Powered Cage Traps——-

How many brands are there that produce beaver sized, powered cage traps? For beaver work, I would not consider a cage trap that isn’t powered. At least I don’t think I would. If there’s a design out there that isn’t powered but works very well for beavers, I’d certainly like to hear about it.

I just purchased my first cage traps. Comstock 12x18x39 beaver traps. To say I’m impressed with them would be an understatement. Very high quality. Can’t wait to put them to use. I’m new to cage traps, and I like the thought of not having to worry about if someone kicks it like I would with a 330.


But I’m still wondering....who else makes a powered beaver size cage trap? Anyone?

Kirk DeKalb has a very good beaver trap however I understand he is no longer producing his traps. I am with you, I rarely have used gravity doors in the last 28 years. They work but I have had my problems with them along the way. Spring powered is the best and only way to go once you have used several types you will develop an experienced bias as well.

Comstock does have a good powered beaver trap.

Dont know if the guy that Kirk licensed his traps to is making his beaver sized one or not. I would shudder at the price of it based on what he was wanting for the 12x12 coon trap at Escaba.

Would you consider suitcase type traps (Hancock or Koro) to be a "powered cage trap"?- https://www.wildlifecontrolsupplies.com/animal/NWSKT04.html

I had good luck using Hancock traps.I liked that they could be set almost anywhere. The Comstock beaver trap was a close second.

Yes but most people have an aversion to having to wear a hardhat or football helmet when trying to set them...

Kirk is on here- reach out to him. Super knowledgeable about beavers in general.

He sold his trap manufacturing to a Canadian company, Advanced Traps. About 10 yrs ago I paid $125 for a powered bobcat single door. More than triple that now. I would doubt they are selling as the are down to one design in 3 sizes now. www.advancedtrap.com

I have been running Tomahawk stuff for a few years and it is impressive. Same company makes Comstock cages too, in Wisconsin.

Have been fewer beaver calls this year so far after back to back best years in the past two, but still relying on swim through beaver cage traps for 95% of what we catch. The rest of the gear just fills in. Never would have believed cages would be a go to trap if someone had asked me years ago.

I have been testing traps and working with a manufacturer since October of last year. Covid has been a big factor in production of the new traps. The first model will be available next month. It can be ordered within 14 days. I first made the trap about five years ago. It’s probably one of the best and most effective traps I have ever used. It has a reduced magnetic field intensity going through the trap. The doors are extremely fast . It has caught many red fox, gray fox, beaver, otter, bobcat, Possum, raccoon, and other animals. I know of no other trap that has the ability to Catch that this trap Has. Easy to set and replace trigger wires if’s needed.It works equally as well on land as it does underwater Or in water, even floated.
The manufacture has been in business over 30 years and maintains normally a workforce of over 10 people. It has full manufacturing capabilities.
It will be competitively price.The prototypes that they made and we tested caught extremely well.
Airport trapper and warrior have traps very similar almost identical to it. It has a detachable Bait cage Option if you want to use it as a single door.

Bruce Vandervort has a collapsible. I haven’t talk to anyone that used one but he’s a very good trapper and he’s on this forum.

I have 6 comstocks, 2 advance, 2 hancock. In my opinion both Jim and Kirk have great designs unfortunately I was late to the game on power traps and could only get 2 of kirks. I love my Hancock's also because if you need to switch it up, I've found footholds, body grip, and cage traps people feel pretty comfortable messing with because all 3 are straight forward on how they work but Hancock's not so much. They can't figure out is a trap old piece of chainlink fence, some sort of pipe guard ect... my opinion keep with those 3 and you won't be disappointed.

Kirk,
Did these traps ever make it to market? I liked the traps you had when you had advanced trap. However, the guys you sold to have priced those out of the market.

Unless you're doing ADC work, all traps and cages are priced out of the market!

They make a business out of doing pleasure with you

Lots of beaver captured in the 16 by 16 have a (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) traps with no damage
Love Jimmy’s and kirks old designs

Should talk to MR. Bruce aka humptulips on here

I would like to know also.

