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When did Remington rifles decline in quality?

Posted By: James

When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 02:30 AM

'Tis sad, if true: I've read a number of posts that Remington rifles have declined in quality in recent years. But I'm having trouble tracking down what years they're talking about.

I own two Remington bolt-action rifles made twenty years ago (1999 and 2000). One is a first- or second-run .300 RUM LSS that has a trigger job and the barrel was cryo'ed. The other is a .22-250, blued heavy barrel, laminated stock. I'm thinking of selling the RUM. Would year of manufacture be a plus or minus if I try to sell it? I have no proof of date of manufacture, just going from my memory. And the info that the .300 RUM was released in 1999.

If looking for a used rifle, what years of Remington should I consider, and what years should I avoid?

Gunsmiths, your advice is especially welcome.

Jim
Posted By: chas3457

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 02:41 AM

Not sure when the decline started, but it really went in the dumper when "The Freedom Group" bought the product line. Same with Marlin firearms.


There is hope for the Marlin line though, as it was bought by Sturm Ruger. smile




Charlie
Posted By: white17

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 02:43 AM

Prior to 1972 and you MIGHT find a good piece
Posted By: keystone

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 02:50 AM

I think most folks are complaining about there heavy production rifles that they made to keep up with ruger americans, savage axis, etc. I’m not sure what people expect out of a $300 rifle scope combo? Remington still makes some fine custom rifles along with some other models such as the sendaro.
Posted By: Boco

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 02:56 AM

James-go to the Westley Richards website.They have some nice used guns for sale.
Posted By: 330-Trapper

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 02:59 AM

YES The "economy " lines have led them way off course
Posted By: hippie

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 10:47 AM

Remington 700 Is still the "go-to" action for action for target shooting unless you go with an aftermarket action so I question the quality went down statements.

I can't speak to the cheaper line, 770?
Posted By: EdP

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 11:31 AM

You can write Remington and they will tell you the mfg date. There is a barrel code just forward of the receiver that will tell you when the barrel was made and it will be close to the rifle mfg date probably within a year or so. Many think the barrel code is the rifle mfg date but Remington told me that is not so.
Posted By: MJM

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 11:38 AM

You can look most gun manufacturer dates up off the serial number of the gun. I have looked up both Winchester and Browning shotguns.
Posted By: mike mason

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 11:47 AM

I deer hunted with a few gun smiths that worked at the "arms". The company policy changed for the worst in the 80's each gun was no longer checked by a gunsmith. Parts were stamped out and quality suffered.
Posted By: mike mason

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 11:49 AM

Call Whitedog gunsmithing he worked for Remington and did their warranty work. He would have the info.
Posted By: Wanna Be

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 12:11 PM

If y’all are referring to that 770 that’s about $300 with a scope, then yeah, way downhill. We had to sight one in for a guy. Thank God it was close to being on target because after 2 shots I was done. Gun is not balanced at all and kicks like a 10ga with 3.5 turkey loads. We told the owner sell it and spend a little more money on something nicer.
Posted By: Posco

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 01:51 PM

I bought a new Model 700 in 7mm Mag two years ago and I'm completely satisfied with it. Synthetic stock and black matt finish on the barrel. It's a shooter.
Posted By: yukon254

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 02:00 PM

Many many years ago. In more than 30 years guiding big game hunters every season I have seen more Remingtons fail in the field than all others combined. Couldnt give me one. Usually its the extractor, but the triggers can fail too.
Posted By: SoDaker

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 03:04 PM

Bought a 700 SPS in .270 in 2018 was the last Remington I will ever buy. Fitted it with a Vortex HSLR 6-24x50, couldn't hit paper at 50 yards. First thing I do is switch the scope, problem persists. Then I buy a new base for the scope rings, problem persists.

Take to gun smith, he looks it over. Turns out the holes tapped in the top of the rifle are about 15 thousands of an inch off. Which doesn't sound like much to the average Joe, like me. But he did the math and that .015 of an inch difference turned out to be like 20+ inches at 100 yards. Which is significant.

Sent in to Remington for warranty work. They send it right back with a letter that says, 'While we recognize the problem and see the .015 inch difference in the holes tapped for the base, we regret to inform you that it is inside of our factory tolerances and we can't help you.'

