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so how do wildlife officers use social media...?

Posted By: NonPCfed

so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:16 AM

Swamp Wolf admitted on another thread that he was a conservation officer (or whatever they're called in GA). Good to know, I always thought he was a county mounty and not a wildlife cop. Swamp Wolf says he doesn't use facebook for his wildlife investigations but other officers do around the country. I've seen it on a couple of the various Animal Planet "game warden" shows where facebook comes into play. Given Swamp Wolf's comments on that other thread and what I've seen on "reality" tv makes me wonder, "how do wildlife officers use social media...?"

I guess one way is to check it out after they get a complaint or tip. Ok, cool, they get a name to search for on say facebook and check out if that person posts about a certain event or just about hunting, fishing, trapping in general. Still, it sort of makes me wonder if officers then assume anything wildlife associated on that social media presence should be checked out to make sure its legit. I think most LEOs have at least some of that mentality, if they are having an interaction with the public in say a non "public relations" sort of event, they assume there may be something to check out on a person or at least always have their ears and eyes open for anything that might be said, heard, or seen. Ok, I guess they can argue that''s their "job", to pay attention for violations for the law. But it also gets on the slippery slope that the public has to "prove" they are innocent instead of the way that the criminal justice is reported to work, "a person is presumed innocent until proven guilty." Perhaps maybe that's why lawyers and LEOs clash quite a bit.

Ok, what if there is no tip or complaint that has come in but the wildlife officers have this "wonderful" dataset of social media? What's prevents them to take their list of licensed hunters or trappers and start doing random searches on them...? Probably nothing. I suspect that the officers would come back with (and non-social media users), "hey, YOU put it out there in the 'public', I can check it out". I suppose just like a lot of guys check out a hot gal after they've found out a name. Ok, so they find some of the hunters or trappers on their lists have posted photos or stories on say facebook, now how do they use that information? So Bill has nailed a big buck with what he says was with his bow, hmmm, must check it out that he has a bow license at the least or do more work; where was it shot, when, was it over bait, etc. etc? We don't have a big game registration check in system in South Dakota but I suppose in the states that do, its a treasure trove of leads to check out. Same thing for trapping. A guy in MN posts that he's caught a tree mink or fisher during that state's short season so hey, because they are such species of interest in Minnesota, the marten and/or fisher trapper is probably going to get more scrutiny then a coon trapper. The wildlife officers only have so much time, so they probably really target the most "juicy" candidate off of social media (assuming that they're not working off a compliant or tip) but I suspect they probably have "potentials" lined up if they had the time to investigate further. Sort of another way to a police state in my opinion. Tell me how wrong I'm for not trusting "my" employees...?
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:21 AM

And, I know, I now, "if you have nothing to hide, there's no issue!" Yeah, ok, keep on believing that. I don't like that LEOs consider most of their "employers" potential criminals. If that was the actual truth, then the piddly, "gotcha" "crimes" wouldn't be written up as much as they are. To a lot of LEOs, wildlife cops included, its a game and there are two sides, and if they get a "win", then they're up in the game. Call me twisted, I don't really care. Way too many rules, regulations, and "laws" in this country. The United States wasn't found as an administrative state where the civil employees get much of the power...
Posted By: BBarnes

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:27 AM

There’s a lot of wildlife officers and law enforcement on trapperman.

I find your post interesting especially this part

Originally Posted by NonPCfed
And, I know, I now, "if you have nothing to hide, there's no issue!" Yeah, ok, keep on believing that. I don't like that LEOs consider most of their "employers" potential criminals. If that was the actual truth, then the piddly, "gotcha" "crimes" wouldn't be written up as much as they are. To a lot of LEOs, wildlife cops included, its a game and there are two sides, and if they get a "win", then they're up in the game. Call me twisted, I don't really care. Way too many rules, regulations, and "laws" in this country. The United States wasn't found as an administrative state where the civil employees get much of the power...
Posted By: Law Dog

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:34 AM

Without proof what power do we have really and if your giving the proof away then your “ employees” should look the other way then? Sounds like no matter what is done a argument could be made. LOL

A kid texted me the other day he caught a mink while trapping rats I told him to turn it in and he would be OK, that’s what “employees” should do. IMO
Posted By: charles

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:36 AM

I bet some people show off their illegal kills on FB.
Posted By: traprjohn

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:40 AM

Originally Posted by charles
I bet some people show off their illegal kills on FB.


Correct.
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:42 AM

Quote
A kid texted me the other day he caught a mink while trapping rats I told him to turn it in and he would be OK, that’s what “employees” should do. IMO


And Law Dog that was the right thing to do but I suspect that there are wildlife officers that would fine that kid even though muskrat seasin is still open and how does one truly keep all now-closed season mink out of a rat trap...?

Quote
I bet some people show off their illegal kills on FB


Charles, I'm sure there are plenty of poachers and less flagrant illegal wildlife activity shown on fb. So, what's your point, that criminals DO exist?
Posted By: Law Dog

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:47 AM

More going on here then this post I’m guessing?
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:53 AM

See Law Dog, old habits die hard.

