why is this even a crime??????????????????

https://www.foxnews.com/us/vietnam-war-h...purchase-report

Wife died two weeks before raid? Sounds like someone who visited wanted some revenge. Maybe he got on the bad side of his inlaws.

Would it be illegal for me to own a fully automatic rifle with the serial number filed off?

Being a military veteran, or a war hero even, doesn't put a man above the law. He had a full auto weapon in his possession. It matters not at all that he bought it decades ago, he still had it now and it was not legal.

With all do respect, the man should've known better when the serial number was scratched off. GIANT red flag

WHY is it illegal. Whats different about finishing an 80% reciever for a semi ( no serial #) or owning an old military rifle picked up in a war zone?

Why is full auto illegal? Are people with full auto more likely to commit murder? Does the rifle change the way the owners mind works????

well Trump could pardon him say I understand that the gun laws have gotten so ridiculous that a good guy , war veteran though of it as just another rifle , it was purchased pre registration so let him go.

your pardoned thank you for your service.

Two words, Jury Nullification.

It should be obvious that there's more to the story than what's in the article. They don't just randomly raid a persons home, and they weren't there looking for one particular unrecorded rifle from 40 years ago.

I am thinking there is way more to this story.

Someone tipped off law enforcement for revenge for something.

I understand it's a law but 7 years in prison seems harsh for just possession.

"fully automatic"....gets me every time!

Land of the free, home of the brave, right? If your betters tell you that you do not rate to own an automatic rifle because you did not pay a 200 dollar tax you deserve to be put in a cage for seven years.
There will be no movement to repeal the National Firearms Act by the Democrat Lite party or the gun control club called the NRA.

Your question "why is this a crime": its a crime because it violates a Federal Law. I find it difficult to believe that any one gun owner/collector does not know this law. Now if this man passed away and the weapon found its way to an uneducated radical, we now have an automatic weapon on the street in the hands of a nut job. Cause and effect. Its called consequence thinking. We have Federal Laws for a reason, you have the right to vote and try to have the NRA over turn this law. There are exceptions and many collectors have auto weapons, they follow the law.

So your saying its a crime to steal because thats the law? No reasoning behind it. Its just the law? As to the NRA Id rather support nancy pelosi. She is honest about supporting gun control

Blame Al Capone and the likes for why it's now illegal. Or, keep whining about something you and i had no control over.

Vote enough pro-gunners in and we might get somewhere, but with the 50-50 splits we've been having, nothing is gonna change.

Finn..........
The democrat lite paerty has done more than your group will ever do to help us. Get one elected would be a good first step. Easy to say what they "might" do when they can't even get elected to dog-catcher.

We have a libertarian state senator here in Nebraska, laura ebke. From what I understand, shes the highest elected libertarian in America. As far as automatic weapons, a gun is just a piece of metal, government has no more business regulating that piece of metal than any other piece of metal I own.

It's also illegal for Al Sharpton to not pay income taxes. But....

if he bought it legally back then should be ok now. seven years lock up dosnt figure.

Elected as a Republican and then changed parties, Same as Gary Johnson.

But that's ok with me. How many gun laws has she eliminated since she's been in?

“Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives agents looking for the rifle raided Pick’s Plano, Texas, home two weeks after his wife died of cancer and found the weapon.“

So, who knew about the gun and had a grudge against the old man? His in-laws maybe? I think the informant should be tracked down.

He earned the right to own that gun. God bless him. Jail time? Something is very wrong.

I am surprised an avid gun collector would buy a gun with a scratched out serial number. He should have known better, verteran or not.

As far as I know, not a single one. From what I understand she's always leaned libertarian but made the switch in opposition to our governor. She's pro-DACA, that's all I need to know about her. Though on this particular issue, her website says that owning any weapon, in and of itself should not be a crime.

