Question about Canine Flat Sets

Please excuse my crude, marked up, football playbook drawing, but I'm a visual person. I wanted some advice on what others think about their flatsets. At what point do you start to question when you are wrong in trap placement? In the photo I edited for you from this morning's check, you can see the trap in light blue, the yellow circle around the rock is a tiny bit of coyote gland lure, the yellow zig zag on the right is coyote/fox urine. The red circled tracks are from a big wolf that ran through last night, the purple circled traps are a coyote that ran through the night before.

I went with my gut this morning, and I DID NOT touch this set. I told myself, it's just a matter of time, they'll get caught, don't go messing with anything. They clearly are fired up and enjoy marking the set otherwise they wouldn't keep returning. I did put two teeny tiny rocks in each wolf track, to maybe get them to step slightly different. However, it's only a coyote trapper's nature to second guess oneself and wonder if you have your placement off? I use my trapline dog as my guide for trap placement so when he peed on this spot the day I was setting traps, I bedded the trap right in his track. He's an 80 pound collie so I thought the placement should have been perfect.

Other picture is the set the day I made it, before all the canines ran through.

Am I just overthinking it? How many "misses" do you guys let your sets get before you do something different??


Thanks for any responses.

I'd also leave it alone..but when I can't stay away any longer because the trap is still empty after two weeks I'd put in a urine post set about ten feet away using two traps.

I normally don't but I had to remake two of the sets that were within a few yards of this one because I don't use waxed dirt in early season but now we have freezing temps coming so I re-bed all my sets in weatherproof dirt....except this one lol

I'll have to do that maybe by Sunday if I don't connect. A man could drive himself crazy second guessing himself. I was thinking if I find another fresh scat pile on another property maybe I'll add it to the set a few inches up, just to keep them interested?

The lack of any backing at all surprised me.

You got an empty k9 trap that long you better be making a new set/s or move on as you are wasting your time and there's more/different k9s to be caught with less effort.

My 2 cents FWIW

Maybe it is the picture, but that black blob really sticks out. I notice a pattern of the coyote and wolf both stepping there...just different distances out. About the only pattern I see. Not a big time canine trapper, but on the flat sets I had success with, I want them focusing in on an something when the scent hits them.

Are you talking about the black blob to the left of the bottom purple coyote track? That's actually a scat pile from a fox that I added. So what you are saying makes sense, if they sniff the scat pile, then take a step forward to mark the scat pile, that's probably why their tracks are all about a foot north of my trap bed...maybe it is as simple as moving or adding a fresh scat pile 6 inches south??

Usually flat sets don't utilize a backing...but to a wild canine, even a domestic canine, those little teeny tiny tufts of grass are a fire hydrant to them

put in a third lure on a stick or rock make a triangle from the 3 lure placements. Put a trap right in the center of the triangle and make sure the scents are 9-10" away from the center of the pan.

I would not do anything to this awt either. Just in the future, perhaps pick a spot that can give you a natural walk through like some grass clumps to funnel the coyote in

I didn't pick this spot, it picked me! lol when I was scouting, I put in 2 regular boring dirt holes at this location and the backscratching and scat piles stuck out like a sore thumb...being a coyote trapper I couldn't just walk by and not put a set here. But unfortunately this is just a pond that was created 2 summers ago, so there's nothing for 100 yards in any direction, just dirt and the little bit of clover clumps that you see in the picture.

I think I'm going to slap my hand and not touch it until Sunday...and if I still haven't connected then what do I have to lose, I'll move the trap like you said, to the north 6-8 inches where those tracks seem to congregate.

It is a nice subtle well blended set, I would leave the trap as is and guide a little harder with the Fox turd and a dirt clod or two. It will make a catch either way before too long I would think.

Put a trail cam on it on video setting to see what there doing. It will answer all your questions.

The perfect circle around your trap tells me. Make were they are stepping less inviting or add another trap. A small stepping stick wouldn't hurt. They are showing you were they want to step. Now you show them where to step.

I would take a rock and smear some lure on the bottom of the rock and put it behind the trap where the purple circle is

IMO he knows where your trap is ,That means odor to me

I'm not a master at the flat set but I like my attractants about 9 inches or so from the pan of the trap so they have to take a step to get from one odor to the other. It's hard to tell from photo but it appears your attractants may be closer than that. Also like previously mentioned move the droppings so that all three attractants make a triangle with trap centered.

