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Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7240943
04/11/21 06:30 PM
04/11/21 06:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
W
wissmiss Offline
trapper
wissmiss  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
Yes. My comments all are in reference. FHA operates in a similar fashion. Often times, FH will announce there will be no PT sales. Either buy it in the room or go without. I usually do most of my FH buying in the room. On the items I buy, there isn’t much left by the time the pages getnto the PT room.

At the FHA sale in April 2020, I did put together a couple of deals after the auction ended.


www.usedtraps.com

Please check out my updated inventory of Native American books.

Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: wissmiss] #7241041
04/11/21 08:38 PM
04/11/21 08:38 PM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,971
WI
N
nimzy Offline
trapper
nimzy  Offline
trapper
N

Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,971
WI
Originally Posted by wissmiss
The commissions and fees were the same whether it sold in the room or PT. Exact same structure.

The starting price in the PT room depended on how that species did in the auction room.

If that species sold very well in the room, the PT price would be 10% above Hammer price. No wiggle room.

If the species sold ok in the room, the PT price would start at 10% above. They might settle for hammer price, especially if you wanted a lot of skins.

If the species struggled in the auction room, they would try for hammer price and probably hold at that level. If the buyer was talking large numbers, there was some negotiating room.

I’ve been going to international auctions since 1984. There has been only one case in all those years when the PT room was a free for all. The year was probably the late 1980s. The species was bears. The magic number was $3.00. It was either yes or no on my part. There were some bears that I declined to buy at that price.

Note - on those bears, this was when you could sell any bear, even partial hides in Ontario. Now the hide has to have 20 claws to be legal to sell. I don’t recall the last time a bear sold for less than $20.00.

Except for that one time, I don’t remember ever getting a smoking good deal in the PT room. Deals, yes. But no barn burner, get filthy rich deals.



You must not be out of the loop then.. Lol.

Thanks for the hands on clarity. Over the years I have made it to 2 sales one in Seattle the other Toronto I was very impressed with both operations.

Do you ever get frustrated with the rumor mill?

Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241074
04/11/21 09:07 PM
04/11/21 09:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,088
Cheyenne Wyoming
C
Castormound Offline
trapper
Castormound  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,088
Cheyenne Wyoming
Something I've never seen before. Looks like the 9 cats I sent in for this sale are already marked "held for next sale" Anyone have any insight on that?


Antelope, the original fast food!!
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: wissmiss] #7241079
04/11/21 09:11 PM
04/11/21 09:11 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,635
Pottawatamie co. IA
LLtrapper Offline
"The Coon Combine"
LLtrapper  Offline
"The Coon Combine"

Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,635
Pottawatamie co. IA
Originally Posted by wissmiss
Yes. My comments all are in reference. FHA operates in a similar fashion. Often times, FH will announce there will be no PT sales. Either buy it in the room or go without. I usually do most of my FH buying in the room. On the items I buy, there isn’t much left by the time the pages getnto the PT room.

At the FHA sale in April 2020, I did put together a couple of deals after the auction ended.


What changed on the PT room because that is not how it works now. What they sold coon for was not even close to the valuations they had on them. LLL


Isaiah 51:6 But my salvation will last forever, my righteousness will never fail.
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: Castormound] #7241084
04/11/21 09:18 PM
04/11/21 09:18 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
W
wissmiss Offline
trapper
wissmiss  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
Originally Posted by Castormound
Something I've never seen before. Looks like the 9 cats I sent in for this sale are already marked "held for next sale" Anyone have any insight on that?


Just my opinion. Perhaps they arrived too late to be included in this auction. Or they didn’t have enough cats from your section to put up a good collection and they were/are hoping to have available for the next auction. Just an educated opinion.


www.usedtraps.com

Please check out my updated inventory of Native American books.

Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: nimzy] #7241091
04/11/21 09:23 PM
04/11/21 09:23 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,421
mn north of blakely
S
Steven 49er Offline
trapper
Steven 49er  Offline
trapper
S

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 10,421
mn north of blakely
Originally Posted by nimzy
Originally Posted by wissmiss
The commissions and fees were the same whether it sold in the room or PT. Exact same structure.