The law was passed because in the 20's too many gangsters used them in crimes, hence the '27 NFA. BUT, full auto firearms can be possessed legally with the proper registration and NFA Stamp, like Suppressors. NO firearm can be possessed with altered or destroyed serial numbers. Did he actually buy it, or did he steal it from the Government during his military service?

Shame on him! Hillary should have him suicide'd.

Whys that?

No, they haven't. Their platform, instead of calling for the abolition of the NFA and subsequent unconstitutional federal gun laws, mumbles on about reciprocity for permission slips to carry concealed and 'lawful' gun owners. Blah blah blah. Buncha do-nothing grifters.

because automatic is automatic. They put "fully" in front to make it sound scary.

"Who?" put fully in front of it? Reason I was wondering is that it really only had me guessing what you meant by that statement. Then as I was looking through the Wyoming regulations it states in there that no one shall take wildlife with any fully auto weapon. Seems they dont think it is a scary term.

Can buy a Remington semi auto that only shoots singles before having to clear a malfunction in feeding due to poor manufacture and compare that to a fully single shot. However, the fully in front of automatic is redundant. It either is automatic or isn't. It leads into the bump stock discussion and the murky waters of how fast of a trigger finger is TOO FAST. Republicans and Democrats both seems to agree that there is a trigger finger that is too fast for a semi automatic and need laws made to restrict.

Not sure it is redundant but I was wondering "who" put it in there to imply scary? Guess I dont see it as scary. I think it was put there years ago just to distinguish between semi auto and full auto.

The author of the Fox news story put it in there.

Im guessing he wasnt the first!

I think so too.

NFA came about in '34. And that was just to keep revenue agents employed after Prohibition was repealed.

The ATF is a tax agency. Why they have goons in tactical gear kicking down doors over tax issues is a joke.

Mike

The 'semi' in semi automatic is what distinguishes one from the other. Fully automatic is redundant.

Just follow the laws, or vote to have them changed...

330 I do both.

I have a real hard time understanding how somebody can rabidly support the ownership of semi look a like rifles and in the same breath claim auto firearms should be taxed regulated and heavily controlled. Including banning production for civilian sales.

The NRA got the NFA passed in 34 by playing on peoples fear of bank robbers. Bonnie and Clyde were fond of BAR 30-06 for example and others liked the smaller .45 "tommy gun".

Everyone ought to read up on how the government got it past the supremes.

Every argument you folks make in support of black semi rifles equally applies to auto's.

If you pull the trigger one time on a "semi-automatic", how many times does it shoot?
Then it should be called a single shot. A pump can be fired nearly as fast as a semi-automatic.

come on devil dog....you know the full auto distinguishes from the 3-round burst

I've described before the raid I witnessed at my neighbors. I am amazed nobody got shot. I wasn't the only one of my neighbors who grabbed a gun before hearing "sheriffs dept search warrant". They didn't blow a door off but they did explode a big firecracker. Got ignorant when I told them to get off my property and tried to get me to go inside. A bunch of sorry cowardly bums I no longer respect.

So you left the gun inside while you were out there getting mouthy???

So pass thru you want to abolish tresspass laws?

It is what it is, and has been our whole life Danny. Why bother asking a question you know the answer to and know the guy, as the regulations are, is in the wrong?

As a Devil Dog I was taught that three round burst feature on an M16 was put there only to satisfy the U.S. Army who can't hit any side of a barn while standing inside of it. Fire superiority is brought with AUTOMATIC rifles and machine guns while rifleman use well aimed shots.

Hippie your right. He's a grown man and almost certainly knew he was breaking the law. IMO it is a good example of one reason why the law needs changed. He obviously was no threat just liked his old war weapon. I keep hoping the supremes will do the right thing and negate all the gun control laws in the U.S.

Free people have every right to arm themselves with whatever arms their government has. The government of free people by definition only governs with the consent of the governed. To maintain that ideal, the governed must have the means at hand to overthrow the government if consent is no longer given.

He may have posted it to light a fire in your mind as to why you keep supporting a party of limp wristed appeasement in dealing with the 2nd amendment.