I never sold my patents I had licensed them to two intities over the last 4 years. I stopped manufacturing in 2017. At that particular time I had developed some outstanding models. I didn’t realize to the extent as to how good they really were until I wrote my book. Doug Massey, Warrior, and Airport trapper I have some of my last models. Making my trips out of the country was a mistake but I couldn’t get out of it for almost 2 years. My last endeavor with Townson didn’t work out because of Covid restrictions to work force. In 2017 I could’ve sold over $500,000 worth of traps if I could’ve gotten them made. I presently am not manufacturing traps or another words are not being made. I have not found someone that can economically build them and manufacture them to the quality that they need to be built. I have Parkinson’s. I don’t have the drive that I did so I need to get someone to manufacture them and I don’t know whether that’s going to happen soon.

Frustrating. Most live traps you take gloves off and put glasses on to set. Kirks you take glasses off and put gloves on. They are in a class of their own. Amazing traps. Nothing like them

Aix - long time no see my friend.
For your conditions and volume stay with Jim Comstock’s cage traps.
They are durable and have the best triggers on the market.
best, Willy

Have you ever tried one of Kirk's?

No, I have not tried a trap that exists only in memories of the past or in collections.

I need a trap that is durable and has a great trigger so there are no misfires and no escapes.
That is why I use Comstock traps.
And in case you wonder - I get no free traps or discounts.

Kirk's traps do not exist only in memories or collections! Some of us own them and use them.

They are work horse traps, no misfires, no escapes and as durable as any trap on the market.

I do not have anything bad to say about Jim's traps either and own several of his too.

We have and use several of Kirk"s power door traps often. Really like his beaver trap. They all have performed very well for us and have held up to abuse as well.. We also have several of Jim"s traps also. Sure glad I bought my traps when Kirk was still making them himself. His triggering system took some time in its design.

Kirks are best I have. In a class of there own

I guess if I hadn't invited kirk to spend a few days at our home in Sept of 2007 after the New York State Trappers Convention and showed him the very first conibear style wire trigger, cage traps I had invented in 2003, you guys wouldn't have the traps you like, which was basically my first invention. I had a number of variations of what kirk made, that worked o.k., but saw a need for better. From there I knew I could improve on the trigger by utilizing the power in the first powered door traps, with powered lock bars to stabilize the trigger and at the same time get rid of all the unnecessary springs, clips etc. It took 3 months to engineer, but it worked. Simplicity as always proves best, fewer parts in a totally self contained unit. Glad so many guys like the powered door, wire trigger traps. For those in Canada, our beaver traps are certified.

So where can I buy a new, economical priced Kirk trap today???

Good morning sir, I was wondering what you’d been up to lately.

When I was in the market for a few powered cage traps, Comstock’s were what was available. I am very satisfied with the 12x18 beaver trap. It’s more versatile than I expected it to be. I really like the additional width. Right or wrong, I feel as though it creates a more inviting opening.

Aix, Glad to hear the beaver traps are working for you, as they work for us too. I'm not going to take credit for having thought everything out as to how well they would work, but was pleasantly surprise when they exceeded expectations. Never expected to be able to just throw them in and have them stay set and never even gave upside down setting a second thought until I was in the field trying them out. It just seemed "right." I make my living with them and have done so for 11 years since we made the first ones. These traps invited 3 more beaver into them today in our ADC work, for a total of 1,674 since October 29, 2010. I've always been a numbers guy, records. Tomorrow we will hit 800 beaver for the past 4 years. This year we have caught 93% in cages. A couple of years ago we were at 97% for the year. Seems to be no shortage of beaver this year either.

Jim, why don't you make the trigger with less travel?

Yea...

No, I have never tried a Kirk trap.
The praise here sounds good.
If available would give them a very brief look.