The starting price in the PT room depended on how that species did in the auction room.

If that species sold very well in the room, the PT price would be 10% above Hammer price. No wiggle room.

If the species sold ok in the room, the PT price would start at 10% above. They might settle for hammer price, especially if you wanted a lot of skins.

If the species struggled in the auction room, they would try for hammer price and probably hold at that level. If the buyer was talking large numbers, there was some negotiating room.

I’ve been going to international auctions since 1984. There has been only one case in all those years when the PT room was a free for all. The year was probably the late 1980s. The species was bears. The magic number was $3.00. It was either yes or no on my part. There were some bears that I declined to buy at that price.

Note - on those bears, this was when you could sell any bear, even partial hides in Ontario. Now the hide has to have 20 claws to be legal to sell. I don’t recall the last time a bear sold for less than $20.00.

Except for that one time, I don’t remember ever getting a smoking good deal in the PT room. Deals, yes. But no barn burner, get filthy rich deals.



You must not be out of the loop then.. Lol.

Thanks for the hands on clarity. Over the years I have made it to 2 sales one in Seattle the other Toronto I was very impressed with both operations.

Do you ever get frustrated with the rumor mill?



One trip I will always be glad I made is a NAFA sale in Toronto, hopefully Canada opens back up and I can go to a FHA sale or the FHA convention.


"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241127
04/11/21 09:55 PM
04/11/21 09:55 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,265
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
trapper
Boco  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,265
james bay frontierOnt.
2nd year now no convention-bummer.
Been going every year since it was OTA.
Lots of friends there.

Last edited by Boco; 04/11/21 09:57 PM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: wissmiss] #7241132
04/11/21 09:59 PM
04/11/21 09:59 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,088
Cheyenne Wyoming
C
Castormound Offline
trapper
Castormound  Offline
trapper
C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,088
Cheyenne Wyoming
They were there in time as all my other fur is posted. My hunch is maybe they were holding the fresh cats until they can get the buyers in person. No worries on my part, just found it unusual.


Antelope, the original fast food!!
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: Boco] #7241140
04/11/21 10:08 PM
04/11/21 10:08 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
trapper
Dirt  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
Originally Posted by Boco
2nd year now no convention-bummer.
Been going every year since it was OTA.
Lots of friends there.


True , your partys have always been important to me. crazy

Last edited by Dirt; 04/11/21 10:15 PM.

Who is John Galt?
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241142
04/11/21 10:10 PM
04/11/21 10:10 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,265
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
trapper
Boco  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,265
james bay frontierOnt.
Me too,good to get to know new people and meet up with old buddys.
Lots of stuff goes on besides the partying.Always good to talk to the graders over the weekend.
I met a few guys from the forum here at the convention.
And my good buddy,Robert Stitt, trapping in the Yukon now, comes down,great to see him.

Last edited by Boco; 04/11/21 10:15 PM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241170
04/11/21 10:34 PM
04/11/21 10:34 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
trapper
Dirt  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
All those things that happened to you really were good for me too. smile


Who is John Galt?
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241174
04/11/21 10:37 PM
04/11/21 10:37 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,265
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Offline
trapper
Boco  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 45,265
james bay frontierOnt.
Dont understand your point-have you ever attended?


Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: Castormound] #7241227
04/12/21 01:33 AM
04/12/21 01:33 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
W
wissmiss Offline
trapper
wissmiss  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,681
north Idaho
Originally Posted by Castormound
They were there in time as all my other fur is posted. My hunch is maybe they were holding the fresh cats until they can get the buyers in person. No worries on my part, just found it unusual.


Your hunch is probably correct. The last receiving date for the April sale was the middle of January. Many of the better western cats are still walking around then. Or they are in freezers waiting to be put up.

By the last receiving date for the July sale (middle of April), cat seasons are closed and trappers have their fur put up and ready to sell/ship.

