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Stucco #7460980
01/14/22 08:34 PM
01/14/22 08:34 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 373
St lawrence county, ny
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Eyehi Offline OP
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Eyehi  Offline OP
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St lawrence county, ny
Hoping to build a house thus summer out in the country , my wife and I are considering finishing the outside with stucco ? We live in northern NY state and have harsh winters .... Looking for some advice from anyone with knowledge about stucco ?

Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7460996
01/14/22 08:52 PM
01/14/22 08:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,889
Georgia
warrior Offline
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warrior  Offline
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Georgia
Go with real cement stucco or not at all. The fake stuff will rot out your walls if it ever gets water behind it.

Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461007
01/14/22 09:06 PM
01/14/22 09:06 PM
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 1,154
Interior Alaska
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Oh Snap Online content
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Oh Snap  Online Content
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Interior Alaska
Dryvit 3 coat synthetic plaster over foam for insulation. Used on commercial buildings here in the interior!


I love the smell of burning spruce---I love the sound of a spring time goose---I love the feel of 40 below---from my trapline I will never go!
Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461027
01/14/22 09:21 PM
01/14/22 09:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,889
Georgia
warrior Offline
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Georgia
Is it 3 because 1 and 2 were failures and subject to a class action?

Back in the building boom of the nineties that stuff was going on everything. And having to be torn off just as fast.

It's also quite fragile. Almost poke your finger through fragile. And birds love it, almost every dryvit chimney chase around here has at least one woodpecker hole in it. And you won't be putting a ladder against it to fix it either.

Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461034
01/14/22 09:29 PM
01/14/22 09:29 PM
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 1,154
Interior Alaska
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Oh Snap Online content
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Interior Alaska
Your talking about something different than whatís used here. We are working on Ft. Wainwright doing core drilling. It takes 5 minutes to drill through it. Far from being fragile.

Itís been used here for over 30 years and I have never seen any removed other than for a remodel job tie in!

Last edited by Oh Snap; 01/14/22 09:34 PM.

I love the smell of burning spruce---I love the sound of a spring time goose---I love the feel of 40 below---from my trapline I will never go!
Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461039
01/14/22 09:35 PM
01/14/22 09:35 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 12,885
Green County Wisconsin
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GREENCOUNTYPETE Offline
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Green County Wisconsin
ever thought of cedar shake ? 50+ years and no stain , paint or other , nice big eves and let it turn dark

I hated painting the house as a kid my current house has well faded aluminum siding but it keeps the weather out so it can stay forever I would rather live in a silver house than waste another summer scraping and painting.


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461043
01/14/22 09:46 PM
01/14/22 09:46 PM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 24,718
nm
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adam m Offline
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Real stucoo is great if installed properly. If not stucoo will start cracking within a few years. You'll have to fix it asap as it will get worse and possibly get water infiltration Thankfully they sell "patch kits" that are already dyed. Find a very reputable company around your area make sure they have a great warranty.

Stucoo has lots of benefits including adding additional fire resistance.

Most buildings here are stuccoed.

Re: Stucco [Re: Oh Snap] #7461045
01/14/22 09:47 PM
01/14/22 09:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,889
Georgia
warrior Offline
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Georgia
Originally Posted by Oh Snap
Your talking about something different than whatís used here. We are working on Ft. Wainwright doing core drilling. It takes 5 minutes to drill through it. Far from being fragile.

Itís been used here for over 30 years and I have never seen any removed other than for a remodel job tie in!


Maybe, but I was running framing crews in the 90s and could have run as many crews tearing off the Styrofoam fake stuff. I'm told it was because everyone and their cross-eyed brother was slapping it on. Maybe so but in our humidity any crack or crevice is invitation to rot.
I don't see it being installed on much new construction anymore and what I do is on commercial steel.

Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461053
01/14/22 09:55 PM
01/14/22 09:55 PM
Joined: Dec 2021
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Indiana
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CaseXX Offline
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Indiana
Real concrete stucco or gunite (concrete spray on). 25 years as a hod carrier in the AFL-CIO building and trades. Been useing it in steel mills and 100 ft blast furnace smoke stack for a long time. Like to see any bird peck through that. At Eli-Lilly went through a dozen 30 lb air hammer bits a day to repair 1 sq. Yard.
Built many schools, library's, jails, court houses, useing concrete stucco.
Case.


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Re: Stucco [Re: warrior] #7461075
01/14/22 10:13 PM
01/14/22 10:13 PM
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 828
Indiana
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CaseXX Offline
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Indiana
Warrior, I think you guys are mixing up different products when gunite came out others soon copied the process but the original gunite corp. was very protective of their patents and others soon changed some of the ingredients and or processes to look like the same thing, the spray on fire retardants are the same situation, all look alike to a layman but very different in nature. Unless you are a building materials engineer it is almost impossible to tell the difference visually. With most respect my 2 cents.
Case


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Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461092
01/14/22 10:30 PM
01/14/22 10:30 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 8,692
Asheville, NC
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charles Offline
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Had a neighbor in Central NC who bought a new home that had the new stuff. After about 7-8 years he had to have it torn out and lots on interior problems as well. Seem to recall it was something put over styrofoam, but not sure. Kind of guy who knew everything.