Nope, if I was so inclined, you could check out my LEO record or have your friends do it. I haven't been arrested since I was a juive and haven't paid a fine for a long time as well, I think it would have been a vehicle related. I just like maximum personal freedom and the administrative state clashes with that idea. Given the size of the U.S. and individual state population, there is a need for some administrative state but it can quickly get out of control or at least has the potential. I work for an enitity that writes bad checks all the time but can cover it by printing its own money. However, I don't work for a regulatory agency or law enforcement so my ability to use the administrative state is pretty limited. Not so with other parts of government.
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:56 AM

Quote
I work for an entity that writes bad checks all the time but can cover it by printing its own money.
at least for a while (covering it by printing their own "money")

I'm going to go watch Tucker Carlson while I skin out tow old big coons that finally thawed out. Later.........
Posted By: Wanna Be

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:02 AM

Had a buddy that posted him posing with a bear in the back of a truck and said, “Never know what you’ll find in the woods!”
It wasn’t 2 hours and the local GW with friends was at his house, lol!!
He had a friend that had killed it legally in North Ga where there are bears and a season for them.
So yeah, they monitor FB or someone that doesn’t like him tipped them off. It’s got to the point around here now that folks save their hunting pics and post them more during the Spring and even Summer with limits of ducks, or a turkey, or in another buddies instance, a very nice deer. He also got visited, lol. The buck was mounted on the wall.
One of the many reasons I’m not on Social Media...except here and I know what to post and what not to post and when.
Posted By: BBarnes

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:06 AM

While your out there skinning why don’t you loose that chip you have on your shoulder. It seems that your way of thinking is how certain people get elected to office.


B
Posted By: Law Dog

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:09 AM

Originally Posted by NonPCfed
See Law Dog, old habits die hard.

Nope, if I was so inclined, you could check out my LEO record or have your friends do it. I haven't been arrested since I was a juive and haven't paid a fine for a long time as well, I think it would have been a vehicle related. I just like maximum personal freedom and the administrative state clashes with that idea. Given the size of the U.S. and individual state population, there is a need for some administrative state but it can quickly get out of control or at least has the potential. I work for an enitity that writes bad checks all the time but can cover it by printing its own money. However, I don't work for a regulatory agency or law enforcement so my ability to use the administrative state is pretty limited. Not so with other parts of government.


Never said anything criminal just said something going on was all I said. I’d start over tomorrow if I was you but you do what you think works the best for you. I’m avoiding dog and pony shows in 2021 nothing personal just what works best for me.
Posted By: DWC

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:11 AM

If one cherishes personal freedoms, Facebook is the last thing to be on.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:45 AM

NonPCFed,
You come very close to understanding the role that social media plays in modern wildlife violation investigations.

But there are legal aspects that you didnt mention......its called reasonable suspicion and probable cause.

RS is the terminology that describes facts and/or circumstances that the officer discovered/observed that leads him to believe a crime MAY HAVE BEEN committed. RS is short of the level that probable cause reaches. RS is needed to start an investigation or to conduct a stop.

PC is a set of facts and circumstances that goes beyond RS that causes the officer to believe that a crime HAS BEEN or IS ABOUT TO BE committed. PC is required for an arrest or a charge to be made.

Ex) Seeing pics and comments on social media of three bucks that was posted days before the season legally opened would be RS. The GW takes a closer look at the poster's public FB page. Maybe a name is learned and a location. The guy's info is looked at to see if has a hunting license. He has no valid hunting license...which is PC for a lic charge that may be coming. The officer uses the info (pics and comments) thus far to apply for a search warrant from FB. A judge agrees there is PC for the warrant based on the PC that the pics and comments provided showing the posting date and the comments related to the pics. FB responds to the warrant a few weeks later and provides 1000 pages of the guy's FB page. More PC is obtained from the guy's page related to the deer poaching including the geolocation of where the buck pics were taken. The officer visits these locations and documents more evidence...blood, drag marks, etc. The guy is located and an interview is attempted, but he refuses to admit to anything and tells the GW to leave his property. The officer applies for a search warrant of the guy's residence and outbuildings to locate the deer meat and antlers. An arrest warrant is applied for also. A judge agrees and issues both warrants. Three GWs serve the search warrant, find the deer thats in the pics and secure them. A county deputy stands by to transport the poacher after he is arrested. He is assigned a bond at arrest & booking for three counts of hunting deer out of season. The GW didnt charge him for the lic violation.He dont have anyone to sign his bond so he sits in jail until his buddy drives over the next morning and bonds him out.

That is a fictional story, with extra details, but shows how a GW can use social media. The poacher provided the best evidence in this case....., especially to start the ball rolling.
Posted By: maintenanceguy

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:46 AM

CO in our area got 6 months off from work using social media - or at least Craigslist. He couldn't get a search warrant for a property he suspected was growing pot. So he put an add on Craigslist for free firewood or free scrap metal or something similar at the suspects address. He then responded to his own add and looked around for the scrap metal or firewood or whatever it was.

We only have a few COs that serve our part of the state. I've met a few, maybe all of them. The rest have been polite, professional, and reasonable. He stood out from the crowd.
Posted By: newtoga

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:47 AM

Originally Posted by charles
I bet some people show off their illegal kills on FB.

Bobcats are protected in Ohio and people post pictures on FB that they caught and killed. Dumb a~~ es
Posted By: frank1969

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:50 AM

There is a pa warden on this site
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:53 AM

Originally Posted by maintenanceguy
CO in our area got 6 months off from work using social media - or at least Craigslist. He couldn't get a search warrant for a property he suspected was growing pot. So he put an add on Craigslist for free firewood or free scrap metal or something similar at the suspects address. He then responded to his own add and looked around for the scrap metal or firewood or whatever it was.

We only have a few COs that serve our part of the state. I've met a few, maybe all of them. The rest have been polite, professional, and reasonable. He stood out from the crowd.