The trigger travel is subject to whatever the user wants to make it on the 9x11 and 12x12 traps. I have left the travel longer on the beaver traps purposely so that the beaver or otter are more deeply into the trap when it fires, pretty much centered when the trap goes off, which has worked very well. Got 5 more today, 10 in the past 3 days, pairs at 3 colonies all cleaned. You can make the the trigger travel almost zero on the 9x11 and 12x12 traps buy using a small grinder to take down the short tab on top of the swing bar to where ever you want it to be. You could reduce the travel to little more than a bump. The factory traps start with a few inches of travel, but can be altered. They can be made shorter after the fact, but not longer of course. I guess some might be worried that an animal might get by a trigger without firing it. If set on the ground, because the triggers are essentially a door on a hinge with the ends of the wire rotating in an arc, I have put sticks down through the cage on either side of where the wires swing in the arc to keep animals from bypassing. Good with baby animals. The newest trigger wires are made to fall off after a catch is made so that the are less apt to get bent, then just popped back on. If they are bent they can easily be straightened outside of the cage before attaching. There are no points to stick an animal.

The last thing I want to do is have to grind the trigger on a brand new trap althoughthat's exactlywhatwehad to do to make it function the way it should. The 12x12 comes with enough slack that otter can get through without setting the trap off. That's a pretty big problem with the otter bringing $300 on the live market. I have yet to talk with anyone who uses them who wants that much travel.

To make a trap function "they way it should," is subjective. There are tradeoffs no matter what you do. You know every trapper has is own way of doing things, likes and dislikes, preferences and ways he will modify virtually every trap made, to suit his own specific situation. My best example of personal preference had to do with something as simple as handles on a cage trap, two. In less than an hour two trappers called. One said, "oh I love the two handles." A few minutes later a second caller said, "I like the traps but I don't like the two handles." I rest my case. Because many trappers use the 12x12 for beaver, the extra travel is a plus. I have caught 61 pounders in them and heard of them up to 63 pounds in the small traps. They barely fit. Charlie Dobbins was one of best at it, someone I admired. He shared a lot of great ideas in his writings and books. I sought him out at every convention to see what new idea he came up with and how he made traps work all the better. In the 70's when I trapped with Thorpe I added springs to the Blake and Lamb #1 single long spring double jaw traps before anyone made them, 120 actually, and they worked very well, the first double jay, double #1's ever made. I still have some. When I trapped bobcats in California for 8 years I pulled the jaws out of my 1 3/4 Northwoods, reversed them and popped them back in to create the first offset jawed Northwoods traps ever made, superior because it was only a slight offset with round edges that other traps did not have. I could hold a cat by the tip of one toe without injury and lost but 3 catches in over 1100. I drilled and swiveled the base plates for a center fire trap and added swivels to many dozens of them. I added springs to the weak side on some, put heavier springs on others, left many as is. I replaced the steel pan bolts, drilled over sized holes, added stainless bolts with washers. I put large links on the ends of the short trap chain to accommodate 2 opposite facing dog swivels for quick connects to 10 foot grapples. I beefed up the dogs on my 7.5 CDR traps because they needed the strength to hold up. I cut the levers down on my Victor #3 coil spring traps and rewelded them shorter to pick up less dirt and fire quicker, added base plates too. I built my own 660's from Belisles, made my own 660 self supporting conibears, made stretch conibear traps from 160's 220's and 280's. I took a lot of pride and satisfaction in what I did as Charlie did and never complained to anyone that out of the box traps weren't exactly what I wanted. I guess over the years I have modified just about every trap I have ever set in one way or other to make it my trap for my own situation. Another way to have approached this might have been to say, "the traps are really solid, well made, with fast closing doors. The trigger travel was a bit longer than I wanted so I took a minute and made the simple adjustment to make them work for my situation."

No. When someone claims to build the "best cage trap ever made ". It should actually be the best. Maybe the design has changed in the last few years but the one I ran for otter was definitely not well designed. Had to add a rod to keep the springs on the doors from breaking the cage wire. The doors have decent speed but are not the fastest on the market.

