Bitcoin plummets

How bout that, I predict a crash

Look at what DNMR is at now !! That poor stock is taking a beating !!!

Its just "Transitory"

Its still 37,000.00$ for an imaginary coin, eh?

Gold is climbing, has been, tween 1840-1850 break restance at 1850 mite see 2000. I don't care who is in office. Some super Repub. or a bozo Dem. as long as we are on a fiat currency system with a not federal, not reserve, not bank, privately owned company in charge of our money everyone of us is going to get, well not a good thing. Go ahead print some more "it's just paper" Just my opinion, I know others have there's.
Case

Bitcoin is getting dangerously close to my buy targets.

From 42 to 38 is a plummet?

Roll those dice. Good luck. It's not like the house always wins, heck they may even let you skim some cream. Win, Win.

Admittedly I don't have a clue what a bitcoin is but if you own 5 of them you just lost 20k in about 15hrs. If I understand the chart. Just my opinion, of course.

Only months ago people were calling Bitcoin at 38k "tulip mania", now Bitcoin at 38k is a death spiral. I love it.

Whatever gets the clicks I suppose.

Pump n Dump by any other name would yada yada yada. See what I did there? Tulip-Rose, I crack myself up. Little smiley thingy.

I know nothing about bitcoin, but what backs it up? Anything?

Hopes dreams and imagination. Currency thought up by the same generation that is calling for defending the police , summer of love, bail reform and green energy is the answer........

Yes and months ago it was 68,000 and people said it would top 100,000 by January. It better pick up jan is almost gone.

I am somewhat of a sceptic of Bitcoin. However, the same could be said of the US dollar; What backs it up? Anything?

Nothing "backs" Bitcoin. Its one if its qualities that makes it the best money ever created... no 3rd party risk (when you properly custody it yourself) . Almost everything you (think you) "own" right now is "backed" by a 3rd party. Your dollars in your bank account, your retirement accounts, etc. If the Federal Government wants to take it they can with ease.

However, the Bitcoin network is secured (different from "backed") by tremendous amounts of electricity which is distributed worldwide, making it extremely difficult for even a State actor to attack.

That's a good question. As stated I don't know about bitcoin, maybe like our federal reserve notes, the full faith and confidence in the American Govt. but in this case with my admitted lack of knowledge might be the world bank. Hopefully someone with a knowledge of the trading system will chime in and help us out, as I also would like to know.

I found one in the lowes parking lot one day. Come to find out it was just a lug from an electrical box .....

I have a few more furs to sell, then if it hits 35,000, I'll buy 10 shares. Lol.

bitcoin like derivatives is something i fail to grasp no matter how much i read about them

i know you can mine bitcoin. with a computer program. seems like another ponzi scheme to me. food ammo traps snares tools clothing property fuel medicine, are things I believe will always have value

i say no thanks to derrivatives and bit coin. what do i know though?

Bitcoin is inexpensive to self verify and easy to self custody..... Derivative products don't make any sense to you precisely because they don't make any sense. They do however make cents for the right people, which is why they exist.

Keith

Chryptic-Having a meaning that is mysterious and obscure.
I wouldnt put good money into something like that unless I was willing to part with it.

Derivatives make complete sense if used for the correct purposes and in the right context.

At least derivatives are based on a tangible underlying asset like oil or corn or beans etc.

White17, was hoping you would show up, all joking aside I did and do have questions about bit c. But now I find it to complicated to type with one finger on an old I-pad, guess I'll have to wait for another time.
Case.

I can't answer BTC questions. Others on here are better informed on that subject.

Derivatives are a different matter. Used appropriately, they can be a very useful tool.

Good enough

Fake money?

By design, there will only ever be 21 million Bitcoins created. What that means for the average "investor" is that the closer it gets to that number the higher the price will rise, as long as the interest is there.

It has been volatile the whole time it's existed. This "plummet" is pretty much in line with that volatility.

