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A recession?

Posted By: Wild_Idaho

A recession? - 03/19/20 11:56 PM

Been researching the possibility of a recession worse than the one in 2008, due to the virus and global economies shutting down. Hope I'm not opening a can of worms here, but I'd like to hear the thoughts of trappers on this. Been reading a lot of articles online that are purely speculation but a lot of them seem to think there will be a recession. And what I'm reading makes sense. A recession seems inevitable... but for how long and how bad?
Posted By: Bob_Iowa

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 12:09 AM

I think it would be short, since this time the medical field and its suppliers are making money last time I check 3M was doing very well, also people are waiting for the bottom to reinvest, what bothers me the most is this oil feud thats the wild card in this, if it doesn’t rebound it may not be pretty in the ag sector.
Posted By: Diggerman

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 12:13 AM

Originally Posted by Bob_Iowa
I think it would be short, since this time the medical field and its suppliers are making money last time I check 3M was doing very well, also people are waiting for the bottom to reinvest, what bothers me the most is this oil feud thats the wild card in this, if it doesn’t rebound it may not be pretty in the ag sector.

Curios, Why. Low fuel cost would be a boon to me.
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 12:15 AM

It will bounce back fast , once people start to realize this fake crisis is all BS
Posted By: SundanceMtnMan

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 12:17 AM

I believe we are on the verge of a worldwide depression comparable to 1929. It took a world war to pull us out of that one and unfortunately a world war now would probably involve nuclear weapons. I hope I am wrong but it doesn't look good.
Posted By: Bob_Iowa

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 12:20 AM

You have low fuel, nitrogen (if Koch wants), but the ethanol plants cant make money so they shut down one less place to sell, and then you lose the distillers grain which is used in most feed, and is a lot more efficient than feeding more shell corn and soybean meal.
Posted By: atrapper

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 12:20 AM


Originally Posted by Diggerman
Originally Posted by Bob_Iowa
I think it would be short, since this time the medical field and its suppliers are making money last time I check 3M was doing very well, also people are waiting for the bottom to reinvest, what bothers me the most is this oil feud thats the wild card in this, if it doesn’t rebound it may not be pretty in the ag sector.

Curios, Why. Low fuel cost would be a boon to me.


I know in my hometown the ethanol plant is planning to shut down for two weeks due to the oil issues going on and foreseeable lack of gasoline sales. People are staying in, not driving places. The local ethanol plant is a huge factor to ag success in our area. Many, many, bushels of corn are consumed at this plant.
Posted By: Yes sir

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 12:28 AM

Look a national debt and private sector debit. We may have run out of air to keep the bubble inflated....
Posted By: proratman

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 12:33 AM

Based on what is happening in China, the Coronavirus should "Burn itself out" in June. That is the good news. The bad news is that the damage will have already been done. With record high unemployment there will be many foreclosures and bankruptcies. Plus many consumers will get behind on their credit and that will only make things worse.
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:01 AM

Social income would prevent something like this to be so devastating. Tax the Wall Street tycoons who benefit from things like this and allow for social income. Even if it’s not permanent. Social income for the next few months would help us all.
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:05 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
Social income would prevent something like this to be so devastating. Tax the Wall Street tycoons who benefit from things like this and allow for social income. Even if it’s not permanent. Social income for the next few months would help us all.



Move to canada or another country if you want free crap !!


Are you a bernie lover ?
Posted By: Yes sir

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:10 AM

I think he showed his hand on the gun thread were he told someone he'd gladly give up his guns to see them lose theirs. Now he's backing socialism.....
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:11 AM

Originally Posted by Yes sir
I think he showed his hand on the gun thread were he told someone he'd gladly give up his guns to see them lose theirs. Now he's backing socialism.....



Crazy !
Posted By: Boco

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:12 AM

Trump's turning socialist,lol,
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:14 AM

Originally Posted by Boco
Trump's turning socialist,lol,



He's just playing along .......for now
Posted By: danny clifton

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:14 AM

takes all kinds to make a world i guess but why pretend your a trapper?
Posted By: bblwi

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:14 AM

Yes many will do pent up stock buying, travel etc. etc. My wife and I are using our stay at home time to really review our spending habits. With our two major trips cancelled for the year and not much else going on I can see where we may just choose to spend 10K less per year. One can get really used to not doing many things we just did because we had more time and discretionary money. I think many of the elder families that are the targeted group with this virus will just decide lie we are doing to live more economically and not feel like we are sacrificing anything. Also retired persons don't have employment options to rebuild wealth and financial security. Their retirement savings are important for their standard of living and for many minor to major adjustments will need to be made.

Bryce
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:15 AM

I do agree with some of Bernie’s thoughts. I’m not for all socialism but we do need to find out how to fix the wealth gap and a way for everyone to have medical assistance. And I’m not against guns, but we do need to figure something out to stop guns getting in the wrong hands.
Posted By: Yes sir

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:16 AM

Originally Posted by Boco
Trump's turning socialist,lol,

Good, let's get this show on the road, I'm tired of waiting. Lol
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:23 AM

Originally Posted by Boco
Trump's turning socialist,lol,


It’s about time. He’s starting to see the logic in it. Now that he can see the benefits of some social programs, maybe he can Make America Great Again.
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:23 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
I do agree with some of Bernie’s thoughts. I’m not for all socialism but we do need to find out how to fix the wealth gap and a way for everyone to have medical assistance. And I’m not against guns, but we do need to figure something out to stop guns getting in the wrong hands.

Sounds like Canada is the perfect place for you ...........im being serious

America is a place where you make your own way ........
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:27 AM

I love America. But we can always improve.
Posted By: danny clifton

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:37 AM

how can you love america then say the guy in the mirror is not the one responsible for your lack of money?
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:46 AM

I don’t have a lack of money. Doesn’t mean I can’t have the desire for the wealth gap to be fixed and affordable medical for everyone. Socialism isn’t a poor person thing. It’s for everyone.
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:51 AM

You had the same opportunity as everyone else

What did you choose for a living ?

