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American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore #7460925
01/14/22 07:39 PM
01/14/22 07:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 24,262
williamsburg ks
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danny clifton Online content OP
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danny clifton  Online Content OP
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Interesting video. What you think?



Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7460942
01/14/22 07:51 PM
01/14/22 07:51 PM
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Northeast Oklahoma
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Mike in A-town Online happy
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The smoothbore target was about right. Lol. But whoever shot that rifle needs to work on their load some more.

Timothy Murphy is credited with mortally wounding Gen. Símon Fraser at a distance of 250 to 300 yards with (depending on which account you read) 3 or 4 shots.

A rifle in the hands of an American who knew how to use it was a lethal piece of machinery.

Mike


One man with a gun may control 100 others who have none.

Vladimir Lenin
Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7461061
01/14/22 10:00 PM
01/14/22 10:00 PM
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Green County Wisconsin
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GREENCOUNTYPETE Offline
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shot from standing like they would be on the battle field , if they were infantry lined up in formation

true rifle men shot laying down much of the time or with a rest , and we lost when we played by British rules of engagement , we won when we went Guerrilla
don't line up on a "battlefield"
even with his so-so rifle group it was 50% smaller thus effective to 50% greater range that isn't an insignificant improvement.

with proper loading and a rest that group could be reduced to just in the red making it about 5X smaller than the musket group now 5X the range is a game changer

taking a Red coat general off his horse at 300 yards who is behind all of his men is a game changer

now the smooth bore probably could have been reasonable accurate to about 80 yards but a few factors with the brown bess , it used a Large flint and a big pan there was a big flash , the bigger flint and pan was to make it more reliable and it may have.
there is no rear sight so having your face in the same place is critical
and probably most importantly the British relied on Volley fire we say ready, aim, fire AIM didn't exist in the British training 1775 , Take sight is an american invention. Americans as we were by 4-20-1775 were a custom to hunting for food shooting small game and following through watching your target get hit

British regulars were used to turning their heads to avoid the flash , the emphasis put of speed loading and volley fire.


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7461081
01/14/22 10:17 PM
01/14/22 10:17 PM
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meadowview, Virginia
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The Brits also had rifle troops during the Rev War. They didn't get to be the most powerful and feared army in the world by being stupid. They lost the Rev War for the same reasons we lost in Vietnam (after winning). It was all about politics. Same thing in the War of 1812 when the US lost every major city to the Brits but "won" the war. Sometimes perserverence is underrated.

Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7461084
01/14/22 10:17 PM
01/14/22 10:17 PM
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east central WI
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k snow Offline
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I'll have to wait for better internet to watch the video.

I can hold a pretty decent group with my smoothbore to 75 yards, definitely good enough to hit a man. But line me up standing in a line facing a line shooting back and I am sure my group would open a bit. Not that it mattered much, as long as I hit someone facing me.

As said above, guerilla type warfare is where we shone. Hide, shoot, move. Small engagements. High priority targets. That's much easier with accurate rifles.

Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7461095
01/14/22 10:34 PM
01/14/22 10:34 PM
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williamsburg ks
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danny clifton Online content OP
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According to the video, King George lost because of logistics. Took awhile to get supplies from England to the Army. According to the video many Continental soldiers had smoothbores and some redcoats had rifles. He also claims that Guerrilla warfare by Americans did not play a big role.


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7461105
01/14/22 10:45 PM
01/14/22 10:45 PM
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There is a lot of truth to that. France supported us and it was getting old for England. They were running out of troops. The vast majority of the militia had fowlers (smoothbores) and the American military had mostly used military muskets. Rifle units were scarce and used for harassing the British. Not a big role, no, bit still important.

Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7461203
01/15/22 12:20 AM
01/15/22 12:20 AM
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New York
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I’d like to suggest that everyone listen to the “American Revolution Podcast”. I’ve never heard a more in depth discussion about the war. He starts at the French and Indian war, and goes into extreme detail about every aspect of the war in a chronological order.

Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7461234
01/15/22 01:00 AM
01/15/22 01:00 AM
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Northeast Oklahoma
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Mike in A-town Online happy
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The British had the Ferguson rifle available to them. Pretty impressive piece of technology when it was invented in 1770... And it could fire up to 7 rounds a minute.

Fortunately for our side its true potential wasn't recognized and widely adopted.

Mike


One man with a gun may control 100 others who have none.

Vladimir Lenin
Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7461256
01/15/22 01:37 AM
01/15/22 01:37 AM
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It helped that the Empire was greatly in debt too.

I remember reading a certain “famous” person of the day, perhaps Daniel Boone, I can’t remember, actually preferred the smooth bore for fighting due to the speed and ease of reloading. Rifle for hunting.

Re: American revolution, rifle vs smoothbore [Re: danny clifton] #7461401
01/15/22 09:47 AM
01/15/22 09:47 AM
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meadowview, Virginia
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EdP Offline
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Inside 75 yds or so buck and ball from a smoothbore is a fast and deadly combo.

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