Ky passes new conceal carry law

Ok now Ky is a no permit required to carry concealed. I think it is a mistake but oh well. I took the class and got mine . But now anyone can carry. They claim "ONLY LAW ABIDING" can buy a gun. WRONG until they do back ground checks at flea markets anyone can buy a gun. PLUS look at the revenue that is lost. It is estimated that each sheriffs office in the state will loose on average 44,000 - 50,000 a year in distribution fees. Not to mention the instructors they just put out of business

Jbyrd I may agree with you on SEC football, but your stance on God given/Natural rights is bizarre. Why should anyone have to pay a fee to have the right to defend themselves?

Anyone that couldn't carry legally under the old law, didn't follow the law, you know they carried. Why punish the law abiding citizenry. I say WTG Kentucky!!

I find it odd that part of your complaint is that Sheriffs offices can no longer monetize a constitutional right.

And some folks wonder why we fight to preserve the Constitution?

After a couple LEO deaths in traffic stops, the change will probably be revisited.

Criminals going to get handguns if they want them, why make law abidding citizens have to pay to carry. I feel safer knowing the good guys got um too. Arkansas just cc and the sky isn't falling.

I bet it was a bipartisan vote lol.

18 States now have Constitutional carry now, none have been repealed yet!

It amazes me that people still believe outlaws willing to kill a cop wont arm theirself if there is a law forbidding them too.

because that wasnt happening anyway?


criminals DONT FOLLOW THE LAW. They were carrying anyway. At least now the citizens of KY dont have a tax on their rights. WTG Kentucky! I wish the rest of the country would follow suit.

NOT MY POINT . My point and concern is with allowing people to carry with little or no training. YES most that will carry know how to handle a fire arm but a lady friend of ours that I don't think has ever shot a gun says she is going to buy one to carry now. Didn't want to go thru the class because she was embarrased on how she might shoot.

Are those pearls you're clutching real?

Mike

Have you offered to instruct her on safe handling and shooting?

Mike

Oh crap. Now criminals are gonna carry guns Illegally. Because they never did that before.

Why, did they make murder legal also? Way to go Ky, one of the few states moving in the conservative direction.

We’ve had no-permit constitutional carry here in Idaho for some time now. I have yet to hear about shootouts on every corner or cops getting shot up. Believe me. Our lovely liberal Idaho Statesman would gleefully report on it in spades if it happened.

Works here in KS too.

Grandaughters preschool teacher was here the other night doing quilt stuff with my wife. Said she was thinking about buying a gun. I suggested she take the hunter safety course first. Explained it was mostly basic firearm safety and was free. Got a gun store a few miles from here with an indoor range. Good bunch of guys there. I told her to go there to buy a firearm and get some training on shooting after she had the basic safety course. She will be fine I'm sure.

I forgot the 2A had the clause that right to bear arms shall not be infringed unless you didnt take a cc class.

Most people that buy a gun usually learn how to use it and shoot it a little at least.

Its amazing there are people that are "pro" 2a that then turn around and say except for her or him or that one because maybe they shouldnt have one or maybe they should take a class..

Everyone should have a gun. Everyone. Even felons.(once they pay their debt to society, all their rights should be returned to them. If they dont deserve their rights they shouldnt have been released or shouldve been shot to begin with). And everyone should carry their gun every time they leave their house. The world wouldnt end in a mass shootout. The opposite would happen. Return to polite society where everyone feels secure.

Blood will run in the streets !! Shootouts on every corner !! It will be Dodge City in the old West !!

That's the mantra the antis use every time another law passes that further the rights of gun owners. Funny thing is that never has happened in any state, stats from any of these states law enforcement support CC and constitutional carry. Freedom sure is scary for some people.

several states have had this for a long time others more recent and yet no blood. bunch of fear mongering put on by antis and to many otherwise good people fall for it.

the blood never actually runs in the streets

if anything it reduces crime because it ads fear to the criminal that anyone can have a gun


your never going to believe this criminals don't worry about breaking the law they worry about getting dead.

Way to go Kentucky !

Your lady friend better learn the law. There is a big difference in the law between carrying a gun and when your allowed to pull the trigger. Every state is different and one better take the time to learn. Just brandishing a gun can put you in the slammer. I hope you inform her. Also, conceal carry classes usually don't have shooting. It's usually just classroom.

That's just crazy. We have a constitutional right to carry, and the revenue the police gain is basically stealing money from people. We never should have to pay for a permit to carry a gun. I'm waiting for WI to stop with permit. It has been brought up. Just a matter of time.

Sprung don't know about where you live but in Ky it is approximetly 6- 8 hrs classroom and then 4- 6 hrs range time. At which point you have to hit a certain number of shots in a certain area out of 20 rounds. Then you have to take down that weapon and put it back together.

