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Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem

Posted By: TurkeyTime

Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/13/18 03:10 AM

Hello. One of my property lines(on a farm) has no marking at all other than the 2 corners. There is no line of site between the two. A string can't be used as it is heavily wooded with little pole size trees/can't see more than 20 yards in spots. I do not have a GPS nor know of someone that does. I also do not have a smart phone but my kids do. QUESTION: Is there some kind of app. that will allow me to mark the location of the first corner, go to the end corner and mark it, then it takes you on a straight line back to the first? This way I could cut a path through the woods to have an approximate property line. Thank you for your time.
Posted By: TurkeyTime

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/13/18 11:24 PM

Anyone. Anyone. Bueller. Bueller.
Posted By: Marty

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/13/18 11:47 PM

Topo map and compass, take a bearing and go....check bearing often and mark the trail. Be sure to allow for magnetic declination.
Posted By: tjm

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 12:19 AM

County Surveyor.
Posted By: strike2x

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 12:27 AM

OnXhunt is an app that will give a free 7 day trial. It will show you property lines, state, public and private property. I use it and pay a subscription. I can go virtually anywhere I want and open the app to see who's land I am on. Of course I use anywhere loosely because you do have to have data available to get all the app to function. I highly recommend this app to anyone who spends time in the woods.
Posted By: jackrock

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 12:28 AM

Probably. The Onyx hunt app shows property lines as per the tax maps. Actually pretty accurate and costs $30 per year per state. I do this sort of thing a lot with other technology, so I have not tried the app for that. But I bet that sort of app is available and works a lot better than a compass.
Posted By: DelawareRob

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 12:38 AM

Originally Posted By: Marty
Topo map and compass, take a bearing and go....check bearing often and mark the trail. Be sure to allow for magnetic declination.


This...
Posted By: tjm

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 12:40 AM

Ordinary stuff is not accurate enough to build fence or go to court with is it? Last time I asked the surveyor said gps took several hours to establish any degree of accuracy. =/- 10 yards?
Posted By: tjm

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 12:44 AM

Originally Posted By: Marty
Topo map and compass, take a bearing and go....check bearing often and mark the trail. Be sure to allow for magnetic declination.
And year that land was surveyed because it changes with time.
Posted By: Plum Billy

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 12:48 AM

I worked for guy that was always saying "There's an app for that" Whenever a problem came up. Of course he never meant an app on a phone, he always figured some wacky scheme that somehow managed to get the job done.

Point of story, a topo map and compass should work just fine. You can get a compass for as cheap as 10 dollars, and if you print a topo map all it usually costs you is a little ink and paper.
Posted By: OKforester

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 12:59 AM

If you already have two corners established, as stated above a compass is your best avenue short of having a licensed surveyor mark the line. You can run a bearing from one corner, flagging with ribbon and when you come out at the other corner you will miss it some. How far you miss it depends on how good your bearing was. Again as stated adjust for declination. They are never exactly 90, 180, 270, or 360 degrees. You can then adjust your bearing a little and run the line back to the starting point. You can get your line pretty close using this method. As far as a phone app Avenza pdf maps is free and allows you to download topomaps and you can go to each corner, drop a pin, draw a line between the two pins and save the line. As far as I can tell the gps capabilities on iPhones and the ordinary hand held GPS receivers are abuot the same as far as accuracy. Neither is anywhere close to being accurate enough to survey with, they just get you close.
Posted By: OKforester

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 01:04 AM

Originally Posted By: tjm
Originally Posted By: Marty
Topo map and compass, take a bearing and go....check bearing often and mark the trail. Be sure to allow for magnetic declination.
And year that land was surveyed because it changes with time.