^^^^^ couldn’t have said it better ! ^^^^^^

It will happen, I saw prints in the frozen mud, missed trap by inches

That's exactly why I am not a huge flat set fan. They have their time and place. Why not make a step-down dirthole right there and force him to step on your pan? I guess I'm boring just running the same basic dirthole over and over again. It out produces the flashy sets with transplanted grass, four holes around a trap, or trying to judge where a coyote is going to step between grass patches. I see people constantly having dug up traps, near misses, etc. Generally the only evidence I see of coyote visits are when they're spinning in a catch circle. I've come to the conclusion our Nebraska coyotes are just dumber than the average coyote apparently.

Really?

Because I make many hundreds of them every year and they always have backing.

Backing eliminates 180 degrees of real estate and is a percentage multiplier.

Give up Boone you are outnumbered, lol.

I run flat sets only as a third set. Typically just two to a location, one a dirthole and other is a pee post.
Wade I must be boring too.
Maybe I'll try a flat or two more this year, maybe.
Jim

I usually set a flat and a dirt hole, sometimes two flats no dirt hole, the have a backing too

I love using flat sets, and they ALWAYS have some sort of backing. As said above the backing eliminates the animal working it from the back (usually).

I usually set two sets at least per location, one dirthole and one flat. The dirtholes are big and flashy the flats sets are invisible, I figure make the sets polar opposites I can get the brash and the shy animals both

Boone has to troll every post I ever make on Facebook too, for some reason, he just doesn't like me. Boone, I didn't mean to say that NO flat sets have backing, but I just meant in a general sense compared to a dirthole.

You have to realize, Boone catches a lot of coyotes. I would pay close attention if he offers advice. I agree completely with what he has told you.as I do the same. No backing,well you are just allowing them to come to the backside.

Sniper and Boone are offering good advice. You can help guide the animal without extra effort simply by choosing your spot. Doesnt have to be much, subtle is better. Take your time and look around for those spots its worth an extra minute or two.

Not to pick sides in a feud if there is one, and I'll say I have no idea what happens on other sites, but I'll say Boone is one of the guys I setup and listen to when he posts on here. And the more I learn the more I value his insight.

The only set I ever make without a backing is a dirt hole. I can construct a dirt hole in a way that guides the animal if there is not a backing, I still prefer a backing if one is available.

A flat set needs a backing if you want it to be a high percentage set even if you have to place a backing where you want to make the set.

I ran my falts sets and scent post this year with old cattle skulls and leg bones. Caught my first coyotes. Did not have any luck with dirt holes this year. I will keep trying. What do those of you with experience think of setting these up in advance and putting urine on them in the summer? then set them when the season opens.

I disagree with moving or making new sets after 2 weeks of empty traps. The last 2 weeks here in MN has included deer rifle season. This 1 week of chaos sends the coyotes running, especially in this area. So I figure that's at least 1 week of nothing and don't expect coyotes for another week. This is what I usually see here in this area.

I'm sorry I should re-phrase, I COMPLETELY agree that Boone knows what he is talking about, I respect him as a Western coyote trapper and I actually follow his posts on Facebook because I manage most of the trapping groups and pages on Facebook! I just meant that Boone doesn't like me based on what he's told me in the past, that he thinks I'm trapping for "attention". Again, I'm not discrediting him at all, and I appreciate all the advice! But I just know that trapping in Wisconsin is MUCH different than trapping in the south or out west, so I also consider that when reading feedback, as so far, much of the advice posted wouldn't apply to Wisconsin due to legality or logistics.

This is the thread on Trapperman that I was referencing when I said "no backing". I didn't mean absolutely no backing, I just mean very small and subtle. The tufts of grass and scat clump in my original photo ARE the focal points because this area is just a completely flat dirt spot; no rocks, no grass, nothing, like a smooth gravel road. In my experience with the shy WI coyotes we have, if you bring out a new rock or log and place it somewhere, it takes them months to feel comfortable to start using it. https://trapperman.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/350303/all/FLAT_SET_-_The_No.1_flat_set_I

Here are a few of my other "flat sets" that I use, hopefully it will show that I don't mean just placing the trap in the wide open with no appeal. I don't often log into this forum so I miss some of the advice before I pull my sets but I appreciate learning from those who are experienced. Being a female in a male-dominated sport, I often have a "chip on my shoulder" and become defensive, especially because I try to really put in 210% effort in everything I do and for some guys, it still isn't good enough. I feel that I'm experienced enough to be able to give advice as it pertains to Wisconsin coyotes, but still like to learn from the Western guys in case anything else can apply here, after all, none of us will ever be experts in trapping, and you can't ever know everything since these animals teach us something new every day.