Or why you support a party that hasn't ever passed a pro-gun bill.

And wont, talk about limp!

Your party has passed 100 percent more gun bills than mine. That is irrelevant really. It boils down to a culture of loving big government. If you don't like big government don't vote for it anymore.

I'm just saying it's kind of sheepish to hide your gun if you feel like you're in the right, especially on your own property. You are always throwing the thunder around on here about everything, was hoping you would stick to your guns when it really came down to it.

why do you need a gun in hand to tell a bunch of thugs with badges to get off your property?

They had a search warrant. The guy they were searching had some marijuana seeds in his trash. They found it and got a warrant. He is a guy that works every day, has a wife and at that time two young kids in grade school still at home. He is an adult and knew he was breaking the law. He also was no threat to anybody. Instead of sending a couple cops over to search/arrest they sent at least a dozen. Armed with what looked like to me like m16's. I was not alone in being outraged at how everyone around here had their lives put in danger by these cowards. To scared to do their job without an assault team. One man, one woman, two kids, marijuana seeds. What an imminent threat of harm to the officers. Me and my neighbors had a chat with the sheriff about it. Haven't seen that kind of nonsense since. They had a new team with new toys and wanted to play with them.

Not everyone has an experience where government is exposed for what it is, Mr. Clifton. Force
Once that is revealed it is a turning point for most people.

Well, as it stands now, the guy did fracture a law or two. I don't think full auto (or 3 round burst) should be illegal either but as of now it is and has been for decades now. The law needs to change I agree but it's not like he owned it beforehand. The big stickler here (for me) is the filed off serial numbers. No excuse for that one. I would like to be on the guys side but it's just to blatant. Not much of an excuse that he can give. The sentence seems a bit harsh for the guy I will say. 7 Years for a 70yo man that, I assume, has been a model citizen (a record probably would have been reported) seems a bit much. If it was some thug on the street I would say it wasn't enough. I'm not happy about any of this. Their are no winners here.

I'm guessing the same situation for a hoodie and/or a veteran determine whether or not a crime has been committed.

Not what I'm saying. You have to take into account the criminal record. Some thug on the street who has a record of crime should be sentenced harsher since that person obviously has no regard for the law. A model citizen (again an assumption) should not get as harsh a sentence.

Who aspires to be a 'model citizen'? Jeezus you may as well have a wonder bread mayo sandwich for 40 years and die. America doesn't need model citizens. We need people with M14s. So what if it rubbed against the gun safe andw wore the numbers off. Why are guns serialized and why does the fact this one didn't have one bother?

Serial numbers are on things to identify them.You know so that property can be recovered when stolen.People erase serial numbers to cover up crimes,same as lying etc,it is deceitful action to try to get away with something.
7 years sounds excessive for that guy if he has a clean record.

I suspect there is a whole lot more contributing to this prison term than an automatic weapon.

Numbers engraved are for the STRICT agrement between the seller and the buyer. The buyer may then, if so pleased, use them in an insurance scam. No way should govt give a ripe rip about them. Scratched off or so deep they show up on a DNA test.

You should put an advertisement in the paper for a willing jury member. Prosecutors might see it.

Of course law enforcement can use evidence like removed serial numbers as indicative of covering up a crime in their investigation.What planet are you from.

They just numbers BOCO. Save some wind for skirt blowing. Does each box of ye Lucky Charms cereal come with special numbers?

Who stole me Lucky Charms?.

Then I'd like your SS number, bank account numbers, etc. Just numbers.

it shouldn't be a crime to build a firearm for resale without a serial number. many many many firearms out there produced before that was a law. its still legal to build one for your own use without a serial number.

What actual crime did this man commit? Who was victimized by his actions?

Mike

According to this write-up, he also plead guilty to dope possession.
How much dope did he have? Might explain the sentence he got.

http://www.newser.com/story/266092/american-hero-jailed-for-decades-old-gun-buy.html

It was obvious there was more to the story and the gun headline was to tug at some hearts.