Why didnt you create facebook ? Anyone of us could have or should have, but we all chose something else
Posted By: Yes sir

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:51 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
I don’t have a lack of money. Doesn’t mean I can’t have the desire for the wealth gap to be fixed and affordable medical for everyone. Socialism isn’t a poor person thing. It’s for everyone.

Socialism is for everyone......
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:58 AM

Originally Posted by Yes sir
Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
I don’t have a lack of money. Doesn’t mean I can’t have the desire for the wealth gap to be fixed and affordable medical for everyone. Socialism isn’t a poor person thing. It’s for everyone.

Socialism is for everyone......


Finally, someone who agrees. Now I don’t believe in all socialism but some sort of social income for those who make under a certain amount would be amazing. I don’t mind paying slightly higher taxes to help others less fortunate. They way this country discriminated against African Americans and Latino people is crazy. We like to keep them on the low income side which forces there kids to grow up with nothing so the very wealthy few can make more money.
Posted By: Yes sir

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:02 AM

Only thing I agreed with you on is when you said you needed a break from this place. Unfortunately you couldn't even do it for 12 hours.
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:13 AM

Originally Posted by Yes sir
Only thing I agreed with you on is when you said you needed a break from this place. Unfortunately you couldn't even do it for 12 hours.


Haha someone has some hard feelings in their heart. I sure hope you aren’t Christian. Doesnt sound like a Christ like attitude to me. Charity, the pure love of Christ, goes a long ways. I decided I need to change my attitude because I was going against my post and being negative.
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:14 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
I don’t have a lack of money. Doesn’t mean I can’t have the desire for the wealth gap to be fixed and affordable medical for everyone. Socialism isn’t a poor person thing. It’s for everyone.



What wealth gap might you be concerned about ?
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:15 AM

Originally Posted by white17
Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
I don’t have a lack of money. Doesn’t mean I can’t have the desire for the wealth gap to be fixed and affordable medical for everyone. Socialism isn’t a poor person thing. It’s for everyone.



What wealth gap might you be concerned about ?

That a few people have more wealth than the bottom 50% (over 175 million people).
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:18 AM

Cat trapper , next year lets mix in someones worthless western oregon cats with your nice nevada cats and pay you the average for yours .

You good with that ?
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:24 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
Originally Posted by white17



What wealth gap might you be concerned about ?

That a few people have more wealth than the bottom 50% (over 175 million people).


Why is that any of your business even if its true. You might benefit from this article.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-truth-about-income-inequality-11572813786

It requires a subscription so if you can't afford to open the link I'll copy/paste it for you
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:25 AM

Originally Posted by AntiGov
Cat trapper , next year lets mix in someones worthless western oregon cats with your nice nevada cats and pay you the average for yours .

You good with that ?

I'll throw in some pine thicket Arkansas cats for that deal! Let's do it!
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:27 AM

Originally Posted by AntiGov
Cat trapper , next year lets mix in someones worthless western oregon cats with your nice nevada cats and pay you the average for yours .

You good with that ?


I don’t trap for the money so that’s not a good example. But I agree it’s not far just because someone was born somewhere with horrible cats that they can’t make as much as someone who was born near high end cats.
Posted By: Monster Toms

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:30 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
Originally Posted by AntiGov
Cat trapper , next year lets mix in someones worthless western oregon cats with your nice nevada cats and pay you the average for yours .

You good with that ?


I don’t trap for the money so that’s not a good example. But I agree it’s not far just because someone was born somewhere with horrible cats that they can’t make as much as someone who was born near high end cats.


If you don't trap for the money why did you no sale part of your cats?
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:30 AM

Originally Posted by white17
[quote=cat_trapper_nv]

Why is that any of your business even if its true. You might benefit from this article.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-truth-about-income-inequality-11572813786

It requires a subscription so if you can't afford to open the link I'll copy/paste it for you


Are you really that narrow minded that when someone has the thought of equality that they are poor? I already have a subscription to the Wall Street journal. Same with the New York Times. I believe it’s very important to stay up to date on everything.
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:30 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
Originally Posted by AntiGov
Cat trapper , next year lets mix in someones worthless western oregon cats with your nice nevada cats and pay you the average for yours .

You good with that ?


I don’t trap for the money so that’s not a good example. But I agree it’s not far just because someone was born somewhere with horrible cats that they can’t make as much as someone who was born near high end cats.



I thought you pulled your cats from a sale and found someone to give you more .?? What gives man ?
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:31 AM

Originally Posted by Monster Toms
Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv


I don’t trap for the money so that’s not a good example. But I agree it’s not far just because someone was born somewhere with horrible cats that they can’t make as much as someone who was born near high end cats.


If you don't trap for the money why did you no sale part of your cats?


Because I got offered a high price somewhere else. Of course I’m going to try to get a little more play money if I can. I I pulled all my cats and then sold all my cats.
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:33 AM

Haha just because I don’t trap for the money doesn’t mean I’m not going to try to get the most I can for them. I’m not going to hold them over for a year. Waste of space. So when I get offered more then I’ll sell them to that person. So I can’t be for equality, have money, and still want to maximize my profits even if I don’t trap for money?
And I bet I can’t be a Democrat and own a gun. Or believe in human induced climate change and own a diesel. Or believe in animal rights and be a trapper.

Lots of narrowed minded people hear but that fits the republican bill.
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:33 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv


Are you really that narrow minded that when someone has the thought of equality that they are poor? I already have a subscription to the Wall Street journal. Same with the New York Times. I believe it’s very important to stay up to date on everything.



