Magnetic field of coyote traps

Ok as someone mentioned on another thread this topic deserves a thread of its own so all you high tech trappers give everyone the rundown on how all of this works.

Is this like the coyotes smell the rust on your traps that's why you have to wax them?

I don't think so I don't really know anything about it that's why I'm asking the pros.

PM Kirk De, he is a member on here and has mentioned it several times on other posts. I believe it follows the same thought process behind Keck’s electro magnetic camouflage clothing don’t know anything more about it other than I noticed the name keck’s on the wetsuits on some shark researchers.

I discovered that the reason the animals were avoiding traps and sets was that they were identifying or seeing or feeling magnetic field it was projected from the trap.So I wrote a book about it a short book. I tested various traps and trap devices. I found a website in the United Kingdom that explained How animals can detect a magnetic field in which animals there were that they had tested. There weren’t very many. Mainly dogs wolves fox beaver Otter coyote and a few more. at the time they had Only tested 16 species. Most of the animals tested we’re not animals That were common here. They only tested 16 species. Most of the animals tested we’re not animals that are commonly found in the United States.Nobody had tested traps and trap devices.

I discovered that various methods I was using trapping beavers and otters Was reducing and hiding the magnetic field of the traps I was using. I did the methods because that’s what I found to be the best way to catch the animal. That was why I was able to catch the thousands of animals that I did in such a short period of time. At least it contributed to it greatly.I wasn’t aware of a magnetic field at the time. I had no no clue.

Some animals such as a coyote actually can sense and see the magnetic field. Other animals can only feel it and sense it. How they sense the field is that the higher intensity field increases the molecular breakdown of molecules. Essentially making the trap stink more. It increases the ability of the animal to smell the trap. By using a magnetometer you can tell where the field radiates the most off of the trap you’re using. That will help you determine how to set the trap in the best position to catch the animal. Tom Miranda did a video and it’s on YouTube . Google Tom Miranda trapping diggers video. In the video he places a piece of sandpaper on the pan and positions to trap so that the animal digging out the area he senses is easier caught.So even if your trap radiates a magnetic field how the trappers position makes a difference in how well you can catch the animal.Someone please post that video.

The heck’s suit blocks the impulse of your body so the animal doesn’t see or feel it. I believe it also holds your smell inside so that it’s not dispersed as easily. I believe it possibly could have scent hiding properties also such as scent killer spray‘s claim to have.For example in beaver trapping when setting exposed conibear traps by placing a log in front of the trap on each side at the level of the top of the trap or just below prevents the animal from seeing the radiating field of the trap:If he’s moving fast he Will be in the trap before he sees it:

I wonder why beaver would take a chance and plug a steel culvert?

As the diameter of the pipe is larger and depending on the metals used, There is a reduced field going through the pipe This has a calming affect to the animal. It works the same way to a properly made cage trap. The trap should have a negative reduce field going all the way through the trap. It is in my writings If the pipe had a high intensity at the front of the pipe the beaver probably would just patch it and not go through. A high intensitity would stop him at the door or opening .

I tend to take all of this with a grain of salt and yet I know first hand that some people have an electric field of some kind . My maternal Grandmother could not wear a watch of any kind her entire life. When she was 80 years old we got her a small locket type watch to wear around her neck. As long as she didn’t let it get against her skin the watch worked flawlessly, she was very tickled to finally be able to wear a watch. I personally can wear a wind up watch but not a battery powered one, so I do know their is some electro magnetic “ stuff “ going on . I’m just not convinced that the type of trap you choose will determine if you can catch critters or not .
Skeptical , but not disrespectful,
Don

He didn't say one word about magnetic fields.

Interesting topic. I guess put me in the category of non-believer but willing to be converted. . . . a doubting Thomas, as it were.

So we know there is a ton of research that indicates many animals navigate by using magnetic fields (bats, pigeons, etc.). There was also an interesting article that talked about when foxes are mousing, they apparently use magnetic fields because they tend to orient their bodies predominantly in a North-Northeast configuration. See http://blogs.nature.com/news/2011/01/fox_rangefinder_sense_expands.html.

However, using magnetism to navigate is distinguishable from detecting metallic objects and thus avoiding them, which is what I think is being proposed here. I watched Tom Miranda's video and while he talks about using sand paper on the pan of his trap, he didn't reference any sort of magnetic field, but rather associated it with a fox's desire to dig and scratch at loose soils and objects with odor that lie beneath the soil.

Neither did I , exactly .

I'm in the act of testing, have put out 7 test sets with results so far. Wet weather has slowed me down. Planning on 30 test sets. It's been interesting so far. I make two small mouse size holes about 2 foot apart, put same bait down both, dig a trap bed in front of both, bed a non functional trap in front of one hole and in front of other hole I just pack the trap bed back solid without a trap. Not hard to test if a guy wants to know for sure.

Should be able to determine if the looser soil in a trap bed contributes to digging issues also.

You might want to read what I said in the post about how a magnetic field will increase the stink of a trap because it disrupts the molecular‘s around the trap. I believe I’m the first one to discover the magnetic field dealWhen it relates to animal traps and devices. That’s why I named the book as I did.Sometimes you have to read something two or three times to remember what you forgot. I know in writing the book I had to read many research periodicals several times sometimes 10 times before I understood.

If you use a foothold with a high intensity reading it will prove your test a lot quicker.

Yes sir, you need to make sure the trap when it is Wired open it doesn’t change the magnetic field of the trap. How the wires connected will rearrange the field. Or at least it could. It needs to be presented as you would set a trap normally to be accurate.

OK, now you've got me curious. I installed the Tesla Bot on my phone and its giving me readings. If I'm pointing it at my trap set, is there a threshold number that I should be looking for? What's too high? What's acceptable?

Turn your volume up on your phone and push the 10 X button on the iPhone or on the outside of the magnetometer. Go out in your yard away from any powerlines turn your magnetometer on. Figure out what your average reading is. That is your base anything above that is a higher intensity. Anything below are a reduced intensity. If you have a cage trap when you run the magnetometer in the door of the trap a A reduced reading should be experienced for the trap to be best. A higher rating than your average indicated you may catch fewer animals with the trap.

OK, I get the idea. And for leghold traps, I take it its the same for legholds? I ordered the book by the way. Anxious to read it.

On a standard leg hold highest point of the magnetic field is normally at the dog. But because the way and the mb 550 is made and materials used it may have a very low Reading. Where I live A Standard foothold Trap can have a reading five times greater or more than the average for the area. The lower the reading the better below the average. It can affect the catch by a factor of 5 to 10 times depending on the animal targeted.

So if the highest point of the magnetic field is normally at the dog, is it the same with a dogless trap (since I run a lot of Bridger dogless for coyotes -- I don't use 550's for coyotes)? Also, could you "disguise" the dog's magnetic field?

Use your magnetometer to test the trap and see. As far as disguising the trap, zager uses dead and dried lawn clippings or hay. Trappers have learned to place the dog toward the backing or lower of the trap. You also can lower the trap so that if he paws You’re more apt to catch him. My writings explain other ways.

^^^^^^^
I'm not trying to beat you up but you did all this research wrote a book and at the end of that you say a trap with higher reading MAY CATCH FEWER ANIMALS, all that and you don't know for sure? And if it may make fewer catches would it also be correct to say It may catch the same or it may catch more since we don't really know?

If your target in cats Or young animals But the brains haven’t matured. Maybe animals have never witnessed or xperience with a magnetic field before.Explanation is in detail in my book.

Some animals brains don’t mature until they are two or three years old.The animal may not have developed the abilities to detect until he’s about three years old.Depends on the animal. It is explained in my writings.

“Concentrating on “the most effective traps”, the only thing they “all” had in common was a decrease in magnetic field intensity and a larger percentage of adult animals being caught in the traps with fewer refusals.” Quote from my writings.

My thoughts were initially the same as Lazarus.....a little skeptical but also curious. Considering all the ways in which animals interact with their environment (navigation, barometric pressure, and so on) it didn't sound too far fetched. So I ordered the book. I'm still picking my way through it, but Kirk does a good job explaining things. It is not supernatural or even far-fetched.

I've seen plenty of people be eager to dismiss these findings without reading or giving a second thought. I think often times people tend to think in extremes and that in turn often inhibits them from learning. This isn't about certain traps "never catching" as we all know they do. I found it to offer some explanations that just make more sense than the old adages trappers tell each other. I always thought that animal eyesight got a little more credit than it deserved when it came to refusals.

The magnetic field concept fills in the blank for me. Like why a bottom-edge body grip will drill fur but an unblocked dryland bodygrip will be avoided. They are both squares and those animals can definitely see underwater. It also explains why my catches go up on drizzly nights, why they drop off during a full moon, and so on. I don't buy the suggestion that a beaver can't "see" my 330 in the rain. There has to be more to it.

It's not about saying something will 'never work' or 'always work', but rather to get a more accurate understanding of why something is happening. It's up to each trapper to decide how these explanations might help out on the line.

Well all my canine traps are powder coated will that make a difference? And It's not anything like that cheap looking so called powder coating on those DPs.

Does a magnet on one side of a sheet of plastic attract iron filings on the other side?

I never tested foot holds that were powder coated. It doesn’t help in cage traps, That I found. I believe it with the right coating it could help with footholds.

I know positive and negative charges attract but I don’t believe this is the same thing exactly. Sorry I couldn’t give you a better answer

I take it back. I had a friend come by and he had some new traps they were powder coated very well. They had a low test which was very good. But I did not test before they were powder coated.

Well, the baseline in my house is 29.

I moved it around my laptop on my lap. Right in front of family jewels, it went to 211. I wonder if that is good or bad???

When the microwave runs in the kitchen 30 feet away, it goes up by 10 points.

I am going to have to investigate this a lot. I notice that I have certain trap brands that do not catch as many animals. This may explain it, but I need to experiment.

[quote=Dr. Fur]Well, the baseline in my house is 29.

I moved it around my laptop on my lap. Right in front of family jewels, it went to 211. I wonder if that is good or bad??? [/quote
Not good for extended periods of time say over 30 years.

I made a pyramid trap. Pyramids is how I found so much information. Here is a video that explains why once you understand the principle. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sBPo4FfvC3Y

Think what kind of a reading you would have gotten 15 years ago. :-)

So I went to a spot of ground in my backyard and it was pretty solid at 44. Movement to the left or right 2-3 feet yielded only small variations.

I tested 4 traps.

The first was a Painted (with direct-to-metal paint) number 3 dogless Bridger with a dog knot stake attached. It registered right at 45. Not much difference.

I then tested a painted #3 Monty round jaw dogless with a drag and long chain. It was 44. The drag actually was closer to 43 but the trap was 44. Later I got curious and put the phone right on top of the trap (about 3" distance) and moved it all around the trap. The levels went from a hight of 46 to a low of 38 on various parts of the trap, with the levers being lower than the jaw/dog area.

I also tested a bare, rusted #3 Victor LS. It tested right about 43, slightly below the previous two painted traps.

I also tested a 1.75 waxed Monty with a stake. This trap jumped to 65, which was way above anything else. Later I discovered that if I moved the trap away from the stake, the readings went down to the mid-50's. Then I zeroed in on the stake. I had recently welded a nut to the top of an old dog knot and it was still raw -- not wax or paint to it and some of the welding flux still present. The top where I had welded was the hot spot. The rest of the stake was normal. I tried burying the stake head and the reading subsided just a tiny bit. I then put an aluminum wire screen pan cover on the trap and the reading decreased a few points. The same with the other traps.

I then put the pan cover on each trap and buried it. Doing so decreased the readings slightly.

Star date:2765- destination: unknown. Spock has detected a magnetic mind-reading device on Krypton, and Sulu thinks we should investigate.
In the mean time, I will be de-magnitizing my Klingon traps, just in case.
Kirk out.

Stay away from steel posts when its cold out

To get an accurate reading your iPhone needs to be within an inch of what you’re trying to project on the metal. In the cage trap you’re measuring the area so you put it in the center of the trap

What is the temperature where you’re at. If it’is Below 50° that will reduce your readings.

61 F

I tried holding the phone within an inch and you're right, it really effects the readings, but I found that the percentage increase is about the same. The only difference is the pan of the trap -- all four traps, was really a hotspot.

