Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: white17]
#6977372
08/29/20 12:20 PM
08/29/20 12:20 PM
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Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,576 MN
Donnersurvivor
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,576
MN
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Yes . I admit I am a volatility junkie and it is ONE way to make money if you can live with and afford the risk.
But with a company like XAUMF, that only trades about 40 thousand shares a day that same volatility can trap you.
It only moves 3-6 cents a day and the volume is so thin that there may be no buyers at your price when you want to get out.
Lets say you want to trade this thing and you buy a thousand shares at 2.26. Next it goes up and the spread is 2.29 bid and 2.34 ask.
MAYBE you will find a buyer @ 2.30 and you have made 4 cents without any trade costs. Is it worth it to risk $2260 to make $40 ??
You could do the same thing in a much higher dollar stock with much less risk. Just use the same $ 2260 that you used on the gold trade to buy fewer shares of a company that actually earns money and trades 4 million shares a day rather than 40 thousand.
I would not encourage anyone to day trade however. That usually doesn't end well
If it is just for day trading NUGT is x2 leveraged Gold and has much better volume.
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: white17]
#6977377
08/29/20 12:23 PM
08/29/20 12:23 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,941 2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,941
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
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I'm not White or Steven but I do alright managing my own investments. Depending on your situation, I would consider going to cash for a few months. I did this week. These last few days have been the epitome of Greenspan's "irrational exuberance". The market is ........IMO............completely disconnected from the economy. We still haven't seen the full impact of the virus translated to corporate bottom lines. We still have a very dangerous election ahead of us. Normally I stay 5% in cash but I have increased that to 30% at this point and may increase it more. Ask yourself if Apple is fundamentally worth 90% more than it was at this time last year . I think that is an indicator of how crazy things have become. And risky ! I was more in the 10% cash category but decided that the risk of schools and businesses shutting back down, the election and the fact that a lot of investors are trying to time this but holding just a bit longer was a reason to be early rather than late. I'll jump back in but things need to settle out a bit. I know, market timing is tough.
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: white17]
#6977441
08/29/20 01:19 PM
08/29/20 01:19 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,177 Albany, NY
bobsheedy
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,177
Albany, NY
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The market is ........IMO............completely disconnected from the economy. 2X
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: bobsheedy]
#6977461
08/29/20 01:39 PM
08/29/20 01:39 PM
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,694 nm
adam m
OP
trapper
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OP
trapper
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,694
nm
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The market is ........IMO............completely disconnected from the economy. 2X Didn't the markets dramatically crash which was a factor in the great recession?
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: rex123]
#6977466
08/29/20 01:44 PM
08/29/20 01:44 PM
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Mark June
Unregistered
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Mark June
Unregistered
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On Monday apple will do a 4 for 1 stock split .Is anyone buying? For holders on record 8/24. I already own it, so the 31st will see the split.
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: adam m]
#6977469
08/29/20 01:48 PM
08/29/20 01:48 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,169 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,169
McGrath, AK
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Didn't the markets dramatically crash which was a factor in the great recession?
Are you talking about the GFR ..Great Financial Recession of 2007-9 or the Great Depression of 1929-34+ ?? The market reacted negatively both times but don't confuse correlation with causation.
Mean As Nails
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: Blaine County]
#6977486
08/29/20 02:04 PM
08/29/20 02:04 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,169 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,169
McGrath, AK
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I was more in the 10% cash category but decided that the risk of schools and businesses shutting back down, the election and the fact that a lot of investors are trying to time this but holding just a bit longer was a reason to be early rather than late.
I'll jump back in but things need to settle out a bit. I know, market timing is tough.
Warren Buffett on market timing. "‘They know that overstaying the festivities — that is, continuing to speculate in companies that have gigantic valuations relative to the cash they are likely to generate in the future — will eventually bring on pumpkins and mice. But they nevertheless hate to miss a single minute of what is one helluva party. Therefore, the giddy participants all plan to leave just seconds before midnight. There’s a problem, though: They are dancing in a room in which the clocks have no hands.’
Mean As Nails
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: white17]
#6977655
08/29/20 05:56 PM
08/29/20 05:56 PM
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,694 nm
adam m
OP
trapper
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OP
trapper
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,694
nm
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Didn't the markets dramatically crash which was a factor in the great recession?
