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Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: rex123] #8137601
05/11/24 03:30 PM
05/11/24 03:30 PM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 74
Texas USA
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IWM Offline
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Posts: 74
Texas USA
Quote
If you willfully and knowingly violate the laws of man (specifically game and fish law) are you committing a sin in the eyes of God?


Sticking to the original post:

The "eyes of GOD" are probably focused on much bigger things like how you take care of your family, treat fellow man, and worship HIM. I seriously doubt that GOD even glances at whether your bass met the legal slot limit or not.

I'm sure there are enforcement agents that justify their duty by labeling game violations as "sins", but truth is Fish & Wildlife laws are made by man, for man...with many ulterior/political motives behind their inception.

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8137615
05/11/24 04:22 PM
05/11/24 04:22 PM
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 168
Wisconsin
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Oakey Offline
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Wisconsin
Originally Posted by HobbieTrapper
What happens when predators deplete their resources?

They starve to death. I listened to a wildlife biologist that said wolves are sanitizers. They kill everything until nothing is left then move on or starve. This cycle has happened over and over when man dosnt control wolves.

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8137616
05/11/24 04:29 PM
05/11/24 04:29 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,148
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
"Chippendale Trapper"
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Eastern Shore of Maryland
A couple questions.

Have wolves always done that?

Before wildlife management “saved them”?


-Goofy-
Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: HobbieTrapper] #8137662
05/11/24 06:02 PM
05/11/24 06:02 PM
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 168
Wisconsin
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Oakey Offline
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Wisconsin
Yes. The balance of nature is a lie except when man properly manages it. Left alone it’s a teeter totter effect. Over population leads to disease then crash. In the case of uncontrolled wolves big game is wiped out One only has to look at Idaho up north at the decline in elk. Read the book the Alaska wolf man Jack Glazer. Fantastic read , his life in Alaska starting In 1955.

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8137673
05/11/24 06:32 PM
05/11/24 06:32 PM
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 346
Mo
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Trapper5123 Offline
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Mo
Well if I'm poaching I'm not out fornicating but poaching goes hand in hand with drinking, swearing, and degrading behavior which will eventually lead me to honky tonks and fornicating. I'll draw up a chart.

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Oakey] #8137755
05/11/24 08:45 PM
05/11/24 08:45 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,148
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,148
Eastern Shore of Maryland
Originally Posted by Oakey
Yes. The balance of nature is a lie except when man properly manages it. Left alone it’s a teeter totter effect. Over population leads to disease then crash. In the case of uncontrolled wolves big game is wiped out One only has to look at Idaho up north at the decline in elk. Read the book the Alaska wolf man Jack Glazer. Fantastic read , his life in Alaska starting In 1955.


So God didn’t know that would happen when He was creating?


-Goofy-
Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8137766
05/11/24 09:02 PM
05/11/24 09:02 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 7,648
western mn
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bucksnbears Offline
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western mn
Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
Originally Posted by bucksnbears
No, I see it as your trying to open up a subject to introduce a weird debate and and your falling short.

God says I can kill that coon. Man's law says I can't.

In the above scenario, what would YOU DO?



easy question SW.
wink

I'd let the coon walk B&B, because I'm a law abiding man


And a HECK of a one at that.!

God's gonna have special spot for you for sure.

Sorry SW, I ain't buying it wink.
Would you (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) a friend/ family member if they shot the coon?

I have many die hard Christian friend and I guarantee you, law of not, they would kill that coon without quilt.

Remember, the Bible says they can. smile

But, if it helps you sleep at night with a clear conscience, rock on.


swampgas chili and schmidt beer makes for a deadly combo

You have to remember that 1 out of 3 Democratic Voters is just as dumb as the other two.
Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Trapper5123] #8137776
05/11/24 09:20 PM
05/11/24 09:20 PM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 10,917
Iowa
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trapdog1 Offline
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Iowa
Originally Posted by Trapper5123
Well if I'm poaching I'm not out fornicating but poaching goes hand in hand with drinking, swearing, and degrading behavior which will eventually lead me to honky tonks and fornicating. I'll draw up a chart.

I want to hang with you on a Saturday night.