Re: Stucco [Re: CaseXX] #7461129
01/14/22 11:04 PM
01/14/22 11:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 16,889
Georgia
warrior Offline
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Georgia
Originally Posted by CaseXX
Warrior, I think you guys are mixing up different products when gunite came out others soon copied the process but the original gunite corp. was very protective of their patents and others soon changed some of the ingredients and or processes to look like the same thing, the spray on fire retardants are the same situation, all look alike to a layman but very different in nature. Unless you are a building materials engineer it is almost impossible to tell the difference visually. With most respect my 2 cents.
Case


Gunnite, if I'm thinking of the right product, is a blown on air entrained concrete product.

What I'm talking about, known as dryvit down here, is 1/2"-3/4" sheet styrofoam sheathing taped with fiberglass mesh tape with a synthetic polymer grout like skim coat of about a 1/16". No portland at all in it.

True stucco, wire lath and mortar, was common on the coast and in Florida, often over cinder block. That stuff is impermeable and excellent thermal mass insulation in southern heat.

That styrofoam stuff has to be perfectly sealed as any moisture behind it has nowhere to go. Being styrofoam a perfect seal is impossible to maintain.

Re: Stucco [Re: Oh Snap] #7461156
01/14/22 11:18 PM
01/14/22 11:18 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 17,005
SEPA
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Lugnut Offline
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Originally Posted by warrior
It's also quite fragile. Almost poke your finger through fragile. And birds love it, almost every dryvit chimney chase around here has at least one woodpecker hole in it. And you won't be putting a ladder against it to fix it either.



Originally Posted by Oh Snap
Your talking about something different than whatís used here. We are working on Ft. Wainwright doing core drilling. It takes 5 minutes to drill through it. Far from being fragile.

Itís been used here for over 30 years and I have never seen any removed other than for a remodel job tie in!


I used to be certified to install Dryvit, even had the shirts with the penguin logo. laugh

Installed correctly it is very tough stuff. Install Panzer mesh in the base coat and you will have a tough time denting it even if you wail on it with a hammer.

Most of the problems in the nineties were caused by poor installation procedures by non-certified installers, especially improper installation or lack of drainage mats behind the foam. There are other EIF systems out there but Dryvit was one of the better ones, still is.


Eh...wot?

Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461176
01/14/22 11:41 PM
01/14/22 11:41 PM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 24,718
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adam m Offline
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It is fragile IF it's not installed correctly. If water gets in, the scratch coat tends to deteriorate from behind the finish coat. It has a hard time of drying out so it crumbles.
From base to finish coat on home's you get about 1" thickness depending on the installer. Usually the base coat is half inch thick alone.
Homes buildings mail boxes walls and much more are all coated here. Depending on height if wall they may install a "drip edge".

I've seen a lot of people put it directly on top of siding like. Felt paper chicken wire thin base coat thin scratch thin finish. This is a cheap way but it will fail especially if the siding was already jeopardized.

It's a labor intensive process with great results IF done right.

First time doing stucoo I was 10 stuccoed are backyard wall 75' x 6'6". Before that I would help my dad make the mud fill the buckets cut the leathe chicken wire etc...
Baseball to stucoo will make a hole. Ask me how I know grin

Re: Stucco [Re: warrior] #7461212
01/15/22 12:30 AM
01/15/22 12:30 AM
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 828
Indiana
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CaseXX Offline
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Indiana
Yep you nailed gunite, and I remember stucco on block in Fla. that's where we went when we were laid off in winter. Work a week go get drunk. Till spring thaw back home. We saw and were mixed up in a corporate war here re: the blow on products, nobody knew who would do the work, carpenters, hodcarriers, cement finishers, brick layers, and at the same time the differing companies were in the courts arguing about patent rights each putting out bids on jobs based on cost of time and material. All of that above my pay grade. They must have got it figured out, I know the next year I put up the tallest scaffold that county ever had 103 ft. Tube scaffold carpenters did the work and gunite was used. That was Archer Daniel Millons, Then Ely-Lilly wanted to use it as fire proofing on the red iron on the inside and a minority co. bid on the job way lower than the gunite co. They couldn't figure out how they were underbid. Find out later other co. used pearlite in the mix. Soon comes styrofoam, then glass fiber, next I guess old lady underwear. Eventually everybody had their own patent products that leveled the playing field for prime contractors but left the owners of the finished product. (The building) in total darkness. Now fellows like us here are arguing bout what is witch.