You could always carry open !!!!! . (as the constitution warrants) it was concealed that you had to have a permit for............... DUH ......CCWP Concealed Carry Weapons Permit

SO NO ONE WAS TAKING YOUR RIGHTS. !!!!! GEEZ calm down ...............

here in ks its have gun will travel. just like the old tv show. I like sitting out front of the local tavern to watch the gunfights on Saturday night. makes my wife nervous but I do it anyway.

Here in WI if you have passed your hunter safety, you don't need the class. I just mailed in my money with proof of hunters safety and got my permit.

Ohio ccw barely requires a range test...mine was can you put 5 shots through a paper plate at 7 yards.

Don't worry about the sherriffs revenue.. with CAF that 55k is petty cash

It's not revenue up here, it defrays the cost of back ground checks, they say, and the administration there of.

Where in the 2A does it say "bear arms openly" or "bear arms on your hip or across your back in plain view"?

Or...

"Bear concealed arms as long as they sit through a class and bribe the local constabulary"?

Mike

Jbyrd63.....listen to these fellow trappers, they know of which they speak! Are you just buthurt because you had to take the class, but now you wouldn't?

New Hampshire is one of the 18.......”Live Free or Die” our state motto.

I never would purchase a Kentucky CC permit because I didn't feel the state government had a right to charge me to exercise a constitutional right, concealed or not, they never had legal standing to infringe that right.

Though this new law brings a lot of satisfaction....Nothing really changes for me, exercise your constitutional rights regardless of who tries to infringe them, to the point of open rebellion if necessary.

My dad and sister went and took theirs about a year ago. Bet they wish they would have waited now.

Oh yes what was I thinking they know everything about everything. !!!
Don't believe it just ask them !!!

Plus if you dare to put your opinion in and they don't agree you are a stupid, backwards , hill bred imbesile. Some one that wants to do away with their God given right to own ,shoot ,or carry any type of fire arm.
( sounds like a bunch of democrats and some of their opinions and people that don't agree),

First of all the ONLY GOD given right you have is to be born then the right to chose whether you accept him into your life. Then you die. EVERYTHING in between is man made.

Ok what does this mean.

Or just your mouth moving again

Once again someone has an opinion about something and instant chest thumping and firearm stroking takes place . Some of you are pathetic. I don't agree with this bill. Think back ground checks need to be performed before someone can carry a concealed weapon. Funny almost all you guys thought the CCW permits were great when they came out. ALL YOU GUYS LINED up to get yours !!!!! Don't say you didn't. !!!! Now they were an infringement on your rights since they aren't needed any more,
GEEZ .........

Mark it down MORE places are going to post that NO fire arms allowed because of this. Before this bill passed business owners at least had some peace in knowing the person packing had been some what checked out. It was my understanding that the permit afforded you some form of protection against prosecution . It was told in our class that if you walked in and was carrying ALL they could do was ask you to leave. BET YOU money now there will be laws passed to have a fine or penalty of some type.

Conceal carry permits are pointless.

The only advantage to purchase a permit it you have Constitutional carry is so you have something to show when your in another State that requires a permit to carry. Some States only honor the enhanced permits the require a lot more to get one of them. Here you walk in the Sheriffs Office give them $10 and they do a quick check and you leave with a temporary and get the card in the mail. The enhanced permit requires fingerprints and a class.

Law dog that's what we had to do in Ky. (class finger print) Believe it or not guys I'll renew mine when it's time just to be covered in other states.

Depends what a guy is going to do really if a guy never travels then he really can do without one if one is not required in State.

that's funny even funnier than saying permits and background checks stop crimminals from being armed. that is exactly what I did. refuse to ask for permission.


its to bad its not a crime to sell heroin without a license. addiction is a serious national problem that is largely unchecked.

I never would purchase a Kentucky CC permit because I didn't feel the state government had a right to charge me to exercise a constitutional right, concealed or not, they never had legal standing to infringe that right.

This is the way I felt too kycoyotehunter.

Jbyrd63, the wife and I took the CCW class when we lived in Ky. 8 hrs total, about 6 classroom and 2 long slow hours on the range. No need to breakdown a gun if you bring a revolver. I think it was 20 shots at a human silhouette target at 21 feet with 11 hits in the lethal zone. So easy a blind person could do it. Also, there never was any penalty for carrying in an owner posted location. The law specifically states that it is not a firearm violation. You could be charged with trespassing if you refuse to leave but cannot be charged with a firearm violation. I love this part of the law.

I personally see concealed carry as a constitutional right - the bear part of "keep and bear." No special permit should be required for a legal firearm owner. On the other hand, much has been made of the additional screening CCW permit holders have gone through. In truth it is much made about nothing. I don't believe anyone that can legally purchase a handgun can be denied a permit so long as they take and pass the class. Having the permit is a plus in Ky for anyone wishing to purchase another firearm as no NICS check is required.

