Wink, regarding your fourth point: you, personally, might not be able to influence populations by relocating, but sometimes taking a species across natural barriers (water, mountain ranges) can have hugely disruptive effects to the new environment. This has happened countless times in the last couple of centuries; sometimes it's done intentionally, sometimes not. South Florida is an ecological nightmare because of introduced species.
Justin, as regards misleading clients as to the disposition of catches, that is absolutely indefensible. A professional will do the right thing, and be able to explain to his customer valid, scientific resons for doing so.

Justin you said something that is so true nobody can argue with it.

"If you look there is a ton of junk policy"

Everything else is fair game. lol


I don't think as many animals die off as what people think. Skunks wander naturally so if you take a "healthy" skunk out of a scrap yard (like we did today) and move him to a 250 acre horse farm (like we did today) he or she (I didn't check) is going to wander and find a new den before this evening. Tonight it will move on again until it finds a place it wants to call home until it decides to move again. The same can't be said for a squirrel.

I think relocating squirrels this time of year is tricky. If you don't take them somewhere with ample food supply they will die, no question about it. I try to take them somewhere I know they will find food. Usually close to a farm with still standing corn (we have a lot of those around here).

Raccoons on the other hand are smart, hardy, and I think they can do pretty well regardless of time of year. I know that if they are smart enough to find the void in the concrete under a front porch and chew through the foundation into a pantry they are probably smart enough to find a good place to stay when I let them go. But again I have no evidence to back anything up so it is just what I think.

Even though I trap, hunt, and fish I also enjoy wildlife in general and if I don't have to kill it, I don't want to kill it. I remember getting a chipmunk job last January. The little guy was throwing rocks into the ladies sub-pump and she wanted him relocated. I only knew one place that he might stand a chance. It was a farm I fur trap (when I find time). He always has corn all over the ground but he also has a bunch of barn cats. I figured his odds were 50/50. I much rather see him with a 50% chance of making it than me just killing him. Maybe I am becoming soft.

I agree with you Dave, that a pro will do the right thing and explain it, however we've all heard folks (can't quantify their levels just by a posting) that have stated sure I tell them I relocate it (and then dispatch). I do think some folks believe it is okay if "no one gets hurt" kind of sentiment. Or "what they don't know won't hurt them."

Unfortunately or fortunately I know I could search this topic of "relocation" in the archives and I bet can dredge up some stuff that most of us would rather not have been stated.

S. Florida is an excellent example of a landscape and ecology under attack. Exotic pet trade and a ton of other sources of introduction and oh boy, what a place to work! I would think there are many folks thinking about trying their hand there? Robb, do you guys see an influx since all the python and other critters have been more publicized? More shingles out?

Lol!

While most folks aren't cuddly with rattlesnakes, I've got a soft spot for them and they cannot
be left on the job site where you were called, folks will kill them if left to it. So what to do?
The only limited papers show they will die if too far from a den site. I have requests in with
every professor and govt. univ. person here in my area, looking for folks to collaborate with.
I'd like to know I can move them and have them survive as they are incredibly important to
our southwestern ecology, but I have nothing to base my current actions on.

So there, I've just invalidated my whole argument by saying that what I won't do with the
furry critters, I will do to help the rattlesnakes.

Go figure!

We get our fair share of Yankee experts who swear they can do it bigger and better then everybody else every now and then. lol

While I whole heartedly agree with Justin, sorry Paul, what I truly despise is the operators who plaster RELOCATION ONLY or NO KILL in their marketing. It is a despicable almost accusatory slap against those of us like myself an Justin who know the errant consequences of failing to euthanize our captures. I lump them in with the idiot customers they are seeking to attract and the rest of the antis.
Note this doesn't apply to those like Winkie or Nate (I assume) who have the option and choose to the best of their ability the right course of action.
I will not pander to the idiots among us or let the customer dictate to me how I do my job. They have a problem and I solve it in full accordance with the laws of the State of Georgia and that's all they need to know. If they ask they get the pure unadulterated truth.

Guilty as charged myself. No snake in my possession is euthanized, ever.

In TN it's illegal to release animals in parks, etc, so we have bought properties over the years specifically for relocation of certain species. We don't charge extra as it's built into our cost structure.

I have released squirrels, snakes including rattlesnakes, raccoons, all species we are allowed or required to release. Of course all coyotes, skunks, beaver are put down for various reasons.

We've also dug ponds on these properties for a water source.

I have enjoyed seeing the increase of squirrel nests in the trees where there were none previously.
It's also a selling point for our company to be able to say honestly that we relocate most of our species to our own property.

Besides that I like "developing" properties and playing in the dirt with my tractor!

Hey Justin, if you think you're conflicted you ain't the only one. Until I got into this business, EVERYTHING was dead. And now I kill very few. It's like the old me arguing with the young me on most of these relocation questions.

Dave, don't worry about introducing new species. This ain't Florida. If you ain't strong enough to make it on your own, then you ain't going to make it. ( It's called survival of the fittest and it works the same for relocated animals. ) We have no mountains and there are no natural boundaries except the great lakes. And as often as I wanted to dump stuff in Krier's lap in Michigan, the trip was just never worth it.

P.S. John, now I'm jealous. I'm sure I could have done something similar around here but just never had the brains to think of it.

I got the brains, just not the money. Land is expensive up here.

I was watching house hunters last night and they were in Houston looking at $200,000 houses that would push $600,000 here. To bad me and the heat are not good friends or I would be moving to a new market.

I thought you and Al were friends..?
As for the relo/invasive species issue - good point. Seems that the worst of these happen in the tropics or subtropics. Relocate me to Wisconsin, I'd be fine, 'cept it's a long way to watch the Blues play. At least you still get winter.

As someone who lived in Missouri for a few years I can say I hated it the first couple years and didn't want to ever leave the last couple years. Of course I was living about 100 miles south of St. Louis and about 90 miles north of Springfield so wasn't much to do locally, besides the Ozarks. But all Cardinal games were free and the Royals were so bad back then that front row behind the dugout was only $13. Great food, Great scenery, Good people. We talk about how much we enjoyed Missouri every time we drive through the State.

It is the Law in AZ for most species................

"I got the brains, just not the money. Land is expensive up here."

I hear you Nate. We're lucky to live in the sticks, and land's cheap here. It's only a 20 min drive from my house to the drop off point.

"If I knew they would survive and thrive, I'd be all for it, otherwise I see it more as a business model decision for folks and based on money and economics decisions, more than healthy populations of wildlife decisions."

There you go , you can figure out how to do it correctly. We all know that reintroductions work. The only question is How to do it correctly? Big picture, mass production, be able to evaluate and release on the probability that a positive result will be the outcome.

In MN you need permission of the landowner to release on their property. Alot of open land is State owned. The State (DNR) will NOT give permission to release on their land. I tell my customers the fact's as I know them. The animals may carry disease, they will have to find food and shelter and they will compete with the native population. I then put it in Human terms. I will take them to downtown Chicago, with no wallet, no phone, no money then let them go on their own. If they ask what I'm going to do, I respond, 'you probably don't want to know'.

Lundy, using downtown Chicago is not a level playing field. More people are shot to death every year in Chicago then in the military. ( Probably because you can't carry a gun in Chicago )

You let twenty white guys loose in the middle of Chicago and I'll let twenty raccoons go in the middle of the state highway in front of my house. I bet my raccoons will outlast your white guys, two to one.