I have a question about NICS

Is it illegal to try to purchase a firearm when you have been ruled by a court that you cannot because you have been deemed mentally unfit? The reason I ask this is because the mass shooter in Texas was deemed unfit and tried to get a firearm and was denied. Shouldn't he have been swooped up right then?
Gunman mentally unfit uses "loophole" to purchase firearm

i know what your asking but being mentally unfit as yet is not a crime lying on your application is

I believe he bought it privately. If a 16 yr old attempts to buy cigs should he be arrested?

No. It's not a crime to fail a background check.

The gun he used was yes, bought privately. However he tried to purchase one at a store first, and NICS kicked him out. If someone has been federally banned from owning and purchasing firearms, and tries to get one you would think that would be a huge red flag and illegal.

Wouldn't he have lied?

Don't know what he checked on the form

Would you want to be arrested if you got flagged as a false positive or you had something in your paat that disqualified you from purchasing a gun and you didn't know?

Good point. Isn't the question of being deemed mentally unfit on the form? Guess he could have checked yes.

I believe from the story on Fox that he had to go to court and was ruled unfit from a Judge. I think you would know, but???

Yes it is along with domestic abuse,illegal alien restraining order any felony and a lot of have you evers

yes but the government failed you for the multi millionth time , they tout the millions of denies they said they would prosecute at the beginning of the NICs lie as the system working to prevent sales and not them failing to do what they promised they would and what would be a slam dunk case.

Catc22 and Sniper, I have a buddy who found out he had been a victim to identity theft when he went to buy a gun. He was red flagged but yet has never been arrested or stepped in court. Long story short he knew the guy that used his info and pressed charges and it is a process for him to buy a gun now. That is the very short version of the story.

That's what I'm seeing here. The shooting would have been prevented if this guy was cuffed and stuffed when he applied to purchase.

a friend who used to be a LEO has a person with the same name who got themselves in a bunch of trouble.
my friend knows if she goes to buy a gun it is going to take 3 days and a phone call every time and builds that into any shopping trip.
a PIN personal identification number can help sort out that your the real you , you need to get it form the state DOJ

That stinks. Yup I think he has a PIN and takes a few forms but still has the 3 day wait too

It is a Federal Felony for a prohibited person to attempt to purchase a firearm. But, that's just another law that nobody enforces!

This is what I thought. If he was deemed mentally unfit by the court of law it should be on his background check (Maybe Texas doesn't report, good ol' IL does).

NICS Form 4473 https://www.atf.gov/file/61446/download

read it for yourself

Have you ever been adjudicated as a mental defective OR have you ever been committed to a mental institution?

This guy sure was and tried to get a firearm, why was he not arrested is what I'm wondering.

The crime isn't in trying to buy the gun, but in submitting a false affidavit in trying to buy one. You have to fill out the form, sign the affidavit part, and turn it in to the gun dealer, who then checks with NICS system.

The problem is the feds hardly ever arrest and prosecute for filing the false affidavit. Leaving the miscreant free to look somewhere else for the firearm.

Jim

Enforcement is the huge issue. Unless there are state laws prohibiting the attempted purchase, then the county sheriffs deputy's or city police officers will likely notify federal investigators and defer enforcement of federal statute to them. And who gets called by the gun stores? The locals. Ever try finding a phone number for a local FBI agent or ATF agent? Good luck. You'll get bounced all over the place and the run around until you give up.

Theres lots of federal law that isn't state law, so local authorities lack jurisdiction. Legislatures need to step up and help create laws for law enforcement to act. And theres also a lot of identity theft as mentioned, so even a prohibited person could argue someone else did it unless you have someone at the store that's a rock solid witness or the person is caught there still in the act.

Also NICS hits and requests for records are unfortunately probably ignored by many many small town or county law enforcement that have no idea what they're getting requests for due to lack of resources and high turnover. And or NICS is sending requests to out dated fax numbers or email addresses. How many agencies know who to call to update that contact info if someone leaves?

I thought Americans have the right to bear arms.

We do.

That shooting in TX, where law enforcement failed to stop him when the first shots were fired, just shows that LE cant protect you and NICS check at gun stores is a waste of tax dollars. Even if private sales are required to get a check first how will that be enforced? Your supposed to have a prescription to buy cocaine also.

Mostly in theory.

They have forgotten that whole, “shall not be infringed” part quite a long time ago.

not all of us rob

I said mostly. Some states don’t allow the peasants to carry or defend themselves. They need to wait until the report writers come to document the crime, after it happens of course.

Sounds to me like most that replied on this thread want more infringement. At least they seem to want existing infringements to be enhanced and enforced and some suggested that states all follow the feds down the road to arms prohibition. When guns are banned in the USA it will be the gun owners that did it, not the antis. Gun owners club has written all the gun control laws to date. eh?

3%. 7 generations ago in 1740 my great great great great great great grandfather, John Clifton was born in Virginia. He latter married Mary Perry. He risked everything he had and everything his family had, to fight for a government that would recognize the rights we have today. I'm not going to let him down and just give them back.


https://archive.org/stream/listofrevolution00virg/listofrevolution00virg_djvu.txt

As an FFL dealer I will not call the BATF if a person answers "yes" to any of the questions 11B thru 12.D.1. We cannot call it in if there is a "yes" on any of those questions.
If a person lies on the form and we call it in they should be "denied" if the BATF records are good.
If the applicant feels that the BATF denies them unjustly we provide them with the proper appeal form to submit and get their records cleaned up. Several persons have done that successfully but it usually takes quite a while maybe be a year.
We have not used the "E check" system over the computer so I cannot say how it works.