17,126
Eastern Shore of Maryland
Originally Posted by Finster
I also think that the guy who called the police in the first place should be investigated and if it turns out he was reporting false information, he should be charged with involuntary manslaughter.


The argument will be made that such charge would deter crime reporting. This is already an issue in some communities and starting down this road would most definitely make it worse.


The gun is immaterial, the guy would have been shot if he was holding a TV remote.



-Goofy-
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: HobbieTrapper] #6960713
08/11/20 05:42 AM
08/11/20 05:42 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 13,757
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
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Fredonia, PA.
Originally Posted by HobbieTrapper
Originally Posted by Finster
I also think that the guy who called the police in the first place should be investigated and if it turns out he was reporting false information, he should be charged with involuntary manslaughter.


The argument will be made that such charge would deter crime reporting. This is already an issue in some communities and starting down this road would most definitely make it worse.


The gun is immaterial, the guy would have been shot if he was holding a TV remote.

I agree that, any defense would broach that issue and even the DA might use it as an excuse not to look at the case. However, in my mind, a man is dead and it all started with two calls to 911 and a lie that said a domestic was escalating. The officer while in my opinion is guilty of manslaughter he was the tool but the caller started the events while committing a crime himself if that can be proven. I'm not saying it will happen by any means. I'm saying in a fair and equally just world, the caller should be investigated. Although I do agree, I doubt it will happen.


I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: BillyTraps] #6960719
08/11/20 05:47 AM
08/11/20 05:47 AM
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Posts: 1,386
WI
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Trap_Hunt_Fish Offline
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The victim was raising one hand and lowering himself to the ground but the other hand still appeared to be on the gun. I believe the hand on the gun was his mistake.

I support the police 100% but in this case I think the police over-reacted. I hate to say it but possibly involuntary manslaughter.

Why isnít this in the news? Because the victim is white.


I'm a Politically Incorrect American
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: BillyTraps] #6960720
08/11/20 05:47 AM
08/11/20 05:47 AM
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The Hill Country of Texas
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1) I think the guy was a dumb (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) but 2) from what I can see he doesn't deserve to be a dead dumb (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman)


"Our nation is witnessing a merciless campaign to wipe out our history, defame our heroes, erase our values, and indoctrinate our children."
D. Trump
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: Finster] #6960722
08/11/20 05:48 AM
08/11/20 05:48 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 17,126
Eastern Shore of Maryland
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Eastern Shore of Maryland
Originally Posted by Finster
Originally Posted by HobbieTrapper


The argument will be made that such charge would deter crime reporting. This is already an issue in some communities and starting down this road would most definitely make it worse.


The gun is immaterial, the guy would have been shot if he was holding a TV remote.

I agree that, any defense would broach that issue and even the DA might use it as an excuse not to look at the case. However, in my mind, a man is dead and it all started with two calls to 911 and a lie that said a domestic was escalating. The officer while in my opinion is guilty of manslaughter he was the tool but the caller started the events while committing a crime himself if that can be proven. I'm not saying it will happen by any means. I'm saying in a fair and equally just world, the caller should be investigated. Although I do agree, I doubt it will happen.


Iím curious if the caller paid a visit prior to the call. If he didnít, he is definitely a tool.



-Goofy-
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: Trap_Hunt_Fish] #6960727
08/11/20 05:54 AM
08/11/20 05:54 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 13,757
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
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Originally Posted by Trap_Hunt_Fish
The victim was raising one hand and lowering himself to the ground but the other hand still appeared to be on the gun. I believe the hand on the gun was his mistake.

I support the police 100% but in this case I think the police over-reacted. I hate to say it but possibly involuntary manslaughter.

Why isnít this in the news? Because the victim is white.

Involuntary manslaughter doesn't fit. To be involuntary, it would have to be an accident. This was no accidental shooting. It was not murder either since there was no motive, no aforethought not even moral turpitude. Manslaughter seems like the only real fit and I could see the DA pleading it down to negligent homicide.if the officer is charged at all. One thing is for sure. The guy should not have a badge with the evidence I have seen.

Last edited by Finster; 08/11/20 05:57 AM.

I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: HobbieTrapper] #6960729
08/11/20 05:59 AM
08/11/20 05:59 AM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 13,757
Fredonia, PA.
Finster Offline
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Originally Posted by HobbieTrapper




Iím curious if the caller paid a visit prior to the call. If he didnít, he is definitely a tool.

I'm doubting it or I think the guy would have mentioned it on the 911 call. Although that's noting more than an educated guess. No evidence either way.


I BELIEVE IN MY GOD, MY COUNTRY AND IN MYSELF.
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: Trap_Hunt_Fish] #6960734
08/11/20 06:08 AM
08/11/20 06:08 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 17,126
Eastern Shore of Maryland
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Originally Posted by Trap_Hunt_Fish
The victim was raising one hand and lowering himself to the ground but the other hand still appeared to be on the gun. I believe the hand on the gun was his mistake.

I support the police 100% but in this case I think the police over-reacted. I hate to say it but possibly involuntary manslaughter.

Why isnít this in the news? Because the victim is white.


The guy didnít want to get an $800 gun scratched up by dropping it, is why they shot him.

You know why it isnít in the news, no marches and no week of funerals.



-Goofy-
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: Finster] #6960737
08/11/20 06:11 AM
08/11/20 06:11 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 17,126
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Online happy
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Eastern Shore of Maryland
Originally Posted by Finster
Originally Posted by HobbieTrapper




Iím curious if the caller paid a visit prior to the call. If he didnít, he is definitely a tool.

I'm doubting it or I think the guy would have mentioned it on the 911 call. Although that's noting more than an educated guess. No evidence either way.


I keep forgetting in some places people count on somebody else to do their bidding for everything.



-Goofy-
Re: Police Shooting----What is Your Opinion? [Re: BillyTraps] #6960740
08/11/20 06:15 AM
08/11/20 06:15 AM
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williamsburg ks
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danny clifton Offline
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Why would anybody run out with a gun in their gun hand over somebody banging on the door and running off? Which is what the girlfriend said they thought was going on.

The cops thought somebody might be smacking his partner around so they don't stand in front of the door. They yell police and figure the occupants hear them.

Nut job runs out with a gun to show the kids knocking on the door and running off how tough he is.

Cop see's a nut with a gun.

How many of you are going to run out your front door, gun in hand, because somebody bangs on the door? Guy had a Rambo complex. He did not need killing but I can see how it happened. If I think a gun fight is about to start, but I have the drop on the other guy, I'm not going to assume its a scene from a movie where two people are going to stand with guns pointed at each other talking instead of shooting.


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
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