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Re: Ethics Question [Re: Getting There] #7314306
07/26/21 02:05 PM
07/26/21 02:05 PM
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 2,440
Southern Illinois
F
Foxpaw Offline
trapper
Foxpaw  Offline
trapper
F

Joined: May 2016
Posts: 2,440
Southern Illinois
Originally Posted by Getting There
I think it is odd, the people that make the big bucks very seldom set a trap. They just keep putting more regulation on trappers.
The are your DNR. They want more deer to get more money but if you hit one with a car they no longer have any interest in them.
In Michigan I would say at least 45% of all auto repairs are do to hitting deer. Around 50,000 a year.


And who feeds those deer for "free" I guess ?

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314308
07/26/21 02:06 PM
07/26/21 02:06 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,391
Juneau, Alaska
M
mad_mike Offline
trapper
mad_mike  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,391
Juneau, Alaska
There are no free rides in life. Someone always pays.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314309
07/26/21 02:08 PM
07/26/21 02:08 PM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 392
Southern Indiana
H
Hoosier71 Offline
trapper
Hoosier71  Offline
trapper
H

Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 392
Southern Indiana
Pretty clear to me you weren't looking for a cheer section. I get what you are saying. If we say trapping is a management tool and animals suffer WITHOUT trapping, then should we not feel obligated to trap whether or not there is a paycheck? Interesting question.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314310
07/26/21 02:09 PM
07/26/21 02:09 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 451
Northern MN
A
atrapper Offline
trapper
atrapper  Offline
trapper
A

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 451
Northern MN
I think trapping can absolutely be used as a population dynamics tool. Just ask Delta Waterfowl. That said, an individual trapper can do very little to effect animal populations in a broad area in my opinion. Some animals, like muskrats are near impossible to trap out. Others like coyotes you can maybe trap out of a few sections but in all cases, with favorable habitat and adequate food, new animals will always move in. Iíve always liked to believe that I was somehow doing my part in helping animal populations but as others have said, itís really the big guy upstairs that controls the variables that dictate animal populations. Not me. So, from an ethical standpoint what I personally do doesnít ethically mean much to nature but if it gives me joy and makes me (and land owners) happy then I guess itís ethically important to humanity.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Foxpaw] #7314311
07/26/21 02:09 PM
07/26/21 02:09 PM
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 2,440
Southern Illinois
F
Foxpaw Offline
trapper
Foxpaw  Offline
trapper
F

Joined: May 2016
Posts: 2,440
Southern Illinois
Originally Posted by Foxpaw
Originally Posted by Getting There
I think it is odd, the people that make the big bucks very seldom set a trap. They just keep putting more regulation on trappers.
The are your DNR. They want more deer to get more money but if you hit one with a car they no longer have any interest in them.
In Michigan I would say at least 45% of all auto repairs are do to hitting deer. Around 50,000 a year.


And who feeds those deer for "free" I guess ?


My crystal ball says CRP is in the mix.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314315
07/26/21 02:14 PM
07/26/21 02:14 PM
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 730
Missouri
H
HayDay Offline
trapper
HayDay  Offline
trapper
H

Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 730
Missouri
Does a guy with traps have an ethical obligation to use them? No.

Society and the resource benefits when he does, but that is up to him. The ethical argument applies that the opportunity to use them remain, as again there are benefits when he does. But it's not mandatory.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: mad_mike] #7314321
07/26/21 02:22 PM
07/26/21 02:22 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 12,846
pa
H
hippie Offline
trapper
hippie  Offline
trapper
H

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 12,846
pa


You might get pleasure, or "satisfaction" as your dictionary explains it, but I don't see that as the "reason" I take an animals life if by hunting or trapping.