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8137805
05/11/24 10:05 PM
05/11/24 10:05 PM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 16,853
Oakland, MS
yotetrapper30 Offline
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Oakland, MS
Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
Originally Posted by yotetrapper30
No I think I understand. I'll shoot 8 squirrels when the limit is 6 every time I go hunting with zero fear of God's punishment because I know I'll only be hunting X many days a season. I could care less if I break man's law by doing that and I know God won't care that I broke it either.

Your original post said specifically in relation to game laws but anyone that's replied to you in terms of game laws you've poo poo'd saying they don't understand.

So maybe we'd understand you better if you stated what you really wanted to know?

I'll follow game laws that make sense and disregard those that don't.... and sleep just fine without any concern whatsoever for my immortal soul.

What you stated here directly conflicts Romans 13:1-2 does it not?


I don't know, Swamp, as I don't quite understand that verse.

Here's a scenario more grave than the speed limit or squirrel limit. It's 30 years from now. You're a young cop working for the FBI. A radical Muslim gets elected as President of the United States. Both branches of congress are heavily liberal and conservatives have become a small minority. The Catholic church has been in the news on daily basis for two reasons... 1) they've recently uncovered a string of molestions committed against minors by several Catholic priests, and 2) the Catholic church has been voicing strong opposition to homosexuality. Public sentiment is extremely anti-Catholic, with even all other denominations speaking out against them. The President, with support of Congress, announces that Catholics can no longer be allowed to live in America, and that they have one month to leave the country, or they will be executed. Many Catholics of course flee, but some refuse to. The month is up and you've been tasked with tracking down the remaining Catholics and transporting them to a facility where they will be executed.

Are you going to follow man's law?


~~Proud Ultra MAGA~~
Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8137841
05/11/24 11:03 PM
05/11/24 11:03 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,875
KY.usa
rex123 Offline
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KY.usa
If wolves wipe out all the big game as you say why was there big game and wolves all over the Us when white men came to the Americas?

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8137849
05/11/24 11:39 PM
05/11/24 11:39 PM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,016
South Dakota
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Rat Masterson Offline
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South Dakota
I thought speed limit signs were suggestions, my bad.

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: rex123] #8137862
05/12/24 12:32 AM
05/12/24 12:32 AM
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 168
Wisconsin
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Oakey Offline
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Wisconsin
Originally Posted by rex123
If wolves wipe out all the big game as you say why was there big game and wolves all over the Us when white men came to the Americas?

There has always been the teeter totter effect in nature. We’ve seen it with mass die off of coyotes and fox from mange. After the fur market crash the red fox exploded in population in Minnesota and North Dakota. There were as many as 35 fox per square mile in the red River valley. Mange hit hard and wiped them out. I went from seeing fox all day long to seeing 2 in 3 hard days of hunting. The elk population of Yellowstone was around 20,000 before wolves now down to around 4,000 and wolves are hunted and trapped outside the park. Imagine if there were no management of wolves. Northern Idaho has 4 bounty areas with highest $2,000 a wolf Why? Because elk and deer have been decimated. Imagine if they wernt being managed. My deer hunting is all but gone here in northern Wisconsin. 15 years ago for the first time since bow hunting began you could no longer shoot a doe with bow and that remains to this day. And the wolf is only reason. I won’t shoot yearling bucks so I’m done deer hunting. I feed deer and every year after deer season there isn’t a single little buck left. I fed my family deer all my life and that’s over and the wolf is the only reason. You are lucky to get a deer here now and it’s getting worse. Minnesota north of here is turning into a literal deer desert because of the wolf. I can’t believe how little many trappers know about the teeter totter effect in nature. Modern game management has been a huge success but with low fur prices mass die offs from disease are now common cycles. Idaho has between 1,300 -1,500 wolves wildlife biologists have stated that eastern Oregon eastern Washington all of Montana Wyoming and Idaho can sustain 1,500 wolves without negative impacts on game yet Idaho has almost that many alone which is why the $2,000 bounty. 44,000 people bought wolf licenses in Idaho last year but were only able to kill 400 some wolves. It took years of year round bounties and poisoning to get rid of wolves in the past. The day is coming when people will say what idiots thought bringing wolves back was a good idea. I’ve been a taxidermist here for 40 years it what was once deer paradise. I mounted and average of 65 huge bucks a year but now almost none come from my county. They come from other states or southern Wisconsin. Our white tail life style is all but gone here. Pursuing big bucks is now a depressing labor and I finally quit. I’ll spend my time killing canines now. At 69 I’ll never see our hunting back. The wolves are still on endangered list and the states new wolf plan calls for a minimum of 1,000 wolves. When you add the under 2 year olds we have 3,000 plus now. The DNR purposely uses a way conservative number. We’re flat out screwed and it’s only getting worse.