El Salvadore made it a legal tender last June.

Those that bought it in 2017 are still sitting pretty. Even those that bought it in late 2020 are still double what they bought it for.

Most people that are in it aren't even looking at the price right now. They're used to this. I am in it, and only watch for the fact that when it gets low enough I'm going to put more into it. My number is around $25,000 before I pull the trigger again.

Where does your money go when (IF) you buy Bitcoin? If you pull the trigger at $25,000 who gets your $25,000 ???

It's like any other investment/stock.

The investment company takes their fee/cut. The rest goes to the person that is selling it. Or in a lot of instances with Bitcoin, the person who mined.

Elkaholic
Thanks for answering some of my questions, the others were re. Exchange rates and gaming them to my advantage but I just looked at the crypto. quotes and figured it out for myself, thought I had a light bulb moment, but it was a light switch moment instead. Thanks again.
Case

I don't think it's worth $38K. Bitcoin is a a solution to a math problem - that's all. It doesn't produce anything. It doesn't own any assets. The only reason it has any value is that people think other people will pay more for it in the future than they paid for it today. But eventually, you run out of people who are interested in buying it and it will crumble.

How does that work? I pay $25k to someone for a sequence of 1's and 0's which I now have the deed to... And they now have $25k in taxable income.

Now if I can walk into a car dealer and exchange my Bitcoin for a new car... Now we're talking... A medium of exchange for tangible goods.

I just have a hard time grasping how it has value.

Mike

what about the dollar? what backs that back up?

the full trust and faith in the US Gov't that is almost $30,000,000,000,000 in debt?

thats 30 trilllion dollars, or $238,000/taxpayer.

people see it as a alternative currancy that is not constantly devalued like the dollar.
People are sick of the US monetary policy and are looking for a better solution.
Thats where alot of support for it comes.

If its not real, like dollars or bit coin, I dont have a lot of confidence in it. Right now, dollars will buy anything that is for sale. I have a little more confidence in dollars. People are losing confidence in wall street and dollars. If that becomes a tidal wave the house of cards comes down.

There are countries and even some companies that are allowing it to be used as payments.

I know at one time Tesla was considering allowing it to be used to buy cars. Not sure if that came to any fruition or not.

One of the problems, IMO, is that it is far too volatile to use as a medium of exchange. There are also capital gains tax ramifications to using it in that manner.

But the biggest problem, IMO is its vulnerability to government.

China has already restricted ownership. Russia is considering restrictions, and the US won't be far behind.

I actually think some restrictions could be beneficial to bitcoin.


I think Tesla changed its mind about accepting bitcoin but indicated they would accept either Dogecoin or Ethereum. I can't recall which

White, I think the volatility scares a lot of companies from taking it. You buy something today for $40,000 in BTC and tomorrow it could be only worth $30,000.

It could work to your benefit, but not many are going to take that chance.

Exactly right !

If some of you think crypto currency is hard to understand, just try figuring out NFT's (Non Fungible Tokens).
The only people they seem to make sense to are 18 year old guys who aren't old enough to remember some good Ponzi schemes. But then, maybe I'm missing something.

Ya got that right !! Quantum physics is child's play compared to NFT's

Like I said when I saw the crypto. quotes and tried to justify them even with u.s. dollars it switched my flip. I knew it was something I wanted nothing to do with. In my mind at least, it went from quantum physics to string theory quick. And I wasn't even thinking about NFT's I'm sticking to land. Something I can pass to my descendants I'll leave the Einstein & Hawking stuff up to them.

Has anyone ever sold or used these investments or is everyone just holding on I understand inflation and the dollar not backed by gold devaluing it But bitcoin is still valued in dollars so where is there any difference from other investments

Tesla will accept Dodgecoin

Americans better hope Bitcoin fails, because if it replaces the dollar as the worlds currency, we will all be living in a third world country.

I have generic silver in my collection that has lost more value from a percentage standpoint from its high than BTC.