It doesn’t matter what year it was surveyed as long as they used the correct declination at the time. You don’t want to use the declination it was surveyed with, you want to use the current declination.
Posted By: 2labs

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 01:07 AM

Yes ON X map APP is the way to go.
Posted By: Squash

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 12:38 PM

ON X hunt maps are great, but property lines it depicts are based on tax map info. That will get you in the ball park but not a substitute for an actual survey.
Posted By: thskeer

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 03:23 PM

I have a GPS that is accurate to less than a meter in about 1 minute. It is issued and costs about 3500.00 IF you could buy it. Quite a bit of other military stuff is just as accurate- I think open market is limited in accuracy for security reasons.
Posted By: FairbanksLS

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 03:42 PM

Good luck Turkey Time. You can join the ranks of those who have done a little surveying in the past. I've met quite a few of those people and have done a little surveying myself.
Posted By: Kart29

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 05:33 PM

A lensatic compass seems like the perfect tool for this job. In fact, I think it would be much better than a gps for this purpose.

I do geocaching with an older model Garmin gps and it will accurately provide a location within a few feet instantaneously. At least it is accurate to the same point as the person who left the geocache and marked the co-ordinates on their GPS.

But if I were wanting to approximately mark a straight line between two known corner markers, I still think a compass would be more effective
Posted By: ebsurveyor

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/14/18 10:42 PM

Originally Posted By: TurkeyTime
Hello. One of my property lines(on a farm) has no marking at all other than the 2 corners. There is no line of site between the two. A string can't be used as it is heavily wooded with little pole size trees/can't see more than 20 yards in spots. I do not have a GPS nor know of someone that does. I also do not have a smart phone but my kids do. QUESTION: Is there some kind of app. that will allow me to mark the location of the first corner, go to the end corner and mark it, then it takes you on a straight line back to the first? This way I could cut a path through the woods to have an approximate property line. Thank you for your time.


Some of the answers are funny. If it was easy states would not require a license to do it. With more information I'll give some tips. How far apart are the existing corners? How's the terrain? BTW: I draw a paycheck for making GPS Accurate to 1 cm (< 0.5").
Posted By: FairbanksLS

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 12:25 AM

Can't be very difficult if all you need is a smart phone with an On X Hunt app.
Posted By: plumber

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 12:53 AM

Simple just tell neighbor to put their fence up. Walla property line established.
Posted By: BigBob

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 01:08 AM

Spotting scope and a compass worked for me. Set up the scope, pointed at something located with the compass and have a buddy walk towards it with a marker of some kind, I used yellow newspaper bags, that can be tied to trees etc along the way. When you get as far as you can see, move the scope, take another bearing and do it again. Should be close enough.
Posted By: M.Magis

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 01:23 AM

I had a similar problem, but also with some steep hills thrown in the mix. I ran a string from corner to corner. If a tree put a bend in the string, I cut it down. Took a while, but eventually ended up with a straight line of fence.
Posted By: TurkeyTime

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 03:25 AM

It is one side of a 40 acre so 440 yards. It is hilly but the biggest problem is the small trees. I am doing some Timber Stand Improvement to thin them out. I am sure my neighbor wouldn't mind if I would help out his side and kill his black and honey locusts but I have killed enough in my life and don't want to deny someone else the opportunity. Thanks for all of the ideas and help. If anyone else has any comments or thoughts feel free to post and I will keep reading. Thanks again.
Posted By: ebsurveyor

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 07:10 AM

Check back here in 36 hours. I'll post some ideas. From me a licensed land surveyor that has marked many miles of property lines.
Posted By: ebsurveyor