This was "crossing the line". I agree, he should have been reprimanded..if not terminated. He made up his own PC....not good.
Posted By: grumley701

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:03 AM

Poachers are boasters, bragging within their circle just ain't good enough for some and that makes a CO's job a bit easier.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:07 AM

Originally Posted by grumley701
Poachers are boasters, bragging within their circle just ain't good enough for some and that makes a CO's job a bit easier.

Most are. If they cant show and tell somebody it aint as fun.
Posted By: midlander

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:13 AM

Originally Posted by frank1969
There is a pa warden on this site

Im sure there are wardens from every state on here but not sure what your point is?
Posted By: waggler

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:22 AM

Originally Posted by charles
I bet some people show off their illegal kills on FB.

It happens all time.
It doesn't bother me at all that they use FB to nab moronic poachers who post their kills on line.
I did have a GW called me about a year ago because he saw online pictures of a group of Jeepers who were mobbing around in our lake. He wanted to know if I wanted him to write them tickets for trespassing. I said no, just tell them to not come back. I think he may have written them-up for driving through a "sensitive Area" (wetlands) though.
Posted By: grumley701

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:29 AM

I've posted pics of out of season catches to my social media accounts but only after I contacted the warden and made arrangements for the pick up of the beast in question.
Posted By: Hoosier71

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:33 AM

Originally Posted by DWC
If one cherishes personal freedoms, Facebook is the last thing to be on.


This is probably the most intelligent non trapping post I have ever read on here.
Posted By: Northof50

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:43 AM

Originally Posted by charles
I bet some people show off their illegal kills on FB.

Got that right.
Cougar shot in Manitoba, picture and story posted of FB

what few people know is;
all phone cameras have an embedded GPS imprinted so even the gut pile was recovered
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:52 AM

[quoteGot that right.
Cougar shot in Manitoba, picture and story posted of FB

what few people know is;
all phone cameras have an embedded GPS imprinted so even the gut pile was recovered][/quote]

Was it an Apple phone...? Corporate Apple people wouldn't give fed law enforcement the ability to decrypt the San Bernardino radical Islamic mass killers a few years back. I guess finding out who whacked a mt lion is more important than admitting there are Muslims who want and will kill non-Muslims for no real reason...
Posted By: WyFurHarvesters

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:53 AM

Catch them anyway you can as far as Im concerned a poacher is a thief and stealing from me and other sportsman while making us look bad. Would you use facebook if you found someone posting pics of traps and fur they have stolen from your traps. Just saw a guy in Colorado got caught for shooting 12 deer a bighorn sheep and 2 turkey just this year. How many do you think he got away with in past years. In most states you will never get a chance to get a bighorn sheep permit or kill a trophy buck this guy took a lot of chances away and killed a lot of genetics. A big buck, bull or ram lived that long because he was tough, knew how to escape and some thief takes him with a cheap shot out of season and like I stated how many did he get away with before being caught.
Posted By: Yukon John

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:57 AM

I'll give all who will heed some advice...if you don't want your business known, then KEEP IT OFF OF THE INTERNET! As far as I know, it is not illegal to peruse ones (voluntary) public comments. Use common sense, "what you say, can, and will be used".
Posted By: Yukon John

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:59 AM

...I don't even text most wildlife pics, unless I know for sure that I am legal to do so.
Posted By: Bigbrownie

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:59 AM

I know a fella who was on the PGC radar screen for years. Had paid numerous fines and finished up on a three year license suspension two years ago. Last season, he got a pic taken with a half dozen different bucks that his buddies legally killed. He posted a pic of him and these bucks on his Facebook page, with no commentary. The phone was ringing off the hook at the regional PGC office. It wasn’t long before the PGC had several of there people looking into the pics, and spent many hours going around trying to gather info on what they thought were illegally killed deer.
Posted By: Matt28

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 03:58 AM

Originally Posted by Yukon John
I'll give all who will heed some advice...if you don't want your business known, then KEEP IT OFF OF THE INTERNET! As far as I know, it is not illegal to peruse ones (voluntary) public comments. Use common sense, "what you say, can, and will be used".

Well said.
Posted By: Grandpa Trapper

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 04:40 AM

Originally Posted by frank1969
There is a pa warden on this site


And some ex-ones.
Posted By: Wright Brothers

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:19 PM

I've had more grief from non-leo than leo after posting location/catch pics.
I like seeing location as much as anyone
and learned long ago that not all internet trappers are genuine.
Nor are all internet friends.

Gotta grin when seeing folks bark about social media on t-man.

Just glad no anties on here
grin
Posted By: Wanna Be

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:31 PM

My best gobbler I mentioned earlier came from a PUBLIC post on FB. My buddy sent me a pic of a “pin” where the gobbler was and a blue dot where the hunter was. And it was a satellite view of a spot on a local WMA!!! He said if you recognize this area, there’s a turkey there that’s been kicking this guys butt for the last 2 weekends.
I’d been hunting this WMA since I was a kid and knew where it was. He sent it on a Thursday evening, so I called my boss and said I’m taking half a day vacation in the morning. I went to his spot and waded through the swamp to where he had pinpointed the turkey and waited until daylight. He wasn’t an easy bird to kill, lol. First gobble at 0650. Killed him at 1110!
An 11.25” beard with matching 1.5” Spurs...all thanks to someone posting on FB of a local public bird!
Posted By: DWC

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Wright Brothers
I've had more grief from non-leo than leo after posting location/catch pics.
I like seeing location as much as anyone
and learned long ago that not all internet trappers are genuine.
Nor are all internet friends.