It has value is its incorruptible like every fiat currency in the world.Whether it will be a viable medium of exchange remains to be seen, it is still in its infancy.

White governments are more vulnerable to bit coin than the other away around, or at least that is how this contrairian sees it. The only way gubbiments will be able to stop it is to completely shut down the interweb.

On its face value socialism could be a useful tool. As it is, the ease it can be corrupted makes the scourge of humanity. When the derivative experience finally blows up in our face it will be the same scourge.#

When Oregon was still a territory beaver pelts were legal tender.

Can we please go back to that?

You will need a wheelbarrow full to get a loaf of bread currently,but in the near future they will be much more valuable than money.
A buddy of mine has a nice collection of HBC beaver tokens-each token is equivalent to 1 made beaver.Sort of like the oldstyle bitcoin.

The canoe brigades from fort temiskaming to matachewan in the 1880's in North eastern Ontario were paid in made martens.The bowsmen and steersmen got 25 made martens each and the middlemen got 20 each for the return trip.Goods were taken by Canoe brigades to Matachewan and fur was brought back to fort Temiskaming.The entire trip can still be navigated today by canoe.

I think tesla still takes bitcoin for car purchases

Tesla does not currently take bitcoin, that doesn't mean individual dealerships dont

It seems like that is something important to have figured out before calling something currency.

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/bitcoin/

still dropping

Well, is it getting time to buy some or are people losing confidence in its value and its not coming back????????????

So when mining bitcoin........is it found in the same proximity as gold? ...................

Did you ever think that the price dropping may have something to do with the Fed Reserve looking to roll out a digital currency soon. https://www.theblaze.com/news/the-federal-reserve-moves-forward-with-digital-currency-initiative

We're practically there already. One could easily do without cash but it's nice to have some in the underwear drawer.

I think part of it has to do with different countries shutting down Bitcoin mining, and illegal Bitcoin mining.

I think it will go away.

If the Gubmint can invent it's own invisible digital currency where's the value in any other currency?

If you bought a hundred dollars worth of them in 2010 they would be worth over $43 million even after this drop. Choose to look at however you want.

Steven 49'er last night I looked and a 64 quarter is worth about 4.39 in today's money, that's coin silver. Never ment to get rich off it, only hold value. I bought from 4 $, to 20 $ oz. including premiums. Gold I bought from 300 something to 600 something. Including premium. I started buying farm ground at 2500.00 per acre. My last major purchase was 5000.00 acre.

The last time I put pencil to paper my silver DCA (dollar cost avg.) was 11.00 oz. never did analysis on gold, saw no need. I've made 5 trades in metals useing silver to gold ratios and the reverse each time increasing my oz. totals with no out of pocket money. Last one just a few months ago where I did what I feel was a great trade silver to gold. Ratio was mid 50's to 1. All in all I've increased my oz total in both to what I feel is a substantial amount. I don't know if I beat the Dow, or S&P but I am certain I've done much better than some in the stock market. I'm surrounded by some of the largest farm ground owners in the area. Archer Daniels Midland, and Prudential inc. I know the value of my land to them would exceed 10,000 acre. I do/did this for my wife 10 yrs my jr. and heirs.

Now I've shared more personal financial info with you and the www. Than you are ever going to share. Just let me say I don't think comparing coin silver with the spot price at its peak gives a true reflection of the wisdom of holding things with intrinsic value compared with today's Fed. Res. Notes.

This post was about bit coin I'm way off base, and this will be my last post on this thread. Thanks.
Case

Post script, Steven I do respect your opinion. By the way.
Case

Just read the description in this link. People are so stupid .I don't care if they become trillionaires on this stuff it's all based on fantasy and imagination Like selling cubic feet of air . Can't see it can't touch it.

Trouble with any Gov't making a digital currency is the same problem with our current dollar.
The Gov't can print/make more any time they like.
When they do they devalue the existing dollars.
No faith in any gov't baked currency whether digital of notes (dollar bills).
The gov't can change the rules at any time.

