life on Venus

Interesting

Science says the big bang occurred about 13.7 billion years ago, our sun formed 5 Billion years ago and the first life appeared 3.7 billion years ago. That would suggest life formed fairly early after the earth became habitable suggesting it is a fairly straight forward process that should be repeatable elsewhere. I strongly suspect there is other life in our Galaxy and am pretty confident other life exist in the universe.

I once was talking to my brother (devout Christian) about this while elk hunting, I asked him if he thought it was possible that two other bipedal creatures were looking for a large 4 legged deer type creature on the mountains of a distant unknown planet, he replied simply "No".

To my knowledge, God never said we were the only world that he created.

^
This.

Well Dissenters will know someday.

330, I'm a Christian.

where in the Bible does it say God didn't create others in His own image?

800° on venus, no animals or people there, our probe landed, it lasted about one minute before it died

You didn't watch the video did you.

What fun would it be with Goldilocks and not a mention of the 3 bears!

Nope

Good video. That guy gesticulates as much as the president when he speaks.

There is also speculation that giant gasbag-like life might exist on Jupiter at high altitude, sustained by the energy of fierce electrical storms.

Jim

Someone will correct if I'm wrong, but it would seem to me that although the Bible never explicitly states that God never made others in his own image its incredibly unlikely. Let's think about it for a minute, to say that God created other beings in his image on another planet is to say that either, it is a perfect world untainted by sin. Or to say that this other world is doomed to h*ll, with no hope for salvation. Or that God sent Jesus to die to save a world yet agian. Id have no trouble believing that God created another world with life but that life is NOT made in his image. Thats my opinion

Word of the day-gesticulate.
Speaking of giant gasbags....I better not say it.

Why couldn't God just create another world and it be perfect. Wasn't this a perfect world until a certain Grandpa ate from a tree he wasn't to touch. It was perfect til then. So why couldn't there be another perfect world and it would remain so until it became imperfect? Why couldn't Jesus save two worlds. Is there only enough of His blood to save some of this world. Does it only take a drop to save one or does it take all of it to save just one. Looks to me when we limit God, then we are making God in our image, and thus limiting Him by our our own limitations.

Who says his creations all have to be the same. The angels are not the same as human, and yes even a 1/3 of them rebelled.

I'm not sure that God is done creating, doesn't it say that He stretched the Heavens in Isaiah 42:5, leading me to believe the heavens are elastic and still expanding?

I'm just saying that if God created another world that has remained perfect then why would he would he not destroy this one already and move the followers of christ? (I.e the flood, just saying that he's done it before) God is not done creating, the Bible clearly spells this out for us, stating that God will create a new heavens and earth for us after this one has run its course.
Yes this was a perfect world and then man exercised his free will and suddenly God was forced to punish him for disobeying. But he was far from merciless and offered us a way out of eternal damnnation by sending his only son to pay for our sins. So if God created another world that has remained perfect, then they most not have free will so then they're nothing more then puppets on a string. Or if God created another world that has sinned as we have then he's sending his PERFECT son to die agian, why would he not just combine the two worlds? Why create another mess for no reason?? I'm not saying that all his creations are the same, I think its very likely there is another world but I dont believe that there's anything on it that has a soul to be saved. And its very likely that the new world has been created. You used Angels as a example of the diversity of God's creations, but where in the bible do you see God offering the fallen angels forgiveness?? Humans are unique and made in God's image, and he loves us beyond our comprehention so I find it hard to believe that a just, fair, loving and perfect God would create another world like ours, I mean why? Why would he? What would be the point? I dont believe God creates purely because he's bored! Saying that, Is giving him Paganistic qualities.

Who says God necessarily created a world with intelligent life on it? Why can't he create other worlds with only animal life or microscopic life? Dinosaurs existed on earth before man, God must have created them for some reason. What isn't God doing things like that else ware? No one has God figured out or you would be one.

If there was other life forms out there the Dems would be sending them mail in ballots. Let's think this through guys.....

^^^this

like a couple days before man read your Bible dude! Also I was literally saying that, reread what I wrote

How does religion get brought into a discussion of possible anaerobic bacteria in the atmosphere of Venus? I think it is interesting that such a thing is theoretically possible. I am confident we have a lot to learn about stuff that exists outside our atmosphere and I fail to see what religion can add to the exploration.