What’s your Lowe’s for the night and temperature. Is it 40° or below

Were u within an inch when you tested ur traps Laz? I got a bigger reading on my traps. Even varied based on which part of the trap I was reading.

That’s the way it should be

Lows in the 50's

Yes, when I went back (after Kirk's correction) and tried the one inch rule and it varied greatly, but again, percentage increase I thought was roughly the same . . . I will have to confirm tomorrow when its not raining.

Going to try it tomorrow...ain’t catching anything anyways, lol. But all my traps are MB550’s. Guess I could get different readings per trap. We’ll see. Then again, guess different soil could also affect the readings. Got plenty of time to play around after work. I can go to my guaranteed spots that produce year after year and compare those to other sets with no catches yet.

If your traps are all identical everything should be all the same as far as the magnetometer readings

Robert would have caught like 2700 coyotes this season instead of 900 and some if he had known about this. Hes gonna be crabby when he finds out...

All this would do is confirm that he’s the real deal. I’ve always thought that about him.

I actually took super powerful neodymium magnets, and buried them in front of canine/meat based baits, and in beaver dam breaks and in the dirt/mud in beaver haul-outs, all with trail cams watching. There is no noticeable avoidance of the magnets by beaver when the magnet is under water in front of the dam break, or just under surface of the mud above waterline on haul outs. No beaver has had any noticeable reaction to the magnets, even shoving them into the dam with arm arm-load of mud on two occasions. Beaver could not even seem to tell the magnet was there, ever. Something like 20 visits recorded on video, several different ponds, all sizes of beaver. No avoidance by raccoons that I can tell, nor red fox or coyote. I admit I only have a half dozen or so coyote visits on film over the magnets, but not one even payed any noticeable attention to the magnet, although a few did turn and spot the camera and cut a fast trail for another county...
No video of otter around the magnets but plenty of mink. So far, I can’t see any indication that any animal even knows they are there. Not one, not once.
This says nothing about cage traps though, haven’t done any testing with those at all.
That’s my observation, and based on that I’m not concerned with magnetic fields of footholds. And I’ve just caught too many beaver in conibears to think they have some magnetic property that beaver are afraid of. But hey, it is possible that when steel is magnetized it could make the metal smell more so yotes smell the trap better. Doubting it based on my observations but it’s possible.

I believe that in scientific terms this is what is called a “control group or study “. Without a control, data or observations have a much lower value.

In my book I explain in detail why control group study will not work or be accurate. You have to read the book from start to finish to really understand. I explain in the book throughout the book by using inconsistent consistent inconsistencies. I gave examples by using different forms of Radiation examples.

There’s a tremendous bit of difference in catching animals in the deep South. . Because of the thousands of animals that I caught in the deep South and because of my patents I was able to come up with these deductions that others could not. I know of no other trapper with the Experience I have with the 24 hour check as deep south as I have.The warm weather winters the higher magnetism of the earth the further south you go allowed me to have experiences of others just haven’t. The testing that I did all makes common sense in a simple way, It all makes sense when Understood.

Animals detect magnetic field if it has a high intensity variance. Where I live the induction of the earth there’s about 46 micro tesla. Probably where you live and where are you trap if it’s Alaska is about 60. Because you’re cold temperatures reduced daylight and lower magnetism of the moon you have very little intensity variance when it’s below zero it’s almost nothing. It would be the same as the battery not being able to start a car in the cold you have to heat the battery up in order for it to work. Unless you’ve trapped some in the deep south or at least in some of the lower 48 you would always have the feelings that you have now.Mocking something that’s accurate just hurts the industry.

Inconsistent consistent inconsistentcies? Sorry, you lost me with that one.

Your magnetic field will be consistent when you set a trap. How deep you put the trap or the trap is under the water hot conditions or rain make something that’s consistent inconsistent. I found the cage trap was’s the best way to find out about magnetic fields. It can be set above ground or in the water and then going through iit field can be measured and will stay relatively same While set.Even how close the trap fieldis or the devices to the person or animal makes a big difference even 1 to 2 inches.

This is all very fascinating. I wonder about powder coating. Perhaps that may hide the magnetic field.

I'm moving ahead with my book on mind reading coyotes, and their ability to detect the magnetic field, with telepathic siphoning of
trapper brain waves.

They are way ahead of proximity detection, please buy my book now so I can explain it all, since science really can't.

Beav Ask about that yesterday. I haven’t tested any traps before and after that were powder coated that were foothold.I did have a friend come by that had some traps or powder coated that had low readings. I am not sure the maker I know what I think it is I would have to ask him to be sure it was over a year ago. There are coatings that claims to mask radiation. I wouldn’t be giving you a incorect answer Just speculation. It’s best to test the trap yourself under your conditions. With cage traps it doesn’t matter whether the trap is powder coated or not On the traps that I tested. The ones that were five years old and caught 100 animals tested below or better than traps that were powder coated better than what I’ve done in the past.

What I have discovered will make some patents in accurate.Claims that were made will be proven not true. Some statements That were made in the past will be exposed as being not true ,a person may truly believe what he was doing but he was proven wrong with what I wrote in the book and how traps now can be tested. It will effect trap suppliers and trap makers and whole factions of industry. The book I wrote exonerates round up in the billions of dollars in suits that were involved with Bayer. Research what I wrote in my book about trapping devices and about the lawsuits Bayer has against them. You will find at I have said and stated to be very accurate and helpful to all industry that’s why I named the book what I did.Many Will discredit and attack so that few people can learn about what I’ve written. What I discovered will promote and confirm the best trappers. Some will be doing what he book contents confirms not to be true ,that sell products. Read my book so that you can understand when attacks takes place.I know this sounds crazy but as you can see some of it is already started.Since I published my book and giving information to Bayer there has been no money paid in settlement.The EPA Has confirmed round up safe.

I’m not attacking anything or anyone, I do want to be clear in that. I am just sharing my direct observations with a trail cameras shooting video on magnets in places I want to keep animals away from. I was testing very strong magnets to see if they repel any animals. These magnets are around 1.5 Tesla and fairly large ( so they have a high Weber value, Weber is a unit that also measures the size of the magnetic field, a large 1.5 Tesla magnet can lift more steel than a small one). Think big “metal fishing” magnets. 1.5 Tesla is 25 times more than 60 micro Tesla, and 37 times the field of 40 micro Tesla which is a big variance in magnetic field especially when very near the the magnet. Animals would routinely put their feet and bodies within an inch, and often actually touched the magnets. Not one showed any avoidance, ever. At any distance. I really wish the results would have been different. You’d be seeing adds for my “beaver repeller” devices. Instead I’m writing this sob story of crushed dreams. Sympathy anyone? Anyone?????

I feel your pain. I've had what I thought were ingenious ideas that didn't pan out. You get all excited then when u test it flops.

I will say this, I've put in 7 test sets to see if a bedded trap affects how a coyote works a set and I'm seeing strong evidence that it does. I'm going to keep making them to get a larger sample.
Here's my results so far.

Thanks for taking the time to share, Yes sir.

I absolutely was not making any reference to any person that I quoted and responded to on this thread or any previous thread that I’m aware of that I’ve posted on Trapperman recently or within the last two or three months. I’m sorry that it was taken that way.

That is very good to field test that way. I've noticed to on my line. Seems there are times they almost know. I do bed extremely tight. Just when I examine the foot pattern in sand or snow it's very interesting. Anyone ever think maybe has alot to do with the covering? If dirt feels different over the trap, it could arouse curiosity to dig or avoid?

Ray Milligan wrote about patterns and his teachings in professional instruction. About the absolute necessitie or digging the trap bed to be just big enough for the trap to fit in. He would have the student get on their knees and approach the set until they felt the loose soil outside the trap jaws. He taught them to have as little disturbed soil outside the jaws as possible. He didn’t want the target animal to feel any difference in the soil around the trap until the last step. Just a thought, he was one of the big numbers guys back I n the boom days. Yes Sir, on the test sites without a trap did you dig a bed and refill it like you would if a trap was present? Will go back and reread your post for that part.

I did dig a trap bed and refilled in front of the baited hole without a trap. Also I'll mention that by working with nonfunctioning trap I can bed it really solid even over the pan

The firmer the soil is around the jaws of the trap the less of magnetic intensity disbursement. The looser the soil the greater the chance of the magnetic intensity being expelled.I believe that’s why Mark Zagrrs method works so well with the dead grass over the set.He makes it firm with every set sometimes you can’t because of the soil. The dead grass would make up the difference to a degree.The dead grass block The field emissions and give reason for the soil being loose or not firm

I like to have a large trap bed. I feel that a very small trap sized bed pin points the trap location. And has some critters digging from the get go.

Kirk - this really interesting to me as I got a lesson this year coyote trapping. Not sure what the lesson was but my confidence was beat up. I had better territory and more traps but this year I caught less than year 1.
Only 3rd year setting for coyotes but something changed. Sets not even worked, just plain dead but I set on fresh sign or locations that had been great.

So what changed? Could be a number of things. But I did swap out the cable stakes for chain and welded the j hooks about a month before setting. I am really wondering if this may have contributed to my lesson? How long before magnetic fields dissipate?

Also - driving the cable stakes was rough with 6” of hard frost. Bent two drivers. This probably added to the magnetic field?

Test a trap like you had it set up last year. See if there’s a difference. If you bought new traps that are different that could be the situation. How are you positioning the trap. If that has change that will make a difference. Did another trapper trap there last year or close by.?If it’s the magnetic field intensity you should have more dug up traps. Then you did last year.

The magnetic field does not dissipate it is what it is. If you do have a high intensity it helps to have more backing and a deeper set.

Kirk just ordered the book. Very interested in this. I run a sloped trench set with the trap on a steep angle. Caught all age groups of yotes in it. All are buried up in the corner of the trap with about 2 out of 10 double footed. I did find that the dia of the hole per trap size was very important. Reckon the angle affects the magnetic field?

When I read, "In my book I explain in detail why control group study will not work or be accurate. You have to read the book from start to finish to really understand. I explain in the book throughout the book by using inconsistent consistent inconsistencies,." all credibility went right out the window.
What did become clear to me, is that there is absolutely no scientific basis to any of this, and someone is trying harder to sell books than prove a theory.
I use the term "theory" loosely, as there isn't enough scientific method in this proposal for it to considered anything more than a hypothesis.
I have a big problem with it being presented as though it were proven fact.

You obviously haven’t read the book. I was making reference in the book to magnetic fields and all forms of radiation referring to testing that was done concerning Bayer,s Round Up. Read the book!

Read it several times I found it if you don’t you’re gonna miss out.You have to understand the concept to use it in every part of your trapping situation. Thank you

What about making a degaussing mechanism (coiled wire with electricity to it) like they do in aircraft and other factories? Just run your traps through it and neutralize the magnetism?

I just don’t know whether that would work. If you read the book and understand how magnetic field works in a double door cage trap you will understand what I’m saying.

If you want to have an accurate study it will prove every time the study is completed this is how I would do it or how I did it. Test the magnetic field of every trap. Do your testing on land or in shallow water 4 to 6 inches deep. Use four double door traps that are 14 inches wide and at least 14 inches tall at the door. Go to at least 20 to 30 locations set the traps with lure between them.Set them preferably at least 5 feet out from the bank. Target beaver. At the same location have at least two 12 x 12 double door traps one with a low magnetic field reading going through the trap and one with a high magnetic field reading going into and through the trap. Set them on Crossovers on land trails. Pay close attention to refusals or go arounds.Record your results. The lower intensity traps will catch more in every trial that I’ve done. There are no exceptions. If your traps don’t have a reduced magnetic field intensity going through the trap you’re losing money.

I’m the eternal skeptic so here goes.

I’ve successfully used the Pipe Dream set with metal screen just like Zagger does. If the screen is metal and touches the trap, the magnetic field would essentially be the same. Does the grass cover negate the magnetic charge?? That’s the part that makes me wonder. I don’t know the answer. But I’d bet there is more to it than just the magnetic field of the trap. For the time I used the pipe dream set last fall, my catch rate absolutely skyrocketed. I even had the screens scraped clean and removed meaning whatever sensed the trap or screen, took the time to expose it.

Could any of what you’ve seen be attributed to the dye, wax, water contaminants in boiling water? Anything the traps were stored in going to and from the trap sites? Did your vehicle exhaust system vent into the storage area of the truck box because it had a hole in it? In a controlled study, these things or things like them would have to be considered.