When you check out how cats sell in April, don’t be too concerned if they don’t do well. Much og the collection is probably held over goods or dealer lots. I think the cat offering will be much better at the July sale.


www.usedtraps.com

Please check out my updated inventory of Native American books.

Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241293
04/12/21 07:45 AM
04/12/21 07:45 AM
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,971
WI
N
nimzy Offline
trapper
nimzy  Offline
trapper
N

Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,971
WI
Easy for you to say.

It seems this is a critical sale for FHA. Shipper confidence is extremely low. The timing of the latest internal news (which sounds like it occurred in September) is horrible. The accusations flying are serious. And the death sentence (bankruptcy) handed down to the competition is looming. If they fail to motivate buyers they will likely be crucified. Are fur auctions following the path of the buggy whip?

Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241306
04/12/21 08:21 AM
04/12/21 08:21 AM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,635
Pottawatamie co. IA
LLtrapper Offline
"The Coon Combine"
LLtrapper  Offline
"The Coon Combine"

Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,635
Pottawatamie co. IA
Nimzy WissMiss is a buyer. She benefits from the way these people operate by her own admission. If I am not mistaken she has relation that works there. Those folks are not making the decisions however. It is the president. Watch for the golden parachutes to come out any time now. If they cannot get this right, which I doubt they can because of Canadian fear of foreign travel and other things, it will be there Waterloo. LLL


Isaiah 51:6 But my salvation will last forever, my righteousness will never fail.
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241332
04/12/21 09:02 AM
04/12/21 09:02 AM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 359
Iowa
J
Joe1 Offline
trapper
Joe1  Offline
trapper
J

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 359
Iowa
wissmiss things change every auction you talk about what happened in the past you talk about the pt sells according to the bids they receive in the auction room how about the thousands of furs that dont even get a bid in the room and yes theres been a lot of sales that never even came close to the evaluations ive often wondered why they even bother with them talk about a waist of time

Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: Joe1] #7241425
04/12/21 11:24 AM
04/12/21 11:24 AM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,211
Co.-Wy. part time AK.
W
wy.wolfer Offline
trapper
wy.wolfer  Offline
trapper
W

Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,211
Co.-Wy. part time AK.
Originally Posted by Joe1
wissmiss things change every auction you talk about what happened in the past you talk about the pt sells according to the bids they receive in the auction room how about the thousands of furs that dont even get a bid in the room and yes theres been a lot of sales that never even came close to the evaluations ive often wondered why they even bother with them talk about a waist of time

This is called the "Dunning-Kruger effect".

Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241442
04/12/21 12:05 PM
04/12/21 12:05 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,997
Oregon
beaverpeeler Offline
trapper
beaverpeeler  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,997
Oregon
The only thing we have to fear....is fear itself.

Nafa overextended itself catering to the ranch mink industry. FHA has been much more conservative and doesn't have much outstanding debt if any. They'll pull thorough this fur slump.


My fear of moving stairs is escalating!
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: ponyboy] #7241482
04/12/21 01:03 PM
04/12/21 01:03 PM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
D
Dirt Offline
trapper
Dirt  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,135
Armpit, ak
Monitors report April 5,2021

I guess you can't loan money to mink farmers and then sell their product below production costs. The farmers can't pay you back if you loaned them more than the mink are worth. Pure genius!

Weird thing is NAFA has mink at AME selling with FHA.

Last edited by Dirt; 04/12/21 01:05 PM.

Who is John Galt?
Re: FURHARVESTERS [Re: Dirt] #7241634
04/12/21 05:25 PM
04/12/21 05:25 PM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,121
sseMinnesota
blackhammer Offline
trapper
blackhammer  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,121
sseMinnesota
Becoming an bank and terrible decisions by Jansen as president broke them. He got out with a chunk of money before the cops got there many speculate They should be still business probably smaller but greed destroyed themq


Ah,for the life of a millionaire,say some,but just let me stay a trapper. Bill Nelson
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