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Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: wallfur] #7179350
02/12/21 02:34 PM
02/12/21 02:34 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
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Boco Offline
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Boco  Offline
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james bay frontierOnt.
Originally Posted by wallfur
great ideal boco i think i will do that when i get my money from NAFA...the western state auctions sales in usa have out preformed auction house as of late by far.

penny anti .
Read what Mark wrote again-there is a reason FHA is still going when many have folded,or come and gone like a flash in the pan.

Last edited by Boco; 02/12/21 02:36 PM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: wissmiss] #7179354
02/12/21 02:37 PM
02/12/21 02:37 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
trapper
Dirt  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
Originally Posted by wissmiss
Originally Posted by Dirt
Maybe there is a reason they don't do this, but instead of sitting around waiting for the Canadian government to let you run your business, move your sale a few hundred miles south into a country that will allow international travel. Bring the samples, ship the rest from Canada. AKA what they were doing in Helsinki.


Back in the day when Seattle Fur Exchange was in business, FHA partnered with them to have wild fur auctions in conjunction with the ranch mink auctions. Seemed to work out good for every one.

I know it was easier for me to go to Seattle (6 hour drive) than to go to North Bay (full day of travel going there).

Not sure where FHA would find a facility in the US that would accommodate them.


Stoughton Business park. smile

I also seem to remember NAFA had sale in NY back in the late 90's, maybe?


Who is John Galt?
Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Boco] #7179357
02/12/21 02:41 PM
02/12/21 02:41 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,445
idaho
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wallfur Offline
trapper
wallfur  Offline
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,445
idaho
Originally Posted by Boco
Originally Posted by wallfur
great ideal boco i think i will do that when i get my money from NAFA...the western state auctions sales in usa have out preformed auction house as of late by far.

penny anti .
Read what Mark wrote again-there is a reason FHA is still going when many have folded,or come and gone like a flash in the pan.
....dont speak to soon that could change quickly....lol

Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Boco] #7179362
02/12/21 02:42 PM
02/12/21 02:42 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
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Dirt  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
Originally Posted by Boco
Originally Posted by wallfur
great ideal boco i think i will do that when i get my money from NAFA...the western state auctions sales in usa have out preformed auction house as of late by far.

penny anti .
Read what Mark wrote again-there is a reason FHA is still going when many have folded,or come and gone like a flash in the pan.


The part where he was admitting Groeny was kickin his arse?


Who is John Galt?
Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179365
02/12/21 02:43 PM
02/12/21 02:43 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
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Boco Offline
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james bay frontierOnt.
Never seen Mark write that.
He did say that the carpetbaggers were trying to take advantage of the trappers though when Nafa folded.
You have to understand the History behind FHA to know why they exist-the support they have in Ontario and why they are so strong and solid financially even in fur market downturn.

Last edited by Boco; 02/12/21 02:46 PM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179370
02/12/21 02:48 PM
02/12/21 02:48 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
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wissmiss Offline
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wissmiss  Offline
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Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
Dirt - yup, NAFA had sales in New Jersey, in the late 80s or early 90s. Back then they had a presence in New York City. In the once big “fur district”.

Lots of things have changed since the first time I attended a Hudson Bay Company/NAFA Sale.


www.usedtraps.com

Please check out my updated inventory of Native American books.

Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Boco] #7179372
02/12/21 02:49 PM
02/12/21 02:49 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,454
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
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walleyed Offline
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walleyed  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,454
Henderson, N.Y. Jefferson Co.
Originally Posted by Boco
Never seen Mark write that.
He did say that the carpetbaggers were trying to take advantage of the trappers though when Nafa folded.
You have to understand the History behind FHA to know why they exist-the support they have in Ontario and why they are so strong and solid financially even in fur market downturn.


BOCO,

Don't feed the troll !!! LOL !!! laugh

w


"Provisional/Interim" member of NYS Trappers Association
Jefferson Co. Fur Harvesters

I Support Non-Resident Trapping



Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: wissmiss] #7179385
02/12/21 03:01 PM
02/12/21 03:01 PM
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 695
Ontario
S
Saskfly Offline OP
trapper
Saskfly  Offline OP
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Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 695
Ontario
Originally Posted by wissmiss
Originally Posted by Dirt
Maybe there is a reason they don't do this, but instead of sitting around waiting for the Canadian government to let you run your business, move your sale a few hundred miles south into a country that will allow international travel. Bring the samples, ship the rest from Canada. AKA what they were doing in Helsinki.