Testing to support your book can’t be done by you now. It would be a built in bias. Independent study, say, by Ron Jones or Yes Sir, or Mark Zagger, or somebody else we generally trust would have to do it.

The best way to answer your questions is to or for you to go back and read all my posts . Read the book. As far as someone to test the traps I would recommend Robert Waddell first Choice.DougMassey of Georgia Toby Hutchinson of Alabama and Paul Dobbins’s.Just do the testing yourself

Current running through a coiled wire produces a magnetic field,not sure if it would cancel out an existing mag field. College physics was a long time ago!

It creates a magnetic field I believe it’s on page 21 or 22 in my book.

I believe I understand Lazarus was talking about. I just don’t believe it would work in this case.

I'm not seeing that,Kirk.

I don’t have access to my book right now.

Mike and Lazarus I did a little refresher on demagnetizing
The degaussing will work (strong AC current through an insulated wire wrapped around a steel loop) traps in center of loop while slowly reducing current level to zero .
My memory was telling me a couple sharp raps with a metal hammer would diminish the magnitude of the magnetism. It does this by scrambling the atoms electrons out of the pattern that a magnet has. So brace the side of the base plate on a block of hardwood strike sharply with a medium size drift pin. Less mass =higher speed = more shock with less distortion. Two strikes on each side and on each end of the base plate. Then set trap and dry fire two times. The jaws smacking together will take care of their magnetic field. CAUTION! DO NOT DRY FIRE CAST JAWS They may break causing bigger problems.

And theeeeer ya go demagnetized traps!!!

Full disclosure I will not be doing this to any of my traps.
Nor will I be heating them to decoalessence about 1150F another way to demagnetize.

Hard on the springs don’t ya know.

Instead I will continue to set on sign and catch critters.
And the ones I don’t catch will be left for seed. And I’ll scratch my head and say HUH looked like a good spot. Y’all have a goodun and stay well.

Dang it now I have AMAZON trying to sell me Kirk’s book!! Guess I’ll have to deguasse the phone to stop sending out LURES for pop ups! LoL.

Wouldn’t the springs just bring the field back no matter what you did to the trap itself.

I don't believe so,only if and electric current was induced to the springs.

How it doesn’t really matter because what I have written is true. If followed will dramatically increase your catch.What device you use does not matter what I have written is true,And will still be represented as I said.Helping the industry is all that matters.I know that I’ve done that.

I see this info as something I'm going to sit with a while and figure out how I can apply it to my trapping. Yes, everybody should keep setting on sign. That's obvious. But if I can be mindful of all the ways animals interpret the world and use it to my advantage once in a while, I see that as a win.

I agree, as much as I get schooled I'll take any advantage I can find.

I reviewed what was said I went back in my mind over all the testing that I had done. I believe the whole keys with everything is the ability to measure the magnetic field. The use of a magnetometer to measure the field. What I discovered in the first place. That’s the whole key. Demagnetizations would not be the route to go. You all were telling me by the comments that you made.I’ll try to explain later.

I bought your book when it first came out, and it's intriguing.

I'll have to read it again!

I don’t believe it’s practical to demagnetize foothold. We already have enough that have a low intensity that can be measured. We have the tools magnetometer and methods Needed to improve our ability to catch. If you were to demagnetize body grips, snares, and especially cage traps it would actually probably hurt your ability to catch.

Please read all of the book is very important that you understand the second half in order to really thoroughly understand the first half.

I'm a bit confused. First the magnetic field thing is bad for your catch rate but If you demagnetize your traps It's also bad for your catch rate.

So if I am catching 300 plus coyotes a year in Alabama every year with a MB -550 = IT MUST be the right trap? I use Formula 1 trap coating, and stake most all of my traps

I'm just commenting so I can find this thread later.

The information will just help you to determine what is the best set to make and what might be the best trap to use. It will help you understand why the animals responding the way that it is.How well you use the information is up to you.

If your running 150 traps for 300 days of the year there could be room for improvement.....

With cage traps set on land or in shallow water it is more absolute. The cage trap that you’re using should have a reduce intensity below the average for the earth going all the way through the trap. If you have one trap that has a high intensity going all the way through the trap, the low intensity trap overall will have a better catch rate.As much as 4 or 5 times greater than the high intensity trap. This is when you’re trapping animals that can sense the magnetic field of the trap. Beaver, Otter,Red fox, and other animals that can sense the magnetic field.

Kirk, what would be a high reading and a low reading example in a cage trap?

The average of the field of the earth where I live is 46 to 47. The beaver traps I use that are most effective and meet the criteria go from 46 down to 18 in the center of the trap back out to 46 on the other end. A high intensity trap would be one that would start at the door at 60 or more and maintain that or don’t go down all the way through the trap. A high-intensity trap could be one that is low at the door and high in the middle. Most most of the high intensity traps that I tested were 70 or more at the door and 50 or 60 or more in the middle.

Jonesey it didn’t matter what trap design are used the results were the same. The wider and taller traps in the water traps with low intensity readings were the most effective. They all could be sitting in or under the water.Underwater sets has made no difference in the ability to catch or at least not very much

You haven’t read the book. Depending on how the trap is made how the snare is set the steel used determines whether the animal wants to go through the trap or not or is willing to go through the trap. With the cage trap by using the correct method the trap Or device reduces the need for the animal to go around. In a cage trap it actually forms OK tunnel it safe to go through

If one trap is copied from another trap ,They will have almost identical magnetic field readings.If not it’s not a full copy.

so what you find is say a 1/2 by 1 mesh 12x12 that is 30 long would be the same as a 1 by 2 mesh 12x12 30 long. in other words the increased wire mesh would not increase the magnetic readings. the increased numbers would come from other causes.

I haven’t tested enough one by Two to give you results. I have one by one and they are both The same.Half by one and one by one are the same. They have the same test results

Jonesey this is gonna be a real eye opener for you.If you haven’t been doing this or be aware of this.

Ran about 240 days of traps this year. For coyotes. Hogs the rest of the time in Bull Creek traps. Caught between 350-400 hogs in about 3 months worth of trapping. Don't always run 150 traps , but I run large places. No jobs this year under 4000 acres . SO I will say 125 traps per job would be about average.

1) Why are you adverse to such studies as double blind studies of your premise of magnetism of a trap affecting catch rates?
2) Why are you adverse to studying the demagnetizing of traps?
I find it difficult not to be skeptical when I see an aversion to using the scientific method to move a hypothesis to a theory, then to scientific fact.
I also find it troubling when there is aversion to nearly any and all suggestions which are not in "the book". It would be refreshing to see a straight discussion rather than referring everyone to read "the book".
In conclusion, I am not a 'magnetism denier', any more than I am a Global Climate Warming Change denier., but without science, I am not a buyer of either.

Run whatever scientific study you want. I have given imformation enough from all the post that I’ve done on trapperman to do what you need to do. At least the basics that I know.I’m sure we would all like to know. I’m sorry I couldn’t reach your criteria.

I am not a believer yet but not a na sayer either. And since I set cages and snares every day in my job for raccoons, groundhogs, skunks, and squirrels, I can investigate it a little more. Just so I have my bearings right, I take a reading of the area, then take the reading of the traps and or snares in place. Keep track and see where it goes. But I can honestly say there are not many cage traps and snares I set that does not make a catch within 3 days. But I do have 2 jobs right now where the female squirrels are avoiding the traps. So I will take readings on these traps and see. I also realize the animals mentioned may not be affected by magnetic fields. I have read enough on the post to at least make me intrigued to the theory. I have learned that to be able to prove something does not work, I first have to do everything I can to prove it does work. This mindset has many times shown me that things folks say do not work, do in fact work when the effort is applied.

Buy the book and read it!! It's truly a game changer!

How old the animal makes a big difference. He may not have had the opportunity or experience is to determine what has been hurting his friends. A lot of animals have the ability but I like a beagle dog just kind of go crazy sometimes And don’t respond to you

some trappers swear by gang setting an area. I believe they have found they have the best luck that way because of the other animals haven’t had a chance to determine how bad of a situation they were in. There again if you’re using methods that hide the magnetic field from an animal that can see it Will make a difference when you come back again To catch the ones that were spooked.

Kirk, How come my Tesla Magnetometer I downloaded is giving me an average reading outside in the yard of 239 to 245. Not the 45-46 you speak of? Do I need to change a setting?

If you downloaded correctly and is functioning correctly you may be below a powerline or Near a power substation . Maybe close to a cell tower.

I would think you’re reading should be around 50 micro tesla.

You could even be over a magnetic fault line of the earth.

The magnetic induction starts at 25 at the equator and is about 65 at the north pole.The sun and the moon have a greater effect on the change the more you are closer to the equator.

Well atleast if your not catching many fox or coyote you know why.

Kirk, Here is a screen shot of my readings?

If you didn’t download the Tesla Bot app Try downloading it. It’s free then go out in the yard and tried again

What is the actual name of the Apt I need to download?

Tesla Bot

Press 10 X on the right side about midway in the screen. Just below the number reading Turn up the volume it will sound like a gieger counter.

From you that means a lot thank you. The book just makes it easier to understand and has a reference to go back to. These threads also make it helpful to increase your catch in the future.

I down loaded Tesla Bot just for fun. Got 47 outside. So that's my base line? Its dark now Would like to test some traps just for fun. To see what I come up with

Glad to help you. Your post probably helped a whole bunch of others.

Gygercounter is what this IPhone 6 sounds like over a MB 550 trap with Formula 1 trap coat. Held 1 inch over center of pan Out in middle of yard got Blue light to come on. On the Tesla Bot app at 27 Had some highs and lows but 27 was about my average Will bury in sand. Well bedded and see what reading I get tomorrow morning

You’re trying to find the high points on the trap. It doesn’t sound like you’re getting the readings correctly.

Towards the side of pan was much higher. In the 60s and up around the coil springs. Moving it around at 1 inch It would run 32 around levers and 55 to 65 to space to bottom left of pan. Coil springs area. I wonder what readings it will give buried. I had to try to dead center it and hold steady over dead center to get 27 to 30 range

You’re reading over 47 is what counts it’ll tell you where he’s going to dig or smell. So far if you’re getting the Same readings tomorrow It will explain why the trap is catching so many coyotes

Ok. Will post some results in morning Buried in sand. I pack my traps fairly tight between the jaws. And bury the trap deeper than most Will see what number I get. Tommorrow. Will deferent soils produce. Different readings??? Be interesting to ser

What happens if I put a refrigerator magnet under the pan.
What if I use a stainless steel trap

What if I wrap copper wire around my cage traps, to make a Faraday's cage. So to speak

Try anything it’s just a test. Whole purpose for using magnetometers is to do the test.

Even with stainless steel a coyote would be able to train him self to detect it with enough experiences. Same as with a prospecting dog.It would just depend on how many surviving experiences he had.

[/quote] How old the animal makes a big difference. He may not have had the opportunity or experience is to determine what has been hurting his friends. A lot of animals have the ability but I like a beagle dog just kind of go crazy sometimes And don’t respond to you
[/quote]
Most of my hard to catch animals are older females with young or are trap shy/smart to cages. The males, for the most part, are much easier to catch, again until they get older and have been caught a few times and taken to another location and released. After 40 years of wildlife control / ADC as my living, I can see and know what I am dealing with on my jobs based on the behavior I see (not a habit) the animal is showing. I know catch and relocate or translocate to a different territory causes a lot of the cage trap avoidance, and I can see the behavior of the animal and tells me that is the problem. I key in on one animal over a few days so I can see behavior in response to my actions, a positive for me that I do not have when fur trapping and setting locations to skim the top, and not keying in on one animal to solve a problem. When I see the behavior, I can just go to another presentation or method and catch them unless extremely trap shy then they just take off because of too much negative pressure. But sometimes there is no obvious sign or behavior why the animal is avoiding the cage. I want to see if this magnetic field stuff could explain why for no reason I can see an animal is avoiding the cage. Many times when I have a certain behavior with the cage and I can see it, I simply will add another trap at another location along the travel way a distance from the den entry and catch the animal. I have always thought this was due to den safety factors that many animals will have especially with pregnant or nursing females. (Many springtime fox and coyote control trappers see this behavior if and when setting to close to the den with pups.) So I want to see if at these jobs, where the animal is for no reason behavior-wise that are avoiding the cage. I want to see if, in fact, it is a high magnetic field issue. There is some stuff being done for the wildlife control field on my Cage trap smart cage trap shy and cage trap neutral observations. I would like to see if this magnetic field has any teeth. As a fur trapper, I do not care about missing a 6 dollar animal, but in my ADC/wildlife control business, I do care about missing a 300 dollar animal. So I will be trying to prove your theory right.