Are you talking about the GFR ..Great Financial Recession of 2007-9 or the Great Depression of 1929-34+ ?? The market reacted negatively both times but don't confuse correlation with causation. 07-09. I thought the market crashed bad just before the recession
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: white17]
#6977693
08/29/20 06:47 PM
08/29/20 06:47 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 898 N. W. MISSOURI
TRAPPER-ED
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 898
N. W. MISSOURI
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Yes . I admit I am a volatility junkie and it is ONE way to make money if you can live with and afford the risk.
But with a company like XAUMF, that only trades about 40 thousand shares a day that same volatility can trap you.
It only moves 3-6 cents a day and the volume is so thin that there may be no buyers at your price when you want to get out.
Lets say you want to trade this thing and you buy a thousand shares at 2.26. Next it goes up and the spread is 2.29 bid and 2.34 ask.
MAYBE you will find a buyer @ 2.30 and you have made 4 cents without any trade costs. Is it worth it to risk $2260 to make $40 ??
You could do the same thing in a much higher dollar stock with much less risk. Just use the same $ 2260 that you used on the gold trade to buy fewer shares of a company that actually earns money and trades 4 million shares a day rather than 40 thousand.
I would not encourage anyone to day trade however. That usually doesn't end well
I am in for a longer term , just thought that that company was interesting
50 + years of trapping & some fur buying and i still know nothing.
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: adam m]
#6977698
08/29/20 06:53 PM
08/29/20 06:53 PM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,472 mn north of blakely
Steven 49er
trapper
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trapper
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,472
mn north of blakely
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I'm not White or Steven but I do alright managing my own investments. Depending on your situation, I would consider going to cash for a few months. I did this week. Don't put me in the same league as Ken, I'm a contrarian investor and I'm not ashamed to say I've left a lot of money laying on the table in the past 15 years because of it. I'd rather buy an ounce of gold than buy Amazon stock. I'm not White or Steven but I do alright managing my own investments. Depending on your situation, I would consider going to cash for a few months. I did this week. These last few days have been the epitome of Greenspan's "irrational exuberance". The market is ........IMO............completely disconnected from the economy. We still haven't seen the full impact of the virus translated to corporate bottom lines. We still have a very dangerous election ahead of us. Normally I stay 5% in cash but I have increased that to 30% at this point and may increase it more. Ask yourself if Apple is fundamentally worth 90% more than it was at this time last year . I think that is an indicator of how crazy things have become. And risky ! First off let me say I'm not an investment expert nor an expert at anything financial. I'm a contrarian thinker and I'm not ashamed to say I've left a lot of money laying on the table not buying as heavy as I could into the stock market the past twenty years. I'd rather buy an ounce of gold than a share in Amazon or Tesla in my personal account. I'll let the gurus do what they will with my pension. XAUMF is Schiff Gold. While I like to listen to Schiff and agree with him on many things, I believe there are better investments like precious metal mines that produce something and liquid I agree with Ken also that over the counter stocks come with some risks that he spelled out pretty well. I have an order in to buy an OTC gold mine stock through Ameritrade that hasn't been filled yet, it's been three days. If I try to sell it and have to wait that long or longer it could be costly and hopefully I have a good exit plan. Not very liquid. I don't know if apple is worth almost double what it was last year, I do know that 5 companies comprise 25 percent of the value of the NASDAQ right now. IMHO that's not healthy. But to quote Schiff, "what is good for Wall Street isn't what's good for main street". The stimulus plans, quantitative easing, deficit spending and bailouts have always benefited Wall Street and the financial sectors more than the people. That is how a fiat system is rigged, that is why the income gap is growing. The Democrats haven't figured out the system they are in love with is the cause of the problem and if they ever get modern monetary theory as a mainstream it will get worse. Adam, Ken was right, don't confuse causation with correlation. The stock market crash didn't cause the great recession. The debt bubble crash was responsible for the "Great Recession", that causation. The market dropped because of that debt bubble crash, that's correlation. Any guesses how the Federal Reserve and the US government fixed those two crashes? They made the debt bubble bigger. I hear all the time how Obama fixed the great recession. Nah, it was actions by the Fed that help pull us out of it, or should I say kick the can down the road. Powell just said they are going to leave interest rates at basically zero for years, that's insanity and the definition of a rigged market.
"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: white17]
#6977782
08/29/20 08:06 PM
08/29/20 08:06 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,941 2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,941
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
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I was more in the 10% cash category but decided that the risk of schools and businesses shutting back down, the election and the fact that a lot of investors are trying to time this but holding just a bit longer was a reason to be early rather than late.