Back in the day when Seattle Fur Exchange was in business, FHA partnered with them to have wild fur auctions in conjunction with the ranch mink auctions. Seemed to work out good for every one.

I know it was easier for me to go to Seattle (6 hour drive) than to go to North Bay (full day of travel going there).

Not sure where FHA would find a facility in the US that would accommodate them.


The two upcoming auctions are being held in conjunction with American Mink exchange. Checked out the website and seems like an interesting group that is still owned in North America after NAFA and their umbrella of mink farms got sold overseas.

This has to be killing Mark Downey, the only auction left in North America that is internationally known and they cannot hold an in person auction. We can all argue who, how, where to sell but we all know that there is some truth in what the auction houses say, about them giving trappers an honest look at the market. Just costs us 11% commission to find it every auction!

Three or four state auctions need to get together and start something, we need more than one auction house in North America.

Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179386
02/12/21 03:03 PM
02/12/21 03:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 10,057
Marion Kansas
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Yes sir Offline
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Marion Kansas
Unless I missed something I dont understand the negative towards a company that's trying to bring value into the wild fur market and is taking the time to communicate with us trappers as to whats going on. If you prefer to do business with someone else I understand but why the negative towards FHA? The trapping industry benefits from there existence.

Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179387
02/12/21 03:06 PM
02/12/21 03:06 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,261
james bay frontierOnt.
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Boco Offline
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james bay frontierOnt.
Because its Canadian.


Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Yes sir] #7179388
02/12/21 03:09 PM
02/12/21 03:09 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 12,100
South Ga - Almost Florida
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Swamp Wolf Offline
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South Ga - Almost Florida
Originally Posted by Yes sir
Unless I missed something I dont understand the negative towards a company that's trying to bring value into the wild fur market and is taking the time to communicate with us trappers as to whats going on. If you prefer to do business with someone else I understand but why the negative towards FHA? The trapping industry benefits from there existence.

Best statement on this thread^^^&&


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Never Half-Arse Anything!

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Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179394
02/12/21 03:20 PM
02/12/21 03:20 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
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Dirt Offline
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Dirt  Offline
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Armpit, ak
I suggested they try something, instead waiting on the Canadian government. They told me buyers won't buy my product without seeing them. They need to figure out how to get buyers ( not agents) to a sale. A lot of these buyers are former NAFA buyers, they seem to be cautious in the switch. Smart ! IMHO.


Who is John Galt?
Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Swamp Wolf] #7179397
02/12/21 03:24 PM
02/12/21 03:24 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 2,707
The great cage state Colorado
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Monster Toms Offline
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The great cage state Colorado
Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
Originally Posted by Yes sir
Unless I missed something I dont understand the negative towards a company that's trying to bring value into the wild fur market and is taking the time to communicate with us trappers as to whats going on. If you prefer to do business with someone else I understand but why the negative towards FHA? The trapping industry benefits from there existence.

Best statement on this thread^^^&&


If they are trying so hard to communicate, why are they sending checks without telling the shippers what sold and at what price????






Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179400
02/12/21 03:29 PM
02/12/21 03:29 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,445
idaho
W
wallfur Offline
trapper
wallfur  Offline
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Posts: 1,445
idaho
exactly!!!

Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179429
02/12/21 04:13 PM
02/12/21 04:13 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
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The Beav Offline
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The Beav  Offline
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Wisconsin
Just once I would like to hear the Auction house tell It like It Is.

The fur market at this time Is In the crapper. But we are tying to do the best we can for our shippers.

Do the same buyers that buy at these country auctions also buy from Let's say FHA? If so and they are buying rats at a $3.00 average from these country auctions why would they pay more at FHA.


The forum Know It All according to Muskrat
Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179437
02/12/21 04:26 PM
02/12/21 04:26 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
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wissmiss Offline
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wissmiss  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
Country trapper sales and international fur auctions - basically 2 completely different buyer groups.