Ron I have found much of the same observations in my lifetime.

Faraday cage blocks the harmful effects of a magnetic field. A properly made cage trap rearranges the field where it forms a reduced field going through the trap making the animal less likely to Avoid. A reduced field in a Cage trap creates a calming affect to the animal. Eliminating the field completely would not create that effect. It’s in my copyrighted writings. A body grip trap and a snare are similar.

Clay soil is more dense than sand, makes a big difference. The deeper the better, up to 1 inch. Deeper than that ya may not get a good pad catch. Whenever I see yotes scratching it's always at the dog or at the levers. Used to think it was from rust or poor bedding. So I started to pack it in hard, still had em scratching at the same areas of the trap. Remakes are the worst for this. Witch could explain why some yotes avoid remakes?

The old female yotes are the worst for this, mommas are the teachers! Males are the providers!

ST do you have any MB450s? If so try them and see if they help..

Trappergbus. I don't have any MB 450s. I have some BMI K9 Wolfers. Tested them with Tesla Bot. Got 16 as a low over pan. 22 to 29 over stainless steel dog area. But right or left of pan. Was all over the place Toward coil springs I guess Readings higher that MB 550s. All over the place 22 to 51.

Hmm, I know that big heavy frame traps have the highest reading, especially 4 coiled..

Trap should be placed on ground set.Run the magnetometer over the top of the trap as close to the trap as you can without touching it.Record your highest readingsThat’s where the Coyote Will target. It will have to be over magnetic field of the earth where you are for him to notice it.Touch it with your iPhone if that iPhone you’re using has a cover over it.

BMI are 4 coiled. So maybe that's why they are higher than MB 550s around coil area

With our magnetic fields, could we be charging the flora or area around our sets? I tell students to leave good energy at the set to make sure to catch the older more experienced animals as well as the young of the year.

Positive ions of A magnetic field breaks down organic material and can change the molecular structure of water. If it’s strong enough overtime will destroy cells altering the genetic makeup of an animal DNA.

What this does is break down the molecules left at the set increasing the stink left by the coyote.Or any other animal that was caught

That trap is also very compact with the parts jammed closer to each other.The coil springs are also,equal in size,unlike many coil spring 4x4's.

Now,how much do coils themselves affect readings?Has anyone tested a longspring trap to see how it reacts?

Taxi. We were just talking about that! How did Pud Long and James Lucero catch 1000 plus a year with long spring ??? Would like to see reading on some long spring traps!!

I believe you’ll find that the type of set will correspond with the way the springs are placed in relationship to the pan.That will be determined by the radiating magnetic field from the trap.

Craig Ogorman also uses BIG traps. Like #3 Bridgers and #4 all four coiled with metal screen covers and has been catching 1000 plus a year for any years. I would like to just see how a #4 with 4 coils and metal screen cover , would react to Tesla Bot ? Would there be a difference between a #3 with a screen and a #3 without screen?? I may have to find out IF it quits raining here

I just talked to our friend in Texas.He has two Newhouse traps that he could test but right now,he is too busy playing Mr Mom and nanny to a 300 lb pet calf.

He was busy drinking beer, the other nite. So one my contest the accuracy if his MB-550 tests . LOL!!!!!

Probably a really stupid question. But does any dyes or wax help hide? Such as fmj

It’s not a stupid question. I haven’t really found one. Powder coating I’ve done on Cage traps and Body grips that I have doesn’t seem to make a difference.It’s certainly possible.

It probably doesn’t affect the field but it does prevent oxidation of the metal. So that would help in the detection by smell.

Could I use a Gauss meter to measure the electro magnetic fields?

It’s much easier to understand and to measure magnetic field induction when you’re using tesla or micro tesla readings.

None of the Tesla models I down loaded worked correctly on my android but the gauss meter has a nice dial type gauge that I kinda like.

Although I didn't take readings I get less avoidance/scratching with dyed and waxed coils springs with MB550 4 coils as apposed to just dyed unwaxed.

After reading the entire 9 pages of responses I remembered Locklear’s Teachers of the Night videos I’ve seen and got the impression most of the avoidance of traps was because the canines were hole shy.

In the early minutes of the TotN dirt hole, he shows a coyote work a dh set from the back and side and promptly get caught in a trap set 90 degrees to the right of the dirt hole. That coyote didn’t avoid the trap because it was adverse to its magnetic field. If trap magnetic fields are so repulsive, that female coyote would have gone around the trap on its way to the bait.

In the TotN beaver version, he films a beaver sniffing the exposed metal of a 330. That trap still must have had a magnetic field, but once the beaver felt the “new” addition to its domain wasn’t harmful, it tried to go through it.

I’m not convinced magnetic fields have all that much to do with trap avoidance. Hole shyness, yes. But the pipe dream set has shown us there are a lot of critters caught that aren’t bothered by metal screens or the traps under them. The idea that we could be setting near a fault line, or the trap has to be turned a certain direction in order to lessen its magnetism, or the moon wasn’t in the 7th house long enough or whatever: I’m not ready to think in terms of avoidance based on this theory yet.

I've put in 300+ test holes. Maybe 6 worked from back all others straight on.

Hole shyness I promise doesn't exist with my coyotes here

You might want to go back and read all of my posts since August on magnetic field of devices. Your understanding is why you cannot grasp it.

My observations have convinced me that at least beaver, coyotes, mink, and raccoon do not avoid or even appear to notice strong magnetic fields.
Clearly though, tests show some animals can orient themselves with the earth’s magnetic field when migrating or navigating travels, and strong magnetic fields can disrupt that ability so that they navigate differently or orient themselves in a different direction when traveling or navigating. But I see no video observation based evidence that strong magnetic fields or variations affect an animals behavior or activities at a specific location. Not saying it’s impossible, just saying I’ve got a lot of video of animals doing their thing around super powerful magnets as if the magnet was just another rock. Walking on them, moving them while dam building, standing over them while munching some bait.... No effect. So for whatever that is worth, there you go.

Maybe you tested too many magnets and not trapping devices. I had too many experiences to not to believe what I have

Well that is true, I tested magnets, not trapping devices. So maybe it’s not worth much. Those who are interested may draw their own conclusions. Or not.

Teacher do you know of a trapper or have you made a trap that reduces the field by facing it to the north.Or are you just poking fun saying that it wouldn’t make a difference.Have you tested your traps during a full moon with the magnetometer.Especially cage traps. I’ve heard of trappers say that I tried and it doesn’t work. That it makes no difference. Have you tried with the traps you use. Maybe it takes a special trap.Or is that just silly.

Sounds like this Is more about the use of cage traps.
Don't know about magnetic fields and the 4 compass points. But I do know I have a better catch rate when I have my trap down wind from my bait or lured location.

If what you do and believe gives you more confidence when your trapping so be It.

All I have done is read and study. No, I haven’t tested anything.

Some of what I’ve read is that animals/birds orient themselves due to what researchers say is gravitational pull of the moon. I’ll buy that.

From what I observed of my catch this last fall, in sloppy mud conditions using both aluminum and steel screens over tightly pack traps, then covered with grass. You get where I’m coming from. Before the virus knocked me down, those pipe dream sets gave me the best season I’ve had in years. If it’s your belief magnetism is affecting your season, that’s fine. I’m not convinced it’s affecting mine.

I believe animals are more oriented towards the north and south pole due to the effect of magnetism. I believe the moon play the role but not like the north and south pole. It’s like they were able to get a compass reading.
As far as the pipe dream set that seems to be working because the dead grass clippings seem to form a chaff much like the radar avoiding chaff used in World War II.

Chaff consists of small fibers that reflect radar signals and, when dispensed in large quantities from aircraft, form a cloud that temporarily hides the aircraft from radar detection.
Chaff - Radar Countermeasures
www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/systems/chaff.htm


Qoute: “ As far as the pipe dream set that seems to be working because the dead grass clippings seem to form a chaff much like the radar avoiding chaff used in World War II.“

Radar is a projection of a electromagnetic field. Grass combined with moisture and even freezing conditions form a shielding cloud over the magnetic field of the trap ,Hiding the traps projected magnetic field.

The chaff that affects radar is made of metal. Wood and most substances do not interact with magnetic fields -only certain metals interact with magnetic fields. The magnetic field of a magnetic object is unaffected by wood, and presumably grass, have no effect on magnetic fields. Water is a bit of a special case. In very strong magnetic fields, water has barely measurable effect on magnetic field by slightly blocking some measurable amount of the field. But for all “normal” magnets or magnetic objects, water has no measurable effect on the objects magnetic field - that is to say the field passes right through as if it were air. At extremes almost every substance becomes magnetic because the electrons in the substance start to align according to the field lines. But these are conditions only created my extreme “laboratory” magnets far beyond anything we common folk can buy with a years salary....
This is all well studied and observed. And it would be easy to test the magnetic field with and without chaff. Not sure I would trust an iPhone to test that, but then there is enough info on the subject that I would not bother to reinvent the wheel by dragging out special purpose instruments to re-confirm that organic materials have no effect on magnetic field.

It is also worth noting that RADAR can detect water and organic materials. Radar is more like reflected light than a magnetic field. All very well known and researchable phenomena.

Yep^^^^ my thoughts as well.

I really can't believe this thread is still going!

But since I'm a giver and a problem solver, this is all you need to do ( pay attention)

STEP 1
Go buy some Hecs hunting clothing

STEP 2
cut trap covers out of the clothing and put over your traps

STEP 3
tie your trap cover to your trap ( use non magnetic string) because it's expensive and you don't want to lose it

STEP 4 (THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT STEP)
send me $1.99 for this 1 page book showing you how to disguise the magnetic field of your traps and helping you improve your catch

http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/2002-03/1015162213.Eg.r.html
Look at what I said. I said radar is the projection of electromagnetic field and it is, I Said, the grass combine with moisture and freezing temperatures forming a cloud or type of cloud over the magnetic field of the trap. Hiding the traps projected magnetic field.Maybe I should have said cover instead of cloud
Dry grass or wood is dielectric. It would resist or block the magnetic field of the trap: I should have added paper because it works too. To a degree.
There is no gotcha moment.

I’m sorry but you don’t understand it all need to look at what type of traps and devices there are and how to use them your advice won’t work.

You three just got yourself

I’m here just because I enjoy the discussion and I’ve made some observations of animals in proximity to strong magnetized objects. I’m not trying to gotcha anybody.
RADAR is indeed a projection of electromagnetic field. A magnetized object (AKA permanent magnet) has no electromagnetic field. They are not even measured the same - EMF is measured in units of Newtons per Couloumb or Volts per Meter, magnetic field produced by magnetic objects (like a regular old magnet or piece of magnetized steel) is measured in Gauss or Teslas. And EMF can be affected (attenuated, reflected, etc) by all kinds of stuff, while a magnetic field from a magnetized object is typically affected ONLY by certain metals.
A RADAR can not be made with a magnet, it has to use electricity. Magnetic objects and electromagnetic force have some similarities and some differences.
But all of that is just rehash of well understood physics and me observing animals lack of reaction to strong magnetic objects.

I really don’t know how it all relates or does not relate to trapping devices and catching animals in them. No gotcha, just science review and some observations.

I concentrated on magnets thinking that they would be the means for solving the puzzle. I found it it wasn’t. I sought the advice 3 engineers that work for power companies in my state and my patent attorney is an engineer and he agrees with what I found.My son who is a excellent trapper is one of those engineers. My father was an engineer. My findings are based on thousands and thousands of catches and experiences. Over 60,000 sets that were made. I have permission to trap on over 1000 landowners In my county alone I have permission to Trappin over 350 landowners. Some landowners own over to 20,000 acres of land. I just have too many experiences that have proven my findings to be correct.I had a biologist test traps with me on at least five occasions. He also rode with me many times over the years and saw the numbers of the animals that I caught.

