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Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: Leftlane] #6991785
09/16/20 06:42 AM
09/16/20 06:42 AM
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 561
Indiana
P
Providence Farm Offline
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Providence Farm  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 561
Indiana
Originally Posted by Leftlane
My exwife had a little mare I planned on never liking but she turned out to be super cowey and too smart for her own good so she eventually won me over. I had built a slam latch for the little place we kept her behind the house out of a horse shoe and I was proud of it- the only problem was that if you didn't slam it, it might fail to latch.

One morning I went out to feed at dawn and the gate was wide open- thankfully the little saddle mare was still in waiting for me by the bunk. I remember thinking- well the little numb skull never went anywhere but sign said otherwise. For laughs I drove around a little bit and noticed fresh grazing and piles spread out over several miles. She had visited every set of horses she could find during the night but decided no matter how much green grass she had taken in she wasn't gonna be late for a little flake of alfalfa or some rolled oats!

In my mind, it was a contentious decision she made and shows more reasoning than most.
grin



My dad text me last week telling me "your white goat is out" I was headed up in ten minutes to milk anyway and told him I will be up shortly dont worry about it she won't go far. I went to the barn and got concerned when I didn't find her just outside the barn when I walked around. Just before I was getting ready to expand my search I looked in the stall. Sure enough there she was in the stall with the gate closed standing on it looking at me. It seemed like she was trying to pull a fast one saying yep I have been here the whole time. The stall latch was un lached and there were goat droppings all in the driveway that along with dads text gave her away. I never let on I knew she had been out and to this day she dosen't know that I know.

Last edited by Providence Farm; 09/16/20 10:12 AM. Reason: White goat not wife goat.
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991860
09/16/20 07:58 AM
09/16/20 07:58 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 7,350
The Hill Country of Texas
Leftlane Offline
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Leftlane  Offline
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The Hill Country of Texas
LMBO- yeah she figures to have the wool pulled over your eyes.


"Our nation is witnessing a merciless campaign to wipe out our history, defame our heroes, erase our values, and indoctrinate our children."
D. Trump
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991861
09/16/20 07:58 AM
09/16/20 07:58 AM
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 419
Perry, NY
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Dana I Offline
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Perry, NY
Hobbie, I really don't think we are that far apart. No remembering is not reasoning, that is correct. But I think that using what you remember to avoid the situation in the future is. That is apparently where we disagree.

Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991879
09/16/20 08:13 AM
09/16/20 08:13 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,996
La Vernia & Dallas TX
Mark June Offline
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Mark June  Offline
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Posts: 1,996
La Vernia & Dallas TX
Primates, scientists tell us, are the only animals with a frontal lobe to our brains. I simply did a Google to remind me what scientists figure that region does;

The frontal lobes are important for voluntary movement, expressive language and for managing higher level executive functions. Executive functions refer to a collection of cognitive skills including the capacity to plan, organise, initiate, self-monitor and control one's responses in order to achieve a goal.

I wonder how we got from a fish walking outta the soup onto legs to where we have what no other animals have?
The philosophers of centuries ago coined the atheistic phrase, "Having a watch, does not indicate there is a watch maker."
Well, dang son. Somebody had to make the watch correct?

I feel better already, but interestingly, my dog gave me all this information. whistle

Blessings,
Mark


Dallas Theological Seminary
https://www.dts.edu
https://www.markjuneslures.com/
Predator Trapping Academy Host - 2021 is booked



Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: Dana I] #6991885
09/16/20 08:21 AM
09/16/20 08:21 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,063
Northern Minnesota
BernieB. Offline
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BernieB.  Offline
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Northern Minnesota
Originally Posted by Dana I
Hobbie, I really don't think we are that far apart. No remembering is not reasoning, that is correct. But I think that using what you remember to avoid the situation in the future is. That is apparently where we disagree.


That's not reasoning that's cognition.

Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: BernieB.] #6991889
09/16/20 08:30 AM
09/16/20 08:30 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2,576
rogers city mi.
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jeff karsten Offline
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Joined: Jun 2015
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rogers city mi.
Originally Posted by BernieB.
Originally Posted by Dana I
Hobbie, I really don't think we are that far apart. No remembering is not reasoning, that is correct. But I think that using what you remember to avoid the situation in the future is. That is apparently where we disagree.


That's not reasoning that's cognition.

Used to call that "Growing Up"


olden tyred
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991894
09/16/20 08:33 AM
09/16/20 08:33 AM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 250
Pennsylvania
C
coalbank Offline
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coalbank  Offline
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Pennsylvania
If my dog can't reason, he has me fooled. As a matter of fact he fools me often.

Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: coalbank] #6991907
09/16/20 08:47 AM
09/16/20 08:47 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,010
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
"Chippendale Trapper"
HobbieTrapper  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
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Eastern Shore of Maryland
Originally Posted by coalbank
If my dog can't reason, he has me fooled. As a matter of fact he fools me often.


You certain you aren’t fooling yourself?



-Goofy-
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: Mark June] #6991916
09/16/20 08:55 AM
09/16/20 08:55 AM
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 1,590
Southern Illinois
F
Foxpaw Offline
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Posts: 1,590
Southern Illinois
Originally Posted by Mark June
Primates, scientists tell us, are the only animals with a frontal lobe to our brains. I simply did a Google to remind me what scientists figure that region does;

The frontal lobes are important for voluntary movement, expressive language and for managing higher level executive functions. Executive functions refer to a collection of cognitive skills including the capacity to plan, organise, initiate, self-monitor and control one's responses in order to achieve a goal.

I wonder how we got from a fish walking outta the soup onto legs to where we have what no other animals have?
The philosophers of centuries ago coined the atheistic phrase, "Having a watch, does not indicate there is a watch maker."
Well, dang son. Somebody had to make the watch correct?