Years ago, the trapper sales in Oregon had an international buyer attend a sale on occasion. They didn’t like the way the sale was run and bought very little.

International auctions - graded lots

Country trapper sales - trapper lots.

That is the BIG difference. And it is an important difference!! Each way works for the intended buyer group. Don’t fix what isn’t broke.!!


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Please check out my updated inventory of Native American books.

Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179448
02/12/21 04:41 PM
02/12/21 04:41 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,797
Wisconsin
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The Beav Offline
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Wisconsin
Thanks for explaining the difference.

But If you can't cross the border you can't see the graded product you probably aren't going to buy. Would you buy any quantity of fur sight unseen?


The forum Know It All according to Muskrat
Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179457
02/12/21 04:52 PM
02/12/21 04:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
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wissmiss Offline
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Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
Depending on the species and grade and price, yes I would buy sight unseen. Here are some examples.

Badger - IIIs and IVs
Ermine - any grade
Skunks - first lot in any size
Otter - IIIs and IVs
Black beaver - first bundle in each size
Bears - anything that sells for under $60.00

to name a few. I’m sure there are others. I know those aren’t the better grades but that is still fur being sold without seeing it.

At the April 2020 sale, FHA had pictures posted on line for the buyer to see. Better goods in most species. All the goods in speciality items like wolverine and white fox. Pictures don’t show everything but along with the catalog description, it works for some buyers.


www.usedtraps.com

Please check out my updated inventory of Native American books.

Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179464
02/12/21 05:00 PM
02/12/21 05:00 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 524
Northern MN
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atrapper Offline
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Posts: 524
Northern MN
Last year at this time nobody could have predicted the situation this pandemic would put FHA in. I agree Beav that nobody in their right mind would pull the trigger and spend thousands on fur that they can't even see. That's putting a lot of trust in the graders of a company. All that said, I sure hope FHA can hang in there. We need more than one buyer in North America and right now there only appears to be two for the majority of trappers. What happens if FHA folds? Groney gets to run the show. Has anyone watched some of the videos Groney posts on FB? After gas, equipment costs, and time in the fur shed, people are literally paying him to take their fur for $4 averages on coon, $10 averages on coyotes, $2 averages on rats, $8 averages on otters, and $2 for skunks. It's a shame. I'm always amazed that people don't pull their fur. So what if FHA folds? Now Groney can cut those prices in half and guys have no choice but to start their own small fur business or niche markets or dump fur to him for pennies. This really puts a squeeze on the weekend warrior trapper and young trappers that may not put up enough fur each year to justify shipping and commission costs with FHA. We need more buyers. The few country buyers that are left are fighting tooth and nail to hang in there to prevent a monopoly on the fur market.

Re: FHA Press release 2021 Market [Re: Saskfly] #7179489
02/12/21 05:29 PM
02/12/21 05:29 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,293
East-Central Wisconsin
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bblwi Offline
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East-Central Wisconsin
Canada has lost fur buying firms just like we have. One now not so long ago 8 major firms and plenty of smaller out lets I am sure. I do give the FHA and its former organizers credit for staying the course and being willing to offer options and outlets for wild fur harvesters. We are fortunate in the Mid West to have two major private firms that deal with a lot of fur annually and having a viable FHA international firm collecting fur in our area is a benefit as well. We do have a few other firms that we can utilize as well. When, and if we see a fur demand increase in species we have here, coon, rats, beavers, reds and marginal yotes then having the international auction will be a good thing. I constantly read where many suspect and actually don't believe what the auction houses state or how they grade etc. I feel that those remarks are not always and in most cases rarely justified. It is good you like your markets and the prices you receive without much explanation or discussion. I sold most fur locally this season and to me it was a good option. I have fur to sell at the auction in April. The one thing I valued the most about the auctions were learning a lot more about grading, color, how damage was assessed and to some extent what was creating the damage, me or other causes. We all talk about selling fully prime and full value fur, but when one reviews the accounts and records one finds that nationwide very little fur is ever sold at prime or full value, at least wild fur. How much and to what extent one gets docked for lower grades, damage, size and color usually determines for me where the better averages come from.

Bryce

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