I am catching raccoons groundhogs and squirrels in cages that have a higher magnetic reading on the front outside of the trap, some times 30 higher. but I will say the readings are higher on the open door yet at the bottom and inside they drop to below the area reading. no matter what direction the trap is set or how high the outside readings are, inside they are always below the area readings. Maybe these animals do not mind the fields. I am not saying anything other than I am catching critters when I set the traps. I will be setting two traps that hopefully have 2 different numbers one high and low to see. I will say that the smaller the trap the readings tend to be higher. I would like to get a smaller trap with lower readings than a larger trap and see how the animal reacts, most times when I set a smaller trap and a larger cage trap the animal most times goes into the larger first.

As I have posted animals that are most responsive or coyotes red fox beaver otter.

I have noticed the mice and rats can tell.Traps with plastic pans seem to catch more.That’s just observation Not a lot of testing.

The larger the trap the more frame the more frame easier it is to move the field in the direction you wanted to , to a point.

Jonesey
Air temperature and water temperature is a very big factor. You may not be experiencing what you will experience when it gets hot this summer. You will see a substantial response negatively the more the average temperature rises above 47°.At least that is the way it is where I live. And where I trapped in Alabama years ago.

Kirk before I went full time in the wildlife control field I was a lineman for the electric company. Static electric current was always a concern when there was a heavy air condition. I can remember more than a few times have to wear my rubber gloves LOL But this brings me to another thought. Coyote, fox beaver and otter are thought to be aware of this field, And we also know that horses and cattle would also be aware of the field that is why I have an electric fence for our horses and cows. An observation I have seen is a young horse or cow first time learning the wire will smell the wire from a few inches then hit with the nose and bam!!!! Then from that point on they know what a wire is, well some do LOL The young dogs tend to not notice the wire until they hit it, then they understand and avoid it. So my thought is if geese and other migratory animals obviously use these fields to migrate, which would be a positive, wouldn't the four animals you mentioned have to have a noticeable negative to a magnetic field in order to cause a problem with the traps magnetic field? Again I am not making a negative or positive statement just asking based on what I have observed factual or perceived.

You are right on target Jonesey. I can’t explain everything in these threads . Without understanding that I could not have made the findings that I did.It is in my copyrighted findings.

LOL here is another thought for discussion. Many in the wildlife control field know and have heard me talk about my cage baiting strategies that I developed for cage traps 20 years ago. I developed them watching squirrels, raccoons, groundhogs, and skunks on my jobs working the cages and not going into a normally baited/lured trap. Without going into my cage trap demo seminar LOL I watched the animals many times would smell the bottom of the open door above and the bottom of the front lip of the open trap, and seemed to make a choice to enter or walk around to the back of the trap and work from outside. (Again bait in the back of trap) My thoughts are, this is where a strong amount of animal odor would be present in oils, blood and any negative gland odor as the animals work the door the hardest in a stressed condition. I developed the baiting strategies to create a positive to hopefully override the negative that I assumed and I still believe is at the front of the cage. ( maybe magnetic field is also something here that I have not thought about meaning 2 negatives) I wounder If a positive was created to override the negative at a foothold set can be done? And in fact, if your theory is correct, many have learned how to overcome the negative without really thinking or knowing about the field. Again just thinking with no answer, except I know my baiting strategies increase my catches in cages and DP traps. I will also be testing your thoughts on DP traps.

You’re right on target again Jonesey.Trappers have made adjustments not knowing that magnetic field affected them. It works the same way with DP’s or any other device. My writngs just confirm who is the real deal. If what you’ve been teaching is correct it will be found out through the magnetic testing of positive and negative ions.

An example that may make a difference would be if you had a single door trap that had a high intensity reading over the pan. You probably could take the trap if it was being avoided and place it in water that would just cover the pan. The water would mask the intensity of the field the animimal would be more likelyTo go in.
Another example would be if you have the same trap you might be able to place something over the panThat is dielectric. It might be a type of a shingle or a board that would prevent the magnetic field from radiating off of the pan. Some trappers do this saying that animal doesn’t wanna step on the pan. They are correct except for the animal doesn’t wanna get near the pan. Blocking the field will hide what he’s fearful of.

I think that the bigger the opening the easier It Is for the critter to enter and has nothing to do with a magnetic field.
The yellow pan on the mouse trap has more site appeal.

When I trapped coon I trail set with 220s. Then the 220s were out lawed and you had to have them enclosed. The enclosure had to be 30" long and no more then a 100 square Inch opening 30" X10"X10" guess what my catch ratio sky rocketed. Why It was because I was now funneling those coon Into that trap. But I still had refusals so I decided to bend the law a bit. I built my enclosures 12" high and 10" wide but placed a 2" strip of fencing across the bottom to get me back to the 10"X 10" legal opening. What that did was to let the coon walk Into that enclosure with out bending over. I don't know If that increased the magnetic field or lessened It, and I could care less because It increased my coon catch by a higher margin. The ease of entry Is what It's all about.

I have a friend that has a 500 acre farm that raised nothing but hay and nearly 30 hives of bees and did so for as long as I can remember. He was approached about 10 years ago about leasing his fields for beans and corn, they sprayed Roundup and within 5 years he had lost nearly every hive that he had and the colonys that were left suffered great losses. 3 years ago went back to hay in the fields and no Roundup close by and his colonys are increasing and back to healthy bees, just because a court makes a ruling doesn't mean that they are correct.

I live in the largest agricultural county in the state of Georgia. There are bee hives every square mile farmers keep them there because of the produce cotton and peanuts and corn. I’ve never heard them complain about the bees not being enough caused by round up.The average farmer their farms over 3000 acres in our production levels are higher than anywhere in the state.They all use round up

Chemicals do affect bee's. I have a chemical applicators license. In the instruction class you're taught not to apply at times of the day when bee's are most active, especially with the liquid formulas. So if applied at the right times, it can greatly reduce the effects on bees. So if applied at right times, which farmers may be doing in Kirk's area, may explain why he doesn't see the losses to colonies.

I was going to give the same answer about the bees

I used to believe same as you. When I tested all of my traps I found it to be differently. I mean tested by testing the magnetic field. My patents allowed me to make traps that are three and four doors. They are almost open all the way around. I had side door traps I tested that are completely open on the side that I tested.
As long as I was targeting animals that are responsive to the magnetic field I would never know without doing testing with the magnetometer.The magnetometer Always showed me where the deficiencies were.

Kirk I’m curious if your observations would predict a reaction from animals in the presence of strong magnets, like just a regular strong permanent magnet or a magnetized piece of steel, and if you do predict a reaction, what reaction would you predict? You already know I have a lot of footage of mink, beaver, coyote, and fox appearing to pay no attention whatever to magnets and magnetized steel, so I’m not trying to have any gotcha moment, I’m trying to understand the science behind what you are saying, and how it might contradict or not contradict my observations.

If you make a double door cage trap that has a lower intensity induction of the earth where you’re at going through the trap that’s what you want. If you take a magnet and attach it to one of the doors on either end it will change the field Changing the direction of the negative and positive ions. In most cases it will be negative change as far as being harmful By creating positive ions changing the direction of the flow of the traps Negative ions. This creates a field that is felt And seen by some animals In a very negative way. They seem to be able to tell that the positive ions or harming their body and the body of their friends or other animals like themselves. I explain why it takes place in my book or at least how I think it takes place.
You can take a pyramid trap and place a strong magnet at the top of the trap At the apex. It increases the production of the negative ions being pulled into the trap at a uniform flow Because of the design of the Apex in relationship to the trap. It produces a calming affect for the animal but because of the strong positive ion flow from the corners at the bottom it can be Like a beacon to a coyote or a dog. I was told by an electrical engineer that It could actually be dangerous as a lightning attractor in a thunderstorm. Killing any animal that might be in the trap. I have tried grounding traps and it doesn’t work. Depending on the trap in most cases it’s just rearranges the flow of the negative and positive ions radiating off the trap. That can be very helpful with a foothold but doesn’t seem to make a difference in the cage trap.
A magnet by itself seems to have no or get no response. There has to be a field created for there to be a negative or positive result.

The biggest coon I caught this year were in 8x8 cage traps using Jonesie’s baiting strategy. These were top trip, brand new, galvanized metal Ztraps I bought a year ago. Some were in excess of 28 pounds.

I believe being positioned up wind of trails, baited like Jonesie taught me at school, made a difference. I’m sure those coon saw the trap as something new in their environment and smelled that open door. But I’m sure they liked the bait enough to want more of it and wandered in.

I’ve taken too many fox in 220s, beavers and otters in 330s to think the magnetic field was a turn off.

I'm still in the process of my testing to determine if coyotes can detect footholds but so far id say "for the most part" a buried foothold will have some influence on how a coyote works a set. My belief is not all individuals respond or react the same way. To improve sometimes its more about the ones we don't catch than the ones we do. I've done a good amount of bait and lure testing down holes without traps and it sure seems to easier to get them to work a set without a trap than with a trap and thats why I'm doing the test I am. If and how they know something is wrong when a trap is set there i won't speculate yet.

What seems to be left out is one of the biggest factors affecting what I’ve been saying. That is the weather. The climate where you are trapping.The magnetic induction of the area where are you trapping. If I trapped the way trappers trap in Wisconsin where I live I would catch 10 times fewer animals.

I can’t explain everything on these threads. So I wrote it down. Where I live and where I trap,Water temperatures are about 70° in the winter daytime temperatures get as high as 85° in the last few years on a regular basis. Magnetic field if it’s high intensity field causes all those factors to really make a difference. Many folks planted corn in the garden in February this year. It is a good thing for yes sir to test and I thank him for it. He’s going to find that warm temperatures make a tremendous difference in the response that an animal has to set.Even more of a test difference if he tested below or south of Cordele Georgia.

I’m South of Cordele and have no issues catching critters on untrapped properties. Tempted to even try a cage trap at one property next year just to see if I can get a coyote, bobcat, or fox in it.

I use MB550’s only. I use dirt hole and pipe dream sets with screen and without. Don’t have much luck with scent post sets, or may be the fact I don’t set many.

Each property will have a soil content of hard red clay that even a 20v drill and a 3” auger can’t penetrate when it‘a dry, to sweet dark regular old dirt that you wish was over the entire property.

I trap from Dec-Aug. Winter is the easiest to trap due to how the critters react and their needs. Dirt holes rule because baits (natural and commercial) can be used. Once it warms, ants become the biggest issue. Just my belief, but I don’t think a critter is gonna dig through an ant bed unless it’s really desperate.

During the warmer months I’m on a place that’s been trapped for the last 16 years by much better trappers than I’ll ever hope to be, but I’m still learning. During the warmer months I’ve found that pipe dream sets are the way to produce catches. I’ve tested that theory so far this year and only 25% of my traps are producing...pipe dream sets without screen (I’m out and can’t find any). I’ve now switched over to 75% pipes and 25% dirt holes...we will see.

I’ve yet to see a difference in any critters reaction to any set on what would be perceived as magnetic interference. Only reactions I see are based on time of year, needs of the critters, amount of critters, etc...

You just made the case that magnetic fields are affecting the animals. The set you’re using would represent the best set to use in conditions like you trap to reduce the magnetic fields influence.

First off I bought your book. Interesting, but at no time in its pages 60 plus pages or the 11 pages of this thread do you ever say how to fix this problem. If the only applicable advice you offer is to Power Bed with Nails, then I wasted a ton of time. I don't care about cage traps. Just snares and leg holds.

Also what does Monsanto have to do with trapping???

Thanks for any insite.

On page 10 there’s several examples that you can do to correct the problem.
You have to understand how magnetic fields affect all the different devices to determine the best approach for your situation. By knowing how it affects all of the devices as well as understanding how it affects other situations that I mentioned in the back of the book with round up is the only way to really understand how to adjust to the situation.

There are several examples in the threads on Trapperman that show you how to fix the problem. I have mentioned several times why methods work without a magnetometer you would never know. Without reading the information given in my book you would never know. Example are posts made showing why the sets work. One of those examples would be what I posted about pipedream Set s on other threads. There was a thread on snares posted several weeks ago that confirmed what I said in the book how to correct problems with snares. What I said in my book backed up what snare methods were used as being the best.
I have said in other post you may need read Several times the whole book to understand it.I can’t make you understand it. I know I had to read several scientific studies many times before I understood.