About your styrofoam sheathing here it is 1 to 2 inches thick and is used as an insulation layer between blocks and the face brick, we call it ol'blue or ol'pink depending on manufacturer if anyone put anything on it as a finnish coat outdoors they would be .......... well it wouldn't be good. Quite frankly I can't imagine it used in any exterior application likely because of our extreme differences in climate, yours and mine. Your Dryvit may have some applications down there as a cost saving measure but i can't see it used as a real building material for any realistic use. Just my opinion others are free to have their own.


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Re: Stucco [Re: Lugnut] #7461225
01/15/22 12:45 AM
01/15/22 12:45 AM
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 828
Indiana
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CaseXX Offline
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Indiana
Originally Posted by Lugnut
Originally Posted by warrior
It's also quite fragile. Almost poke your finger through fragile. And birds love it, almost every dryvit chimney chase around here has at least one woodpecker hole in it. And you won't be putting a ladder against it to fix it either.



Originally Posted by Oh Snap
Your talking about something different than whatís used here. We are working on Ft. Wainwright doing core drilling. It takes 5 minutes to drill through it. Far from being fragile.

Itís been used here for over 30 years and I have never seen any removed other than for a remodel job tie in!


I used to be certified to install Dryvit, even had the shirts with the penguin logo. laugh

Installed correctly it is very tough stuff. Install Panzer mesh in the base coat and you will have a tough time denting it even if you wail on it with a hammer.

Most of the problems in the nineties were caused by poor installation procedures by non-certified installers, especially improper installation or lack of drainage mats behind the foam. There are other EIF systems out there but Dryvit was one of the better ones, still is.


Sir. Would you please tell me what an EIFSystem is? And maybe Panzer mesh. As to certified is that to ANSI specs? You should know, after all you have the t-shirt? And of course please google ANSI. Thanks
Case


Rules:
Col. Jeff Cooper #1for a gunfight
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Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461263
01/15/22 01:48 AM
01/15/22 01:48 AM
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adam m Offline
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Case That is interesting. Thanks for the lesson. I've always seen stucco usually made sand cement lyme sometimes a poly is added to the mud which is all hand trowled never thin or sprayed. On brick it can be applied directly w/o foam wire felt etc... You just need to soak the brick prior to applying the base so the brick doesn't rob the moisture from the stucco base.

I think of gunnite thin watery stuff used on pools. Come on down to the SW and you will see buildings of various shapes and sizes fully covered in hand trowled stucco with various finish styles. You would be amazed. Easy to find stucco guys here.

Re: Stucco [Re: adam m] #7461279
01/15/22 03:08 AM
01/15/22 03:08 AM
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Indiana
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CaseXX Offline
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Adam
Please take a reading comprehension course.


I'm done.


Second post.
Before hitting post relply I decided to reread the entire post, maybe you did not see I was a hod carrier for 25 yrs. do you have any clue how many mortar boards, stucco hods I filled in those years. Do you even know what a hod is? You think that you can teach me something. You by your own words say "I have always seen" you don't have a clue what "mud" is, ask any bricky, or mason they will tell you the best mud they ever had was no good. JESUS HELP ME, you people pixx me off.







First post.
Not sure about your posting, here Indiana, stucco is used only indoor depending who the customer is. Most govt.agencies/entities use Portland, fine sand also known locally as sugar sand, and bagged lime. But we have one, the major user in our area of many, many , many, Millions of dollars each year, that requires slaked lime. All others but this one can be mixed by common two or three bag mixers. Really don't have a clue about robbing water from cement, due to the fact that once mixed water and cement create a chemical bond and reaction enabling concrete to harden underwater if needed it cannot be separated on a molecular level. Any and all chemical reactions create heat. Added to your ambient temps may be the cause of your consternation. Hear we add calcium in winter to keep concrete from freezing but that's about the end of my knowledge. If you can help me in any way I am a sponge and constantly in search of things.

I can't argue with you people anymore.
I'm done


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Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461336
01/15/22 08:08 AM
01/15/22 08:08 AM
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Sandhills Nebraska
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Gary Benson Offline
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SOMEBODY NEEDS A NAP!!!
MAN!!!!! Leave it to a bunch of trappers to turn a question about exterior house coating into a whizzin' contest!! laugh
I've always known the exterior stuff to be referred to as stucco............interior stuff referred to as texturing.
The exterior stuff is very low-maintenance when applied properly and lasts for many years. I guess its a regional thing as to whether stucco is exterior or interior.
[Linked Image]

Last edited by Gary Benson; 01/15/22 08:31 AM.

Life ain't supposed to be easy.
Re: Stucco [Re: Eyehi] #7461346
01/15/22 08:16 AM
01/15/22 08:16 AM
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Sandhills Nebraska
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Gary Benson Offline
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EIF......Exterior Insulation Finishing system. I wasn't aware of the term either. Had to google it myself.
Im not sure what stucoo is............. laugh

Last edited by Gary Benson; 01/15/22 08:19 AM.

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