Ok so I really really try and avoid other peoples designs like the friggen plague. Just no desire to copy something 100% and call it mine or sell it cheaper. No to mention I just plain Don't like dealing with possible conflict or fan boys.Seriously even if you give a 20min explanation on how your not selling something people still act like your trying to snatch foo outta somones kids mouth Anyhow my question is though ,if a company or person is making something and people keep complaining about a feature or they want an improvement and the original company just plain says no they will not do that, is it shady for another person or company to take all that criticism and build what people want ? I'm talking about from a moral perspective rather then a copyright thing.

Idk say Tim makes bullet molds and people like them initially but they keep saying hay please make this mold but in .227 dia with a hp tip because their not doing whatever or reviews start coming in the aluminum the mold is made out of is really poor quality for anything past hobby casting . Tim says no my design is the bess knee's take it or leave it. Well Billy Bob sees this and he starts making the molds but in a .227 dia with a hp and brass instead of aluminum so it's better for heavy duty casting. Was that shady or a poor poor business practice?

Again I'm not interested in stealing anyone's design or trying to find justification for doing it I'm just curious about eveyone thoughts on the matter.
Thabks

Necessity is the mother of invention. Go for it.

x2.... if tyou got a better moustrap go for ot your kids gotta eat to

Build a better mouse trap and the world will beat a path to your door.

I don't see anything wrong with making something better especially if the guy that made the original product won't make the improvements needed.

Take foothold traps. They all are made basically from the same original designs. Some guys decided that they could be improved upon and made modifications to the original design and came up with high end, much improved, better traps.

The original inventor had the option to protect his idea with a patent. If they didn't do that, copy away. That's how business works. Everything that exists that can be purchased from more than one company was somebody's idea first.

If everybody lived by the ethical stance that it's immoral to copy any aspect of someone else's design, innovation would stop. It's pretty rare for someone to come up with something completely new. Every advanced technology happened through baby steps with hundreds or thousands of people making little improvements.

The difference between Ford's model A and a Musk's Tesla happened over more than 100 years with thousands and thousands of tiny improvements. If that wasn't allowed, we would all still be driving model A's.

In the case you presented, they had the first chance. If they do not take it then it is any ones game.

A better idea comes from a good idea wolfie thats how America got where it is and other countries stagnated as far as pattern infringment ask the Chinese They'll say American business came here to make things cheep

I've always been of the school of thought that if it's not patented, or if you change it up enough to be clear of the patent, then go for it. Kind of surprised all the comments so far have been in line with that. I figured this post would open a heck of a can of worms what with the way people in the trapping community have lost their minds over some of the traps they feel were copies of others.

I figure if I build something from someone elses design and don't try to sell them I am doing them no harm.
No harm no foul.
just

There's very little of anything new in the world, and darn little of anything that can't be improved,
Improve away and use it, sell it, or give it away.

LOL
I bought a couple of wind wheels that a couple of old Amish fellas built. They asked what I was going to do with them. I told them I had an idea to make a generator .
They told me that everything has been invented already .
lol

One man's junk is another mans ........Junk

there are shades of shady....

I think there are differences between product improvement and undermining established businesses.


Does it only equal stealing if the guy has a patent? If someone doesn’t have a patent, but your version would be infringement if it were patented, wouldn’t it also be stealing? Maybe not legally, but what about morally?


My answer here would depend on the product, details, and how you went about doing it. There’s a good chance what you’re asking about is innocent enough and fine, but if someone makes a living by stealing other’s ideas to sell, then that’s something else.

I had a mentor drill into my head some time ago that "successful people are the ones that will do what others will not do!" And, "the engineering process is nothing more than a series of partial successes, there is always room for improvement ...". Finally, "product death happens when there is failure to innovate!"

What you said there wouldnt be a problem, but if you take a foot hold out of the box and put a single spot of weld on the jaw and try to sell the traps as your own then I’d say you would have a problem.

For what it's worth, Benjamin Franklin had at least 7 inventions and he didn't patent a single one. He said his inventions weren't for his own profit but to profit mankind.

if they are not making what you want and you make your design with some similar attributes but in a different size , that isn't an issue.

so if they don't make a .277 and you want one and use similar tributes like a 2R ogive and gas check base , and tumble lube style driving bands , and you make it in brass then it is plenty different enough

personally I am more of a fan of flat meplat but what every you want to build

if your honestly building a better bullet and not just a dead on copy , go for it , that isn't an infringement

I am willing to bet that most patents on the books today are nothing other than improvements on someone else's product. If the guy doesn't patent a particular feature of his product, or didn't include a feature which would improve it, its free game for someone else to come in with a new patent for the improvement. There are no morals in business. The USA is a Republic of Constitutional Law.
If no one made the effort to improve a product which the original developer refuses to improve, improvement of products would never occur.
Those who do invest in improving designs need to be payed somehow, don't they?

Heard about a company that made pb and j sandwiches without the crust, didn’t think of a patent because it’s pb and j. Smuckers got a patent, sent a cease and desist to the original company and started making uncrustable sandwiches. Totally screwed the first company out of their business.