It looks like this has become a book selling thread.

How i confirmed what I learned was that every time I came in contact with a trapper trapping device I pulled my magnetometer out of my pocket and saw what the device read.Where the high points were in the low points were.I went in stores as I showed in examples in the book.

I’ll tell you what I’ll do Beav I’ll donate all of the income from the book to the NTA that I have received if I’m proven wrong in four years. If I’m proven right you have to donate the same amount of money to the NTA
The information will help too many people not just trappers. It will affect too many lives not to be understood.

it's going to take you 4 years to prove this? I haven't got that much time left.

I probably have less time than you.The NTA could always use the money..

Come on beav he called u out. Perfect time to prove your critics your not just all blow and no go.

There are some good posts on the last few pages. Thanks to Jonesie and others who are posting things that make us think.

How can you be so dismissive? You haven't forked over money for his book. Get with the program before one more animal detects the stench of minute amounts of magnetism at your sets and runs for the hills, leaving you penniless.

Kirk, can you describe the hypothesis, the experiment, and the results/conclusions?
Basically that’s what I feel has to happen for you to be proven correct. And I do think that what you are saying is in theory possible. But one of the tenets of scientific inquiry is that the ideas and observations must be shared freely, and the results must be repeatable (devices and processes based on the ideas and phenomena one discovers are patentable, the knowledge itself is not). In this case, that means you can not expect others to “get a feel for it” because they have caught thousands of animals while keeping it in mind over the course of many years. What we need is a succinct experimental procedure(s) that tests your hypothesis, and which is clearly understandable, does not violate known previously demonstrated scientific principles, and is replicable and repeatable. Outside of that, we will all have to scratch our heads and debate and wonder if your idea is just voodoo or solidly based truth.
I’m not sure where the roundup talk comes from, I’m only discussing potential influence of magnetic objects or disruption of magnetic fields by magnetic objects.

Do the magnetic readings change with moon phases or high and low tides?
Do they "ever" change?

Answering this post and the one before it in detail should give you the answers you want. It’s gonna take me a while so be patient but should be glad you did.

Animals are responding to the change in magnetic induction of the earth. That can be measured with a magnetometer. How that change affects each trapping device is the Key.
The Earth’s magnetic induction ranges from 25 micro tesla at the equator to 65 micro tesla at the North Pole.
The sun and the moon are the ones responsible for the change in the induction because of magnetism of the moon to the earth and the sunlight. Or properties of the sun.The further north you go the less the effect that the moon and sun is on the variance of the earth’s induction . So the further north you go the less induction change or intensity there is for the animal to sense. The hotter it is higher the intensity,. The colder it isThe lower the intensity. That’s why someone in Alaska would not experience the same change as someone in Florida. In fact in Alaska there would be very very little change. So they would never know the difference as someone in Florida being much lower closer to the equator.

Because of this the further north you go, the colder the climate more active the animals are because of the cold weather. They have to fatten up before winter.Because of the intensity is lower further North of the equator, the intensity is not as projected causing a more active animal to get caught. There is less induction change or higher intensity to be felt or sensed by the animal.

As far as the Moon is concerned the full moon could change the intensity of a trap as much is 20%. Most animals travel at night so if you set a trap That had a high intensity reading already and you checked it daily it would have a strong effect on your ability to catch the animal. If the full moon was high during daylight The intensity of the field would be lower during the time that the animals would be most active. Which would increase your catch.

.
I could not see how I could get a patent on something I have had for years that some people have but Do not realize what they have.So I copyrighted and wrote a book . As my patent attorney said, “you’re not a known scientist it’s going to be hard for you to prove and be excepted , no matter that is accurate.”

I used to believe that the more open the trap the better way to catch the animal. I thought that if I have a trap that was completely open as it will make all the difference in the world. I found out it doesn’t, Unless the magnetic field is reduced inside the trap or device.
I noticed the animals responding to the different parts of the traps that I was using. I watched hours and hours of night vision videos. Because the way animals responding to the videos being projected by the camera I thought they were telling me something.I deducted that it was a magnetic field or a magnetic projection of ions. I did not have a magnetometer and I talked a local engineer at our electric co-op to meet me in a field to use his magnetometer. I brought a couple truckloads of traps and test and tested them. I went back and reviewed by results. I learned that I could turn my IiPhone into a magnetometer to do the tests.
Based on results I decided that the best way to test the traps were to set the traps almost side-by-side and see which traps caught the most animals. I also paid close attention is to how animals responded.
At eachtest site one trap had a high intensity field going through the trap and at least one trap had a low intensity field going thru it. Sometimes there were five pairs of traps at each location.I went over 100 locations testing beavers and Otters. I got to where I didn’t even want to take the high intensity traps.I found it was a waste of time and took away from being able to use other traps.
Because of what I learned I started testing footholds snares and conibears.That’s when I realized what I had found. That it affected the whole realm of the trapping industry.
Because I was a trap maker I had customers that had my traps and other traps that I knew had high intensity. They confirmed my testing by the results they shared. I found that unless the trapper had one of each type a high intensity trap and a low intensity trap they would never know the difference.

They both caught animals put the lower intensity trap caught up to 4-5 times more over a season of continuous trapping.

So a 15" long cable stake drove 15" down has (no/some/major) effect on the magnetic field of the trap???

Pull out your magnetometer and see.

Please explain animals crawling under and through woven wire fences?

give me a little while and I’ll have time to get started on it. That’s a good question. There are several answers to Explain why some works one way better than another way.

First of all the ability of an animal to to determine if a magnetic field is harmful or not is a learned ability. The more experiences he has while his brain is developing the better his chances are of survival.
A fence creates a field of its own. I would think that woven wire fence to a coyote would be like a screen in your microwave. If there was a hole in the fence It would show up as a tunnel in his vision Just like a reduced field inside of a conibear or a cage trap, or in this case a snare.

If he has the ability to key on a magnetic Emission or intensity the best way to reduce that emsission or intensity is to use a snare that has the smallest snare lock and smallest diameter cable with the fewest swivels possible.ADC On this forum has the best kill Pole set up and snare set up that I have seen to reduce The magnetic intensity that the animal may see.

Maybe in should bury a magnet at my bait test holes in the spot I would bed the trap and see what happens.

I think everyone who is interested in this topic needs to start with an understanding of the differences and similarities of magnetic fields created by permanent magnets (or magnetized objects that can attract other metal objects) and electromagnetic energy fields. They can interact, but they are not the same thing. Again, they aren’t even measured by the same instruments, and they are quantified by different units.

I was actually being sarcastic. I guess you can say i am thinking this is like a conspiracy theory of.sorts. my method of trapping is K.I.S.S. This topic reminds me a lot of the contaminated trap theory. I am not saying the magnetic field isn't there, I am saying everyone has it and some guys catch big numbers and some guys don't. Some guys have good catch percentage and some don't. I would rather make a set with confidence and catch coyotes rather than worry about what might possibly go wrong. To each his own.

Well I’m the eternal skeptic also, especially considering my observations involving strong magnets. But I do leave open the possibility that magnetic forces may have some effect in certain situations. And I don’t think it is crazy talk to explore the idea, especially given that animals have been shown through solid experiments to use the earths magnetic poles to navigate, and that ability can be messed up by STRONG magnetic fields. These magnetic fields were much stronger than any hand size magnets can produce.
I admit I’m having a lot of trouble thinking that a coyote or beaver can “see” or sense the disruptions caused by metal they encounter in “everyday life”. HOWEVER: in a situation where an animal is on high alert, preceding cautiously, and trying to sense anything abnormal, I leave open the POSSIBILITY that it might be able able sense a disruption in magnetic field. But honestly, I think an animal that is on high alert is an animal that is already educated, and it seems relevant that I catch a lot of educated beaver “cleaning up” after other trappers and landowners try to catch them and EVERY ONE of those educated beaver are caught in a steel foot trap or a snare. Presumably those traps and snares have some effect on magnetic fields, so again it raises my skeptic flag. In the end, with foot traps and snares and body grips, I’m seriously doubting it has a SIGNIFICANT effect on my trapping success. But I really could be wrong. What will convince me are WELL DESIGNED experiments, with controls, that are repeatable and isolate magnetism as the test. And I can tell you this, beaver, coyotes, mink, and raccoon have no avoidance of a plain old strong magnet.

Educated beaver

Everyone you caught with a foothold or snare set underwater the reason I’ve already explained on this written in my book. I said: Animals are responding to the change in magnetic induction of the earth. That can be measured with a magnetometer. How that change affects each trapping device is the Key.

The field can’t be measured underwater with the magnetometer. That’s why you set the trap under the water to hide the field.The beaver can’t sense it when it’s an underwater set.

You are arguing a moot point. There is no argument. The animal can’t sense when it’s a trap set under the water.
A magnetometer just gives you best indication as to what device might be best to use.

It’s much easier to understand what works than why it works.

K.I.S.S. if it ain't broke don't fix it. I am a trapper not a scientist. All the science in the world won't catch more animals than good old fashion experience and confidence.

Kirk - I’m not arguing. Or at least that’s not my intent. I’m discussing and sharing what I’ve seen and sharing what my gut feelings are. Like I said, sometimes I’m wrong, and I’m leaving open the possibility that there is something to learn here.
Your decades of experience and thousands of observations do give you solid footing to propose something like this, but because of the age old bias issue, you or someone will need to carefully design tests (aka “experiments “ in science terms) that can isolate magnetism and have good controls and “all that stuff”.
Perhaps you’ve done that and it is “in the book”? Well, again, the ideas and observations of natural phenomena must be shared freely to be accepted by the “rules of scientific inquiry”. Methods, processes, and devices based on those observations are products that can be copyrighted, patented, and sold as the case may be. Copyright is kind of a mixture - while you can copyright your words, allowing you to control who uses them as written, and how, the ideas they convey are not protected. Let me put it this way, until I’m convinced the underlying observations of natural phenomena are solid, I’m skeptical of paying for a book focused on the subject.
Just my thoughts. Not trying to argue or be confrontational.

I wonder how all the big number guys catch all their critters without this knowledge. Can you imagine if they’d just read the book? We mere mortals wouldn’t have a critter left to catch.

All joking aside, I believe there’s a confidence pheromone aspect that plays a role in making big catches

I drove to Guntersville Alabama yesterday and spent the day with a nuisance trapper. We tested MB 550’s, ring locking door cagetraps, swing bar trigger cage traps, and hanging Power door cage trap.
We found that the MB 550 trap has a high intensity magnetic field of 100 that ran perpendicular to the dog Across the trap from one lever pivot point to the other across the pan.
The magnetic field induction variance was five times lower than the trap that I used as an example in my book. This would explain why the trap has been so successful. Because the way the field ran It would be more likely for the animal to get caught if he were to try to dig up the trap. Lower induction variance is a tremendous advantage.There were no duke 550s to test.
I should have said Jaw pivot point.

I believe the stainless steel dog And the cast jaws, or just the way the trap is made, made the difference

This is an off the topic post. The kiss mindset is very important as long as the person understands it. A new trappers' understanding of KISS is a lot different than someone who has been catching for 50 years. When we all start off we start off at the same place, we Know-nothing, and it is ALL Rocket SCIENCE. As we learn rocket science isn't as hard as it once was, so our KISS changes. The more we know the more we do things without thinking about it. and many times we do not even realize we are doing it, both negative and positive. There are two mindsets, both work, JUST DO IT or UNDERSTAND WHY TO DO IT. Most folks are just do it. The problem is and this is more important in the ADC where I have to catch them all causing the problem yet not waste time and effort on catching the ones not causing the problem. and the problem is just doing it can come to a standstill when the animal doesn't want you doing it. LOL And at that point understanding the 4 W's, what, when, where, and why has to be understood. Human nature is I don't want to have to think about it, but until we learned it, we had to, and every GOOD trapper out there has thought about it to learn it, we just do not think about it after we learn it.LOL

I am not sold on the elictromagnetic field yet, as I am setting cages and everyone has higher readings outside and some inside and catching critters. But, that could be because of my way I do things or the 80/20 concept. I may be dealing with the 80 %, maybe the 20% will pay attention to it. So I am at least 6 months of criiter catchen before I say yah or na, but investigating it is making my job more interesting than the normal set a trap and take another back mindset.