As NY and Ca and other liberal states try to ban guns entirely the conservatives states make it easier to carry them concealed. This is just one more issue following the path of politics in general in our nation today. Conservatives moving to the right and liberals moving to the left leaving the middle empty.

I believe Maine holds the second highest per capita gun ownership and second lowest crime rate in the nation. We also have Constitutional Carry. It ain't the guns. You guys got to learn to treat each other better.

Has Minnesota and Wisconsin joined the Constitution Carry Clan yet ?

You've got great demographics .

Lot of liberals in the southern part of the state, Aaron. Lot of guns, too.

Guess your class was smaller than mine took longer at the range.

Hey Ed why di you take the class. Others on here think it wrong to ask you to do it.

I think it was BECAUSE IT WAS THE RIGHT THING TO DO...correct me if I am wrong.

Ok some have said they didn't do it . But how many that are thumping their chest and rubbing their muzzle on here DID get their CCW???? Why did you ? Now you are mouthing off that "way to go KY It is my right not to need one" !!!!


OK speak up be a man !!!!!

I DID !

One more thing I think the "bear " part of the keep and bear arms means you have the right to use them to protect yourself. Not that you automatically can carry.

OK when this law was made what type of weapon was available to "keep and Bare" ??????????

how can you protect yourself with a firearm unless your carrying it?

When the 2nd was ratified there were no unauthorized weapons. You were free to mount a canon on your wagon and load it with 6 pounds of buckshot. I haven't tried that but I believe it would be effective against a pretty big crowd. You were free to buy a mortar and exploding mortar rounds, or exploding canon rounds or rockets or anything else you thought you might need.

Did you think the local authorities were consulted before someone had a blacksmith beat them out a rifle?

Hey if they can figure a way to tax it it will happen.
Heroin still doesn't touch the number of alcohol related deaths. But just like heroin can be bought on most street corners.

working on it in WI legislation has been out there made it through committee and republican leadership wouldn't let it to the floor for a vote.

now with a DEM in the governors office unlikely

we were actually very close to winning enough court cases that we were anticipating de facto carry when they they passed the CCL legislation in 2011.

we have always had open carry with a 100 dollar fine for getting caught concealed.

in 2011 car carry of a loaded handgun also went through , before that even though you could open carry , unload and case getting into a vehicle

so any one 18 and older can car carry a loaded handgun no training , no permit.

the issues is school zones , the federal law says only licenses or permit holders in school zones.

Here in KS its a felony to enforce federal gun law. Our sorry judiciary wont push it and arrest any atf agents. So instead GOA is taking it to court. Meanwhile though I seriously doubt any federal agents like atf or marshalls or fbi are going to start searching people to see if they are armed in a school zone.

WOW, just WOW is all I have to say to you jbird.

Mouthing off??? That seems like an unnecessary and inappropriate accusation in a civil discussion. Regardless, I'll answer your questions the best I can.



The answer is that at the time it was the ONLY way to be able to carry concealed and do it legally. Vermont and Alaska were the only states that allowed concealed carry w/o a permit. It was the right thing to do if I wanted to carry. It's fine for others to say they should not have to get a permit, and I also think a permit should not be required, but I was not about to carry w/o a permit and risk a felony that would cost me the right to own firearms.

So when you ask I assume you are asking what concealable firearms were available when the constitution was written. The answer is that there were numerous small flintlock pistols available at the time that could be concealed in one's clothing. Here is a link to one that is an actual antique flintlock pistol

Here is another but a reproduction
screw barrel flintlock pistol

I don't necessarily think the permit process is bad, but it appears to me to be an unnecessary burden on a law abiding citizen with the right to "keep and bear" arms. It interferes with the ability of a person under threat from immediately being able to arm themselves in public without drawing unreasonable attention to themselves via open carry. In the time a person may have to wait to get into a class and go through the permit application process, they could be killed. I'm thinking specifically of a woman being stalked or threatened by an ex. Without a permit being required the same person could go to one of numerous gun stores with ranges, purchase a revolver, and take a few lessons. They would then be just as competent as many who pass the CCW class and legally able to carry concealed for their own protection in a matter a day or two instead of perhaps 6 weeks. I see this as a positive change.

You could also add Ed, to the question about specific weapons.........
When the constitution was written, the people could own, and did, equal weapons as the gov't. We are actually more restricted today than at that time.

That's true hippie. Even limiting the discussion to individually operated weapons and excluding warships, jet fighters, and crew manned weapons like cannon, the weapons we can own do not match the weapons of our military. However, in the 18th century there was no difference between what a man could own and what the military used.