Gotta grin when seeing folks bark about social media on t-man.

Just glad no anties on here
grin


This website can not be compared to fbook or these other crap sites.
Posted By: HobbieTrapper

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 12:52 PM

There is no way LE can investigate everything posted on social media even though we all know, “if it’s on the internet, it must be true.” lol
Posted By: upstateNY

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 01:15 PM

Originally Posted by charles
I bet some people show off their illegal kills on FB.

And long before computors and FaceTwitter came along,,they braged about them after one two many at the local gin mills.
Posted By: Tactical.20

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:06 PM

I know one that's on here, he never posts anything, I think there are several more from other states on here, good place to watch for someone making mistakes
Posted By: 330-Trapper

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:07 PM

Originally Posted by Law Dog
Without proof what power do we have really and if your giving the proof away then your “ employees” should look the other way then? Sounds like no matter what is done a argument could be made. LOL

A kid texted me the other day he caught a mink while trapping rats I told him to turn it in and he would be OK, that’s what “employees” should do. IMO

Its always the best route
Posted By: Northof50

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:12 PM

active light duty....sitting behind a desk and cruising the net
Posted By: trapperbless

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:16 PM

Law enforcement officers are definitely watching this site. I had a long visit, about 2 hrs, at my house in 2014 with a federal wildlife investigator and a regional officer.

In 2013-2014 I was on a beaver quest. I had trapped all of my private properties with the exception of a couple because they are full of otter and I wanted to avoid them. I had called our local conservation officer in January and asked him some questions about some public property to make sure it was fine if I trapped it and made sure I didn’t have to check in before starting, whether needed permits, etc. He gave me the green light. Now I’ve only met this officer one time and he seemed like a great guy. But I know of several people, my friends included, that have had some pretty negative experiences with him.

March of 2014 I get a call from an unknown number, so like always I didn’t answer it. The officer that ended up coming to the house had left a message and asked if I was available to talk. I was busy working so I was going to call him back when I finished the job. A couple hours later they call again. I answer and he asks if they can meet at my house to talk. I agree and ask when works for them. He says we’re actually in your driveway now. I’m trying to figure out what I could have possibly done or what has happened. I run home and that’s when the questions begin. They introduce themselves and said that officer so and so said you had been doing some trapping and they’d like to “interview” me. I thought that was strange since I hadn’t talked to him in 2 months. It started out as an interview, but It wasn’t an interview. It was an investigation. . They were both very professional and very very thorough. I was asked the same questions multiple times throughout the conversation. This wasn’t their first rodeo and were very tricky on how they asked questions. If I was bluffing or making up a story, they would have easily figured it out. After answering the same questions 5 times I still didn’t think they fully believed me so I had them get their iPad and I showed them the properties I trapped and exactly where the cats and otters came from. I even gave them the landowners contact to call as well but they didn’t feel the need to at that point.

I didn’t have anything to hide and answered every question without hesitation. Here’s how they confirmed I was truthful with them. They had print outs of my past posts and pictures from trapperman. My harvest logs that I turned in to the state as well as how many of each species I caught,sold, tanned, etc. They showed me these towards the end of the conversation.

I had been trapping 2 states and posted several pictures from those trapping trips. The primary concern for the visit was bobcat and otter. At the time, my home state didn’t have a season for either species so that was red flag number 1 for them. I also had 2 resident trapping licenses, red flag number 2. I had my license from my home state and also was a full time college student in another state which allowed me to have a resident license there too.

After all that, just be careful what you post. If you don’t have anything to hide then post away. If there’s any chance that something is suspicious, they definitely have the right to come investigate. Anything you put on social media can be used just as an anonymous tip of illegal activity. In my instance, they had 2 good reasons to investigate the situation and they did a darn good job of it.
Posted By: Crit-R-Dun

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:23 PM

I think, unless there's an active investigation and a focus on a particular bad character, trolling around sites like this looking for legitimate leads would be a waste of an officer's time. I don't know what it's like elsewhere but our COs are swamped with work, can't imagine any one of them having the time to peruse these types of sites looking for work.
Posted By: MnMan

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:34 PM

I hope this does not steer this topic in a different direction but I have a question about reasonable suspicion and probable cause as far as obtaining a search warrant is concerned. Say, for example that I am coming off the lake with a limit of fish and am checked by a conservation officer. I am within the law but he asks if he can check my freezer at home to see if I have any there. I do not give him permission to search my freezer without a warrant. Does this give him reasonable suspicion that I have an overlimit or probable cause to obtain a warrant. Don't get the idea that I am in violation and I have never been in this situation...just curious as to how this would work.
Posted By: Crit-R-Dun

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:38 PM

Originally Posted by MnMan
I hope this does not steer this topic in a different direction but I have a question about reasonable suspicion and probable cause as far as obtaining a search warrant is concerned. Say, for example that I am coming off the lake with a limit of fish and am checked by a conservation officer. I am within the law but he asks if he can check my freezer at home to see if I have any there. I do not give him permission to search my freezer without a warrant. Does this give him reasonable suspicion that I have an overlimit or probable cause to obtain a warrant. Don't get the idea that I am in violation and I have never been in this situation...just curious as to how this would work.