I do too but the NYT doesn't enter into "staying up to date on everything".
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:34 AM

You should give some of that extra cat money to someone who got less for their cats
Posted By: AntiGov

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:36 AM

Arent you ashamed for getting a higher price for cats you didnt have to work very hard for ?
Posted By: Boco

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:37 AM

Once society collapses the greedy pigs will be dragged out into the streets and beat to death by the pesants.Happens every time.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:37 AM

So how about we just trade cats on even swap. I deserve to get the same play money you do don't you think?
Posted By: Wild_Idaho

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:38 AM

So back on track... recession or no recession... and how bad?
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:39 AM

I even voted for Bernie in the primary. Was really hoping he would win the nomination.
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:40 AM

Originally Posted by J Staton
So how about we just trade cats on even swap. I deserve to get the same play money you do don't you think?


I do agree with that. We should be offered the same. It’s not fair and we need to reform the fur trade. I agree 100%.
Posted By: Yes sir

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:41 AM

Recession. This economy we are in is based on spending not GDP. Can't spend your way to wealth. I know first hand lol
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:41 AM

Originally Posted by J Staton
I even voted for Bernie in the primary. Was really hoping he would win the nomination.


I voted for him both times. But since he got screwed I had to vote for Hilary. And since Russia got involved, I have to put up with trump. But only for a few more months. Then we can have Biden fix everything trump destroyed.
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:46 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
Originally Posted by J Staton
So how about we just trade cats on even swap. I deserve to get the same play money you do don't you think?


I do agree with that. We should be offered the same. It’s not fair and we need to reform the fur trade. I agree 100%.



"From each according to his ability"
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:47 AM

Well then, send me your cats and I'll see what I'm offered at our state fur sale. I'll send you my cats and you can do the same. I believe AR cats were going for about $30 in February. Don't let them short change you.
Posted By: cat_trapper_nv

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:50 AM

Originally Posted by J Staton
Well then, send me your cats and I'll see what I'm offered at our state fur sale. I'll send you my cats and you can do the same. I believe AR cats were going for about $30 in February here. Don't let them short change you.


But that’s not fair to the other trappers. We all need to get the overall cat price average. Sounds perfectly fair to me. The problem is we have be program to accept thinks not being fair and have convinced ourselves it’s fine. It’s not fine and we need more equality.
Posted By: beaverpeeler

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:56 AM

I was listening to money show today and it sounded like the expert there thinks we are already in recession. So yes, it seems a recession is inevitable especially if we finance all these new programs by just printing up more money. That is why it takes 5000 Colombian pesos to buy a loaf of bread down there, and why Ecuador did away with the devalued Sucre and adopted the US dollar as its currency.
Posted By: Bigbrownie

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:56 AM

Recession for sure. Fairly severe.

A lot depends if we revisit this scenario next fall.
Posted By: obaro

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:57 AM

I think that a recession is at hand, but as to how bad or how long it will be I'm not going to pretend to have any idea. There is an ebb and flow, or seasons, or what ever you want to call it, to everything. It's Biblical, its seen in nature, you breathe in, you breathe out, there are ups and downs; just the way it is.

Not sure that I have ever seen anyone compare socialism to Christianity before; history shows that generally socialism tends to be very anti-Christian.

As far as equality goes, doesn't it go both ways? Equal payment for equal performance or equal product or equal whatever? Fair is fair, right?
Posted By: cfowler

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:30 AM

Originally Posted by Yes sir
Recession. This economy we are in is based on spending not GDP. Can't spend your way to wealth. I know first hand lol

I agree with this. I would also mention that cheaper gas and a check for every American only increases the wealth gap, the deficit, and that neither addresses the problem of production. This is the underlying cause of the minor recession we have entered. We could be on our way to a depression, but we are in a controlled fall at this point, IMO. Can they stop it? Probably, through the use of some government mandate. They’re gonna bail-out a lot of company’s this go round. Ultimately I believe it’ll come down to what life is like for everyday Americans. Are there jobs? Do they pay well enough to cover costs of living expenses? Are the goods and services relied upon by everyday Americans available at a fair price? If the result of this is only that Americans got an ”advance on taxes check“. And, that corporations, businesses, and individuals the government determines to be critical will be bailed out, while other businesses are driven out of business or further into debt. We will enter a full-blown recession, which could drop into depression. It’s pretty uncharted waters. We’ve never had worldwide slow down and even stop.

Our nation was formed by capitalist who wanted to free themselves from government interference and unfair taxation. They wanted the right to trade freely, compete against others in business, they wanted to make their own way. That’s the opportunity America represents, not free $H@t!
Posted By: Boco

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:36 AM

Governments propping up failing buisnesses and banks,etc is pure socialism.They will soon be government run/government owned.And basic income to those working in them is next.
Posted By: danvee

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:49 AM

I think the recession has been coming for awhile this just popped the bubble.
Posted By: danvee

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:53 AM

I see several Senators made some big stock sell offs after white house briefings of what was coming down the pike maybe they could dish out some of their investment savings to those in need
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:57 AM

I saw that too !! Someone need an orange jump suit. The problem..........well ONE problem, is that it is not illegal for congress-members to trade on inside information.

I don't know that that is the correct characterization but Burr clearly tried to present a rosy picture while selling stock.

Of course he is a "never-Trumper" so that shouldn't surprise us.
Posted By: bblwi

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 04:00 AM

Pretty hard to ask 300 plus million to toe the line and work together when the ones making the laws are crooks themselves.

Bryce
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 04:12 AM

AMEN brother !!
Posted By: danvee

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 04:30 AM

They need to crack down on the insider trades in the white house as well as wall street make it an even playing field. Im sure their will be plenty that buy back in at the right time. Who says you can't time the market
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 04:34 AM

Actually, I think insider trading should be completely legal. It helps determine the true value of a stock. Why should all information NOT be known ?? But it should NOT be illegal for you & me but legal for congress members

I don't believe anyone can time the market
Posted By: cfowler

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 05:10 AM

[Linked Image]
In 1977, a race horse, “Seattle Slew”, won three major races. It was a remarkable accomplishment and remains an important part of horse racing history. Yet, I know a man who’s father knew a man, and my friends dad went and purchased 100 tickets at each race. He of course won all these bets, as well as a few others. He was foresightful though, and he commissioned an artist (the one who did Babe Ruth at Yankee Stadium) to create and cast 100 Seattle Slew replicas. He then made and sold them with winning tickets of each race attached to the base. As shown in the pic. So impressed with this entrepreneurial spirit was the race tipster, that he introduced my friend’s dad to another friend. There he received interesting advise on investing and the markets. Something to do with all his horse winnings. Needless to say my friend has enjoyed a life few experience. He gave half his inherited wealth away many years ago. Yet today he is valued at more and has continued to spend more and give more each year. He also owns more today than he originally inherited. “I never question if it’s rigged. I just wanna pick the right winner.” As my friend says.
Posted By: Marty B

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 05:27 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
I don’t have a lack of money. Doesn’t mean I can’t have the desire for the wealth gap to be fixed and affordable medical for everyone. Socialism isn’t a poor person thing. It’s for everyone.