Took it to the gun shop I bought it from, sold it back and bought a Bergara.
Posted By: martentrapper

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 03:23 PM

Buying a high dollar rifle? Selling the common man rifles? Are you preparing for the gun confiscations coming with Biden?
Posted By: GREENCOUNTYPETE

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by yukon254
Many many years ago. In more than 30 years guiding big game hunters every season I have seen more Remingtons fail in the field than all others combined. Couldnt give me one. Usually its the extractor, but the triggers can fail too.


what did you see that failed the least?
Posted By: SoDaker

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 03:36 PM

High dollar rifle versus common man's rifle... lol there's a $200 difference.
Posted By: yukon254

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 04:11 PM

Originally Posted by GREENCOUNTYPETE
Originally Posted by yukon254
Many many years ago. In more than 30 years guiding big game hunters every season I have seen more Remingtons fail in the field than all others combined. Couldnt give me one. Usually its the extractor, but the triggers can fail too.


what did you see that failed the least?



Winchesters and Rugers. Never seen one not work, even when it drops down to -50.
Posted By: hippie

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by yukon254
Many many years ago. In more than 30 years guiding big game hunters every season I have seen more Remingtons fail in the field than all others combined. Couldnt give me one. Usually its the extractor, but the triggers can fail too.


I can believe that. Remington extractors are a spring and spring steel tends to break in extreme cold.
Posted By: white17

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 07:21 PM

Originally Posted by hippie
Originally Posted by yukon254
Many many years ago. In more than 30 years guiding big game hunters every season I have seen more Remingtons fail in the field than all others combined. Couldnt give me one. Usually its the extractor, but the triggers can fail too.


I can believe that. Remington extractors are a spring and spring steel tends to break in extreme cold.



I have seen the same things. Years ago when I had an FFL I quit buying Remingtons because so many ended up going back for warranty work.

I own one. A 1970 vintage Nylon 66. It's great but ........I have replaced the "unbreakable" stock four times
Posted By: 3togo

Re: When did Remington rifles decline in quality? - 10/22/20 09:47 PM

As I have mentioned on this forum before, I worked at Remington for 30 years in Ilion. The big decline started in 1993 when Clayton, Dublier, & Rice, an investment firm in NYC bought Remington. They threw away tooling to get replacement cost and anything else the government said they could do in the first 12 months. 19 salary individuals were let go over the age of 50, many had intricate knowledge of the inner workings. A couple came from R&D. DuPont and the new Remington ended up losing a court battle over that and had to pay all but one of those former employees undisclosed sum of money. New engineers had no idea what they were doing. The old time machine setters and technicians were basically keeping things going. Quality checks pretty much came to an end. We changed plant managers like changing your shorts. Seven years after the purchase it was sold to Cerberus Financial. That was the beginning of Freedom Group. And a continuing decline in quality. At that point we were into our 3rd group of new engineers. None of them hunted or shot. Many or the older workers who could find work elsewhere with better pay and benefits left (myself included, that's how I ended up in Illinois). Freedom Group continued to by up other gun companies on credit. When the gun demand declined a few years ago they could not pay the mortgages and filed bankruptcy, the first time. A couple years later they filed again.
Remington was put up for silent auction bids in late September. A hold was put on the auction because a prospective buyer only wanted the ammo plant in Lonoke, AR. A court judge approved of Remington being divided up into any segments that anyone wanted to purchase.
The ammo plant was purchased by Vista Outdoors. They also own Federal ammunition.
Here's a link to a list of the other buyers.

https://www.pewpewtactical.com/bankrupt-remington-sold-off/

As far as who makes the worst guns, I have a friend in Wyoming that runs a sporting goods store. He says that Ruger is by far the worst to get reputable warranty work done. Like when the barrel is on rotated 10° out of line. Or drilled and tapped holes not on centerline.

As an after thought, at one time there were 54 toolmakers in the main toolroom at Remington. That was required to keep a rotating gage inspection and repair procedure in continuous operation. To manufacture close tolerance machined products you need a lot of jigs and fixtures. Six other toolmakers were located in the Powder Metal division toolroom.

Also, there were NO gunsmiths inside Remington. There was a department of gun repairmen who handled most of the complaints and repairs. Yes, some were sent to "certified" repair centers around the country. You do get hundreds of repairs a year when the company has sold millions of firearms.

If you want a good or very good Remington of any type I would look pre '93. Better yet pre 86-87. I will tell you the M700 action is by far the strongest on the market. I know how they were destructive tested, and I know what the strain gages read. No action ever came apart. I did see one come in under warranty that the owner admitted by mistake of loading using pistol powder. Looked like a midget was inside the barrel and cut it off at the recoil lug. But that was pistol powder. The people on here that reload will understand what that meant.

Keep your eyes open for an older gun. You can get the date of manufacture by contacting the Remington Historical Society and using the serial number and date code. No official relationship to Remington.
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