Proposed lead and trapping bans on refuges

https://sportsmensalliance.org/news/feds-discuss-public-land-lead-ban/

https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/4716/text

For a fraction of a second, I thought the title of this thread was "Proposed lead and trapping bans on refugees".

Things need to drastically improve in the US.

Keith

I fear they won’t. This is a slow death to hunting and trapping. Folks are further and further removed from a real life. Rural folks are a small minority, and I mean real rural folks. Not those who reside in the country, but those who make their living in it and from it. Hate to say it but most anti’s are women and Democrats. Particularly suburban and urban dwellers. They don’t approve of our way of life and want us to be like them. Sadly many of us agree with their incremental stripping of our freedoms. Won’t be long till we’re outnumbered even more. Idk that we’re allowing it so much as we are simply outnumbered and have let things fall through the cracks. It starts with lead bans, public ground trapping bans, ridiculous farming practices etc. Think your great grandchildren will have more or less opportunities to hunt and trap? Will they even want to? The Disneyfication and brainwashing are decades ahead of us.

More dumb regulations. My state game and fish started making very questionable decisions several years ago, I have always supported the conservation department but when they instituted non toxic shot for dove hunting a few years ago, which is one of my favorite hunts, I said no more...I refuse. So I decided to not shoot non tox for anything, waterfowl, doves, nothing. I've always followed the game laws and never poached out of season or taken more than my limit, but I've had enough of beauracrat red tape BS. Think what you want and judge, I don't care.

Unfortunately, young college graduates going into wildlife management are liberals and commonsense conservation isn't on their minds. It's more like preservation.

When I worked remolding grocery stores the stores would put out two watermelon boxes out around Christmas for customer donations. One for pet shelters and one for disadvantaged children. The pet shelter box would be full to the brim, while the other would have just a couple items in it. If this is a sign of where people are at, your prediction is probably right.

I am genuinely curious how banning lead shot/bullets is such an affront to conservation?

Maybe not an "affront to conservation", but completely unnecessary.

Nontoxic for Dove??? On a dry field?? It’s not like you’re shooting them in water and I haven’t seen a massive die off down here of anything with lead poisoning, except what was shot, lol.
I’m afraid I’d copy what you did and give it up. I’ll be honest I didn’t even know they made nontoxic dove loads. What’s a guy to do if he’s stocked up with cases of lead dove load?
I hope Georgia doesn’t get that woke or stupid.

I saw a thing the other day that projected all states would require non toxic shot in the next 10 or 15 years. I can't imagine how inefficient slinging steel shot at doves will be, but it will be better than sitting on the couch for me

Banning is easy, fixing something or finding a better solution takes work therefore bans will are an easy to do solution, even if they do little or no good.

Lead is a big concern, but plastic bags and bottles laying around everywhere aren't a problem. Full retard.

I am trying to figure out why you think it would be inefficient. I never saw a problem with steel shot other then the price.

How about rifle bullets?

Steel shot is less efficient in carrying striking energy down range, because of its lighter density/weight.

Steel patterns well with the right choke however, and can kill almost as well with within its limits.

Steel shot is less dense than lead shot therefore carries less energy and is less effective at killing

I currently shoot lead 7.5 shot at doves. The equivalent steel shot size would be #5.5 or lets just round up and say steel #6. I now have less pellets downrange and less pattern density also due to the larger pellet

I'm also going to have to make it go a heck of a lot faster to match the energy of lead, so the overall felt recoil will be increased substantially

Steel pretty much just sucks all around

Until you put a little TSS under it.....

As a land manager who hires seasonal bio-techs every year (recent college grads, essentially), I'd conservatively guess at least 95% of the applicants now are self-described progressive liberals and/or socialists who have never hunted, fished or held any kind of firearm. And have no desire to do so.

Colleges need a severe overhaul the same as D.C. does.

At the Valentine National Wildlife Refuge, 25 miles south of Valentine NE in the Sandhills, they hired a new refuge manager. His name is Juancarlos Giese. I've never seen him outside of his office. He told me where there was some black locust I could cut for firewood. I went to look at it and it was willow. They want to get rid of all the black locust on the refuge and replace it with boxelder..........the most worthless tree there is other than den trees for squirrels. Because it's a native tree they want more of them.

Agree on the college issue, but there are exceptions.

For example- College of the Ozarks in MO is a small Christian school with a growing wildlife degree program. It is led by a former furbearer biologist, with a couple dozen scientific papers, who is a lifetime member of NTA and his state association, and is even active on this forum…He is decent trapper too…
We have 50 students in the program and it is my hope that these students will be the ones that keep up the fight for sound wildlife stewardship. I pray they learn from my successes, as well as my failures, and make more of an impact than I ever did.

Glad to hear, but seems to be the exception instead of the rule, imo.

Send 'em my way, N.Roberts, when they graduate

I hunt one refuge been NO Lead for years

The proposal bans ALL lead (lead shot, lead sinkers, lead bullets, lead line (gill nets).

N. Roberts, thank you for your service!!!!!

I have shot a lot of cases of both lead and steel shot. Yes steel is lighter than lead. But you can get steel shot at speeds they never have lead. I have shot cases of steel 7 shot and never saw a problem with its killing power. I am talking about what I have seen, not what I read.
Hippie they make all copper and different types of non lead bullets.

You shoot plastic bags and bottles out of your shotgun? Weird choice but it’s yours to make. I guess they don’t see enough people with your predilections to make an issue out of it. Seems there are a lot of people shooting lead at various animals. Maybe that is why they are moving for this, control the thing they have control over.

I can tell you for fact that 2 3/4” high brass #6 lead will drop ducks stone cold dead over any steel shot produced whether you’re shooting passing ducks or decoying ducks and with a lot less kick. If lead was such a big issue we shouldn’t have any birds of prey left in the South.

To clarify a little bit. As mentioned above banning lead shot is just unnecessary. My biggest complaint is I can't use " vintage shotguns". Hers an example of the stupidity...
The cornfield behind my house let's say, I can stand there and shoot 1000 clay targets a day, 365 with lead. But I can't go bang out 2 or 3 geese with lead? Gotta use steel for that. I suppose for the shallow water slews and marshes that ducks could injest lead as they dabble, but over dry land fields or deep water I doubt it. They only duck hunting I do is if I jump shoot some off my pond which most of that shot just sails on past the water onto land.