Can't speak for MN but that wouldn't come any where near the threshold required to meet here to constitute reasonable grounds.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:46 PM

Originally Posted by MnMan
I hope this does not steer this topic in a different direction but I have a question about reasonable suspicion and probable cause as far as obtaining a search warrant is concerned. Say, for example that I am coming off the lake with a limit of fish and am checked by a conservation officer. I am within the law but he asks if he can check my freezer at home to see if I have any there. I do not give him permission to search my freezer without a warrant. Does this give him reasonable suspicion that I have an overlimit or probable cause to obtain a warrant. Don't get the idea that I am in violation and I have never been in this situation...just curious as to how this would work.

No....your refusal to let him into your home is not RS and definitely IS NOT ENOUGH PC to satisfy any judge I know.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:49 PM

Originally Posted by Crit-R-Dun
I think, unless there's an active investigation and a focus on a particular bad character, trolling around sites like this looking for legitimate leads would be a waste of an officer's time. I don't know what it's like elsewhere but our COs are swamped with work, can't imagine any one of them having the time to peruse these types of sites looking for work.

When a GW is sitting in his truck at a boat ramp, conducting night hunting surveillance, or daytime surveillance there is a lot of time to flip the computer open and take a look.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by Northof50
active light duty....sitting behind a desk and cruising the net

GWs multi-task.


...not behind a desk.

..from the seat of his patrol truck...on a Panasonic Toughbook with a wireless internet connection.
Posted By: SJA

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
Originally Posted by Northof50
active light duty....sitting behind a desk and cruising the net

GWs multi-task.

. . . and can "wear" many Hats. I knew one that was a GW, Fed, SP, and CustA all at the same time! It was a Special Div.
Posted By: DWC

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 03:39 PM

Theres has been a misconception that wardens can look where they want when they want. No warrant nothin just go and look. Ive heard this for years. Dont be fooled.
Posted By: ~ADC~

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 05:02 PM

I didn't read any of the replies so sorry if this has been said but I bet very few look on any social media to try and find violations, but rather are turned on to violations by internet weasels who can't mind their own business. "Bob said on facebook he shot an elephant and three mice. I know the limit is 2 mice!!! , get him!"
Posted By: Dirt

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 05:10 PM

I've warned several posters on here via PM that what they posted was illegal, might want to delete your post?
Posted By: Boco

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 05:22 PM

It all boils down to "if you follow the law and have nothing to hide,you dont have anything to worry about"-post away fellow trappers.
You need to know the law 100%,if in doubt,get clarification in writing from the authorities.

Someone posted that poachers are the biggest braggers.True for the ones that get caught.
There are people who poach for food-not bragging rights or trophys.They mostly have been maybe caught once or twice but learned from those experiences to hone their craft.They are likely the most secretive people you are ever likely to meet.
Posted By: teepee2

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 05:31 PM

True story, not only dum to post on face book, don't put in the local paper ether. A guy that worked for the county road dept. was doing some work on a bridge. He looked down and saw a big flathead in shallow water along a sandbar. He went down and grabbed it, then had a write up and picture of the fish in the paper. Well he got a ticket for hand fishing, which is illegal in this state, plus he got fired for goofing off on the job. You can't fix stupid. laugh
Posted By: Bear Tracker

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 05:34 PM

DWC it depends on the state. With the exception of your house, in WI they can do pretty much anything.
Posted By: Dirt

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 05:48 PM

Originally Posted by Boco
It all boils down to "if you follow the law and have nothing to hide,you dont have anything to worry about"-post away fellow trappers.
You need to know the law 100%,if in doubt,get clarification in writing from the authorities.

Someone posted that poachers are the biggest braggers.True for the ones that get caught.
There are people who poach for food-not bragging rights or trophys.They mostly have been maybe caught once or twice but learned from those experiences to hone their craft.They are likely the most secretive people you are ever likely to meet.


Do you know 100% of the laws?
Posted By: Boco

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 05:51 PM

Yes, the ones that I am subjected to in trapping hunting tanning and fur dealing-with clarifications in writing.
I am not familiar with all the laws that dont apply to what I do-like slot limits for fish on lakes I dont fish etc.
Posted By: grumley701

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by Boco
It all boils down to "if you follow the law and have nothing to hide,you dont have anything to worry about"-post away fellow trappers.
You need to know the law 100%,if in doubt,get clarification in writing from the authorities.

Someone posted that poachers are the biggest braggers.True for the ones that get caught.
There are people who poach for food-not bragging rights or trophys.They mostly have been maybe caught once or twice but learned from those experiences to hone their craft.They are likely the most secretive people you are ever likely to meet.


Yeah I'm aware that there are subsistence poachers, this thread is about wardens using social media to catch poachers. I would think that the people posting pics of a poached kills isn't poaching to feed himself/family.
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 06:02 PM

Quote
Theres has been a misconception that wardens can look where they want when they want. No warrant nothin just go and look. Ive heard this for years. Dont be fooled.


DWC- Wasn't there a recent news story that Gov. Kristi had her administration reviewing South Dakota's "open fields" doctrine that allows COs to come search your property because they see (or claim they see) something from the road?