Our grandparents went to war to fight communism. Our idiot youth are now voting for it.






You should visit with some escapees from Cuba, Venezuela, Russia. They all tell similar stories.










Try this one on for size :






Upon migrating to the United States many years ago, I embraced my new home and left the past behind. Never could I imagine that, at some point, that past would become relevant.

But now, I am compelled to talk about it again.

In the USSR, we had state-controlled media which shaped the narrative entirely.

Our founder, Vladimir Lenin, was portrayed as a noble, charismatic, and smart man -- the champion of the underdog (the working class), the seeker of equality, defeater of the rich. The humble man with common ideas who was destined for greatness.

Lenin peered at us intently from textbooks and walls. His was the face behind the good intentions that shaped our everyday life.


As a kid, I was largely shielded by my family -- they took the brunt of "adult tasks" in everyday life. They bribed officials to accomplish the most basic of things, they conserved every kopek and piece of bread, they got me the rare medicines I needed, all through means I didn't dare fathom.

Of course, there was nothing special about those medicines, those favors, or anything else that took such effort to obtain -- in America, you can just go out and get it in a corner store. In the Soviet Union, the word "deficit" was commonly used in everyday language.

"This and this product are in deficit." This meant that you couldn't buy them. Maybe for the next three months or maybe forever, unless someone was bribed or the product was obtained via the black market, friends, or contraband. Fruits and vegetables had their "seasons" when they made an appearance in local stores -- we didn't have advanced technology like hydroponic farms.

Instead, adults were herded into collective farms, which were the Soviet antithesis of family -- or individual-owned farms. Under cheerful banners of "accomplishing a five-year plan in four," they usually underperformed and the bureaucrats responsible faked the numbers, which moved up the chain of command.

"Deficit." I heard this term a lot, as I stood in long lines for bread and milk in stores with cheerfully generic names like "Progress" or "Sunrise."

The lines resembled those formed by hipsters in America lining up for the sale of the next iPhone model -- except we stood in them every day.

As much as my family shielded me from their troubles, they couldn't protect me from factors beyond their control. They couldn't raise my level of living above theirs. And they certainly couldn't get me anesthetics for dental visits. Sitting in the gray, sterile corridor for two hours, hearing the sobbing of the kids already in the dental chair as their teeth were drilled without anesthetics, water, or suction, and knowing that your turn was coming -- some handled it better than others.

In the local clinic, needles were resterilized and reused. Ambulances took three hours to arrive, if they came at all.

That was our "free" healthcare.

We also lived in a "free" apartment, which was suffocatingly small by American standards, and it took years, if not decades, for an average couple to obtain such a place. Usually, several generations of a family lived under one roof until the government bestowed upon its citizens another gray five- to sixteen-story building that looked just like its gray neighbor and had the same exact green-painted swings in the yard.

Since almost nobody had cars, people could rarely afford to move to another city or republic.

Public transportation, which we all had to use, consisted of cranky people squeezed tightly like sardines inside a rusty box on wheels. Despite that, when I was eight, I wanted to be a trolley bus driver. Partially because of all the buttons he flipped to open and close doors, but mostly because there was a wall between him and the sardine can.

The walls in Soviet apartments were poorly insulated from noise and cold. Therefore, wall carpets were dominant in Soviet culture. They all looked similar, usually colored red with abstract, curving patterns.

Soviet factories were state-controlled. Variety was not a concept. The color red was all over the place -- it garnished the banners hanging off the sides of gray five-story buildings, with profiles of Lenin, Marx, and Engels fluttering lightly in the wind, proclaiming that "Marxism-Leninism is the symbol of our times." Others stated, "Forward toward Communism!"

Red was splattered on our classroom walls and our school uniforms.

In grade school, you became an "Octyabronok" (named after the October 1917 revolution) and wore a Lenin-faced star on your lapel. You got a free newspaper, the "Young Leninist." Later, you became a "Pioneer" and swapped the star for a red tie. After that, you moved on to "Komsomol" (All-Union Leninist Young Communist League). Those who did not follow the groupthink enough to make it to "Komsomol" lost access to crucial resources and careers later in life.

I grew up with no concept of "brands." If I wanted to get that shoddy water pistol that suddenly appeared in a store, and my parents let me, then that was the water pistol. It broke in two weeks, of course.

Bread in the stores was the bread. Milk was the milk. Kolbasa was the kolbasa. Everything was manufactured by the state to provide the minimum required survivability, and minimum expected functionality. Improvements in design and the manufacturing process did not exist.

When I came to America and laid down on an American bed, it struck me that it was more comfortable than any bed I'd ever experienced. It was the result of evolving design oriented toward customer satisfaction -- a concept alien to my former homeland.

The two famous brands of Soviet cars, Zaporozhets and Moskvich (both named after their places of origin), just... existed. We didn't really have Zaporozhets 1980 followed by a new and improved Zaporozhets 1981 -- now with power steering! No such thing. It was a car, and it required no further improvement. There was no customer demand, because people were poor, the state-controlled prices were very high, and product evolution crawled at snail's pace.



