Pastor stepped in it

A little background, I have a wonderful pastor even if we occasionally butt heads. He's a born yankee, Atlanta raised catholic who came to Christ late in life. Not your typical s Southern Baptist pastor, hence the head butting.

So in Sunday School somehow he went on a tangent regarding protection of God and veered into concealed carry. While he is by no means an anti being a carrier himself he is somewhat of a Fudd. So he goes on about not trusting those not trained and why someone should be trained.

So from the baptist back row a hand is raised.

Pastor, so you're saying I got to go get training before I am allowed to exercise my 1st amendment right to speak or worship?

Lol
They do but,,,my now retired pastor is one of my 5 friends
Bad as east coast fighter pilot, that knows the Word.

People should be trained. When they are kids, by their parents. Hopefully adults whe were not by parents are smart enough to get training.

The responsible thing is to seek out training and skill in all things.

Mandated? By whom?

I'll take my chances without outsiders in my business.

Thought you said you was military?

Veteran, yes.

Had the same issue there, lol.

Maybe, most on here i believe got firearms training at home at an early age from parents and other family members who hunted and shot regularly or took 4H gunsafety class

Good God Allmighty. What was that heethen a thinkin. He knows they ain’t no drinking, dancing, or training, to go on by them Southern Babtist’s.

I loved my church and people there. But about a month ago sent the pastor a txt to remove me from the membership roster. I'm not much of one for the worst to be though of my kids when infact they have no idea what they said could be though of as negative.

It's the 2nd time something silimilar has happened. It cause drama I don't need so it gets removed from my life.

Honestly feel eveyone should have some basic training in firearms,past someone talking to to the range and showing them how to aim in a general direction and fire off rounds "just in case" or more then dad telling you to just put it behind the shoulder . Military grade training no . Collage degree of stuff no .But should be proficient in placing shots and know why your doing what your doing and if your concealed carrying stress testing should be somthign people should have to do imo. a lot of people who carry who really shouldn't be carrying

I totally agree, I have been saying for years that everyone should have to take firearms training as a coarse in school. It does not mean you have to have guns or hunt, it can simply teach everyone how to act and be safe around guns.

"People should" is a common word use of the left. They know what's best after all. Like everything else it all sounds good on the surface untill mission cheep. Who decides, what happened when antics start geting in those positions like is happening now with the states game commissions.

Yep a lot of people are not what I would call safe or knowledgeable with guns, driving, ect.. but I don't care what your idea is your not going to use your idea and limit my right or tell me how to do things.

Go live in Canada and get a license for an airgun and no hand guns at all. Its the only smart thing to do. Baco knows best and what freedom is.
.

What constitutes "training"?

Much like the recent "suggested medical treatment" that cost folks their jobs and social standing?

O just like how they constantly use the "do you really need a (insert firearm ) argument that you also constantly see in the fire arm community

Well I did explain a bit but but it like this . Something like a basic class going over the stats laws " hay you can't just shoot someone if their doing XYZ or you'll go to prison, you can legally do this , this is and actual machine gun this is an actual assault rifle this is not. The basics in how to care for a firearm. This is how you do a basic cleaning, basic safety, what a sight picture is, how to shoot properly,how to aim, some myth busting. And actually have it interesting and useful not some monotone opinionated fudd up there talking about how all you need is a 12ga and a 1911 or something. 8 hr clas make it something that people want to willing go to. Now don't have it where you can't buy a gun if you don't or something but definitely put it out there as " hay if your going to be a responsible gun owner you should really do this"

As far as hunting. I actually do feel like we should do a little bit of what the EU guys do where you have to go though a class , take both a written and field test . Make sure the person can identify their target, they can accurately hit the vital zone ,they know how to properly unload and load their weapon. How to get around obstacles with a firearm have a written test where you have to explain why wyou would or would not take a shot where you would shoot an animal and why , what are the proper bullets to use for XYZ.

As far as stuff like concealed carry , definitely a more advanced class that goes over pricing your firearm, your holster ,different scenarios someone who conceal carrys might encounter, show videos of people using concealed carry arms then have a test on them about what the person did right or wrong ,what could have happened what did happen, again a more stringent shooting test, possibly a shoot house , they have simulators now that are hyper realistic that are amazing training aids.. basic first aid on how to treat gun shot wounds.