Sure they are great for beaver. But a $200 cage should be able to catch more than beaver well.

Don't get me wrong, I have a few issues with Kirk's as well.

The 12x12 traps were first built for raccoons as we already had a great beaver/otter trap in the 12x18x39. The 12x12 has been used successfully for badgers, armadillos, 'possum, porcupines, otter and beaver, even catching fox and bobcat, with the single door traps a great fisher trap. In the single door traps used for fisher, videos have shown the factory trigger travel works as it should, no misses. I have stayed with the larger 12x18x39 cage traps for both beaver and otter in my nuisance work as I like the wide opening, which is more like a 660 in width. Besides all the beaver, we have taken quite a number of live otter in them in dry sets on land and of course in incidental beaver sets under water. Since otters travel together in groups a lot of the time and stay very close together, it is quite common to double in them in the wide 12x18 traps. Besides the many doubles, I have heard of one triple in them, all pups and one trapper who caught 5 large male otter on the Washington coast under a house in a dry land set. As surprised as anyone, Marci said they were all 20 pound males. Washington is loaded with otter. Jonathan Munsterman had a great video of 6 otter coming out single file from under a house. In the East we have skunks and woodchucks under houses. Washington has otters.

I'm so glad Charlie Dobbins made us realize there was a lot more that could be done with most any out of the box trap. Many of us had never understood what could be accomplished with some cutting, welding, grinding. After reading his books I couldn't wait to start tearing traps apart and rebuilding them with confidence. If someone feels there is a necessity for a faster cage trap, springs can be added to the lock bar or our traps quite easily by making one cut in the lock bar spring rod and slipping one or more springs onto the bar, then welding the cut, all of which takes little more than a minute. But, there is strong, stronger and sometimes way too strong. I remember pushing the limits beyond what was practical with footholds. I took a Northwoods 1 3/4 and made it into a four coiled trap, with 4 large springs. I put it together, set it, placed it on the bench and stepped back, only to watch the trap base buckle and bend while the trap folded under the additional spring tension. Also, though not everything can be altered when constructing new traps, some things can be changed. If a trap with a short travel is required it could be custom made at the factory very easily by simply putting a shorter rod on top of the swing bar.

You, my friend, are missing my point.

I know we can't make everyone happy, but our goal has always been to do the best we can, listen to everyone about everything and make adjustments when necessary. What we really appreciate is when so many trappers who have any kind of issue have the respect for us to contact us privately about their concerns so that we can work together to make changes and improvements. Its' only after you get into inventing, manufacturing and working with all the factions from suppliers to trappers that you realize what a challenge all this is. Though there is an occasional nay sayer, there are more positive testimonials than we can count.

So what improvements have you made to the traps from customer opinions?

Trappers wanted more and better options with the trigger wires. We heard it regularly, so we came up with two new trigger wires for the 9x11 because wires sometimes broke and wires got bent after catches were made and had to be straightened inside the cage. The first new trigger wire was a clip on trigger that can be attached in seconds at any position on the swing bar. It is made to fall off after a catch is made. These are a plus because a trapper can use as many or few as he likes and position them anywhere he wants on the swing bar. Wires can get bent a bit, but after falling off they can be straightened outside of the trap and replaced. Second we made a pop on trigger from stainless spring steel with coils on each end to go onto posts on the swing bar. The ends pop on in seconds. These wires are also made to fall off after a catch is made for less damage to the wires. Two come on the swing bar, but with some animals only one is needed, like an adult woodchuck or armadillo for instance. There are 4 posts on the swing bar so that the wires overlap at center. With the new designs there are no points to potentially poke an animal, so the new triggers satisfied several issues.