Another advantage over dollars is it easily moved from place to place or from person to person without the Gov't being able to know about it.

Get caught with $25,000 and the gov't can seize it. See civil asset forfeiture. Its the Gov't stealing your money without proof of any crime.

Withdraw over 10K from the bank and the gov't gets notified.

It started out at $143 so it would have been nice to have bought one then ,but I wonder if it can disappear with a computer glitch .

It started out at zero.

Sorry I'm a little slow , Bit what?

Hope you didn’t lose a bundle Les.

49 er you haven’t mentioned the main reason it is falling and may become worthless Russia announced this week it is illegal to mine or trade it 74 % of Bitcoin is mined in Russia China already made it illegal earlier this year
If Dems figure out they can start their own it will be illegal here
So good luck

My bad PROPOSD ban

Only 11% is mined in Russia .Congress is looking into a U.S.digital currency to replace the dollar
.If they can do it they control all Your money,with a flip of a switch they can own your money or worse how could you receive any money when they control the blockchain.I feel there might be a time where bitcoins or etherum might be the only way to trade.

Our government already has access to all your currency unless you keep it at home instead of the bank. If you keep it in cash then L.E. will seize it if they find out your doing it.

I havent lost a dime on Bitcoin

What puzzles me is, do you use real money to buy imaginary money?????

They just found out in Brazil its a big Ponzie scheme.Everyone got taken.
Like every other ponzie scheme the last ones in get rooked.

You use your credit card, lol

There's 2 ways to get it.

You can "mine" it. This requires a super computer, and a lot of weird algorithms. It used to be pretty time consuming. Even just a few years ago it could take you months to "mine" even one coin. I'm not sure on how fast, or easy it is to do it this way now.

The other way is to "trade" it like stocks. This is the way most normal/common people are doing it.

When it first came out 1 coin was worth about $.09, and the only way to acquire it was through mining.

So yes you're using real money to buy it. Just like with stocks.

I just went down along the river and mined some out of a sandbar. It's laying around everywhere.

No.



I have been known to say there is a 50 50 chance of that.





The value is that it's decentralized.

Casecollector I value your stance and mine is not much different other than I have metals and BTC. My average cost in silver is more than yours but not by a whole lot. My average cost of BTC is low enough I sleep very well at night. Don't take my postings wrong, I am a sound money advocate and I'd prefer we go back to a true gold standard. BTC intrigues me though and I think there is a lot of merit to the concept.




Jbyrd, that is not why it's falling even though you think that is why it's falling. Every one knows it's ford's fault..... Governments can make it as illegal as they want if the people decide it's a viable medium of exchange the only way they can stop it is to shut down the internet. Up til now, this is not the biggest percentage drop it has experienced.

Casexx i should add I'm not trying to be a big promoter of BTC and for sure am not trying to convince anyone to buy any. I am only stating why I think it has a viable chance of becoming a trusted and medium of exchange.

As a contraarian I find the concept very interesting.

Yes sir understood

Someone just hacked 35 million of that invisible money that could be the panic?

Could a country not "shut it down" the same way they shut down child pornography? By sentencing anyone found to be trading in bitcoin to lengthy prison sentences?

Yes but what good is it if you can’t spend it on anything ???

My 30$ i stuck in bit coin for the (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) of it has been a roller coaster i couldn't imagine having 100s of thousands in it. I've been up to 50$ now down to 18$

Am I missing something? People who own bitcoin today can't cash it in for cash money?

Yes you can. I could cash mine in right now (even the shares/ones I bought for $47,000) and still be ahead of the game.

We have ATM's around here that are rated for BitCoin. You can put your money into the machine and get yourself a Bitcoin, or partial Bitcoin. It goes into what's called a digital wallet.

Jbyrd, either refuses to see, or has reading comprehension problems, but there are companies that will take Bitcoin for purchases. There are even countries that have made it legal for all purchases.