The very concept of "customer convenience" did not exist. We didn't have bottles sculpted to fit the shape of your hand, nor did we have polite cashiers, for they were under no obligation to please anyone -- they worked for the state. The abacus was still in common use in our stores while American stores had electric change machines, credit card readers, and sliding doors.

Like most things, clothes were in "deficit" and thus traveled from older to younger siblings in every family over time. Broken things weren't thrown away but repaired.



Our giant lamp television was carried in the family since about the time I was born. It received three channels -- all State-controlled. On our evening news program, the Chernobyl disaster announcement was calm and lasted fifteen seconds. Our state papers, such as Pravda and Izvestia, were not read but used as invaluable sources of free toilet paper. This is not a joke.

Our propaganda put the big focus on the noble working class and how there was no such thing as a "lower" profession. Much emphasis was made on the nobility of simple working man, and certainly there is something to that.



But when the janitor receives roughly the same salary as a teacher who is paid roughly the same as a surgeon who is paid roughly the same as a programmer, all of them surrounded by peers who get paid the same no matter how well or poorly they perform, some people start carrying the team, and then they just give up. Everyone performs poorly in the end.



It was painfully obvious to everyone just how low the desire of the average person is to produce goods for other people. Without competition or opportunity to get ahead, with the state controlling production and paying equal salaries to workers regardless of their contributions, we had no concept of abundance.

With our "free" services, we regularly experienced water and electrical outages and sometimes went to a nearby forest to get water. Once you fill that bathtub with water, you can't use it for anything else.

The first time I entered an American food market at the age of seventeen, I froze.

Older Soviets who visited American stores for the first time, got hit harder -- all the lies they were taught from childhood through the decades of their lives -- until that last moment, they expected them to be at least partially true.

Sure, they heard stories from overseas, but come on, those were just the Potemkin villages, mirages created to make the Soviets jealous. How can one imagine the unimaginable?



"They told us in Odessa, that in San Francisco it's hard to find milk."

This is the typical Soviet mentality, and they were used to it, and they bought into it, and then they entered that American supermarket and saw the rows upon rows of milk of different brands and kinds and fat percentages.



This is where some have been known to cry. It is the realization that their lives were stolen from them by the regime. A realization of what could've been, if they had been lucky enough to be born in this place which, from everything they knew, could not possibly exist.



I now live in Northern California, in the heart of the Bay Area, thousands of miles away from my homeland.

And yet the poison of Soviet propaganda seeps through college dorms just as it did in Soviet classrooms.

Stop a random youth on the street and you'll find out what he thinks about capitalism (bad!) and communism/socialism (good!). Their favorite news programs are the "Daily Show" and the "Colbert Report," where comedians reinforce their brainwashing via short, catchy clips.

Walk through Berkeley and you will see wall graffiti of the same hammer and sickle that adorned the big red flags of the Soviet era.



This doesn't extend to just youths. People of all ages, even acquaintances that I otherwise respect and admire, are like this. They support the "progressive" leader Barack Obama, worship the nanny state, and believe in equality of outcome rather than equality of opportunity.

They badmouth capitalism and complain that only one percent of the American population has the "American dream." They buy into the class warfare rhetoric hook, line, and sinker. They want artificially raised minimum wage, government handouts, and believe that Obamacare is the greatest thing since the invention of pockets.



I look at them and the red ties materialize, familiarly, around their necks.

There are "academic" speakers now who advocate that having too many choices is "bad for you." Too stressful to choose, you see.

Living in the Soviet Union, being bombarded with similar nonsense, we had nothing to contradict it. When we walked outside the school, the everyday reality had no traces of the wealth afforded by capitalism. We lived in the grayness and that grayness was all there was.

Americans leave school to go home and they drop by a mall to buy something from an incredible selection of wealth and choice afforded by capitalism. They drop by a small corner store, which could probably feed a savvy Soviet village for a month (dog food is food, too, you know), and they pick up some "entertainment food" that did not exist in the USSR, in quantities that weren't affordable for an average Soviet family.

Then they go home and write essays on their expensive iPads about how they don't have the American Dream.



Now, most American news sources are no different than Pravda and Izvestia. Now, the government used the IRS to stifle political opposition. Now, ObamaCare is a wealth redistribution platform disguised as a common good. Now, Obama is being portrayed in academia and the media alike as a charismatic, messianic, "progressive" figure, fighting for the "underdog." He would feel right at home as the General Secretary of the Communist Party. Now, Obama Youths are me, from decades ago. Leninist academia has had its way with them. Now, just like Soviet leaders, American leaders give lip-service to "social justice" while stocking up on personal wealth for their families.

There's nothing new under the sun. I'm hardly the only ex-Soviet to point out the parallels. But some things matter enough to bear repeating.
Posted By: Marty B

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 05:43 AM

This is what voting for liberals, and social justice gets you.




Posted By: Marty B

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 05:46 AM

Keep voting for liberals.







Posted By: BILLBRASKEY

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 06:08 AM

I know after reading through some of these comments there is plenty of folks here that will never be welcome at my table... after I work myself to exhaustion day after day after day, I'll take my checks, cash them and live off what I got for my work I dont care what someone else has, if socialism makes it's way in this country we better get rid of the dead weight real fast or so everything the people before us died to protect will be just something our next generation reads about in a book or the internet
Posted By: hippie

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 11:01 AM

They're crawling outta the woodwork lately ! Lol.
Posted By: GROUSEWIT

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 11:05 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
I do agree with some of Bernie’s thoughts. I’m not for all socialism but we do need to find out how to fix the wealth gap and a way for everyone to have medical assistance. And I’m not against guns, but we do need to figure something out to stop guns getting in the wrong hands.



Just enforce the laws we have now and that will solve the gun problem. Quit slapping there patties and leaving them out early.
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 11:05 AM

Since I voted for Bernie in the primary does that make me a liberal?
Posted By: Diggerman

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:06 PM

Originally Posted by Bob_Iowa
You have low fuel, nitrogen (if Koch wants), but the ethanol plants cant make money so they shut down one less place to sell, and then you lose the distillers grain which is used in most feed, and is a lot more efficient than feeding more shell corn and soybean meal.