I have Kirk's book and have read it. I do believe it has merit but I think a lot of people are misunderstanding where the field really becomes a factor. He has said many times that there are only a few animals that can detect it, not all animals. Mainly K9's, beaver, and otter I believe. Also it becomes a learned trait so it's the older, mature animals that it really helps you out with. So you will be able to take many coyotes or the other animals that can sense this field, since they haven't had or learned a bad experience yet. Young and inexperienced so to speak.

Mr. Jones, I believe that's why your catching critters with a high reading on cages. Animals such as skunks, raccoons, or some of the other ADC critters in really makes no difference from what I understand.

I hope this helps individuals to understand what Kirk has been trying to say. If I'm off on my thoughts, please correct me Mr. DeKalb.

I’m going to run a very Unscientific Scientific test this next fall where I only make coyote sets with a confident attitude, and I’ll only use the set locations where I know that I’m going to catch a coyote. I’ll also be putting something so good down the hole that it doesn’t matter what traps i use.

If you read what I just said above you would understand that you are going to still catch coyotes and possibly lots of them. A lot of factors come into play for the field to actually become a problem. Your ground temperature will be less than 50 which will give you an advantage. The warmer the ground temperature the easier the field is detected. Having a reduced field helps catching mature animals that have associated it with danger.

You’re right on target.

Jonesie will come around with an Open mind that he has

yes, you may be right that is why I mentioned the 80 / 20 concept, and I am seeing that maybe skunks may also be able to detect something don't know yet. meaning 80% will go into a trap no matter what, but 20% mostly older females with young at the den seems to avoid cages for no apparent reason seen. I will be putting this to the test in a month or so when the family unit calls start coming in.

.

Jonesie will come around with an Open mind that he has[/quote]

I am always looking for something to give me the advantage. My methods are based on behavior more than habits, So I will try to prove you right. I have no pride in how I catch them, just so I catch them LOL

I am always looking for something to give me the advantage. My methods are based on behavior more than habits, So I will try to prove you right. I have no pride in how I catch them, just so I catch them LOL
[/quote]

I agree with Jonesie's above statement.

If this this is a magnetic field problem ,would not plastic catch traps solve the problem with the 20 percenters of the skunks?
I consistently set multiple traps of traditional wire cage traps and the plastic catch traps. There seems to be no rhyme or reason why the animal will choose one over the other. But, no sense in missing an animal when you have enough traps.
Just like using multiple baits and lures for nuisance trapping. I like to give options when at all possible. You never know what will peak an animals interest.
Also glad to here about the 550's testing out well. Thank you all for your input and knowledge.

Most plastic and PVC traps don’t have a very reduced field going through the trap. Wire cage trap that has a reduced field going all The way through the trap that the reduction is over 50% create a calming affect to the animal. He’s not as afraid to enter the trap.

PVC or plastic would be good. I think a trap that’s got a field reduction greater than the PVC Trap, would be better.

Both of these quotes do an excellent job summing up the way I understand the book so far. I don't ever want to think in absolutes, I always want to keep learning. This is especially true with wildlife. That's how I can get better. So far I feel that the magnetic field concept is not saying that you either will or won't catch all the animals that sense it, but it will definitely come in to play with some of them. It is something that, over time, will show me how and when I can use it. It definitely provides much better explanations for refusals in certain instances. I think like Jonesie said, that then becomes wanting to understand why doing things a certain way can be successful.

Animals process their environment so much differently than humans. I know metal is made from elements found in the earth. But with that being said, is it fair to say that metal made by humans (fences, posts, gates, cages, traps) is extremely foreign to an animals environment? So foreign they can feel it.

I think of it as....They grow up around it, learn to live with it, grow used to going under fences/through culverts/ etc...but that doesn't mean that it never stops being recognized as foreign. An animal senses metal, for it is not natural (just like asphalt roads and building foundations), yet learns to live with it. An adult animal or one that becomes aware of trapping pressure, might then draw on that. Meaning that although he has sensed and perceived that metal his entire life, if he is put on edge or wary, he'll pull from his ability to sense that metal the same way he smells the air. It's how he perceives the world....through a combination of sensory feedback.

That is just something I thought about when I started reading the book.

The Greatest Discovery For The 21st Century...

You said it I didn’t.
The title is called An Outdoorsman’s Greatest Discovery for the 21st-century
The real reasons animals are detecting your sets and devices

Kirk - Some of your writings here are contradictory. Some are poorly explained. There seems to be no scientific support for your claims. How do you know what each species of animal learns or even can learn? How do you know unknowable information? Some of your statements are similar to statements by experts on Bigfoot. In your book do you cover these issues?

That’s why I wrote a book. There’s always a reference to go back to to explain that there was no reference to Bigfoot to cover and to cover the issues that you may find while trapping.

It explains how the trapper can take the opinion out of how well the trap will catch an animal. Understanding it will explain why ,which Will allow him to determine how he should proceed.

All that I will add to this discussion is that I hope that the imminent Man-made Global Warming and Climate Change doesn't negate all of the authors findings.
That would crush book sales...

I would think that if it were not an audio books or video the average trapper would make page 3 or less before going into a coma. That is unless you have lots of pictures. Just sounds a little dry for me.

How do you know it helps you catch older animals, did you age them all?

If a animal grows up around fences, culverts and roads it is natural to them they don't have human intelligence to comprehend where they come from .

If by human intelligence you are referring to self-awareness or realization of their place in the world, then that's another thread. I was taught that every animal species is neither dumb nor smart....instead they are perfectly adapted to the lives they need to live. I think it is an error to think that animals would interpret the world the way we do. Their senses far surpass ours.

I'm not sure how to re-write my post any differently. The point is that they sense it as being foreign, not always dangerous, but foreign. Something that stands out in the natural environment.

I guess for me, the concept that animals can sense a field around metal objects seems pretty realistic. I think it would be harder to believe that they are limited to processing the world the way humans do.

for·eign
/ˈfôrən/
adjective
1.
of, from, in, or characteristic of a country or language other than one's own.
"a foreign language"
(2.)
((((((strange and unfamiliar.))))))
"I suppose this all feels pretty foreign to you"

If something has been there for the hole life of an animal or in most cases several generations of animals ancestors it cannot be by definition foreign

I believe that IF an animal reacts negatively to a magnetic field it is learned by some negative experience that animal has. A trap pinching or going off in its face (beaver and killers) And most of those would be older animals. Older is anything over a year as most animals die with in the first 1.5 years of age when mortality rates are 40 to 60%. Again I am trying to prove Kirk correct, simply because if I try to prove it right, then I know yes or no based on facts, not bias. Why? Because it will answer why I get some animals that just for no apparent reason will not enter a cage trap. Most times I can see the reason, and most times it is an animal that has been caught and released somewhere else or where a young animal has been rehabbed and turned loose. These animals just plain are cage shy or cage smart. CAGE SHY they flat take off, CAGE SMART they work the cage from the side never going in or going into the trap up to the pan and not going any further. One of the tricks of many I use on smart animals working the outside is simply Flip the trap around 180 degrees so the open door is where the back was. Most times the animal is caught the next time they come to the trap. working on behavior rather than methods. ( working damage gives me the advantage of seeing what one animal is doing, where fur trapping I see many and can't tell what each one is doing) Every trap I have tested has had high readings, so in theory by flipping the trap around and the field is the issue, then the same behavior should be seen just on the other side. So I believe that on cage smart animals the field is not the issue. With that being said, I still have to answer the TRAP SHY question, why do a few animals take off as soon as the trap is set there set or closed????? or why do they eat the little bean size baits outside the trap yet never enter the trap?????? Up until now, I have always believed it is catch and release and still believe it as a rule. But maybe just maybe on some, it could be the field. I do a lot of beaver control work, why do most beaver go right into that killer, yet that one beaver sprung the trap? Does chance or hesitation cause the miss????? If hesitation why did it hesitate when the rest didn't????? I know and I agree that when I am fur trapping I am thinking too much and yes when I am fur trapping that is my time to get away from the stress and pressures of my business. So who cares, leave for seed. But in my business, IF I CANT CATCH THAT CRITTER OR MAKE IT LEAVE I don't get paid and MRS Jones reminds me the bills have to be paid LOL

I am also going to do some testing with buried springs for the coyotes and fox. (I can't possess foot traps in NJ or I would use a welded open trap) Springs seem to have a high reading, so these springs or any metal that has a higher reading than the surrounding area placed in front of a dirt hole or flat set should give me the same as a trap.

I am supposed to be giving a cage trap demo at the PA. convention this June if it is still going to happen. And if I find positive to this theory then I will give Kirk a node, if I am still in the air I won't say anything. I do believe in some situations he may be on to something, but also there are many reasons why animals react negatively and the better we are as trappers and outdoorsmen the more we realize this.

On a side note, I bury DP traps in pockets and dirt holes in my advanced DP systems. I find that just sticking the trap in the ground the standard way (KISS) the fox and coyotes tend not to work at getting the meat or bait out of the trap when exposed (KISS) yet when I bury in a bank or ground they dig the same trap out and try to get the bait out. Just something to think about. By the way, Bob Noonan asked me if I stay up all night thinking about this stuff LOL I laughed and said no just all day every day LOL

Sorry for the book but I needed a reason not to go out in the rain and check jobs yet so I wasted time here LOL

When It comes to dirt sets I believe that the animal Is SET shy not TRAP shy.

MnCedar has summed up my thoughts and opinion fairly well. There is no doubt regarding some animals abilities under certain circumstances to avoid and sense certain things that may be seen and unseen. Whether it is thru smell and or a magnetic field detection of an object. These circumstances do occur and I have seen it in varying degrees over the years.

For as long as I have been trapping I have seen and experienced my share of situations. For the most part there aren't many animals that cant be caught one way or another in time. Being an intelligent species as we are that gives us the ability to over come most any circumstance we are presented with in time. It becomes a situation that we learn from when we do succeed.

That's what makes trapping so rewarding for those of us that have been at it for the long haul.

If it was all so easy most would loose interest pretty quick I would reason. It presents constant challenges and keeps us thinking as to how we can improve our skills.

I have found several ways in dealing with what I perceived is an animal smelling or detecting my trap at a particular set or location. It definitely was smelling or sensing something it couldn't see since the trap was buried in most cases.

One situation was remedied by grating a piece of dry cow dung chip over the set area which in my mind disrupted its ability to determine the exact position of the bedded trap. In a couple days I had caught the fox doing the frequent digging at the set. I never had a problem in the area again with diggers. I have caught many fox in that pasture over the years. Red and Grey fox.

After that experience I have always carried a bucket of shredded dry cow chips for blending into my set dirt at times to give me what I had learned was a valuable tool to use when I felt it was needed.

The next situation was another fox set sitting in a harvested corn field with some still standing corn in an area that was somehow missed during the harvest. These types of locations provided interest for hunting fox so they always got a couple sets back in those days. Had one trap that was set off every few days and some bait pulled out of the hole and wasn't sure what was firing it.

I hadn't caught anything there for a while and it had been very wet and rainy during this time frame. I couldn't see the set from the road due to the standing corn which is why I chose the location. I didn't carry any equipment or dirt into the location for this check. Once again the trap was fired and the bait pulled out.

I did reset the trap back as best I could under the muddy conditions and it certainly wasn't what I would call a good finished set. With no dry dirt, only mud and clay chunks lying around I pondered what to cover the trap with. I looked around and found a few leaves blown in the area of the set and found some weedy grass growing sparsely close by and pulled it up for trap cover.

I torn the grass and leaves apart and blended the trap as best I could with the cover available. Not having high expectations for this set I returned the next day to find a grey fox jumping at that set. Who would have figured that would produce. A set made like a first time trapper had set it.

The trap was somewhat visible after my feeble attempt to cover it but it was left as good enough.

I will continue to catch animals with the equipment I have and make the adjustments as needed to continue to be successful.

Understanding animal behavior and using the many tools that we have will give us many options to match wits with the most seasoned animals out there.

Interesting information has been discussed and somewhat evaluated now it is up to each of us to decide how and if it will be utilized in a productive manner along the way.

Thank you for the book response Jonesie.
Maybe my wording is not correct but the cage trap should have a negative reading or a lower reading all the way through the trap No matter which end he enters.As the animal looks in the trap it should be the same all the way through as far as being below the induction of the earth where you’re at. Turning the trap around might help but Would depend on the ability of the predator.You need to have a low reading no matter which end you stick the magnetometer in the trap.
The reading of the induction being lower should extend from one end of the trap to the other, inside.