Maybe Swamp Wolf has more skeptical judges down in his parts of GA, but I suspect that most wildlife officers can get judges to sign off on most search warrant appliactions. And most of those search warrants are probably totally justified, but I bet some are fishing expeditions based on what an officer wants to believe. I have a friend that spent 6 months on this county's grand jury. They seldom denied the district attorney from getting indictments for whatever (this was way more than just wildlife crimes). A few times he told me the GJ stood up and pushed back on the DAs, but not very often.
Posted By: Dirt

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 06:18 PM

Nobody knows 100% of the laws here, Not even the wildlife troopers. I once had to call their boss to have him tell them to stop writing tickets for something that was legal. I have often had to tell the troopers the law and then they would go and check to see. They have also corrected me. The laws are so complex and convoluted and changing all the time. nobody can know them all, well except the legend.
Posted By: Law Dog

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 06:21 PM

Originally Posted by ~ADC~
I didn't read any of the replies so sorry if this has been said but I bet very few look on any social media to try and find violations, but rather are turned on to violations by internet weasels who can't mind their own business. "Bob said on facebook he shot an elephant and three mice. I know the limit is 2 mice!!! , get him!"



Today most city folks think everything is endangered when most are thriving because of conservation efforts you cant fix the stupid in these people.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 06:30 PM

Originally Posted by NonPCfed
Quote
Theres has been a misconception that wardens can look where they want when they want. No warrant nothin just go and look. Ive heard this for years. Dont be fooled.


DWC- Wasn't there a recent news story that Gov. Kristi had her administration reviewing South Dakota's "open fields" doctrine that allows COs to come search your property because they see (or claim they see) something from the road?

Maybe Swamp Wolf has more skeptical judges down in his parts of GA, but I suspect that most wildlife officers can get judges to sign off on most search warrant appliactions. And most of those search warrants are probably totally justified, but I bet some are fishing expeditions based on what an officer wants to believe. I have a friend that spent 6 months on this county's grand jury. They seldom denied the district attorney from getting indictments for whatever (this was way more than just wildlife crimes). A few times he told me the GJ stood up and pushed back on the DAs, but not very often.

Thats because a grand jury hears only the prosecution's side and then decides if it appears there is enough evidence to go to trial...

...but there is still a trial.
Posted By: Golf ball

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 06:31 PM

Back when gas was $4 a gallon our GW’s were limited on the amount of miles they could drive per week . They spent many many hours on the computer cruising sights like this . They found a guy on face book posting a picture of his previous years buck that he had just got back from the taxidermist. The red flag was a 190” deer from Florida. When they looked closer they found that this was an Illinois deer killed on his cousins lease with his cousins buck tag. He had not wanted to spend the $400 for a buck tag and purchased a doe tag so he could hunt without looking over his shoulder. After all if your gonna take vacation to poach a monster you wouldn’t want to be looking over your shoulder the whole time , lol ! It took this guy a year to get caught but thankfully our CPO’s caught him while he was here hunting the following year.
It does not bother me one bit that these folks use social media to catch these low life’s, and they can get on this site and Learn a little more about trapping and trappers. I think it’s a win for both sides !
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 06:35 PM

Originally Posted by DWC
Theres has been a misconception that wardens can look where they want when they want. No warrant nothin just go and look. Ive heard this for years. Dont be fooled.

In Ga, GWs are allowed by law to go on property, outside of buildings, without a warrant, in the performance of their duties.

No foolin' ya here in Georgia.

South Dakota? I do not know. But a quick search of SD law would answer that.
Posted By: Northof50

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 07:02 PM

This is turning out to be a good soap opera. Lets keep the stories rolling.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 08:08 PM

Originally Posted by Northof50
This is turning out to be a good soap opera. Lets keep the stories rolling.

I could use some help replying to these threads from all those game wardens (retired or not) yall say are on Tman. ClayC is busy scraping pelts...lol

Im not here to "get" anyone. Ive been here 12 years because Im a trapper that is also a GW. Never tried to hide that Im a GW.

Ive had a fantastic career....25 years "boots on the ground" so far....patrolling half a dozen rural counties around the Okefenokee Swamp/walking the fields, woods, river and creek banks/riding the rivers and swamps in a jon boat and riding an ATV for hundreds, if not thousands of miles annually/travelling all over Ga and sometimes the Southeast to assist with everything from mass fatalities (Hurricane Katrina) to civil unrest in Ga cities/meeting some great outdoorsmen & some real (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman)es/helping many people in distress/educating hundreds of young hunters and boaters/training new GWs how to catch outlaws from poachers to moonshiners to dope growers/ always trying to enlighten people about the reasons why conservation is so important/have issued 1000's of citations, warnings, and verbal guidance always focusing on the resource damaging and public safety violators and giving folks the benefit of the doubt...believing a "tie goes to the runner".

I have never had to "work" a day since holding up my right hand and being sworn in as a Ga GW. When you love your job its never work. What a great career it is and has been!!!
Posted By: teepee2

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 08:09 PM

Watch how you try to stretch the law. Here we can by our license on line plus we have to report our harvest by phone or on line. One fella went and shot a deer without a license in the afternoon, went and bought his license after legal shooting hours, then reported it on line. The computer thur up the red flag---- The deer was reported before the license was valid, which would of been the next morning.---- DUH.
Posted By: Crit-R-Dun

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 08:15 PM

I did 32 years of front line policing in rural Ontario and some of my fondest memories are some good partnerships working with COs. Here we team up a lot with game wardens to do joint patrols and joint enforcement efforts. Any I ever worked with were highly dedicated and passionate about their conservation efforts but applied the laws with fairness and common sense. Thanks for all your time and input here Swampy, it's valuable and appreciated and you never get rattled by the occasional goof ball, lol.
Posted By: Dirt

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 08:34 PM

Originally Posted by Northof50
This is turning out to be a good soap opera. Lets keep the stories rolling.