To each his own I guess in today's world tho.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314324
07/26/21 02:25 PM
07/26/21 02:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 5,394
Marion Kansas
Y
Yes sir Offline
trapper
Yes sir  Offline
trapper
Y

Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 5,394
Marion Kansas
I understand your point and have pondered it myself. I think some trappers are getting a benefit confused as the motivation. I believe the large majority trap for the $ or the recreational side of it and the benefit to nature is a benefit of it. And I worry that if we try to build are defensive on a falsehood it could hurt us in the long run. Most trappers don't know the animal #s close enough to make a management decision. And don't know what a target population # would be for there area.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314326
07/26/21 02:27 PM
07/26/21 02:27 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,966
Wisconsin
T
The Beav Offline
trapper
The Beav  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,966
Wisconsin
Our WI coyotes suck but I love to trap them so I will just keep doing It. And the only rats I have caught In the last few years are those I'm getting paid to catch.


The forum Know It All according to Muskrat
Re: Ethics Question [Re: hippie] #7314328
07/26/21 02:28 PM
07/26/21 02:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,391
Juneau, Alaska
M
mad_mike Offline
trapper
mad_mike  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,391
Juneau, Alaska
Originally Posted by hippie


You might get pleasure, or "satisfaction" as your dictionary explains it, but I don't see that as the "reason" I take an animals life if by hunting or trapping.

To each his own I guess in today's world tho.


Sounds more like ďmoralsĒ vs. ďethicsĒ.

I do enjoy killing animals. Make no mistake about it. Fur, food, or fun.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314340
07/26/21 02:47 PM
07/26/21 02:47 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,650
East-Central Wisconsin
B
bblwi Offline
trapper
bblwi  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 8,650
East-Central Wisconsin
Most if not all trapping organizations use the wildlife management factor for defending our right to trap and control animal species to prevent the extinction of prey species, minimize disease and offer a harvest option during a time of year when the harvested animals have value and this is for the most part done at a minimal to very low cost to citizens and taxpayers. Now from my perspective that is the statements we use to continue to work with our wildlife biologists and managers and to keep the AR organizations somewhat at bay. When we walk through the gate of the organizations and look at where the rubber meets the road we as individual trappers for the most part do lip service to those ideals and do what we want when we want and then complain about how others impact our heritage and have to subject ourselves to numerous regulations and rules. If even half the the members on this forum trapped their lines with few weeks of high intensity the number of animals removed would not impact the overall numbers enough to change the population overall. Why then are we not seeing 5 fold the numbers of animals we did 5 years ago (coon as an example)? Mother nature will answer the bell if we don't and landowners, home owners, farmers etc. develop their own harvest procedures when trappers can not be counted on to fulfill the need. We are lucky that antis continue to use the scare and shame aspect of trapping being barbaric and obsolete etc. and that their efforts are targeted toward the ignorant that have money. Any educated US citizen that can read the reports on fur harvest sales by state can easily see when trappers slack off and let the traps hang in the shed.

Bryce

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314341
07/26/21 02:48 PM
07/26/21 02:48 PM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 976
el vado, nm
T
Tom Fisher Offline
trapper
Tom Fisher  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 976
el vado, nm
It's overthunk, I can't not trap!----It's a good time to be a trapper!

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Tom Fisher] #7314342
07/26/21 02:52 PM
07/26/21 02:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,391
Juneau, Alaska
M
mad_mike Offline
trapper
mad_mike  Offline
trapper
M

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,391
Juneau, Alaska
Originally Posted by Tom Fisher
It's overthunk, I can't not trap!----It's a good time to be a trapper!

Exactly. Sit there and think about why or why not? Get out there and trap. Kill, eat, and donít be a Mary.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314348
07/26/21 03:00 PM
07/26/21 03:00 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,615
Tug Hill, NY
Redknot Offline
trapper
Redknot  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,615
Tug Hill, NY
Originally Posted by Blaine County
Originally Posted by Redknot
My thoughts?

You need to spend less time on your tractor!


Tractor time is good for the brain. I zone out and come up with some of my best ideas (or most obscure questions)!