Make people understand that this is a serious matter and way more then " o I have a gun who cares I'll be safe " or " well I have this just in case not like I need to practice or anything I'll just use it to scare somone"

The big thing though that makes me second guess all of this hard is #1 I don't feel this should be mandatory, but then how will you enforce it in a way that couldnt completely back fire on you. Because if you have to do this class to get a fire arm or a license then. That's gonna require a national registry or something kinda list and yeaaaah we know how that can go. #2 the culture ,we aren't living in the 50's anymore the culture is completely different which leads to a lot of problems ( hence why we can just walk around with mil spec select fire m4's like the Israelies or something, different culture just would not work for a large portion of America). Really feel we need to get people to understand or think in the means of " your an American you need to be a le to protect you and everyone around you regardless of race sex religion politics whatever, so go to these classes and do this for you your family and your community.
But then we also come to the problem where we can now have individuals who are semi proficient with and know how you use firearms more effectively that probably don't need them for a host of reasons so that's also a problem. Now one can argue instead of a drive by where three kids and a old lady get shot along with the guy they where after you have a instance where people who know what there doing will just shoot the one guy and be done with it with no collateral damage would be better which yes is a fair point. But at the same time we could end up with what the Mexican government is dealing with . So yeah
Idk it's a complicated issue that people want to make simple but really it's not

I agree wholeheartedly with you on the deadly seriousness of owning, much less carrying, firearms. It "should" be basic common sense that one has the required knowledge to safely handle anything dangerous from pocket knife to automobile. But we all know even in the best of worlds common sense ain't common.

So in the absence of sense do we really trust "they" to train?

Again, I'll takes my chances.

We have too many laws. Time to start repealing most of them. Forcing a class on someone does not give them the ability to think.

An entire generation of woke college educated idiots is proof of that.

Wolfdog most states have required hunter education classes to buy a hunting license if your born alert a certain date. In Indiana people can get an apprenticeship license for 3 years before they have to take the class.

I went through it twice becuse of the game differences between my daughter and my boys. The 2nd class was better. They covered a ton of great info, fire arms carry, crossing fences, tree stand safely ect. Live fire arms shooting with .22 rifles, clays with shotguns and .22 pistol and revolver shooting.

It was a good class with a ton of info a lot of kids wouldn't get even from hunting families. BuT my boys didn't need the class and didn't miss a question. Knew all the answers when the game wardens asked to the point they would not call on them any more so other kids could answers

But not many kids get the education mine do at home.

Who is this they your referring to. There's tons of options you could go to for say a state wide program. I Mena you got them NRA arnt they supposed to have all the guys ready to train and all that jazz. Then there's tons of private places that offer everything from pistol to machine gun classes , heck local sheriff departments. I Mena lets look at what is viewed across the board as a good standard for firearms training and then just get people who fit that

The rhetorical "they" when referring to regulators, aka karens with authority.

Again, no issue whatsoever with self seeking knowledge. Matter of fact I highly encourage it.

My problem is third party requirement, of any type, to exercise an innate liberty.

Best case an annoyance worse an artificially imposed barrier.

I believe it is Hawaii that just mandated state approved training before firearms my be purchased.

Guess how many state accredited trainers there are?

Hint: It's less than 1

Never, ever, under any circumstances expect the government to not abuse any power granted to them.

Mike

Hench why I said spoke on multiple time how it shouldn't be a requirement. It should be a highly encouraged deal from a societal point of view. Have it to where is one of those deal where people just want to do it. Like kids wanting to get into a karate class or people thinking they should go to college

Wolddog today it's encouraged to pretend to be what gender they are not.

when your right steps on my right we have a problem

so innless you are endangering me in such a way that my right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness are endangered,
like your weapons handling is strait up dangerous and endangering me.

people with VERY little training defend themselves and live with guns every day their training might literally be 20 minutes with dad showing them how to load and unload the revolver and grip point and fire it at a target 10 feet away.
it might be 10 minute's with the guy at the gun counter where they bought the gun they latter use when someone is beating in their door.

should we offer all the free/very low cost training to make people safe we can , yup some youtube videos can really give you a lot about safe handling and the why

when you stop and look back at Hunters ed it is a 12 hour class in WI that is taught to primarily 11-14 year old kids and they really have a fairly good track record of safety with guns after that.
it counts for your WI CCL proof of training as does a 4 hour DOJ class that some places offer for free as does a DD214 or a CCP/CCL form any other state.

that said you need nothing to carry in your home or not concealed , I think we should have constitutional carry

what I find is that when we mandate a training people will think they are an expert after that 4 hour training sure they need no more. every 4 hour training given should end with this is the absolute bare minimum to meet a mandate you should seek training in how to use your gun now.

no the 4 hour training with zero live fire does not make you an exert in anything.
however
all we really need is for you not to shoot yourself , your family or people on the street and most people do really well with that a billion firearms 330 million people and actual accidents are very few

we could teach some super basics in schools without any live fire it would be solid education for something that they are likely to run into.
it could be like 4 hours of health class freshman year and it would be tax dollars well spent

You do as provided in the Constitution.