Curious what we did with all this corn 10 years ago? I feed by products, on a small scale, not so much for efficiency but convenience.
Posted By: Bob_Iowa

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 01:51 PM

We didnt have this much the acres are up, but not only that, the genetics have made the corn have better yields, you may not have over 200 bushels every year but the lows are much higher I farm some very rough ground and 10 years ago during a drought 80 acres would be 50 bushel to the acre now I average 140 bushel to the acre. Before people jump on me for raising corn on that its back in alfalfa production I have to raise corn on it to get it back into alfalfa production since we dont have a good small grain market.
Posted By: Hydropillar

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by J Staton
Since I voted for Bernie in the primary does that make me a liberal?

Yes
Posted By: bblwi

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 02:42 PM

There are 500 million more people in the World then there was 10 years ago which means there is far more livestock , mostly pork and poultry then there was 10 years ago. Corn yields go up about .75 to 1.5 bushels per acre per year on average over the last two decades. Corn acres varies mostly based on weather, a wet cool spring less corn, more beans, the price of beans, wheat and cotton also impact acres as well. Also one of the values or curses if you will of the market is to establish pre-season prices for commodities. When the market wants more of x the futures prices goes up and fewer acres of y and z etc. are planted. So even if many producers don't contract their production the market does dictate a lot of what may be planted or not planted.

Bryce
Posted By: Bob_Iowa

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:03 PM

Yes Bryce the market does dictate to some people however there people here in Iowa including myself that will not raise soybeans, not just because they’re a pain to raise but also here we can make more money in corn because our bean yields are so poor. Yes there are more people and more pigs raised, unsure about chickens myself, but in the hog market we have over production now thats why we have a cash market in hogs around .30 to .40 cents and the futures have been down, before the virus stuff drove down all markets, here in Iowa hog barns are still built mainly because people are afraid they are going to put a stop to building new confinement buildings. What I hope for is high wheat and cotton prices to keep the southern and western guys planting those crops instead of corn.
Posted By: hippie

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:04 PM

They came and took my sis' s pigs that they usually don't take until they hit 275. The pigs were only 240.

Big push right now.
Posted By: Bob_Iowa

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:12 PM

They have been doing that here for a while, here the main reason has been cost of production, the people that own the pigs have said that the extra 30 to 40 pounds isn’t cost effective, the packers here are on the fence if they like it or not, its easier to handle the smaller pigs but the total number of pigs has to go up to equal the total pounds of pork going out the other end of the plant.
Posted By: hippie

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:14 PM

Ahh, this is the first for us. Thanks for the info.
Posted By: bblwi

Re: A recession? - 03/20/20 03:41 PM

Corn will always be the dominant or preferred crop for corn belt producers to raise as it is typically more profitable due to the huge increases in yields and the high yields that can be obtained. Also the modern genetics can handle very dry weather and yield well along with significant insect and fungi control. Also corn has many uses and ways to market the crop. When talking poultry I was talking worldwide. Asia consumes huge amounts of poultry. Countries like India consume much poultry as does China and all of Southeast Asia. Poultry consume considerable amounts of protein and energy feed, but are more efficient in their conversion into human food and occupy far less space and create much less waste per lbs. of gain or growth, all which are beneficial to high population regions with limited growing resources. Corn responds to inputs and management where soybeans have a much lower ceiling and respond less to inputs. Also corn genetics makes it much easier to genetically improve the seed stock quickly, unlike beans, wheat and cotton which are much more difficult to genetically change in shorter periods of time. Soybeans due to their very velvety stems and leaves also collect lots of fine silt or soil and when that is run through combines they wear out faster than running through 4 times the material in corn.

Bryce
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/21/20 04:58 AM

The wealth gap has been created by the Fed's money printing. It's all been going straight into the hands of the wealthy and they call Bernie a socialist.That's like the pot calling the kettle black.

REPO hitting 1 trillion per day now.
Posted By: cfowler

Re: A recession? - 03/21/20 06:19 AM

Muddy I think you’re right in your idea. Bernie wanted to take from the rich and “redistribute” to the poor, socialism. What we have with the repo and bailout program is more fascism it seems to me. True capitalism can’t really function with governmental influence and manipulation in the “economy”. Wealth redistribution is what we see taking place. Time to help you neighbor, not wait for him to go under so you can buy him out. Predators don’t all wear fur.
Posted By: Steven 49er

Re: A recession? - 03/21/20 01:02 PM

cfowler, you're not insinuating the wealth redistribution in this country is actually going from the bottom/middle up when we've been told it's from the top down?
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/21/20 10:50 PM

Originally Posted by Steven 49er
cfowler, you're not insinuating the wealth redistribution in this country is actually going from the bottom/middle up when we've been told it's from the top down?




Thats exactly what he is saying and thats exactly what has been going on under both parties. The socialism word is only used when the bottom 90% get it. Socialism for the rich and the rest can pound sand. This is the new definition of Capitalism, only capitilism can't exist under financial manipulation.So it's Fascism.


Article I, Section 8, Clause 1 of the United States Constitution, The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;
Posted By: cfowler

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 02:09 AM

Originally Posted by Steven 49er
cfowler, you're not insinuating the wealth redistribution in this country is actually going from the bottom/middle up when we've been told it's from the top down?

You’re right, I should’ve been more clear. The rich will get richer, and they’ll do it by making the poor poorer. It’s the way greed works. IMO
Posted By: BuckMink

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 02:28 AM

AMEN!! Dont like america, get out. We are americans ...not your home country. Socialist ideas will RUIN this country!!
Posted By: BuckMink

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 02:30 AM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
I don’t have a lack of money. Doesn’t mean I can’t have the desire for the wealth gap to be fixed and affordable medical for everyone. Socialism isn’t a poor person thing. It’s for everyone.