When I zone out in the tractor my rows start to get very wavey!! Really unfortunate when cultivating!!


~Illegitimi Non Carborundum~
Re: Ethics Question [Re: mad_mike] #7314356
07/26/21 03:07 PM
07/26/21 03:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 4,906
Wi.
D
Diggerman Offline
trapper
Diggerman  Offline
trapper
D

Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 4,906
Wi.
Originally Posted by mad_mike
Got it BC. Still clear as mud

take a deep breath, open your mind just a little, His question is a good one.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314378
07/26/21 03:53 PM
07/26/21 03:53 PM
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 2,495
W NY
Turtledale Offline
trapper
Turtledale  Offline
trapper

Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 2,495
W NY
Without us trapping mother nature will take it's course, whatever that will be. With us we trapping and shooting we will manage the land to the resources we see fit and try to manipulate to what we think is correct.
So no just because we trap it doesn't mean we should no matter what. Who are we to play God. I would think without out our intervention the land would return to what it should be after disease, survival of the fittest etc. takes hold
All that said I will trap every year to some extent because I love doing it and don't waste what I've taken. There is pleasure involved and I see nothing wrong with that
I also hunt and fish for meat and take great pleasure in doing so.


NYSTA, NTA, FTA, life member Catt.county trappers
Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314393
07/26/21 04:16 PM
07/26/21 04:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,864
Northern Nevada, 31 yrs old
B
Bob Offline
trapper
Bob  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,864
Northern Nevada, 31 yrs old
If we call ourselves conservationists then we have the ethical duty to do what needs to be done for the health of the overall ecosystem. Sometimes that means trapping/hunting a certain species that is booming, and sometimes that means letting your traps collect dust to allow a species to come back. Sometimes that means feeding deer and elk after a dry summer followed by a very cold and snowy winter. Sometimes it means installing guzzlers in strategic places during a drought.

Trapping is a tool to use for the betterment of the overall ecosystem. Wether or not we are ethically obligated to use it is very situational.


"I have two guns, one for each of ya."
Re: Ethics Question [Re: Turtledale] #7314394
07/26/21 04:21 PM
07/26/21 04:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,864
Northern Nevada, 31 yrs old
B
Bob Offline
trapper
Bob  Offline
trapper
B

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,864
Northern Nevada, 31 yrs old
Originally Posted by Turtledale
Without us trapping mother nature will take it's course, whatever that will be. With us we trapping and shooting we will manage the land to the resources we see fit and try to manipulate to what we think is correct.
So no just because we trap it doesn't mean we should no matter what. Who are we to play God. I would think without out our intervention the land would return to what it should be after disease, survival of the fittest etc. takes hold
All that said I will trap every year to some extent because I love doing it and don't waste what I've taken. There is pleasure involved and I see nothing wrong with that
I also hunt and fish for meat and take great pleasure in doing so.


We donít play God when we intervene in nature. He gave us dominion over all the creatures on earth. What that means to me is in order to honor God we must care for the ecosystem and be a part of it. He gave us the animals to use the animals as we see fit, but also the responsibility to care for His creation.


"I have two guns, one for each of ya."
Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314397
07/26/21 04:27 PM
07/26/21 04:27 PM
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 904
NC
T
Tailhunter Offline
trapper
Tailhunter  Offline
trapper
T

Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 904
NC
Does a real trapper, you know the guy that dreams about it at night and reads about it during the day, ever need a reason to trap?

Itís in the blood.

No reason needed.

Re: Ethics Question [Re: Blaine County] #7314400
07/26/21 04:31 PM
07/26/21 04:31 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,979
Anchorage, Alaska
J
James Offline
"Minka"
James  Offline
"Minka"
J

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,979
Anchorage, Alaska
I don't think a trapper has any more obligation to trap than a non-trapper has.

Jim


Forum Infidel since 2001

"And that troll bs is something triggered snowflakes say when they dont like what someone posts." - Boco
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