Microsoft, Paypal, Overstock, Wholefoods, Starbucks, Home Depot, are some of the bigger companies that allow you to use it for purchases.

Basically it's like Apple pay and other digital wallets. They just incorporated BTC into the system to be able to use it for purchases.

Companies that take it are playing a very dangerous game with it. Say you use it to buy a drill.
You walk in buy a $200 drill. They take out the appropriate amount of BTC out of your wallet for the purchase. The next day BTC drops 20%. They have just lost money on that sale. On the other hand. You purchase that same $200 drill and tomorrow BTC goes up 20% they've made more money off that purchase. I'm sure they have safe guards in place so that it instantly turns that BTC into the cash the instant of the purchase. But I can't/won't say for sure because I never looked into using it.

I guess I should clarify also. I didn't drop $45,000 on a BTC. I bought a partial one. I can't remember the actual amount I put into that partial one, but it was less than $200. I'd have to go add the numbers up, but I think I have a total of 8.0005965 BTC. Or some odd number like that.

I also don't sit there and watch the market everyday. You do that and you'll drive yourself crazy. My cousin is one of those people that watches the market constantly. He smokes like a train and sits there and moans about it. His phone is constantly going off with alerts on things he owns. To him a 1% daily loss on a $500 stock is the end of the world. I didn't even know what BTC was at until this thread, because I hadn't looked at it since before Christmas.

Angela, even something so vile as you mentioned can be had if a pervert is willing to look for and take the risk to procure.




Who says you won't be able to spend it as you put it. A better term would be trade it for other goods with willing participants, there is a massive underground economy that thrives in every country everyday. If the masses lose enough faith in the debt backed currency they are using they will find a way to use it illegal or not.

Personally I have no plans to sell mine, I don't expect the America dollar to survive the largesse by the people it serves. I will keep it until it is a universal means of exchange. If that means I lose it all if it fails so be it. That will mean my mainstream investments are healthy a life still goes on.

They didn't hack the block chain.

I don't get it either. It's like monopoly money to me. You can't take a bitcoin to the convenience store and by a pack of smokes. It's like investing in unicorn poop.
However I don't play the stock market and am very limited in my knowledge of it other than it's buying and selling shares in a company. Obviously there are people willing to invest in this selling of thin air so I guess there is ways to make tangible money from it.

So talk me through this, Bitcoin is very valuable, but the value that we gauge it with is in U.S. dollars, which are going to be worthless?????

Oh I see elk You set up an account (buy Bitcoin) then you spend it like a debit card .Just using your Apple Pay analogy But instead of put and take what you add or withdraw you have to look every minute to check your balance. Then you either must go to a country that accepts it for payment OR just buy coffee , health food or 2+4 here in the US
Yea makes perfectly good sense !!

Ok 49er I think you are on to something!!!
You yourself just said what will shut it down
“Massive underground economy “ GUB ment don’t like that They want their part

Jbyrd, I think what you're not getting is that most people, at least most "common" people are buying/selling it like stocks. To most the losses out weight the gains when you figure in the computers and the amount of energy it takes to mine it.

But yes it can be used just like Apple pay, or a debit card. I am not. I could sell what I have right now on a trading site, and make a ton of money. But I'm just playing the game for now. If it goes to a number I have already picked out I'll sell and still come out ahead. Much like I do with all of the stocks I own.

Will I lose money on it?? Who's to say?? I could miss a really drastic fall and lose. But that is the nature of the game. My only real regret with it is that I didn't hear about it when it was in it's infancy.

I currently am mining etherium and etherium classic with a little raven coin thrown in the mix.Its expensive to start up a mining rig which basically is made from a computer motherboard and video cards.The cost of new and used video cards is outrageous right now and a mining rig generates a lot of heat ,so much in fact I haven’t had to run my heater yet this winter and actually saved a couple bucks a month from using my heat pump.I currently have 3 mining rigs with 17 video cards running which produces about .25 etherium and 1 etc a month.I started in May last year and invested 5300.00 in all the equipment.I recouped that money Dec 30.My next endever will be helium mining you’ll need to google that lol.Its easy to sell the coins but there are fees to do so I sell it off at 1000.00 increments and cost between 4-6 dollars depending on network fees.