I can carry anyplace in the Country on my LEO ID and I believe everyone should be able to do the same but I still have a State carry permit as it only takes one idiot to ruin your day so a CYA move can come in handy at times. Even with a LEO ID all State laws need to be followed and some are ridiculous so everyone is still as risk if they are not informed.

I was hunting at a military base one year and asked if I could just have my pistol in the vehicle in the woods off of the base it looked like a un-shot prairie dog town with the heads popping up at every cubical! LOL

And often the citizenry has had better rifles than the military. May I point to the original Armalite rifle amongst other cases in different wars/time periods.

Ive been in LE here in KY for 23 years, the new law faze phase me.....

Im always amazed at the number of open carry people I see. If I was someone with bad intentions and I was evaluating what my threats would be, the first one I would take out would be the open carry guy. Ive never carried my off duty gun in plain view when Im out and about, that's just me though...

do you think people plot to take out the cop first or wait till he drives away. 99.99% of the time they wait till the cop drives away

likewise 99.99% of the time they waited for the OC to walk or drive away.
until very recently i was aware of no examples of an open carrier being the victim but that did change in Milwaukee it must be getting harder to get a decent gun because they started ambushing open carriers in MKE for their gun. guns had already been stolen from federal agents in MKE so they are bold, i don't recall if it was 1 or 2 times it happened but 2 guys on one oc by himself the guy walked around a corner to a gun in his face and another coming up behind him to take his gun from the holster.

I also don't OC but I do think it is a right , I also don't drive a flashy car that begs to be stolen but doing so certainly isn't a crime.

Somewhat like the OP, I am a little conflicted by the prospect of ignorance on the part of some folks carrying guns. In todays society, what used to be common sense no longer exists. Even so, the training required doesn't need to take up half a day or cost big bucks.

Here is all you need to know about the use of deadly force:

• You need to be an unwilling participant
• You need to be in fear of death, or great bodily harm to yourself, or others
• No lesser force will do
• Know where you are: In some places you may "stand your ground"; In other places force only where no retreat is possible

I see someone missed some in service training. Lol Just kidding.

Studies and interviews don’t support that . Nor does real life experience.

Bad guys get focused and go into straight up “ tunnel vision “ as much as trained shooters.

It doesn't matter what you "think". It matters what the law states.

What I meant Aaron.....

Hypothetically, if I was a bad guy, with bad intentions, and I saw a law abiding citizen who open carries, I would take that person out first because he poses a threat to me and my illegal activity I’m trying to get away with.

If you want to open carry, have at it.

If you want to conceal carry, knock yourself out. I don’t have issues with either.

I’ve been in an officer involved shooting, I know about tunnel vision, auditory exclusion, and the after effects.

Carry on gentlemen.

My son in law open carries. He believes it makes him less likely to ever need it if people know he is armed. I don't have an opinion I just don't know. One advantage is speed to draw. Lots easier to put your hand on a weapon carried outside your clothes no matter how good your concealment strategy is.

If I'm ever in a position where I cant get out of shooting somebody I want them to find out I'm armed when bullets are hitting them in the chest. I think that element of surprise will be an advantage.

This might surprise you but I plan on taking the class even though we just passed constitutional carry here too.

Why?

The training to see if I can shoot a firearm doesn't interest me much. I know which end the bullets come out of... My main focus is the legalities involved in shoot/don't shoot situations. So as a responsible citizen I will do my part. But I'll be damned if I'm going to beseech the government to force everyone to do that.

I'll worry about me. Everyone else can worry about themselves.

Mike

Lots of different ways to look at it Danny.... Each has his/her own choice. Mall shootings, nightclub shootings, school shootings, whatever the case may be, if I’m committed and don’t care if I lose my own life, I’m taking out the immediate threats I can see....

I think most people will continue to take the class. You still have to have it to carry out of state. I like it and I'm surprised how many people are questioning that decision. There's a lot of people that do not like our Governor now and will not agree with any decision he makes.

not every state requires permission. there is a lot of momentum for the right to be armed

lots of states don't care if you have a note from mommy saying you can carry your firearm. they will still arrest you.

If I still lived in Ky with the new law in effect and did not already have a permit, I would take advantage of the new law and carry concealed every day like I do now. However, I would also take the class to get the permit in order to be able to purchase w/o waiting on a NICS check and to be able to carry in reciprocal states. The key to me is that I would not have to wait on a permit to legally carry concealed in state.

"Don't care if I lose my own life". You mean go to prison or being killed?

IF you are not stable enough to carry a weapon, are you stable enough to be walking the streets?

The notion that a shooter enters an area and takes the time to identity a handgun openly carried firearm is crazy. A uniformed person at most. But we're giving way too much credit to these guys. It's a numbers game and time is of the essence. So get in and start shooting .

I agree 100%. I see no difference between open carry and concealed. Our constitution says "Shall not be Infringed" and every politician thinks they can override our constitution.

Explain more please.