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Help with a scope choice. #7023242
10/21/20 12:24 PM
10/21/20 12:24 PM
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Oklahoma
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Matt28 Offline OP
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I am having a buddy build me a bolt gun. To make a long story short, it has a 20 moa rail and they don't make one that will fit thats less then that. So i bought a Vortex viper off midway and it doesn't have enough adjustment down to get it on at 100. I am new to all this so if any one has any advice on what scope to buy that will work on my set up I would be greatly appreciative. There is 1700 in the gun and already got the scope on top of that so kinda don't want to have to get a 1000 dollar scope for it.

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023247
10/21/20 12:34 PM
10/21/20 12:34 PM
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Golf ball Offline
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You didn’t say what you are having built or your intended target at what range. If your building a flat , long range shooter it may be as simple as sighting in at 200 yards and remembering your hold UNDER at a hundred .

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023250
10/21/20 12:37 PM
10/21/20 12:37 PM
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cmcf Offline
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Ditch the rail and install Redfeild “style “ bases preferably Leupold medium rings for up to forty mm objective bell
High for anything larger.
Reminds me of the kids where I went to school. They would lift their pickup 4” then wonder why the truck was eating U joints. Good luck!


Go as far as you can see, and you will see farther
Zig Ziglar
Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023264
10/21/20 12:50 PM
10/21/20 12:50 PM
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Matt28 Offline OP
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Its a 7mm-08 and may shot out to 500, 600 at the most. The thing is bottomed out and is about 8" high at 100. Be about right at 500.
I dont think I can ditch the rail. It came with the action i think. [Linked Image]

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023278
10/21/20 01:00 PM
10/21/20 01:00 PM
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grapestomper Offline
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Never seen a rail put on a gun like that.

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023280
10/21/20 01:02 PM
10/21/20 01:02 PM
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GREENCOUNTYPETE Offline
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first it seems very odd that a scope with 65moa of adjustment wouldn't be able to get a zero

is it a Remington pattern action ?

have you lapped the rings ? you could have a high spot

before you lap , have your reversed the rings back on front and front on back see if it changes your POI ?

shims in the rings to see if you can make it get a zero brass shim stock


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023282
10/21/20 01:04 PM
10/21/20 01:04 PM
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Golf ball Offline
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Would not have thought a good gun smith would have went that way . I believe I would be asking him about his choice !

If he put it on there he can take it off !

Last edited by Golf ball; 10/21/20 01:04 PM.
Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: grapestomper] #7023286
10/21/20 01:09 PM
10/21/20 01:09 PM
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GREENCOUNTYPETE Offline
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Originally Posted by grapestomper
Never seen a rail put on a gun like that.

the rail is very handy and quite common now it allows you to move the scope where it needs to be for you and removes a lot of the limitations of the traditional mounts for those of us who are not a traditional size or proportions.

since a scope mounted level 0moa would have 30ish moa above and below zero changing 20moa in the rail means you should have around 10moa below and 50 above

I like the EGW extended rails

this is a 20moa rail you can see the down angle of the rail since you shoot up through the line of sight the greater angle 1/3 of a degree

it is also possible to have a rail with 20 ,30 , or 40 moa and rings with built in 20moa putting you out of scope adjustment range
[Linked Image]

Last edited by GREENCOUNTYPETE; 10/21/20 01:14 PM.

America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023291
10/21/20 01:20 PM
10/21/20 01:20 PM
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there are some Remington pattern custom actions that have a integral rail machined in these may be the fix if you need to take out some of the angle getting you to 5moa or even zero https://www.natchezss.com/burris-st...fset-inserts-30mm-1-25-height-matte.html


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023300
10/21/20 01:33 PM
10/21/20 01:33 PM
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There a lot of 0 MOA rails available from a lot of different manufacturers. I personally have 20 MOA rails on two of my guns. A 300 WM with a 4-16 Nikon and a 338 WM with a 3-9 Leupold both of which are zeroed at 200. At one time I had them set at 100 and decided 200 worked better for a 0 to 300 yard shot, no hold over. The 300 is my long range toy. Use the range finder and dial it in. The 338 is one of my hunting rifles and I don't intend to exceed 300 yards. If needs be I get closer. It sounds very odd that you can't get zero at 100. What is the total adjustment range on your model scope and are you sure your rail is a 20 MOA.

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023305
10/21/20 01:48 PM
10/21/20 01:48 PM
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Matt28 Offline OP
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Its a big horn origin action and rem 700 foot print the rail came on it. The rings are lapped. It only had 30 moa of adjustment. I guess I will trade the viper and 600 for a razor if I can't figure this out. I didn't think about the rings being 20 moa also I will check that.
This guy is a friend from way back and is building the gun as a present for me he has 1700 in it and I have about 500. He isn't a master gun Smith. He just builds guns for him self. He feels bad about the scope he had me buy not working so he is going to trade me the razor if I want.

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023306
10/21/20 01:48 PM
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Based on the amount of wear on the bluing on the action VS the wear on the rail I would be surprised if the rail is integral to the action. If there are screws through the rail into the action it is a bolt on and can be removed very quickly. The screw holes are an industry standard spacing based on the action and bases will be available. This is not rocket science, even if some would like to believe it is.


Go as far as you can see, and you will see farther
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Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023313
10/21/20 01:59 PM
10/21/20 01:59 PM
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I bet $100 the rail is installed backwards. There is no freaking way you bottomed out that turret.

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023317
10/21/20 02:06 PM
10/21/20 02:06 PM
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Matt28 Offline OP
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[Linked Image]
These are the rings a bought.

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Raizmup] #7023319
10/21/20 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Raizmup
I bet $100 the rail is installed backwards. There is no freaking way you bottomed out that turret.

If it was backwards its would still be 20 moa in the other direction?

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023320
10/21/20 02:08 PM
10/21/20 02:08 PM
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I see the Big Horn actions pin the rail to the action plus the screws. After a little research I think your issue is with the scope. I'm not a Vortex fan but I did notice one of the Viper models only had 42 MOA total adjustment. Plus/minus 21 MOA is pretty useless if you ask me. Don't forget your load ballistics come into play, bullet weight and velocity are all part of the equation.

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023328
10/21/20 02:21 PM
10/21/20 02:21 PM
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junk sale it !!! I'll give you a hundred bucks

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Matt28] #7023333
10/21/20 02:26 PM
10/21/20 02:26 PM
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Burris make a set of rings with plastic inserts. 0-20 moa. you can mix and match the inserts to over come the rail difference.






Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Monster Toms] #7023335
10/21/20 02:33 PM
10/21/20 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Monster Toms
Burris make a set of rings with plastic inserts. 0-20 moa. you can mix and match the inserts to over come the rail difference.



Yes years ago a piece of a aluminium pop between the tube and ring solved this problem.

Re: Help with a scope choice. [Re: Paul D. Heppner] #7023340
10/21/20 02:44 PM
10/21/20 02:44 PM
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Matt28 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Paul D. Heppner
I see the Big Horn actions pin the rail to the action plus the screws. After a little research I think your issue is with the scope. I'm not a Vortex fan but I did notice one of the Viper models only had 42 MOA total adjustment. Plus/minus 21 MOA is pretty useless if you ask me. Don't forget your load ballistics come into play, bullet weight and velocity are all part of the equation.

Yes you are correct. I called the guy who made the actions and he said he has heard of this problem before. He said take the rail off and get 2 front rings for a rem 700 and it will take me back to zero moa. I have heard good about Vortex but this one has been trouble.

Last edited by Matt28; 10/21/20 02:44 PM.
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