Did I ever tell the story about the wildlife trooper who shot an illegal moose. Apparently, he was hunting the wrong area. blush
Posted By: Snowpa

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 08:39 PM

They recruit informants every day ,Just got worked by one the other day while coyote hunting question after question .Almost hilarious ,I just tell them what they want to hear and then some !
Posted By: Tactical.20

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/05/21 10:13 PM

😆
Posted By: Wanna Be

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 01:58 AM

I wouldn’t mess with Swamp. The Oke has gators big enough to eat a full grown man whole and this man plays with them, lol. I don’t mind small gators, but don’t care for the ones that can make you disappear in one bite!! If he’s survived with all those crazies on the East side, then he can’t be half bad.
Posted By: Tailhunter

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 02:01 AM

Freedom no longer exists in this country. You are being watched, listened too or both everywhere you go.

And it gets worse everyday.
Posted By: Bearguy

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 02:58 AM

Great thread. Brings to mind a story from a long time ago.. I knew a guy who thought feeding his big family wild fish and game on a regular basis was perfectly fine. Mostly because, well, he had a big family. Got caught with one to many deer one evening, and according to him, he became a person of interest to the local GW for ever more. Some time the following winter he was trapping coyotes and was stopped by a Game officer way out in the pucker brush so to speak. The officer ran his info, and found him to be a person of low moral character. The officer asked to look in the tool box in the back of his pickup, my friend said no. I can get a search warrant the officer said. Well go ahead and get one, there's nothing in there illegal and your just wasting your time. Well a judge was found, and another officer showed up with the paper work hours later. The tool box was opened, as were door panels and headliner. Nothing illegal was found. He told me if he had to do it over he would of popped open the tool box, let him look and be on his way. He finally moved out of state.
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 03:18 AM

Quote
The tool box was opened, as were door panels and headliner. Nothing illegal was found. He told me if he had to do it over he would of popped open the tool box, let him look and be on his way. He finally moved out of state.


I take it they didn't put his truck back together for him...?
Posted By: finbar

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 03:41 AM

Your cell phone camera typically includes metadata with the photo, called EXIF data, that can include a gps stamp of where the photo was taken. When you send the picture to someone or post it on the internet, this data is still in the file. You are sharing this data willingly. The govt is not intercepting it . You can remove the EXIF data but I just use a dedicated digital camera.
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 03:48 AM

Did you know you can't sell bird nets on ebay...? Maybe illegal in some or most states, maybe some of those regs that aren't in the "book" but show up in administrative code that still can used to fine people. Stinking swallows try to make nests on my front porch brick columns most years, sometimes they're faster than me in building than I'm removing them. So, a few years back a robin built a nest in the angle of my downspout on the house and then later the swallow got a nest 100% done. The swallow nest came down by me in one piece and later after the robins fledged, I didn't see the need for that nest to stay up on my house, so it came down as well. Now I had two different birds nests and thought it might be a neat thing for someone to have so tried offering it on ebay. The ad got shot down several different ways so I figured that 1) there must be a lot of bunny huggers that think selling old annual bid nests is cruelty to the birds, and/or 2) various state or h*** maybe even the feds have "laws" against such, because these birds are migratory. Ok, bird nests became one with nature in the back yard somewhere.

Fast forward to this winter. Leaves have been off of the one smaller tree we have on the street edge and I hadn't noticed that there was a robin's nest in from 2020. So I pulled it out of the tree and lookie, there were still 2 whole eggs in left over from spring, seriously dried out I'm sure and one that had hatched or at least broke in two. I thought that would be a cool thing to give to a kindergarten or 1st grade teacher to show their students. So, I had it in my garage sitting around on a shelf for a couple of months. Towards the end of January, I had my sad coon cubbie incident that some may remember me posting about before I realized that the subject was one that couldn't be discussed. The state guys investigated the event, my cubbie and location were totally legit but the one officer just wanted to see my licenses in person and see me operate a bodygripper so he was coming out the next day. I saw that robin's nest sitting on the shelf and thought, "wow, maybe its verboten for me to have this bird nest and maybe if he saw it, he'd ticket me." So, that bird nest went away as well. That's where we are folks, worrying about a seasonal bird nests made by a tweeter that numbers in the what, hundreds of millions, and only lives probably about a year and half on average. And that's basically the benign administrative state.

Boco, you still know all the wildlife laws 100% that you fall under...?
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 03:48 AM

Originally Posted by finbar
Your cell phone camera typically includes metadata with the photo, called EXIF data, that can include a gps stamp of where the photo was taken. When you send the picture to someone or post it on the internet, this data is still in the file. You are sharing this data willingly. The govt is not intercepting it . You can remove the EXIF data but I just use a dedicated digital camera.

Hush! Lol
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 03:51 AM

Hey, Swamp Wolf, one more question for you. Do you remember the case that made national news a number of years ago about the USFWS team that raided a Maine restaurant to take a very old taxidermy mount (120 or more years old) of a seagull that doesn't exist anymore? Do you think that was a "good score" by the feds...?
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 03:54 AM

Originally Posted by NonPCfed
Did you know you can't sell bird nets on ebay...? Maybe illegal in some or most states, maybe some of those regs that aren't in the "book" but show up in administrative code that still can used to fine people. Stinking swallows try to make nests on my front porch brick columns most years, sometimes they're faster than me in building than I'm removing them. So, a few years back a robin built a nest in the angle of my downspout on the house and then later the swallow got a nest 100% done. The swallow nest came down by me in one piece and later after the robins fledged, I didn't see the need for that nest to stay up on my house, so it came down as well. Now I had two different birds nests and thought it might be a neat thing for someone to have so tried offering it on ebay. The ad got shot down several different ways so I figured that 1) there must be a lot of bunny huggers that think selling old annual bid nests is cruelty to the birds, and/or 2) various state or h*** maybe even the feds have "laws" against such, because these birds are migratory. Ok, bird nests became one with nature in the back yard somewhere.