Sure, just like for every Venezuelan...
Posted By: BuckMink

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 02:36 AM

Finally, someone who agrees. Now I don’t believe in all socialism but some sort of social income for those who make under a certain amount would be amazing. I don’t mind paying slightly higher taxes to help others less fortunate. They way this country discriminated against African Americans and Latino people is crazy. We like to keep them on the low income side which forces there kids to grow up with nothing so the very wealthy few can make more money. [/quote]


Sure, pay them and they have no incentive to learn and put forth effort and contribute to society.

When the reward is great, the effort to succeed is great, but when government takes all the reward away, no one will try or want to succeed. Is this man truly a genius? Checked out and this is true…it DID happen! An economics professor at a local college made a statement that he had never failed a single student before, but had recently failed an entire class. That class had insisted that Obama’s socialism worked and that no one would be poor and no one would be rich, a great equalizer.

The professor then said, “OK, we will have an experiment in this class on Obama’s plan”. All grades will be averaged and everyone will receive the same grade so no one will fail and no one will receive an A…. (substituting grades for dollars – something closer to home and more readily understood by all).

After the first test, the grades were averaged and everyone got a B. The students

who studied hard were upset and the students who studied little were happy. As the second test rolled around, the students who studied little had studied even less and the ones who studied hard decided they wanted a free ride too so they studied little.

The second test average was a D! No one was happy.

When the 3rd test rolled around, the average was an F.

As the tests proceeded, the scores never increased as bickering, blame and name-calling all resulted in hard feelings and no one would study for the benefit of anyone else.

To their great surprise, ALL FAILED and the professor told them that socialism would also ultimately fail because when the reward is great, the effort to succeed is great, but when government takes all the reward away, no one will try or want to succeed. Could not be any simpler than that.
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 02:46 AM

Originally Posted by BuckMink
Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
I don’t have a lack of money. Doesn’t mean I can’t have the desire for the wealth gap to be fixed and affordable medical for everyone. Socialism isn’t a poor person thing. It’s for everyone.



Sure, just like for every Venezuelan...


We are Venezuela...You think debt monitization works different here ?

You do realize the Fed must print money and buy debt to surpress interest rates ? There's no free market about that.
Posted By: charles

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 03:23 AM

Can’t see how we can afford this year, but at least Bernie is not at the wheel.
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 03:33 AM

Originally Posted by charles
Can’t see how we can afford this year, but at least Bernie is not at the wheel.


What do you need Bernie for when you got Trump . Have you checked the national debt lately ?
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 03:52 AM

Originally Posted by muddyriverdogz


We are Venezuela...You think debt monitization works different here ?

You do realize the Fed must print money and buy debt to surpress interest rates ? There's no free market about that.



You do realize that the Fed prints nothing.

When the fed buys debt it electronically credits 'reserves' to the seller's account. They don't print currency and hand it to the seller.
Posted By: Steven 49er

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 04:01 AM

What "reserves" does the FED have?
Posted By: Hydropillar

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 04:06 AM

Originally Posted by white17
Originally Posted by muddyriverdogz


We are Venezuela...You think debt monitization works different here ?

You do realize the Fed must print money and buy debt to surpress interest rates ? There's no free market about that.



You do realize that the Fed prints nothing.

When the fed buys debt it electronically credits 'reserves' to the seller's account. They don't print currency and hand it to the seller.

ok the fed doesnt print money?? who does?? it must be comeing from somwhere!!
Posted By: Hydropillar

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 04:08 AM

One of the most common questions about the Federal Reserve is this: Does the Fed print money?

There are really two ways to address this question. In terms of the actual, physical printing, no, the Fed doesn’t actually print or produce money in any form. Coins come from the U.S. Mint, and paper currency comes from the U.S. Treasury’s Bureau of Engraving and Printing. The Fed distributes currency after it’s printed.

Controlling How Much Money Is Available
However, what many questioners might really be asking is whether the Fed has the ability to control how much money is in our economy. That’s a different story.

The Fed adds to (or subtracts from) the amount of money in the economy by buying (or selling) U.S. Treasury securities and other financial instruments. This is referred to as “open market operations,” since these transactions take place in the open market. (The Fed isn’t allowed to buy securities directly from the U.S. Treasury.)

The Fed pays for those securities by crediting funds to the reserves that banks are required to hold, either cash in their vaults or deposits at a Reserve bank.

“So, in that sense, we can think of ‘printing money’ as adding reserves to the banking system,” said David Wheelock, vice president and deputy director of research.
Posted By: Hydropillar

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 04:11 AM

i concider the treasury the fed also... there probably isnt enough trees to print the dollars created,,,,, wasnt that many years ago i hear the word trillion... now its every day
Posted By: BuckMink

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by muddyriverdogz
Originally Posted by charles
Can’t see how we can afford this year, but at least Bernie is not at the wheel.


What do you need Bernie for when you got Trump . Have you checked the national debt lately ?



Sure, all of the national debt we are going to blame it on trump without acknowledging the past presidents...what have they done to alleviate the debt?
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by white17
Originally Posted by muddyriverdogz


We are Venezuela...You think debt monitization works different here ?

You do realize the Fed must print money and buy debt to surpress interest rates ? There's no free market about that.



You do realize that the Fed prints nothing.

When the fed buys debt it electronically credits 'reserves' to the seller's account. They don't print currency and hand it to the seller.



I do realize they don't actually have to physicaly print the money anymore. That they can just add digits to a screen. It is 2020.

That doesn't change the meaning of my comment. Weather the currency is represented in digital or paper form it was still created under the Fed's discretion.
Posted By: cfowler

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 04:49 PM

Originally Posted by Steven 49er
What "reserves" does the FED have?

Air
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 04:51 PM

Originally Posted by Steven 49er
What "reserves" does the FED have?


You,your children and your grandchildren. etc..

We are all the collateral.

Loans being took out in our names(and people wha have not been born yet) that we have no say in...The funds being handed to those they choose..I would call that socialism and Taxation Without Representation.