Here's another one...His family led the ATF to him.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/guns/201...-rifle-purchase

"mentally unstable addict"

Ah so he is part of the compromised class. The class that NRA and Republicans through under the bus in one of their many appeasements. "Unstable addict". LOL.

The 2nd article you posted hippie said he had 10 grams of marijuana and 2 grams cocaine,
3/8 ths of an ounce of weed,the article said he was sentenced for
possessing a firearm while using/possessing a controlled substance.
Are you suggesting anyone caught with a misdemeanor amount of
marijuana should loose their 2nd Amendment rights?
Or only if someone they know says they might have a problem?

Unlike the 4th which uses the word unreasonable which can be interpreted differently. The 2nd says 'shall not infringe' which is a "concrete" unchangeable statement. Although he can be charged with a drug crime I don't believe it constitutional to charge him with a gun crime.

Guys like him are the reason we have regulations on such firearms. Going into hospitals and threatening to shoot people in the knees and elbows while doped up.

Go ahead and defend idiots, you'll get more regulations.

I'd say go on defending regulations, you'll get more regulations.

Could be, but this guy isn't where i want to plant my flag.

Stupid is as stupid does.

Read his background....2014 brandishing a firearm while criminally tresspassing is just one. (at hospitals)
Not his first run-in whith weapons.

"repeated criminal behavior"

I agree that this guy isn't a rallying cause but I don't think that was the OPs point in the beginning.
https://www.dallasnews.com/news/guns/201...-rifle-purchase
That article is a primary example of why we need to draw a line in the sand in fact move it back.

It says they didn't charge him with the unregistered gun or serial number violation. Doesn't say what he was charged with, but my guess is repeated terroristic threats (while doped up and in possession of a gun). Fake news!

Show me a reasonable person wronged, i'll stand with. Not this guy, even his daughter saw he was nuts.

Fairweather friend to the 2nd amendment.

Fella told me.........If ya can't afford the 200 dollar stamp, ya can't afford ten seconds on the trigger, lol.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQnU1t7UzgM

Your right Finn.
Drug addicts running around with guns threatening people, i don'y support. They cause regular people to force our gov't to make laws that us normal people don't want.

The article states that he was convicted for
possessing a firearm while using illegal drugs.
Was it his kids that called ATF or were they her kids?
If her kids,is there an inheritance involved?Did they not like him being with their mom?
I know I'm throwing out "what ifs" that we don't know,
but there has to be more than we're being told.
I'm not trying to defend this individual,
do not know enough about this specific case and I
don't trust what the media is portraying,headline says he was arrested
for a scary gun, but the article says it was for possessing a firearm while using drugs.Fake news.

How about the part the he admitted to stealing the gun while in the military?

Read it close and you'll see whos daughter.

Prosecutors SAY he admitted to others (no proof and not charged) to stealing from the government.
Her last name is different than his,could be either married or the daughter of
his wife of 40 years which would still be considered "his" daughter? Don't know.
We live in a scary world when anyone can say someone is a danger,
and the law can come in and prosecute any crime they find.

So when it says his daughter, and her stepmother, you can't figure that out?

Come on, this guy IS NOT THE GUY TO STAND ON!

HE'S A POSTER CHILD FOR GUN CONTROL IDIOTS!

They just love to point out guys who buy illegal guns at gun shows (his lawyers story), want more background checks?
You guys are being stupid. PERIOD.

No such thing as illegal guns. Period.

Your right Finn, my mistake.

Even an automatic is legal for normal people, just not idiots doped up going into hospitals threatening people with them.PERIOD.

even fully automatics???

News article said he had cocaine and pot in his possession.

I think I need to start buying water proof gun safes and hide my guns before I get throwed in the slammer for a pellet gun!

https://www.foxnews.com/great-outdoors/m...-their-property