No idea what a block chain is I’m guessing that might be the reason for the panic with the lack of understanding the ins and outs of it for many people.

You can’t take a stock certificate to a store and buy a pack of smokes either lol but the stock certificate is still worth real fiat.My last purchase of a computer power supply and cables was with etherium.

That’s why I never leave my coins on an exchange,when I transfer to an exchange it’s sold the minute it hits the exchange and the cash is transferred to my checking account.Hackers hack exchanges they can’t get to your wallet.

70's From what I understand the reason most of the mining is done in China and Russia is the electricity costs are much lower.

Helium mining sounds interesting. I don't have a computer capable to even think about doing it. My son is currently building one though that may just be the ticket.

They have been shutting down mining in China for the last year saying it’s costing to much energy but the real reason are to many people were making to much money.You can use bitcoin in China and lots of people are exchanging it between there selves for good and services and China doesn’t like that.china is also working on their own digital currency,this in my option is one of the biggest threats to freedom in the world.Our government is also talking about going digital currency,We must never let this happen if we do they can totally control what you can buy ,they can seize all you’ve money and if everything is digital any future earning could still seized as we will all be assigned a digital wallet for life.

Do you have a dedicated server just for mining?

I understand the concept but who knows who is behind it, backing it and still cant figure out why they want greenbacks to buy bit coins. Only so many to be made can't counterfeit them? Even government computers are being hacked into nothing is safe on the internet. Best investment I know for long term is good land you can live on and produce food on. As far as digital currency we are on it now for the most part how much does the average person buy with cash? Stocks, bonds, food, services is for the most part purchased on line or with credit card its all digital now. You sell your furs you get a check that goes in the bank into an account its digital. The banks dont hold all the cash its all numbers that transfer from account to account. Most folks on this site don't think much of Bill Gates but he is one of the wealthiest men in the world and he is the biggest land owner in America and buying more all the time. My thinking its all about resources and those that have it will never want and eventually control the world. What are most wars over? resources to keep things going.

The value today is measured in US Dollars. IMHO Bitcoin will have failed if it's always denominated in central bank controlled currencies.

I'm a gonna be rich

I’m running a Linux operating system for mining called hiveos.Im in a pool of miners that’s mining from hiveon pool.As the pool finds a coin the profits are split on how many meghash your farm is running.

No. It's one form of imaginary money used to purchase another form of imaginary money.

Fed reserve notes (what everyone thinks of as a dollar these days) is fiat currency, which means imaginary.
Along that same line of thought, Cryptos could also be considered imaginary.

However, since we can purchase tangible goods with either, "imaginary" is more hyperbole than fact.

Thats interesting. We've been programmed to get excited when we have a big handful of ink on paper. The more the Gubmint prints the less it's worth. Now there's many more digital dollars than paper dollars.

At the Fort Mackinaw area (between the Lower peninsula and Upper) it was the trade for pelts from 18 hundreds and the gateway to the west by way of water.

49 but I do have a question If you own Bitcoin the only way to make money from it is to sell it if it goes up ?
Or is it like stock and pays a dividend?

Do you listen to what I say? I'm never selling it as you put it for cash to make money. To me it's insurance for what I believe is coming. I will use it when it's a universal medium of exchange and I'll trade it for goods and services

I'll worry about the income taxes when that happens. Who knows what the tax laws will be then. If I die? The kids will get it, then it will be their problem.

Here is a good graph showing BTCs previous corrections.

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/bitcoin-historical-corrections-from-all-time-highs/

As of now it's the sixth largest drop. Most likely this one isn't done yet