Nothing in the Constitution allows for any of this.But ya'll keep beating your chest over that 2nd Amendment.
Posted By: cfowler

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 05:40 PM

Oh, the Constitution, they still got that old thing around?

I think we’re past the point of finger pointing at parties myself. Most of us watched 2008 and we knew we’d do it again, and that it would be bigger. Here we are. It was wrong then, and it only allowed the problem to increase in size. Now they’re ready to prop it up again, and push off their problem onto the taxpayer, again. A debt driven economy will devalue its currency out of existence.

I’m curious to see if this isn’t part of “the plan”. Trump talked about gold and a gold backed currency in his early years. Even appeared in an article some place, shortly before coming president, where he accepted at least partial payment on a big business deal in gold. China hints at a gold backed crypto-currency soon. Lots of theories out there. Several countries have increased their gold reserves in recent years, as have many larger banks. If it’s not worth anything, why do the rich keep so much around?
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 05:52 PM

Actually the Fed owns gold certificates transferred to it by the Treasury in 1934 in exchange for gold owned at the time by the FED. The official value of that gold is set by statute at $42.2222 per oz. Congress could, if it chose, revalue that gold and the value of those gold certificates
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 06:00 PM

Originally Posted by white17
Actually the Fed owns gold certificates transferred to it by the Treasury in 1934 in exchange for gold owned at the time by the FED. The official value of that gold is set by statute at $42.2222 per oz. Congress could, if it chose, revalue that gold and the value of those gold certificates



$42 per ounce...What a joke..No manipulation here folks move along.

Congress isn't going to do anything because they answere to the Fed. The Fed tells them how it's going to be.
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 06:06 PM

LOL !!
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 06:17 PM

We should ask Congress to see if the Fed would give them permission for a full audit about now.

I think i know what the answere would be.
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 06:36 PM

The Fed does undergo a full audit every year by Deloitte & Touche and semi-annually by the GAO. Each Regional Federal reserve bank posts it's balances and positions online every thursday for public perusal. It is in an interactive format so that individuals can access the details of every line and ask questions of the fed by email.

Maybe you better get an updated talking point from Ron or Rand.

Here's an example of what is available to anyone willing to make the effort.

This was released 9 days ago.



https://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h41/Current/h41.pdf
Posted By: cfowler

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 06:56 PM

I’m not worried about the Fed operating within the guidelines. What those guidelines are, and what they might become are of more concern. Capitalism must be allowed to return in order for Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness to endure.
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 07:09 PM

Originally Posted by white17
The Fed does undergo a full audit every year by Deloitte & Touche and semi-annually by the GAO. Each Regional Federal reserve bank posts it's balances and positions online every thursday for public perusal. It is in an interactive format so that individuals can access the details of every line and ask questions of the fed by email.

Maybe you better get an updated talking point from Ron or Rand.

Here's an example of what is available to anyone willing to make the effort.

This was released 9 days ago.



https://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h41/Current/h41.pdf


That is not a independent audit and they can put out what ever they want.

Your the only person i know of that defends this. Most all involved in financial's will admit there is no way to know what the Fed is actually doing.
Posted By: Diggerman

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 07:19 PM

Originally Posted by cat_trapper_nv
Originally Posted by Yes sir
Only thing I agreed with you on is when you said you needed a break from this place. Unfortunately you couldn't even do it for 12 hours.


Haha someone has some hard feelings in their heart. I sure hope you aren’t Christian. Doesnt sound like a Christ like attitude to me. Charity, the pure love of Christ, goes a long ways. I decided I need to change my attitude because I was going against my post and being negative.

You mean Forced charity, right.
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by muddyriverdogz
Originally Posted by white17
The Fed does undergo a full audit every year by Deloitte & Touche and semi-annually by the GAO. Each Regional Federal reserve bank posts it's balances and positions online every thursday for public perusal. It is in an interactive format so that individuals can access the details of every line and ask questions of the fed by email.

Maybe you better get an updated talking point from Ron or Rand.

Here's an example of what is available to anyone willing to make the effort.

This was released 9 days ago.



https://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h41/Current/h41.pdf


That is not a independent audit and they can put out what ever they want.

Your the only person i know of that defends this. Most all involved in financial's will admit there is no way to know what the Fed is actually doing.



That explains a lot right there.

I never said that the PDF was an audit. I said it is a statement of balances and positions for the previous week ending March 13, 2020.

The independent audits are done by....wait for it...independent auditors,
Here is a link to the one done in 2015 by KPMG.

Knock yourself out disputing it with them.



https://www.federalreserve.gov/publications/annual-report/2015-federal-reserve-system-audits.htm
Posted By: Boco

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 07:36 PM

The "independant auditors" are just puppets of the board.
Posted By: muddyriverdogz

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by Boco
The "independant auditors" are just puppets of the board.


Exactly but some seem to think whatever they or the Fed say is gospel.
Posted By: Steven 49er

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 08:39 PM

Originally Posted by white17
Actually the Fed owns gold certificates transferred to it by the Treasury in 1934 in exchange for gold owned at the time by the FED. The official value of that gold is set by statute at $42.2222 per oz. Congress could, if it chose, revalue that gold and the value of those gold certificates


How many ounces of gold do those certificate represent?
Posted By: M.S. Pickins

Re: A recession? - 03/22/20 08:47 PM

The Federal Reserve is a private entity that has complete control over our economy. Just as any private entity the main goal is to make money for the owner! The real question to ask is who owns the Federal Reserve (my guess is the Rothschild family and affiliates) and why did FDR sell our country to them? Most importantly, why do the American people tolerate this?
Posted By: white17

Re: A recession? - 04/10/20 04:03 AM

Originally Posted by M.S. Pickins
The Federal Reserve is a private entity that has complete control over our economy. Just as any private entity the main goal is to make money for the owner! The real question to ask is who owns the Federal Reserve (my guess is the Rothschild family and affiliates) and why did FDR sell our country to them? Most importantly, why do the American people tolerate this?



And why would you think that ?
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