Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: Grandpa Trapper]
#7280043
06/05/21 02:22 PM
06/05/21 02:22 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,763 Beatrice, NE
loosegoose
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,763
Beatrice, NE
|
So it sounds many believe if you are horrible person but have faith you will get to heaven faster than a person who is really a good person here on earth but doesn’t have faith. Didn’t many of the mafia figures of yore that killed people have faith in God. I know several that donated large sums of money to the Catholic Church when I grew up in Pittsburgh. Terrorists have faith that their god exists but kill people. If you can earn your salvation by your good works, then God owes you something.....your salvation. God owes nobody anything. Further, if you could earn your salvation by your good works, there was no need for Jesus to die on the cross.
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: James]
#7280070
06/05/21 03:01 PM
06/05/21 03:01 PM
|
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,899 American In the Pyrenees; Fran...
swift4me
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,899
American In the Pyrenees; Fran...
|
Sorry, but after 4 pages of this I have to throw in.
For me, after 18 years being raised as a Catholic, but never really adhering, I kept the big message of doing the right things all of my life. 40 years later, with my brother who had turned deep baptist because of his wife... who was born lutheran but chose to be baptist, I learned that my mother, my father and every person I respected that we knew in common would burn in He!! because we hadn't fully accepted the body of Christ.
I told my brother that I would rather take my chances with the people I respected in the fires below than spend a promised eternity with them, who had traded a life with the unworthy on earth for an eternal promise..
There are thousands of religions on the planet, each one which thinks they have the right idea, yet nobody talks about that... only that their's is the ONE. My brother lives in a town with 6 baptist churches and he goes to the one that is the furthest away because the message is stronger.
I respect people based upon how they treat others, regardless of money, race or religion, and I have great respect for people who do the right things every day. I grew up surrounded by self proclaimed Christians who flew the bird at somebody in the parking lot getting out of church.
Just my take on it. I live my life every day on earth as if it was my last and always try to do right by others, and I'll take my chances after that.
Pete
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: swift4me]
#7280072
06/05/21 03:09 PM
06/05/21 03:09 PM
|
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 15,628 Champaign County, Ohio.
KeithC
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 15,628
Champaign County, Ohio.
|
Sorry, but after 4 pages of this I have to throw in.
For me, after 18 years being raised as a Catholic, but never really adhering, I kept the big message of doing the right things all of my life. 40 years later, with my brother who had turned deep baptist because of his wife... who was born lutheran but chose to be baptist, I learned that my mother, my father and every person I respected that we knew in common would burn in He!! because we hadn't fully accepted the body of Christ.
I told my brother that I would rather take my chances with the people I respected in the fires below than spend a promised eternity with them, who had traded a life with the unworthy on earth for an eternal promise..
There are thousands of religions on the planet, each one which thinks they have the right idea, yet nobody talks about that... only that their's is the ONE. My brother lives in a town with 6 baptist churches and he goes to the one that is the furthest away because the message is stronger.
I respect people based upon how they treat others, regardless of money, race or religion, and I have great respect for people who do the right things every day. I grew up surrounded by self proclaimed Christians who flew the bird at somebody in the parking lot getting out of church.
Just my take on it. I live my life every day on earth as if it was my last and always try to do right by others, and I'll take my chances after that.
Pete Pete nailed it. Keith
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: Foxpaw]
#7280121
06/05/21 04:10 PM
06/05/21 04:10 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,936 2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,936
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
|
Not all Baptist are created equal.
One group believes anything goes and nothing you do can get you kicked out. But on their wall they have some kind of pledge saying you will never touch any form of alcohol. They teach Jesus made grape juice and not wine. Yet if you are chosen you can not fall. Seems to me that the ones that wrote up their handbook may have been a little tipsy when they wrote it. And, I am not disparaging all Baptists and Nazarenes. I am disparaging all prosperity gospel kooks. Basically, if you are a bad person, think that Jesus will make you rich or have a Christian fish or bible verse on your business card, website or other marketing materials, we are not doing business or becoming friends. I prefer Christians that live like Christ would approve.
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: James]
#7280142
06/05/21 04:56 PM
06/05/21 04:56 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 5,214 Crivitz WI
Sprung & Rusty
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 5,214
Crivitz WI
|
Don't you think if God created us, he will take us back unless we choose not to go?
No Jab.
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: James]
#7280167
06/05/21 05:22 PM
06/05/21 05:22 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 2,535 NW Illinois
Kevin Stake
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 2,535
NW Illinois
|
If you truly except Jesus Christ as your savior. You will change the way you talk, think, and treat people. Yes we will sin til the day we die. You also have to ask for forgiveness to Jesus when you do sin. Your old self is gone. You have to die of your old ways to truly live. The Bible is the word, the word is the truth. It’s your choice whether you expect Jesus Christ or not.
It is more blessed to give than to receive
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: Kevin Stake]
#7280181
06/05/21 06:02 PM
06/05/21 06:02 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,252 Maine, Aroostook
Posco
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,252
Maine, Aroostook
|
If you truly except Jesus Christ as your savior. You will change the way you talk, think, and treat people. Yes we will sin til the day we die. You also have to ask for forgiveness to Jesus when you do sin. Your old self is gone. You have to die of your old ways to truly live. The Bible is the word, the word is the truth. It’s your choice whether you expect Jesus Christ or not. Yes.