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 05:23 PM

I would use a $30,000 GPS receiver and could mark the line within a foot or so almost as fast as I could walk the line. You could also do this: Walk the line & count your steps. After you get to the end. start back flagging a straight line to the other corner. How: at a corner hang a flag (I use survey ribbon, but any thing will work, strips of cloth, plastic bags, etc.). Walk toward the second corner and hang a second marker. Now, continue to walk and place a third marker in line with the first two. A machete is useful to cut small brush/trees to help you see "the line" that you are marking. With some care you can mark a straight line. Continue to mark a straight line until you pass the second corner. At the second corner pace the distance from the straight line to the corner. The marked line needs to be adjusted by the amount of the error at the second corner. Example: the error at the second corner is 100 yards. So your error is about 22.7 yards per 100 yards of marked line. 22.7 x 4 = 90.8 walk down the marked line 40 yards and place a marker 90.8 yards from the marked line. Walk down the marked line another 50 yards (now 350 yards from the start) and place a marker 22.7 x 3.50 = 79.4 yards from the marked line. Your new flags will have the property line marked every 50 yards when finished. Now you can cut the line open between the corrected flags,. With some trial & error you can get the line marked with this method. Here are the correction for my example: 440 yard line has 100 yard error. Each yard of marked line has 100/440 = 0.23 yards of error. The marked line needs to be corrected as follows: @ 50 yards correct 0.23*50 = 11.5 yards, @ 100 yards correct 23 yards, @ 150 yards correct 34.5 yards, @ 200 yards correct 46 yards. @ 250 Correct 57.5, @ 300 correct 69 (0.23 x 300 = 69). This method is not as hard as it sounds. Good luck.
Posted By: gcs

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 07:02 PM

I have an APP, "Huntstand" that will show your and your neighbors property lines, and names of adjoining and local landowners.
You can measure distance between points, show the acreage of an area, and mark waypoints. I think it's free.
You should be able to do what you need with it.
Posted By: M.Magis

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 07:20 PM

The GPS hunting apps aren't nearly accurate enough to mark a property line. Some of them are so inaccurate you can see it by just looking at the map on the phone.
Posted By: Diggerman

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 07:30 PM

Borrow a buddies garmin that has the ONX hunt map in it. They are accurate to within 6 ft. according to my experience. Check with the coon hunting guys, some one close will have one.
Posted By: tjm

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 08:07 PM

So are the two corners diagonal?
Posted By: wetdog

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 08:29 PM

I helped an old man years ago. He waited until a calm day,had me load saws, axe's, paint and brush and a metal barrel. We went to the easy to get to corner. Unloaded the barrel,set it 10 feet on his side of the corner pin. He made a fire in the barrel while I gathered green grass and leaves. He took the paint and brush and went to the other corner. He told me to wait 15 mins and start adding the green stuff. What a cloud of smoke it made,straight up. I added more green as the smoke would die down. 30 after the first smoke I saw him thru the trees,he was painting trees on both sides as he walked. The distance was about 700 yards. That was the easy part,took me 2 weeks to cut a drivable path through there. I was young it was work and I got a 22 bolt action for my hard work. My times have changed.
Posted By: ebsurveyor

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/15/18 09:54 PM

Originally Posted By: wetdog
I helped an old man years ago. He waited until a calm day,had me load saws, axe's, paint and brush and a metal barrel. We went to the easy to get to corner. Unloaded the barrel,set it 10 feet on his side of the corner pin. He made a fire in the barrel while I gathered green grass and leaves. He took the paint and brush and went to the other corner. He told me to wait 15 mins and start adding the green stuff. What a cloud of smoke it made,straight up. I added more green as the smoke would die down. 30 after the first smoke I saw him thru the trees,he was painting trees on both sides as he walked. The distance was about 700 yards. That was the easy part,took me 2 weeks to cut a drivable path through there. I was young it was work and I got a 22 bolt action for my hard work. My times have changed.


I like the sound of this.
Posted By: warrior

Re: Cell phone/GPS/woods navigation ?/problem - 02/16/18 01:22 AM

Originally Posted By: Marty
Topo map and compass, take a bearing and go....check bearing often and mark the trail. Be sure to allow for magnetic declination.


Dad and I did this thirty years ago to mark his back line. Pulled off the nearest section monument, the next property over.
Ten years later had it professionally run. Dad's mark was off by six inches.
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