Fast forward to this winter. Leaves have been off of the one smaller tree we have on the street edge and I hadn't noticed that there was a robin's nest in from 2020. So I pulled it out of the tree and lookie, there were still 2 whole eggs in left over from spring, seriously dried out I'm sure and one that had hatched or at least broke in two. I thought that would be a cool thing to give to a kindergarten or 1st grade teacher to show their students. So, I had it in my garage sitting around on a shelf for a couple of months. Towards the end of January, I had my sad coon cubbie incident that some may remember me posting about before I realized that the subject was one that couldn't be discussed. The state guys investigated the event, my cubbie and location were totally legit but the one officer just wanted to see my licenses in person and see me operate a bodygripper so he was coming out the next day. I saw that robin's nest sitting on the shelf and thought, "wow, maybe its verboten for me to have this bird nest and maybe if he saw it, he'd ticket me." So, that bird nest went away as well. That's where we are folks, worrying about a seasonal bird nests made by a tweeter that numbers in the what, hundreds of millions, and only lives probably about a year and half on average. And that's basically the benign administrative state.

Boco, you still know all the wildlife laws 100% that you fall under...?

Seems to me that you and eBay are the only ones worried about your bird nests. You are one paranoid dude.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 03:58 AM

Originally Posted by Wanna Be
I wouldn’t mess with Swamp. The Oke has gators big enough to eat a full grown man whole and this man plays with them, lol. I don’t mind small gators, but don’t care for the ones that can make you disappear in one bite!! If he’s survived with all those crazies on the East side, then he can’t be half bad.

We call our agent gator trappers to get them bigguns. Had a 9 footer about break my dang wrist last summer. I knew better than to try and cinch his snout shut with my ketch pole. He took it away from and spanked my butt with it. He was feisty!!!
Posted By: DelawareRob

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 04:00 AM

Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
Originally Posted by Wanna Be
I wouldn’t mess with Swamp. The Oke has gators big enough to eat a full grown man whole and this man plays with them, lol. I don’t mind small gators, but don’t care for the ones that can make you disappear in one bite!! If he’s survived with all those crazies on the East side, then he can’t be half bad.

We call our agent gator trappers to get them bigguns. Had a 9 footer about break my dang wrist last summer. I knew better than to try and cinch his snout shut with my ketch pole. He took it away from and spanked my butt with it. He was feisty!!!


Gator trapping/Hunting sounds fun.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 04:01 AM

Originally Posted by NonPCfed
Hey, Swamp Wolf, one more question for you. Do you remember the case that made national news a number of years ago about the USFWS team that raided a Maine restaurant to take a very old taxidermy mount (120 or more years old) of a seagull that doesn't exist anymore? Do you think that was a "good score" by the feds...?

Not familiar with that.

The USFWS operates a little differently than most state GW agencies.
Posted By: Wanna Be

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 04:04 AM

So if someone has a Spectacled Eider mounted legally and it’s now endangered, they can take that? I don’t know what the laws were on Seagulls 120 years ago, but what’s the point in taking it?
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 04:15 AM

Originally Posted by Wanna Be
So if someone has a Spectacled Eider mounted legally and it’s now endangered, they can take that? I don’t know what the laws were on Seagulls 120 years ago, but what’s the point in taking it?

There are some tight federal laws related to possession of protected migratory birds and birds of prey. People fuss about this all the time when they are not allowed to keep the road-killed owl or hawk. These tight laws keep illegal trade in feathers and other parts at a minimum thereby protecting the resource. How enforcement is carried out varies across the country...some areas it is more lenient..others not so much.
Posted By: Boco

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 04:43 AM

Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
Originally Posted by Wanna Be
So if someone has a Spectacled Eider mounted legally and it’s now endangered, they can take that? I don’t know what the laws were on Seagulls 120 years ago, but what’s the point in taking it?

There are some tight federal laws related to possession of protected migratory birds and birds of prey. People fuss about this all the time when they are not allowed to keep the road-killed owl or hawk. These tight laws keep illegal trade in feathers and other parts at a minimum thereby protecting the resource. How enforcement is carried out varies across the country...some areas it is more lenient..others not so much.


Its not a resource anymore if you cant use it.
Posted By: Swamp Wolf

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 04:46 AM

Originally Posted by Boco
Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf

There are some tight federal laws related to possession of protected migratory birds and birds of prey. People fuss about this all the time when they are not allowed to keep the road-killed owl or hawk. These tight laws keep illegal trade in feathers and other parts at a minimum thereby protecting the resource. How enforcement is carried out varies across the country...some areas it is more lenient..others not so much.


Its not a resource anymore if you cant use it.

That dead one may not be, but all the living others of that species are.
Posted By: NonPCfed

Re: so how do wildlife officers use social media...? - 03/06/21 05:07 AM

Nope, doesn't matter when the taxi mount was done, if the species status has changed to say threatened or say new laws about birds of prey, you can't possess it. They will take it.
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