Before I test, I need input from experienced peopl

Here’s the deal. My partner and I have been discussing chunks of fish vs a grass wad covered in salmon oil in pockets/pipes/and fish sticks. There are enough people on Tman who have already done this experiment (I’d guess) to see some opinions, before splitting lines and experimenting.

Based on my experiences so far, grass with oil works. But I don’t want to do this exclusively if fish chunks or even a prepared bait works better.

Long liners like O’Hearn and Obermeier do a slap and go system with small amounts of prepared bait. Don Boldt used to do a chunk of carp, impaled on a stick, up under the grass along stream banks. In all cases, I suspect the coon were locating by sense of smell. Decent salmon oil smells good as does regular fish oil with a bit of shellfish added to it.

For those of you who have streamlined your systems of using bait/lures for say 100-200 wet sets, do you use bait, lure only, both, neither or something in-between. NOTE, I’ll also be using dogproofs. ‘Already have my bait for that.

How long are you running your lines? Seems like the guys running are letting the sets soak for a while. If you're turning sets over every few days then your bait volume gets staggering

Most of what I use now are dogproofs but we’re looking at extensive creek/river setting and that would facilitate pockets/pipes and footholds on drowners. I tend to let everything soak too.

For dogproof baits I use a banana based sweet bait or pelletized bait that’s been coated with Kaatz Smokin’ Aces or persimmon oil. My recent testing shows coon LOVE these flavors.

A lot of coons caught here on just a shot of fish oil mixed with shellfish oil in a pocket.

Would think you could hit a piece of sheep’s wool with it in a dp and do just as well as any prepared bait.

I'll run 100-200 pocket sets, all made basically the same, but I don't get too picky about it. Bait, no lure. I use some fish and some commercial bait, placed in the back of the pocket. If grass is handy I will grab a handful and wad it up over the bait. That's it. Keep it fast and simple.

Dont over think your sets KISS

Newt might have solved this issue but if you are betting a case of beer just run 50 one way and 50 the other. The animals are the experts in what they prefer. JMO anyway

I think either way is successful as the other. As long as there is scent to keep them attracted long enough to catch them

If your looking at using fish sticks the sheep's wool thing would be the way to go. Rough up your stick wind a bunch of sheep's wool around the end and then stick them In your bucket of bait/lure and let them soak. A lot quicker then winding grass around a chunk of fish. Pre made garb and go set ups.

I gave up on digging pockets along time ago. Know I just jam my tile spade In the bank give It a few pushes back and forth to open the slot drop In a part of a rat carcass or some other prepared bait stomp the slot shut and I'm on my way. It opens up a lot of opportunities where you can't dig a pocket. And It solves some of your high and low water situations.

See that's a problem with the way people think about the pocket set and others.

Listening to a podcast interview of a good coon trapper complaining that in in hot spots he might only be able to get one pocket dug and he'd wants to put several in. My thinking is one pocket, multiple traps. You can catch as many coon coming and going to the set than you would setting at the hole itself. Especially using drowners in tight spots.

At least in my area, my creeks and rivers have shelves they work so there's only one way to get to the set shy of rappelling gear

Why can't you set multiple traps using my method? There is still scent in the air that will attract them and will walk by the other traps too

Its not the method. Its the thought. People only seem to think of coons walking straight into the set from the front and that they have to get the animal working the set. The animal working the set is actually kind of a bad thing if you think about it if your trap is anywhere in that working area.

Fair point. I definitely see where your coming from and I do agree with you

These discussions are always fun to read. Different situations bring different approaches. Thanks everyone

A good prepared bait that is fish based and sticky and sweet with no off flavors so coons love to eat it all, will catch you a crapload of coons. You can spoon a little in a DP or smear it on nearly anything and set your footholds in front of it, PVC sets are great with it too. So fast to use you can really pile up the numbers of traps you have out. You're not going to pile up mink with it but you'll get incidental otters, beaver, even coyotes I have). If you haven't read Red Ohearn's book on coon trapping, you should.

http://thebeav.us/fall03/fall03.html#pvc
These PVC sets work great no digging and the white color gives you eye appeal.
And when your on location just about any type of fish bait or a good sweet bait will catch you some coon.

Those shelves and tight spots Snipper refers to are gold, a squirt of coon lure on a slicked up spot or PVC on the bank and blind sets the trails coming and going has killed a pile of coon for me.

A bottle of good sticky coon lure fits in your pocket, not so much with a pint of bait.

Just pre bait the pipes and your good to go.

Gang set guy here, and I make some sets in water and at least one or two up on bank like a dry dirt hole with bait or a 160 in bank trail. Hard freezes or rising water overnight put some of my creek and pond sets out of commission fast but I'm always happy I had dryland sets and blind sets at same locations if sign is there.
Even a cage hidden up on bank has been a lifesaver for me from no getting blanked and checking frozen in or flooded sets.

When Raccoon become worth $40.00 a piece again use both and the best.

I'm fond of the elbow PVC sets in water but a straight one shoved into the bank at a slight upwards angle works great too. Never liked dry land trapping coons in footholds until DPs came out, but no doubt they work.

This is my favorite picture of the elbow PVC set in action. There were 6 sets here, the two still standing didn't make a catch that night. We caught 15 the first 3 nights here before they slowed down but also ended up with a coyote in that set in the center of the creek and a large beaver in one along the edge here.

Awesome picture!!

I recall a similar location further down this creek where it got very rocky. We could only find a hole between a couple rocks to set 2 pipes so we smeared the same bait on rocks near the edge of the water, did just well in those smear sets. I'm sure the PVC could have aided them with the eye appeal nearby but a good smelling bait is nothing to turn your nose up at. pun intended!

Used to love pvc elbow sets, problem was they tended to end up missing in more public locations if you didn't paint em. Or coon would destroy or cause them to get lost.

I use the portable pockets now and I can stake to them.

That's why theirs lots of opinions. I never lost a pipe and never had one chewed up either, they were always laying on the bottom just outside the coon's reach. I never painted any either, but I olny used them back on private ground. In public locations the smear sets are great for concealing your set,,, up until you catch the coon.

So your baiting them and then putting the elbow In place?

I just scoop them into the container of bait like a spoon and poke them in the bottom of the creek, set the trap in place and turn the pipe towards the trap. Its as simple as that, no tricks or anything tough about it.

Teacher, given the two options you talk about, salmon oil on grass vs chunks of fish in a pocket, I would go with the chunks of fish. A chunk of bait in a pocket give you a lot of eye appeal for your target animal, more so than salmon oil on a grass wad.

If you really want to test things, take 20 locations. At each location put 1 grass stick set with salmon oil and one pocket set with carp. On half the locations put the salmon oil set on your left hand side as you face the bank, and put the pocket set on the right hand side. Reverse this on the other half of your locations. See how they perform.

For what its worth, you could dig pockets and just put a trap in front without any bait or lure and do fairly well, just the fresh digging has an appeal to mink, rats and coon. If you are using a tile spade, you should be able to make a pocket set in a matter of a few seconds. I'm not a fan of hiding the bait when making a water set, I want the target animal to be able to see it in the back of the pocket.

Spot on. I'll go so far as to add when you put your chunk of fish in the pocket give it a big squirt of salmon/fish oil in a rainbow over the pocket so it runs down and creates an "oil slick" on the water. IMO this draws coons and mink ,from down steam especially, to see where its coming from.