Let me ask you this, how was the universe created? Now maybe you see how Religion plays a role.......

Sometimes understanding the Creator gives insight into the creation

No one knows cowboy. I would guess we never will. No I dont see how religion plays a role. Religion has gotten in the way of ALL scientific research. At one time the church forbade the dissection of human cadavers. I wonder where modern medicine would be if a few brave men had not chosen to continue the research in secret?

Religion has NO role in seeking knowledge.

It doesn't

Never said it does.

Narrow mindness can drive on both sides of the street if we allow it

There is no evidence of a creator or evidence that there is not so far as I can determine. So it is foolish to let a CHOSEN belief system stand in the way of research.

Evidence of a big bang and evolution does not prove there was no creator.

The existence of a natural world does not prove there was a creator.

It is creationists who fear science as they worry their belief system will be proven to have some holes in it.

Scientists fear creationists because they try to impede research and teaching.

I fear we are not as advanced as we think we are without the courage to get out of the way of both ways of thinking. Let the chips fall where they may.

Ok, All knowing One!

I'm sorry you feel this way, you should know tho that there's a big difference for between the church and God. The church is run by men, so its easy to see how it could be wrong when it does things like forbide scientific research. I will ask you tho, if no one knows how the universe was made then isnt it time to consider that a being far greater than anything we can imagine created our world and the universe? Its a recurring theme thru out most cultures and history man has always turned to believe in a god of some form and for good reason, its honestly the only logical answer in my opinion. I'm not trying to force my opinions or religion on you, just debating thats all.

This was my fault right from the get go...posting about the discussion with my brother that I found interesting and relevant.

Of course "someone" then had to remind/threaten me with eternal damnation and here we are

In my opinion everything points to a creater, so before you say it doesn't explain the human body and mind to me that doesn't happen by chance, I dont see zebras debating their existence.

If by chance you are referring to me, my defense is I never addressed you specifically.

Would one be safe to say that without knowledge people perish or maybe a man with a little knowledge is a danger to himself? If only we had a tree of knowledge, oh where have I heard that before.

I agree, you can debate life on other planets till your blue in the face. If God had wanted us to have all the answers he would have given them to us.

It may not be possible to travel thousands of light years in a vehicle. Mathematicians keep working on it though. I doubt i will see it in my life time. If it is really possible. Venus is not to far away for modern space travel though.

I sometimes wonder though if claiming life is possible, or finding evidence of it, is how researchers get tax dollars to fund their research. Personally I feel tax dollars spent on space exploration is worth it. Who knows what we will find?

Exploration of the new world in the early 16th century happened because monarchs had been told great wealth in the form of gold and silver was out there. While some gold and silver was found that was not the source of the wealth that eventually was created.

This thread is kind of amazing to me. As I alluded to in my first post there are two mindsets forming.

1- Wants to know what's out there, wants to explore and gain knowledge into what they do not know and understand.
2- Already has all the answers so it does not matter.

The only role religion has in science is stifling it so that it's stories won't keep getting debunked.

Lot of religious thumpers on here feel the need to preach all the time.
Must be a proddy thing.

. You can take the boy out of the country but you can't take the country out of the boy. If the country boy goes to the city barefoot he will look out of place, because he is!

Like wise atheists feel the need to tell me people that there is no God, but have no answer for any questions

I think we need to explore, i just disagree with funding it with tax dollars when there are soo many other thing that that money need to go to

where do you think tax dollars should go cowboy?

Getting the country out of debt is always good. Funding EMTS and firefighters with necessary equipment such as that used in grain bin rescues. Funding medical research. Housing homeless children and adults and veterans. Etc.. the list goes on. Now there might be money left over and then maybe its time to fund space exploration i just feel like we have more important things to worry about right now. For instance let's stop the child sex trade Id be glad to see tax dollar going to that.

Who coulda seen that one coming...

The scripture about "the poor will be with you always" is probably one of the most misused in the bible. Judas wanted the money put in the treasury from the expensive oil used to anoint Jesus. Because Judas was the treasurer and for that reason he wanted the money not because of the poor. So many justify Jesus's words that the poor don't need it. But it is rather the framework to help those with less. Of course when one gets into the distribution of it there is still problems, and in one instance caused Stephen to get stoned to death. So there is nothing new in that respect.

I guess one analogy of it could be that if one lights his cigars with $10 bills maybe he should buy a lighter or even better buy food instead of cigars .