With all internal trigger components these are the only traps that have the ability to set and function in any position without worry, like upside down or sideways, even vertically, but with that many new things were learned from something that had never been done before. When these traps are set with the doors closing from the side the triggers can be made to hang from the top and also come up from the bottom. All options are open. When the wires come up from the bottom it forces animals into them better, impossible to avoid. When using the beaver traps upside down the wires come up from the bottom in the same way. My friend Tim in Ohio has set our traps with the triggers coming up from the bottom and found that coon more or less left them alone and did not bend them like they did when hanging from the top or coming from the side. The just walked on them. But, from trappers we have learned that there is a vast difference in animals from one section of the country to another in how they react to all sorts of things.

I can tell you when anyone shares their experiences with us about something unexpected that happened, we were on it. Raccoons have absolutely been the worst. We used 1x1 mesh on early traps, including doors. After a year we heard that coon could actually reach through the mesh to pull on the lock bar. A trapper told me on the phone, "all you have to do is put 1/2x1 on the door to stop it." We did it, changed the next day. Because of the versatility of traps and guys setting them upside down etc. we learned things that never would have ever been an issue with standard traps set only right side up. The new setting possibilities opened up new challenges never anticipated. The gap at the top of the door was about an inch on the 9x11. It took 10 years before we heard of a coon again reaching through the opening when the traps were set upside down because a coon could lay on his belly and now reach under the top of the door that would never happen when set normally right side up. Set upside down changed the game. I was on the phone to manufacture in minutes and the gap was closed in hours.

I know from 55 years experience, if something happens once to one trapper, though not always, it will likely happen again, so changes to existing equipment are never avoided, but embraced. We want to hear about whatever needs attention. The challenge in creating is engineering simple, small, practical, solid, unbreakable and escape proof to name a few, lots to think about. It's not always one size fits all as changes are sometimes merely trade-offs, good for one and not for the other.

In my opinion the internet creates too easy access and and too many opportunities to criticize a person or manufacturer.

Definitely is the case. We don't deal with personalities, just mechanical issues, function etc. I guess all you have to do is put yourself in the place of someone producing any product to realize that the last thing they want or intend is to make something that doesn't work or has problems. Every time the product gets shipped a manufacturer's reputation goes on the line. The only time I even consider going public with a purchase I have made is when issues are met with hostility. You have to understand that it's not always the guy making a product that is the problem. We took back a couple of squirrel cage traps from a trapper who swore up and down that the traps had no triggers. He said, "I've been trapping for 45 years and your traps have no triggers." We said O.K. and apologized. He sent them back. Guess what, the traps had triggers and worked fine. We try to be objective and give the benefit of the doubt to the trapper first when we get questions. Most often questions are just a case of slowly working through the perceived issue to come to a positive resolution.

Myself and several others at different conventions have mentioned these issues to Jim in person.

Even at the NTA this year.

I also talked with Kirk Dekalb about the issues with his traps a few years ago.

Only one of those two actually wanted to discuss the issue.

Airport

One sided conversation with a narrow minded wall. You are not being listened to. You are just being told what you are missing for using a Dekalb trap

As an aside. I went to thrift store and bought a bunch of spoons. Bit of bending and I have a top mount bait holder for a baited cage

A good source for info on cage traps is Ronnie Vincent.

Because he exclusively uses yours....

Not sure about that, but he is the only one I know of who has had quite extensive experience with both traps and made the decision to liquidate his advanced traps and replace them with ours as you baited me in to say.

I can name others who done the opposite... 2 are on Tman..

We have been involved in different positive trapping projects with researchers as well as with hundreds of trappers over the past 11 years that sometimes events are momentarily forgotten. I just now remembered that several years ago an Illinois student did an otter study for 3 years using primarily our 12x12x36 traps with a few of our 12x18x39 traps in which he published his findings. While the program was a great success, trapping and tagging dozens of otter and catching more than 80 incidental beaver, most important he had no issues with the traps. He was very pleased with the results and never had any complaints, which of course was our biggest concern. The results spoke for themselves. He even caught several otter more than once. This line of traps has been used with great success for fisher and otter study as well as nutria control work. Most recently we made some heavy duty transport boxes for a beaver re-introduction project.