I'll jump back in but things need to settle out a bit. I know, market timing is tough.
Warren Buffett on market timing. "‘They know that overstaying the festivities — that is, continuing to speculate in companies that have gigantic valuations relative to the cash they are likely to generate in the future — will eventually bring on pumpkins and mice. But they nevertheless hate to miss a single minute of what is one helluva party. Therefore, the giddy participants all plan to leave just seconds before midnight. There’s a problem, though: They are dancing in a room in which the clocks have no hands.’ Excellent quote.
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: blackhammer]
#6977824
08/29/20 08:34 PM
08/29/20 08:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,237 Co.-Wy. part time AK.
wy.wolfer
trapper
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trapper
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,237
Co.-Wy. part time AK.
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Roughly 7 trillion dollars printed out of thin air so no big suprise. . 49er negativity LOL Exactly! What most don't realize is that when you print more money, it just dilutes what is already existing and erodes the buying power of dollars you have or earn. All politicians are quick to take advantage of this and give the voting public something for free or what the public thinks it "needs".
Last edited by wy.wolfer; 08/29/20 08:35 PM.
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: stinkypete]
#6977837
08/29/20 08:41 PM
08/29/20 08:41 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,169 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,169
McGrath, AK
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If you are able. Buying into apple after the split is good if you are investing for the long haul. It will make it affordable for the blue collar investor. That's true but no different than buying 25 shares at $500/sh. You still end up with a hundred shares monday morning. You're right though, with AAPL it has historically increased 6-7 % after a split......within 6 months or so. It will open monday morning around 125-130. If we get some sort of market event that drops it to 75-80 I might consider buying it. I just think its price has vastly outrun its value in the last month. Other than that it is a well run company and the coming 5G could be quite a catalyst for the company
Mean As Nails
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Re: Stocks sore today
[Re: Steven 49er]
#6977858
08/29/20 08:55 PM
08/29/20 08:55 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,169 McGrath, AK
white17
"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
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"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 35,169
McGrath, AK
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First off let me say I'm not an investment expert nor an expert at anything financial. I'm a contrarian thinker and I'm not ashamed to say I've left a lot of money laying on the table not buying as heavy as I could into the stock market the past twenty years. I'd rather buy an ounce of gold than a share in Amazon or Tesla in my personal account. I'll let the gurus do what they will with my pension.
XAUMF is Schiff Gold. While I like to listen to Schiff and agree with him on many things, I believe there are better investments like precious metal mines that produce something and liquid I agree with Ken also that over the counter stocks come with some risks that he spelled out pretty well. I have an order in to buy an OTC gold mine stock through Ameritrade that hasn't been filled yet, it's been three days. If I try to sell it and have to wait that long or longer it could be costly and hopefully I have a good exit plan. Not very liquid.
I don't know if apple is worth almost double what it was last year, I do know that 5 companies comprise 25 percent of the value of the NASDAQ right now. IMHO that's not healthy. But to quote Schiff, "what is good for Wall Street isn't what's good for main street". The stimulus plans, quantitative easing, deficit spending and bailouts have always benefited Wall Street and the financial sectors more than the people. That is how a fiat system is rigged, that is why the income gap is growing. The Democrats haven't figured out the system they are in love with is the cause of the problem and if they ever get modern monetary theory as a mainstream it will get worse.
Adam, Ken was right, don't confuse causation with correlation. The stock market crash didn't cause the great recession. The debt bubble crash was responsible for the "Great Recession", that causation. The market dropped because of that debt bubble crash, that's correlation. Any guesses how the Federal Reserve and the US government fixed those two crashes? They made the debt bubble bigger. I hear all the time how Obama fixed the great recession. Nah, it was actions by the Fed that help pull us out of it, or should I say kick the can down the road. Powell just said they are going to leave interest rates at basically zero for years, that's insanity and the definition of a rigged market.
No expert here either. I too have left a lot on the table by getting out too soon. But always remember that one-liner by Bernard Baruch. ....." I made my money because I always got out too soon." Adam: Steven has said just what I would have in response to your question. There is one more entity that benefits from manipulation of interest rates lower. In fact the biggest beneficiary is the federal government. Just imagine how much more debt the economy can take on when the debt service is so cheap !! That's a true statement but it should be really scary ~
Mean As Nails
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