Or we could resort to Chinese proverbs and say give a guy a fish and feed him for a day or teach him to fish, etc.

So no exploration of Venus till the national debt is paid, all the prostitutes are forced to get "real" jobs, fire departments all have grain silo rescue equipment, cancer is cured, and homeless people are given free housing? Sounds about as feasible as parting the red sea I suppose.

You are slacking off Danny, I would have thought you would have used Reed Sea instead of Red Sea.

No I disagree with free housing, but I feel like theres got to be a way to help get veterans off the streets. And I never mentioned prostitution, I meant the CHILDREN being sold into that. Its just seems to me that going to venus is not that big of a deal. Why don't you explain to me why it's so all fired important?? If we can't solve the issues in our planet why are we going to others? We spent billions going to the moon, what did we accomplish besides showing off? I'm genuinely interested why space exploration is so important I dont understand, call me ignorant if you will.

tell me what children are being sold .

space exploration m ay yeild nothing of value. it may also yield value in ways we can't even conceive of yet

Of course there is a way to get Veterans off the street, quit giving them food and money and force them to get a job or starve to death. Single biggest determining factor in child abuse is single mother households, quit allowing harpies to divorce their husbands and live off child support while dating every loser in a 20 mile radius. Off the top of my head I believe children from a single mother household are 30 times more likely to be abused. Easy to be a single mom or choose your mate unwisely when you have daddy GOVT to fall back on.

Why look to expanding knowledge and science? Seriously?

I realize by your name on here you are probably about 15, I think its a good thing you show intelligence and the ability to discuss ideas and I do not want to be to hard on you but right now you are holding some grandiose ideas that we probably all had as young men, these will likely dissipate in time.

Yeah Cowboy you are trying to solve the worlds problem and the biggest problem now is covid 19 and it will all be over Nov 3. So kick your shoes off and relax, lol.

See? Now I've been educated. I realize I'm not going to solve the worlds problems I dont even want to try. I just think its maybe a little foolish to spend billions on going to venus, to study "possible" bacteria.

Jamie closs from a town 15 miles from me

if i was any more relaxed I'd be dead, which in all honesty sounds kinda nice

Oh Cowboy when life gives us a shipwreck we just have to swim that much the harder and when you get tired, grab a board and hang on. It will get better when dawn comes.

GOOD!!! If you have already given up on trying to solve the worlds problems at 15 you are wise beyond your years. We should emphasis teaching young men how to improve themselves, their families, their communities and if they prove to be exceptional maybe then the country and the world. Work on self improvement, learn to dress, study Aristotle, Nietzsche and the Bible and in thirty years you may be leading us all.

Perhaps, but president is a postion I'd never wish on myself, or any man for that matter

Aim higher then, we don't need another president, we need an emperor if we are to preserve our empire.

Well, guess I've got some studying to do and some social events to attend lol

Good read on the way back from a very nice Kansas get together. Kansas folks are just flat nice folks. Great time.

Maybe in an attempt to paint a more accurate scenario of the religious and the sciences, it's helpful to visit more accurate history. Weird how, as we progress, factoids drop from being taught to us.

The orthodox (historical) Christian faith has never opposed scientific advance, although individuals in both camps may have. Some scientists don't like the religious and some religious don't like the scientists. That is most certainly true (countless atheists and religious leaders have personally sent hate mail to their "opponents", but to say the religious oppose science is not true in any sense.

I hope this helps to clarify;

"We out to begin by noting that Christians have commonly understood that the natural order of a wise Creator who continues to providentially guide it, and that it, therefore, possesses an intrinsic rationality and orderliness that can be investigated. Discovering evidence of this design brings God glory, thus its continued investigation is warranted (Hooykaas, 1972; McGrath, 2001; Stark, 2003). Indeed it is mostly Christians in the West who founded the scientific revolution, and the main contributors to the early developments in the natural sciences - astronomy, physics, chemistry , and biology - were Christians of various stripes, including Roger Bacon, Copernicus, Kelper, Galileo, Francis Bacon, Newton, Boyle, Pascal, Descartes, Ray, Linnaeus, and Gassendi. Throughout the history of Christianity, science has been seen, fundamentally as a gift of God."

- Eric Johnson, Psychology and Christianity, 2010, p. 10.

Blessings,
Mark