Jonesie
A spring would create high intensity but would not have the surface area of a trap to disrupt the Molecular structure around it. Increasing the smell.

Waded through most of this thread, and trying to get my head around this magnetic field. The thing that popped into my head.......is this similar to the magnetic field that is generated by things like underground utilities and such? Things that can be detected by "witching"? That also may seem like voodoo until you have done it and prove to yourself it works.

Are you saying these traps generate a similar field that the animals can detect just like a person using witching rods can?

Divinity rods I have used many times in years past to find well water, gas and water lines etc It does work so is it our bodies that cause the rods to work at detecting the fields or is it our bodies transcending the energy down into the rods creating the response?

I learned in years past to keep a couple pair of rods made from old bent coat hangers as my rods. They seem to be in my experience more consistent in their reading and they flow/rotate easily in my hands as they react to the magnetic fields as it is detected.

I also believe the metal of the coat hanger rods serves as a better conductor of the energy in a stronger manner for detection. Never used the wooden sticks much once I got good with the metal rods.

From what I have seen I'm certain that coyotes get location shy when they see another that's caught and are in distress.
I think you can place the exact same set some distance away and start making catches again. I think other animals react the same way.

I thought the same for many years. Then I tested as explained in the previous threads several times.

You’re right it does exist. It’s just another way to determine what you need to do and to eliminate more questions.

Jonesy,
You can't even possess footholds in NJ? So if you wanted to go out of state and use them you would have to store them across the state line? Yet you write about using DP's which also hold the foot. Those are some weird laws.

So drags and long chain? Would that increase magnetic field and disrupt potential catch?

I'm 15 sets into my testing of whether coyotes can detect a trap in front of a dirt hole so far and the reactions are VERY interesting. I'll share my findings after 30 sets. What I see goes in the face of some of my theories and some theories others have. I will say at this point it seems most likely the majority of the coyotes can detect a clean trap is in front of a hole. Actually has been the most interesting thing I've playing with coyotes. Remember theories are only theories until they are tested, unfortunately if theories get repeated enough people start thinking they are facts.

Food for thought
Witching water and pipelines works to differing degrees for some people. Ive seen it first myself. Some people the signal is real strong and the same pipeline can't be detected at all by another person using the same method.

About 4 years or so ago, we were trying to locate some water lines and electric lines at the place I had just moved to. Had sought to use the Dig Rite guys to locate them for me, but they only go to the meter. After that, they don't know or care. These lines were well downstream of the meters. So I mentioned to the contractor I had hired to do some digging that we could witch em, so we grabbed a pair of coat hangers and went to work. He was better at it than me.....that day.

Last year, I went at it again.......and was getting good results for all lines........except when I crossed my sewer line.......the wires suddenly went dead. Where not more than 10 min earlier I had been getting clear solid reactions, I got suddenly had nothing. Whisky-Tango-Foxtrot??? Next day.....was back to working again. Strange, strange, strange.

Still wondering if this reaction animals are having is like that? Or perhaps like one of the metal detectors? Or are animals sensitive enough for this to work like a Reed switch?

Whatever the case, I would think that at some point, unless there is a positive or negative reward........they would eventually learn to tune things out and ignore it. Otherwise, they would go nuts.......place across the road from me is a mine field of old metal hardware off farm equipment, gates, fence wire, etc.

Jonesie :Quote Every trap I have tested has had high readings, so in theory by flipping the trap around and the field is the issue, then the same behavior should be seen just on the other side. So I believe that on cage smart animals the field is not the issue. “

Jonesie,

Your test won’t be accurate. Got to have one with a low intensity and one with a high intensity. Several homemade traps, Thompson traps, duke traps, tru-catch are available that have a low intensity. I just don’t know what models they are.I’m not making traps now so I don’t have any to send you. I would think there would be several in the country or even near you in the store. You just have to test to find it.

I can not have in my possession or in the state any steel-jawed leghold type traps. nor can you drive through the state with them either. The DP trap is an encapsulating trap, not a steel-jawed leg hold. The DP trap has it's own BMP category that is how we were able to get them as one of our tools. the DP trap is not a foot trap it is a dog-proof trap. And yes all my foot traps are in PA. I am only 30 mins from the PA NJ line. It gets touchy for Newt Morgan and Myself at the school making sure no one brings foot traps

I can't use a snare above the water surface either, But we have the (original name in 1987) Non-Lethal Body Gripping Restraining Snare, now called NJ legal Cable restraint. LOL a deer stop 2 inch, swivel, and the only lock we can't use is a cam lock or kill springs. and we do not have a bad either nor do we want them LOL

My coon size traps are more or less neutral inside, higher at the pan. My squirrel size traps are higher in readings. But the squirrels do not seem to care, let's face it they run along the power lines LOL But I will say this. my female skunks with young can be a pain with small traps. If I switch to bigger traps they go in. Single skunks don't care LOL So I am getting ready to do some testing here soon on the family skunk jobs to see if it is behavior do to hormones and maternal instinct or the magnetic field.

Which brings me to a question for you. Is there a noticeable difference in your testing with the coyotes on male or female detecting the field from a trap as I believe you stated the hotter it is the more magnetic field present?

I wouldn’t know the difference between male and female ability to sense.
The hotter it is the higher the intensity difference. It’s like a battery in the winter time is slow to start your car. But when it gets above freezing much easier to start your car.The current is stronger in the warmer climate


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth%27s_magnetic_field

As long as the trap is at least 10 inches wide and at least 12 inches tall it’s not very difficult to make a trap with a reduced Field going through it. For some reason when you go narrower than 10 inches shorter than 12 inches is harder to get a trap To have a reduced field like you would like.

If memory serves from reading 15 pages, temperature makes a difference. So, if my canine traps are in 10-20-30-40 degree ground, it really shouldn’t make a difference what is magnetically high or low.

Maybe this is important for the nuisance/warm weather trappers, but for those who trap under cold climate conditions.... you get my point.

“Even if an animal cannot feel or see a high intensity magnetic field, where new devices are set and scent remained, The Magnetic Fields disruption of molecules will enhance the detection by smell. “ Quote from my book and spoke about on this thread. It doesn’t always stay below 40° or below really in this case 30 or 20°. When the device warms up if it has a high intensity field the disruption of molecules from a previous time will still increase the smell of the trap or detection of the Set device. When it cools down that scent Or enhanced smell is there.

Knowing what I discovered just increases the ability of the trapper to make the best choice. It will verify that he is making the best choice. It does not lie.

Define “warming”.

I’m talking about upper tier states where waxed dirt, packing in dry dirt and antifreeze is necessary to keep traps working a good portion of the season. Yes Sir is testing now, when soils are 50-60 degrees. If temperature of the soil is a variable, 20 or 30 degree F is a whole lot different than 50-60 degrees F.

Kirk, are there independent (e.g. university, USDA) studies that support your experience?

Even if your soil’s at 20° air temperature can be 50° or 60°. It may be only for a short period of time but during that time it will make a difference in the way the animals approach the snares, cage traps, and conibears exposed. To actually know you would have to pull out your magnetometer and test.

As far as the state or government agency doing a test, why didn’t they approach me when I was catching 1000 beavers a year , in about 100 days and did it for Years on end. By myself with no helpers with a 24 hour check in a warm climate. The only biologist that ever rode with me , and had any interest,was from another state. As far as the qualifications go I’ve never met another person That has had the experiences that I have had And could verify it.Experiences that would be best used in this case. It is written in the preface in my book and can be seen on Amazon.It may take some time to gain confidence but it will take place. It’s too important not to learn.
It is a discovery.

A retired physics teacher (and good trapper) suggested something that may prove or disprove your theory. He suggested witching old trap catch locations to see if there was a correlation between natural EMF and the catch. His suggestion was to use a pair of coat hangers over old trap locations. If there is a correlation, it might be a way of locating future trap sites.

I think yes sir will be able to tell us. All you have to do is measure the intensity of the trap and the animal will be digging where the intensity is the highest. If it is projected over the dog he’ll dig at the dog if it’s projected over the jaws he will dig at the radiating jaws.If he’s afraid of it he will stay away or back.
How the animal responds depends on how high the intensity is. And many other factors. The key is going to be doing the same thing in each location. That way you can tell the difference because the Magnetic field reading will stand out.
It is very admirable for yes sir to do so many sets. It makes it easier to prove or Confirm your results.The only other better way that I can see is to use half your traps with a high intensity reading and half the traps with a low intensity reading for a full season. You would hate one over the other by the end of the season

The whole premise for what we’ve been talking about is the reduction of positive ions dispersed from the trapping device. The more negative ions that are there such as in a cage trap the more relaxed better feeling the animal is. The easier it is to catch them. This is link to a number of technical description but it tells various stories, That explain how important negative ions are and how destructive positive ions are. That’s what the animals Are detecting,Positive ions they sense to be harmful or they feel to be harmful to them.

https://www.djclarke.co.uk/file06.html

I opened the link. Lots of references to people doing studies and I expected to find a list of reference credits at the end. What I found was advertising for ion generating air purifiers. Hmmm. Mr DeKalb you gotta do better than this.

I remember seeing ion exchange and electrostatic air purifiers in bars in the 1980s and 90s. They worked to take out the particulates in smoke. They seemed to work as long as people replaced the filters often enough. Most didn’t. The technology failed and people stopped using them.

I’m still not convinced.

How do you convince someone that believes witching rods made out of coat hangers work better than the magnetometer to measure the earths induction.

The studies and the test done that we’re posted are accurate. The product used the studies for promotion.Whether or not the product was good is it in very much question I agree. But the studies are accurate

Of all the websites this is the one that taught me the most. It should teach you if you read it and can understand it. But for someone that doesn’t understand it it’s like reading Chinese. I have posted it before. This is for you teacher.

http://www1.lsbu.ac.uk/water/magnetic_electric_effects.html

.

Speaking of witching. Can this magnetometer be used to locate a septic tank, underground lines?
I "think" you did say the meter can be had on a smart phone yes?

Sure beats reading what color to paint a trap.

Let’s assume that you can find a trap with witching rods and you have determined the intensity of the projection of the trap. How do you write it down. How do you compare it with Something that will work or something that will not work. What’s your unit of measure.
With a magnetometer you’ve got a reading that you can get for unit of measure. You have a basis to go on. If it rains if it’s cold it doesn’t matter the magnetometer will give you a reading. It doesn’t matter who uses it it will give you a reading. You can set the trap on the table and get a reading. You can set it on the ground and get a reading. You can write it down I can’t write down a reading from witching.

Well this magnetics is new to me, digging for septic is old.
I knew couple guys that could witch, not me.

I did better k9 trapping with compass points in mind nut always thought because prevailing winds.
Then paying attention to thermals agreed with that "theory".
But wind is not consistent and there was "something else".
Coal bank and I brain stormed this at a camp fire and we agreed confidence was it, as he alluded to.

I'm off this topic as it's not my "field" of experience.

Still trying to wrap my head around what is being proposed.......that traps are magnets.......and means to measure the magnetic force.......a magnetometer.

So I looked up "magnetometer" and came away with more questions than answers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetometer

Which of the various types of magnetometers are being suggested to be used? As in which product.......exactly. There seems to be many forms.

If a magnetometer is the tool to measure the strength of the magnetic force inherent in the magnet......the trap......how does the trap get magnetized in the first place?

To answer you the best way would be to repeat what’s already been said. If you will go back and read all of the post that I made pertaining to magnetic fields or radiation off of a trap or a trap device. You can find all of the post under users post on Trapperman.

Don’t think of magnets or magnetism you’ll get confused. All you are doing is measuring the intensity of the positive ions radiating off of the traps and devices. Negative ions will always give you a reduced field and the positive ions a more intense field.
Negative ions are good positive ions are not good at high levels or higher levels than the average induction of the earth

I saw where I did not respond to this.

Aluminum screen covers would make a tremendous difference. It would shield the field reducing the amount of intensity.I believe, especially on the type of traps you mentioned.

Craig uses steel screen.

Both aluminum and steel screen will Distort the field or rearrange the field. Aluminum is paramagnetic aluminum should have more of a shield, Depending on material and how it covered the pan,And area under the pan.