I feel better already, but interestingly, my dog gave me all this information. whistle

Blessings,
Mark


A guy was curious where everyone got the time to set there watch. So he called the radio station and asked where they got there time from. They told him the watch maker . So he called the watch maker and asked where he got his time. He said the radio station.

Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991917
09/16/20 08:56 AM
09/16/20 08:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 376
mo.
N
nate Offline OP
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mo.
Big fancy talk is learned behavior.

Conclusion to a problem is reasoning.

Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991918
09/16/20 08:57 AM
09/16/20 08:57 AM
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 419
Perry, NY
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Dana I Offline
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Perry, NY
Definition of cognition- the mental action or process of aquiring knowledge and understanding through thaught, experience or senses.

Definition of reasoning- action of thinking about something in a logical sensible way. Or to find an answer to a problem by considering various possible solutions.

Therefore I believe aquiring the knowledge is the cognitive part. Deciding what to do with the knowledge is reasoning.

Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991922
09/16/20 09:03 AM
09/16/20 09:03 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,010
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
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Eastern Shore of Maryland
There appears to be as many types of reasoning as there are stray cats in an Asian restaurant dumpster.



-Goofy-
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991925
09/16/20 09:07 AM
09/16/20 09:07 AM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,620
SE Minn
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Rat Masterson Offline
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SE Minn
Giving animals any human abilities is thinking like PETA. All animals are nothing more than a natural resource and should be treated as such.

Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: Rat Masterson] #6991941
09/16/20 09:39 AM
09/16/20 09:39 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,010
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
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Eastern Shore of Maryland
Originally Posted by Rat Masterson
Giving animals any human abilities is thinking like PETA. All animals are nothing more than a natural resource and should be treated as such.


Everybody wants their pets to be special. I think most will agree, the special is a projection.



-Goofy-
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: Rat Masterson] #6991947
09/16/20 09:51 AM
09/16/20 09:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 376
mo.
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nate Offline OP
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mo.
Originally Posted by Rat Masterson
Giving animals any human abilities is thinking like PETA. All animals are nothing more than a natural resource and should be treated as such.



Peta agenda is to take our rights they care less about animals.
My pup is not a natural resource she is used to catch out natural resources we use for food and clothing.
It's us trappers that love and protect our wildlife.

Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991950
09/16/20 09:55 AM
09/16/20 09:55 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 16,010
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
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HobbieTrapper  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
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Eastern Shore of Maryland
Originally Posted by nate
Originally Posted by Rat Masterson
Giving animals any human abilities is thinking like PETA. All animals are nothing more than a natural resource and should be treated as such.



Peta agenda is to take our rights they care less about animals.
My pup is not a natural resource she is used to catch out natural resources we use for food and clothing.
It's us trappers that love and protect our wildlife.



The Defense rest your Honor.



-Goofy-
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991963
09/16/20 10:10 AM
09/16/20 10:10 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 7,350
The Hill Country of Texas
Leftlane Offline
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And when they train themselves? Our definition of reasoning could vary a little bit I guess?


"Our nation is witnessing a merciless campaign to wipe out our history, defame our heroes, erase our values, and indoctrinate our children."
D. Trump
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991969
09/16/20 10:14 AM
09/16/20 10:14 AM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,152
Wyoming
C
cmcf Online content
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cmcf  Online Content
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Joined: Oct 2015
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Wyoming
Grandad had a mut that had a vocabulary of two or three hundred words. Understood not spoken, just for those with ancestors in Rio Linda.
He brought Grandad all kinds of things when asked to. Pipe, several different ones and styles, shoes, tobacco pouch, car keys, kids! Yep Grandad could name a child and Nick would find the kid and return with him or her, we had about forty acres to play in. It took Nick about twice being told to “Get the paper “ before he started watching for the paperboy. Grandmother would go out after dawn and unlatch the henhouse and after the chickens were out Nick would get his basket out of the pantry and go collect the eggs and bring them to the kitchen and put the basket on the table. This started after Grandmother let him carry the basket back to the house a couple of times.
Was Nick unique in the dog world? Not in my opinion, rare, yes. If you search famous dogs, there are a bunch of them that have done many amazing things that scientists are unable to explain. Somethings a child of eight or ten
probably couldn’t do. Things like traveling overland over two thousand miles to reunite with their families. Or picking the Kentucky Derby winner seven years in a row.
The “Faithful “ would protest “that is learned behavior “ or “that is cognitive behavior “. Me thinks they doth protest to much.
Mr. June I think your labeling Mr. Darwin’s studies a “ religion “ is beneath your intelligence and dignity. As always
JMO


Go as far as you can see, and you will see farther
Zig Ziglar
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: nate] #6991984
09/16/20 10:24 AM
09/16/20 10:24 AM
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Wyoming
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cmcf Online content
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Wyoming
And don’t even get me started on the two way conversations recorded between the gorilla and humans, or the bonobo chimp and humans. Conversation that is easily understood by Anyone fluent in American Sign Language.


Go as far as you can see, and you will see farther
Zig Ziglar
Re: Reaoning power of animals [Re: cmcf] #6991986
09/16/20 10:27 AM
09/16/20 10:27 AM
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Posts: 2,063
Northern Minnesota
BernieB. Offline
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Northern Minnesota
Originally Posted by cmcf
And don’t even get me started on the two way conversations recorded between the gorilla and humans, or the bonobo chimp and humans. Conversation that is easily understood by Anyone fluent in American Sign Language.


Once again, that's learned behavior. Cognition, not reasoning. You can teach a mina bird to ask for a cracker. You' can't teach a mina bird or any gorilla to solve a logic problem.

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