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8137894
05/12/24 06:22 AM
05/12/24 06:22 AM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 29,148
Eastern Shore of Maryland
HobbieTrapper Offline
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Joined: Dec 2008
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Eastern Shore of Maryland
I see. You had me confused there for a bit. You actually don’t want government management, you want the freedom to harvest. I can get in that camp.


-Goofy-
Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8137967
05/12/24 09:04 AM
05/12/24 09:04 AM
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Posts: 3,211
Wy
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[Linked Image]
This is from 1 Timothy Ch 1
This is of course speaking of God's law.
If you read Roman's 13 in context with Ch 12 and 14 . I think you will see this is speaking of the church.
And the government with in the body of christ. When it comes to man's law. This is where a contradiction comes in.
It was man's miss interpretation of God's law that put our Lord on the cross .
God knows our hearts.

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8138056
05/12/24 02:22 PM
05/12/24 02:22 PM
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Posts: 760
Georgia
sportsman94 Offline
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Georgia
I tried to respond to this once, but don’t think it came through. I think it ultimately comes down to the heart of the individual breaking the law. Only God knows their heart so as far as I’m concerned it’s not much of my business unless it directly affects me. I have a buddy who went through his younger years avoiding pretty much all of the temptations that affect high percentages of young men. I hear him talk negatively about people who didn’t avoid or overcome the temptations, and then proceed to watch him break game laws left and right with no regard. I always see it as being a bit hypocritical. I think when we invite Jesus into our life he begins to renew all things. Anything we can’t let go of is an idol or a stronghold for Satan.

As for breaking of laws or following them, I generally look at the intent of the law and try to follow it based on that (knowing full well that law enforcement has to provide laws for the masses to protect from the abuses of few). Take a speeding example. The purpose is safety. If I go 5 over or 9 over can I do it safely? On most roads I absolutely can. In a road where pedestrian traffic is higher I’m more likely to go the speed limit out of concern for my fellow man.

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8138062
05/12/24 02:49 PM
05/12/24 02:49 PM
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,808
Southern Illinois
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Foxpaw Offline
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Southern Illinois

Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
Originally Posted by bucksnbears
No, I see it as your trying to open up a subject to introduce a weird debate and and your falling short.

God says I can kill that coon. Man's law says I can't.

In the above scenario, what would YOU DO?

easy question SW.
wink

I'd let the coon walk B&B, because I'm a law abiding man....but you already knew that...




Sadly I think our society has been gaslighted, brainwashed or whatever name one wishes to call it into thinking the predator should have free range with the law protecting them and if we will only put our kids in a pen they will be safe from the predators.

I can tell you right now if a coon comes to my wife's chicken house and has a free lunch, 2nd's will most assuredly be more costly !

Re: The Laws of Man? [Re: Foxpaw] #8138080
05/12/24 04:02 PM
05/12/24 04:02 PM
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 168
Wisconsin
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Wisconsin
France has the highest number of documented humane fatality to wolves 7,000 documented over a 5-6 hundred year period. I looked this up after hearing a wildlife biologist say humane wolf kills were common in Europe because the kings and lords owned all the land and hunting wasn’t allowed and wolves had little fear of people. . If people wernt killing wolves here the same would be true. We’ve had several close calls here and had some been unarmed like the guy in Adams county Wi. Whose story made bugle magazine and outdoors news they would have been dead. Poaching deer is a bad thing If everyone did it there would be no deer. Killing wolves is a good thing and everyone did it and killed them all in Minnesota and Wisconsin it would be good thing.

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