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: James]
#7280191
06/05/21 06:12 PM
06/05/21 06:12 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,328 The Hill Country of Texas
Leftlane
"HOSS"
|
"HOSS"
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,328
The Hill Country of Texas
|
If someone were truly agnostic why would they care about your answer? Ask yourself that one.
“What’s good for me may not be good for the weak minded.” Captain Gus McCrae- Texas Rangers
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: Leftlane]
#7280209
06/05/21 06:24 PM
06/05/21 06:24 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,694 nm
adam m
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 25,694
nm
|
If someone were truly agnostic why would they care about your answer? Ask yourself that one. I have numerous times over the years and my conclusion is some are genuinely interested but for whatever reason they are skeptical. I've known a few agnostics who became Christians
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: Leftlane]
#7280217
06/05/21 06:30 PM
06/05/21 06:30 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,936 2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,936
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
|
If someone were truly agnostic why would they care about your answer? Ask yourself that one. I think it is fair for James to ask these questions. Isn't answering those questions part of spreading the word?
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: James]
#7280227
06/05/21 06:42 PM
06/05/21 06:42 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,650 Southeast Ohio
amspoker
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 3,650
Southeast Ohio
|
You aren't the first "lawyer" to ask that question James. Here ya go..
25And behold, a certain lawyer stood up and tested Him, saying, “Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?”
26He said to him, “What is written in the law? What is your reading of it?”
27So he answered and said, “ ‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your strength, and with all your mind,’ and ‘your neighbor as yourself.’ ”
28And He said to him, “You have answered rightly; do this and you will live.”
29But he, wanting to justify himself, said to Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”
30Then Jesus answered and said: “A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among [i]thieves, who stripped him of his clothing, wounded him, and departed, leaving him half dead. 31Now by chance a certain priest came down that road. And when he saw him, he passed by on the other side. 32Likewise a Levite, when he arrived at the place, came and looked, and passed by on the other side. 33But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was. And when he saw him, he had compassion. 34So he went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine; and he set him on his own animal, brought him to an inn, and took care of him. 35On the next day, when he departed, he took out two denarii, gave them to the innkeeper, and said to him, ‘Take care of him; and whatever more you spend, when I come again, I will repay you.’ 36So which of these three do you think was neighbor to him who fell among the thieves?”
37And he said, “He who showed mercy on him.”
Then Jesus said to him, “Go and do likewise.”
Levi
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: Blaine County]
#7280238
06/05/21 07:15 PM
06/05/21 07:15 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,328 The Hill Country of Texas
Leftlane
"HOSS"
|
"HOSS"
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 20,328
The Hill Country of Texas
|
If someone were truly agnostic why would they care about your answer? Ask yourself that one. I think it is fair for James to ask these questions. Isn't answering those questions part of spreading the word? That is my hope I guess (that he isn't 100% on the agnostic thing) but the other answer is he just wants to troll us
“What’s good for me may not be good for the weak minded.” Captain Gus McCrae- Texas Rangers
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: Leftlane]
#7280259
06/05/21 07:35 PM
06/05/21 07:35 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,936 2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
Blaine County
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,936
2A Sanctuaries-W. OK & N. NM
|
That is my hope I guess (that he isn't 100% on the agnostic thing) but the other answer is he just wants to troll us
That wasn't the vibe I got. I'm a lapsed Catholic that enjoys reading Mark's posts (although we never learned most of that ). I like reading those of others too (I liked AM's above). I struggle with the "lapsed" part and it's probably just a matter of priorities, by the way. I think his question was sincere. And, it's been a good mostly civil discussion.
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: James]
#7280363
06/05/21 09:39 PM
06/05/21 09:39 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,497 PA
PAskinner
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,497
PA
|
On another thread Loosegoose posted, "Christ is king, salvation comes through faith and not works, and we can all agree on that." I didn't want to derail that thread, so am starting this one.
Is LG right? I think not. I'm now an agnostic, but was raised in the Roman Catholic Church, and that's not what the Church teaches. Good works do count (but not without faith).
The salvation-through-faith-alone belief is a license to do anything. You can do anything at all, if you believe Christ died for your sins 2000 years ago.
I'm curious how many individuals believe in faith alone. Do you ignore good works? If not, what role do you believe good works in this life will have on your afterlife?
Jim
The Catholic church does mix faith and works. That's what the reformation was resisting against. The CC had people buying indulgences to get their kinfolk out of purgatory. Totally unbiblical. Of course faith will produce works, but works do not save anyone.
Right now I’m having amnesia and déjà vu at the same time. I think I’ve forgotten this before.
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: white marlin]
#7280364
06/05/21 09:39 PM
06/05/21 09:39 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,252 Maine, Aroostook
Posco
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,252
Maine, Aroostook
|
once again, James sneaks in, drops a turd and then vacates the discussion he started. I noticed that and expected he would but as someone mentioned above, it's something many of us like to discuss anyway.
|
|
|
Re: Cristians: Do good works matter?
[Re: whiteotter55]
#7280372
06/05/21 09:48 PM
06/05/21 09:48 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,252 Maine, Aroostook
Posco
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,252
Maine, Aroostook
|
God loves us so much he had Jesus die for our sins. We do good works because we love him. Good works do not help us get to heaven, we get there by grace alone. WE aiso do good works to show non believers what God's love has done in our lives. Yes.
|
|
|
|
|