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Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? #7594342
05/30/22 07:22 AM
05/30/22 07:22 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,961
shelbyville, illinois 50years ...
foxkidd44 Offline OP
trapper
foxkidd44  Offline OP
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,961
shelbyville, illinois 50years ...
Guys, just something I was thinking about,, but canít seem to find any information to support my theory. Does anyone know when the mass closures of mental institutions began?? Mid 90s?? Seems thatís when the spike began. Yes,,, weíve always had shootings to some degree,, but before the mid 90s they were isolated and not as common as they are now.


Stand by your principles, Stand by your guns, and victory complete and permanent is sure at last.
Abraham Lincoln
Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594346
05/30/22 07:30 AM
05/30/22 07:30 AM
Joined: Aug 2021
Posts: 1,042
MA
F
Flicker Shad Offline
trapper
Flicker Shad  Offline
trapper
F

Joined: Aug 2021
Posts: 1,042
MA
Yeah. We didn't have internet back then either. Think about that.

Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594348
05/30/22 07:32 AM
05/30/22 07:32 AM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 5,417
Kansas
Pawnee Offline
trapper
Pawnee  Offline
trapper

Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 5,417
Kansas
I donít know the answer but Iíve heard that in the 1800ís up through the mid 1900ís we had something like 1000 mental hospital beds per 100,000 people. Now itís less than 100 per 100,000. Thatís from memory so donít quote me. Now days they give them some pills and send them down the road. No oversight to see if the pills ever get taken.


Everything the left touches it destroys
Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594367
05/30/22 07:59 AM
05/30/22 07:59 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 6,013
Three Lakes,WI 71
C
corky Offline
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corky  Offline
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C

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 6,013
Three Lakes,WI 71
Jimmy Carter, followed up by Ronald Reagan, with the help of the Democrat majorities in Congress, passed the mental health legislation in the early 80"s. There have been a mountain of unintended consequences since then.

Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594369
05/30/22 08:03 AM
05/30/22 08:03 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 15,237
The Hill Country of Texas
Leftlane Offline
"HOSS"
Leftlane  Offline
"HOSS"

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 15,237
The Hill Country of Texas
Has anybody heard anything about the little idiots father? I haven't been watching the news so maybe he was in the boys life maybe not.

It would seem to me that if his momma was a druggy then dad was probably too. I don't know if trying to identify and lock up the crazies would work but I cannot help but wonder that if children were raised in 2 parent homes if some of these kids would not be getting into nonsense like this


ďWhatís good for me may not be good for the weak minded.Ē
Captain Gus McCrae- Texas Rangers


Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594372
05/30/22 08:06 AM
05/30/22 08:06 AM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 7,777
Arkansas
J
J Staton Offline
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J Staton  Offline
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J

Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 7,777
Arkansas
We slapped mask on them and told them they were going to kill grandma....no wonder the youth have gone mad.


James 1: 19-20
Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594374
05/30/22 08:06 AM
05/30/22 08:06 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,278
PA
w side rd 151 Offline
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Happy Birthday w side rd 151  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,278
PA
The system today is built around the concept of medicating the symptoms . Mental illness is a disease just like many other medical problem .Today's medical profession(business) is not designed to treat the masses and follow up that treatment .It is all about making sure the medical professionals and institutions are getting their share of the profit .And the well being of the patient is secondary to the well being of the profit margin . Anyone that is having mental health issues is already having problems with understanding what to do .And giving that kind of person drugs that can make the situation worse. Throwing money at a problem is not the answer to changing the well being of someone that has the problem to begin with

Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594379
05/30/22 08:13 AM
05/30/22 08:13 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 24,867
williamsburg ks
D
danny clifton Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
danny clifton  Offline
"Grumpy Old Man"
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 24,867
williamsburg ks
Ronny Raygun emptied the mental institutions of CA when he was governor then cut funding to all the states as president.


Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)
Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594438
05/30/22 09:11 AM
05/30/22 09:11 AM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 758
Killingly, CT
Brian Mongeau Offline
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Brian Mongeau  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 758
Killingly, CT
Originally Posted by foxkidd44
Guys, just something I was thinking about,, but canít seem to find any information to support my theory. Does anyone know when the mass closures of mental institutions began?? Mid 90s?? Seems thatís when the spike began. Yes,,, weíve always had shootings to some degree,, but before the mid 90s they were isolated and not as common as they are now.


CT State Hospital for the Insane opened in 1904, closed in 1996.

Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594466
05/30/22 10:00 AM
05/30/22 10:00 AM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 13,225
Green County Wisconsin
G
GREENCOUNTYPETE Offline
trapper
GREENCOUNTYPETE  Offline
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G

Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 13,225
Green County Wisconsin
Originally Posted by foxkidd44
Guys, just something I was thinking about,, but canít seem to find any information to support my theory. Does anyone know when the mass closures of mental institutions began?? Mid 90s?? Seems thatís when the spike began. Yes,,, weíve always had shootings to some degree,, but before the mid 90s they were isolated and not as common as they are now.


I think your talking about the Regan policy to de-fund and close mental hospitals that had in many cases life long residents.

as most things it started in California Reagan signed the first bill in 1967 slowly closing down long term care facilities

it was the mid 80s it went national a friend was a Deputy sheriff back then and they started to see in influx of mental folks visiting the jail.

as in most things it was a slow process so it took years.

mass killings have mostly followed population , there were 61 active shooter events in 2021, 12 of which qualify as a mass killing event 103 dead 140 injured that was a steep increase from the previous year 40 and prior to 2020-2021 30 had been the common median number.

what changed , I think it has a lot to do with the way the media sells it , if you watch the news you might have seen numbers like 693 mass shootings , clearly they are getting their statistics from other places , no surprise they are including every possible criminal shooting to make up their numbers things that have known motive and intended victims often where few are innocent in the exchange

when you sell every day that it is common and polarize absolutely everything push every stresser people snap so they take advantage of weak people prone to snapping and help push it in a more violent direction.



Last edited by GREENCOUNTYPETE; 05/30/22 10:18 AM.

America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594502
05/30/22 10:56 AM
05/30/22 10:56 AM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,029
Champaign County, Ohio.
K
KeithC Online content
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KeithC  Online Content
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K

Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,029
Champaign County, Ohio.
I put the blame mostly on the media too. They put the idea of going on a shooting spree in people's heads with their beyond extensive coverage of a shooting spree when it happens. The media then brings up that shooting every year on it's "anniversary" and every time another somewhat similar shooting occurs, ad nauseum.

Keith

Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594516
05/30/22 11:22 AM
05/30/22 11:22 AM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,287
pa
H
hippie Offline
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hippie  Offline
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H

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,287
pa
It's what we as a society have allowed to be normalized. What is a mental case anymore?

Would you consider this person mentally stable or hire him for a very important position in the federal govy?
[Linked Image]

Or maybe this person for another important position?
[Linked Image]

If those are not crazy but revered enough to run agencies within our govt, this one is probably ok too?
[Linked Image]
(in charge of nuclear waste)


Yes, we're talking about mental health all the while normalizing it at a federal level. Go figure.

Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: hippie] #7594523
05/30/22 11:34 AM
05/30/22 11:34 AM
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 1,258
Interior Alaska
O
Oh Snap Offline
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Oh Snap  Offline
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O

Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 1,258
Interior Alaska
All 3 of these sick human beings were recruited, in the shadows, by a pervert at a young ageÖ.just like they are doing right now IN PLAIN SIGHT!

Originally Posted by hippie
It's what we as a society have allowed to be normalized. What is a mental case anymore?

Would you consider this person mentally stable or hire him for a very important position in the federal govy?
[Linked Image]

Or maybe this person for another important position?
[Linked Image]

If those are not crazy but revered enough to run agencies within our govt, this one is probably ok too?
[Linked Image]
(in charge of nuclear waste)


Yes, we're talking about mental health all the while normalizing it at a federal level. Go figure.


Last edited by Oh Snap; 05/30/22 11:49 AM.

I love the smell of burning spruce---I love the sound of a spring time goose---I love the feel of 40 below---from my trapline I will never go!
Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594526
05/30/22 11:48 AM
05/30/22 11:48 AM
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,029
Champaign County, Ohio.
K
KeithC Online content
trapper
KeithC  Online Content
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K

Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,029
Champaign County, Ohio.
Aberrant behavior is a requirement to be a part of the biden administration.

Keith

Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594529
05/30/22 11:57 AM
05/30/22 11:57 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,278
PA
w side rd 151 Offline
trapper
Happy Birthday w side rd 151  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,278
PA
In today's society everyone wants to express their individuality But no one wants to accept responsibility for their actions .Than when things go bad it has to be someone elses fault because it is unfair to single out those that are different There are many people that need help and want help but the system fails them by putting into programs that only put a band aid on a critical problem And when those people do something tragic everyone points the finger and says that is the problem

Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594561
05/30/22 12:39 PM
05/30/22 12:39 PM
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 10,098
Northeast Oklahoma
M
Mike in A-town Offline
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Mike in A-town  Offline
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M

Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 10,098
Northeast Oklahoma
There was a lot of abuse in the mental institutions back in the day... The stories of experiments on the patients isn't just Hollywood horror movie stuff.