He had great success compared to what other cages? That's the key. Like I have said before, they're not bad traps, but there are traps that catch better.

How does he know he didn't miss any otter?

Jim - you are a good man.
Nobody wastes that much of my time without paying in cash in advance.

Why is the wire put on cage so there is a bump every inch on the lockbar? The lock bar hangs up if stopped part way thru cycle. Ideally there should be a pair of stainless runners for lock bar to slide on.

It is made that way so it locks as it goes down. Animal can’t back out. Com stock promote setting his trap upside down. This makes it more difficult for the animal to push the door open and back out. The dekalb traps prevent back outs in a normal set

Never had problems with your traps Kirk. But other traps the door hangs up if door hits him halfway down and doesn’t close. So the coon turns around and pushes out. So if I guess I can try and increase lock bar tension. And this was on a long trap. Guess using Pam would help

I'm just trying to have a discussion

It seems like what Jim is trying to say is that it is easier to make the bar shorter on top of the swing bar than it is to make it longer.

Some people like it the way it is. Some people would rather it be modified to be shorter. Easier to grind some off than weld a longer tab on.

Perhaps they could be special ordered with short tabs and both parties would be happy. Just a thought lol.

There’s a whole archive about modifying traps. Trappers love modifying traps to suit them even if that trap wouldve worked out of the box.

Airport - you may claim that you are “just trying to have a discussion”. However that is a very sanitized misrepresentation of your bickering, badgering, challenging, disagreeing, questioning, provoking, time-wasting and insulting commentary about Jim Comstock’s traps.

Why do you not have your own trap design and manufacturing facility?
Why are you not nationally known for designing and manufacturing high quality animal traps?
Why are you not in direct competition with Jim Comstock selling your ideally and perfectly designed traps?
Why don’t you make a massive cash offer to buy out Jim Comstock’s business so you can correct the flaws and defects?

It is probably best if we all formulate our own answers to these questions.

Why would I? There are already better traps out there.

My point was he claims to have designed the best , however it is just not so. I never said they're not good traps. They're towards the top.

Are you aware of the definition of a discussion? It includes to debate.

And when you replace trigger wire do not make a loop. You can end up "snareing" in a live trap. The wires can have no loops.

It has been pointed out that though looped trigger wires on some wire trigger traps, other than ours, may be problematic, when designed properly looped trigger wires will work just fine. We have two types of looped trigger wires that work great on our 9x11 traps and one type for the 12x12 traps with no points and no way for an animal to become ensnared because the wires simply detach from the trigger bar and drop to the bottom of cage once the catch is made. Captured animals generally do not bend or break the wires once they have popped off, though nothing is 100%. Just has to do with the personality of the individual animal captured and or the section of the country. Once the wires have detached, if bent, they can be easily bent back into shape outside of the trap and quickly reattached. This helps a lot when dealing with tough animal like raccoons, fisher, badger and armadillos that can be really rough on fixed trigger wires.

I have tried most traps for trapping beavers over the past 40 years of ADC work here in Illinois with no question the Comstock beaver traps are getting me more work and therefore more beaver in my ADC business. People like the idea I am using a cage trap in an urban area.

In my arsenal of Comstock traps there are different trigger wire systems. Not one is capable of inadvertently snaring an animal. It appears not possible even if the user intentionally tried to create that result. The above contention appears to be typical misinformation or disinformation typical of current fake news reporters.

I would not want to run my business without my Comstock traps.

Sometime over the next 60 days I will do a video showing the distinct differences of a trap using a support mechanism versus a swing bar for trigger.I will show advantages and disadvantages of both. Changing the trigger on a trap with a support mechanism can be done in less than two minutes and 30 seconds. The type of trigger that it supports is far superior to any other trigger system wire trigger system. It can be used as a pan it can be used as a wire trigger bite and pull trigger a one-way trigger and a multitude of other designs and configurations..
For someone to Say any differently just doesn’t know he’s limited on what he does know or was trying to push A product that has an inferior trigger system.