But instead of trying to fix that, we threw the baby out with the bathwater and shut the hospitals down.

I am generally opposed to government handling things... But after one mass shooting, don't remember which... Parkland maybe, and the issue of mental illness came up... Ben Shapiro made a pretty good point... The burden of the mentally ill falls on society as a whole. So it should be up to society to fund and undertake the care of the mentally ill.

We need to decide what criteria must be met for a person to be deemed dangerous enough to be institutionalized and apply those criteria. I have to wonder how many parents/family had an inkling that these kids need to be locked up and just ignored it or hoped the worst wouldn't happen... Or worse yet, looked into having something done and found out it was nearly impossible. Because getting someone committed long-term is nearly impossible. They basically have to commit a criminal act before the state will even consider it.

But everything is politicized now... And I'm not sure government could be trusted to set the standards for what qualifies as crazy now. All of the proposed red flag law legislation makes that apparent... Democrats want to lock you up for simply wanting to own a firearm.

Mike


One man with a gun may control 100 others who have none.

Vladimir Lenin
Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594581
05/30/22 01:09 PM
05/30/22 01:09 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 37,169
james bay frontierOnt.
B
Boco Online content
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Boco  Online Content
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Posts: 37,169
james bay frontierOnt.
i bet there was a lot more shootings in the 1700's and 1800's per capita than today.


Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: Mike in A-town] #7594588
05/30/22 01:16 PM
05/30/22 01:16 PM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,278
PA
w side rd 151 Offline
trapper
Happy Birthday w side rd 151  Offline
trapper

Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,278
PA
Originally Posted by Mike in A-town
There was a lot of abuse in the mental institutions back in the day... The stories of experiments on the patients isn't just Hollywood horror movie stuff.

But instead of trying to fix that, we threw the baby out with the bathwater and shut the hospitals down.

I am generally opposed to government handling things... But after one mass shooting, don't remember which... Parkland maybe, and the issue of mental illness came up... Ben Shapiro made a pretty good point... The burden of the mentally ill falls on society as a whole. So it should be up to society to fund and undertake the care of the mentally ill.

We need to decide what criteria must be met for a person to be deemed dangerous enough to be institutionalized and apply those criteria. I have to wonder how many parents/family had an inkling that these kids need to be locked up and just ignored it or hoped the worst wouldn't happen... Or worse yet, looked into having something done and found out it was nearly impossible. Because getting someone committed long-term is nearly impossible. They basically have to commit a criminal act before the state will even consider it.

But everything is politicized now... And I'm not sure government could be trusted to set the standards for what qualifies as crazy now. All of the proposed red flag law legislation makes that apparent... Democrats want to lock you up for simply wanting to own a firearm.

Mike
We need to decide what criteria must be met for a person to be deemed danger but everything is so politicized now Democrats want to lock you up for wanting to own a gun. Now a days if you have any opinion other than guns are dangerous you are considered a criminal

Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: foxkidd44] #7594595
05/30/22 01:40 PM
05/30/22 01:40 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 3,845
Oklahoma
Blaine County Offline
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Posts: 3,845
Oklahoma
Since the McDonalds shooting in 1984 (21 dead people) we have added over a 100 million people in the U.S. And, social media. If one percent of the population are nuts, we added an additional one million additional nuts to the general population (on top of the nuts already there). I expect social media and general societal decline increases the percentage of nuts.

The Constitution does not have an adjustment for population growth--nor should it. In fact, we more of a reason to protect ourselves now as the country gets crazier and more crowded.


MOLON LABE
Re: Mental hospitals/ mass shootings? [Re: danny clifton] #7594736
05/30/22 05:08 PM
05/30/22 05:08 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 209
MICHIGAN
WANNABE-TRAPPER Offline
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MICHIGAN
Originally Posted by danny clifton
Ronny Raygun emptied the mental institutions of CA when he was governor then cut funding to all the states as president.


Yep

Huge portion of this is because our healthcare system sucks if you are poor. Zero help.

Last edited by WANNABE-TRAPPER; 05/30/22 05:10 PM.

Think beyond right or left don't be guilty of group think.
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